Salary sacrifice

[Euan]

My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should be
no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.

Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the best
tack to take?
--
Cheers
Euan

[trek-man]

I cant offer advice because im in the same boat but i can say that whil
i was in brissy recently i overheard a lady racking up a huge bill a
the counter at lifecycle (over $10,000) and then she mentioned th
magical 'salary sacrifice' words and i quitely swore under my breath


Euan Wrote:
> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory i
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should b
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles
>
> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the bes
> tack to take
> -
> Cheer
> Eua

--
trek-man

[coppershark]

Euan Wrote:
> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there shoul
> be
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.
>
> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on th
> best
> tack to take?
> --
> Cheers
> Euan

There is a very good reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified fo
bicycles - they are not mentioned in the Fringe Benefits Tax Act.
You will have to ask John Howard to change the Fringe Benefits Tax Ac
first

--
coppershark

[GPLama]

"Euan" > wrote in message
...
> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should be
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.
>
> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the best
> tack to take?

Hmmm.. now you've got me thinking!!..


cheers,
GPL

[Euan]

>>>>> "coppershark" == coppershark > writes:

coppershark> Euan Wrote:
>> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My
>> theory is that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then
>> there should be no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified
>> for bicycles.
>>
>> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on
>> the best tack to take? -- Cheers Euan

coppershark> There is a very good reason why salary sacrifice can't
coppershark> be justified for bicycles - they are not mentioned in
coppershark> the Fringe Benefits Tax Act. You will have to ask John
coppershark> Howard to change the Fringe Benefits Tax Act first!

Oh bugga. Strike cunning plan to get new bike :-(
--
Cheers
Euan

[kingsley]

On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 19:19:31 +1000, coppershark wrote:


>> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars.
> There is a very good reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for
> bicycles - they are not mentioned in the Fringe Benefits Tax Act.

So my company can buy me bicycles with no problem with FBT ?!
Mmmmm... new Ti delivery bike :)

-kt

--
Kingsley Turner,
(mailto: )
http://MadDogsBreakfast.com/ABFAQ - news:aus.bicycle Frequenly Asked Questions

[flyingdutch]

in the mid 90's i scored a job for the first time in the evil CBD.
T'was bit sceptical about it but the job and bucks were good so took i
on.
Soon discovered how cool the city was, but part of my package was
carparking spot, as i had always worked in (advertising) in Sth Melb
richmond or StK Rd with free parking.

Months slipped by and the parking spot was never organised...
I was catching trams to begin with and then started riding after kne
reco's.
Anyway's, the boss asks "What's the carpark like that Im in?"
"Dunno. you never arranged it for me!"

The carpark was worth (then) about $3500 so i had a flash of brillianc
and pitched my evil plan...

"Howabout we forget the yearly carpark fee and you gimme a one-of
payment of $4K so I can buy a super-commuter and all related gear an
gym membership so I can shower/change/etc?"

Well, he 'bought' it!!! I got new bike (Its still my slicked u
commuter with racks/panniers and lights that still burn bright).

I guess that's not FBT or 'package' related but perhaps its all in th
sales pitch? both parties get what they want nd so does society. winne
i say..

--
flyingdutch

[ritcho]

kingsley Wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 19:19:31 +1000, coppershark wrote:
>
>
> >> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars.
> > There is a very good reason why salary sacrifice can't be justifie
> for
> > bicycles - they are not mentioned in the Fringe Benefits Tax Act.
>
> So my company can buy me bicycles with no problem with FBT ?!
> Mmmmm... new Ti delivery bike :)
>
> -kt
>
> --
> Kingsley Turner,
> (mailto: )
> http://MadDogsBreakfast.com/ABFAQ - news:aus.bicycle Frequenly Aske
> Questions

Unfortunately, if it _isn't_ mentioned specifically for FBT, it mean
it _attracts_ FBT at the highest rate. This means your salary sacrific
will be completely eaten up by FBT, leaving you no better or worse off
I tried this one out already...

Ritc

--
ritcho

[Euan]

>>>>> "flyingdutch" == flyingdutch > writes:

flyingdutch> "Howabout we forget the yearly carpark fee and you
flyingdutch> gimme a one-off payment of $4K so I can buy a
flyingdutch> super-commuter and all related gear and gym membership
flyingdutch> so I can shower/change/etc?"

flyingdutch> Well, he 'bought' it!!! I got new bike (Its still my
flyingdutch> slicked up commuter with racks/panniers and lights that
flyingdutch> still burn bright).

Inspiring stuff. Unfortunately I'm government so doubt I'll be able to
swing that.

Very cool though :-)
--
Cheers
Euan

[Terry Collins]

Euan wrote:
>>>>>>"coppershark" == coppershark > writes:
>
>
> coppershark> Euan Wrote:
> >> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My
> >> theory is that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then
> >> there should be no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified
> >> for bicycles.
> >>
> >> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on
> >> the best tack to take? -- Cheers Euan
>
> coppershark> There is a very good reason why salary sacrifice can't
> coppershark> be justified for bicycles - they are not mentioned in
> coppershark> the Fringe Benefits Tax Act. You will have to ask John
> coppershark> Howard to change the Fringe Benefits Tax Act first!
>
> Oh bugga. Strike cunning plan to get new bike :-(

Something tells me that people have been getting computers under this
scheme, so you buy a computer(bicycle of course) and OH&S approved safe
moving device (bicycle) {:-).

[Terry Collins]

Euan wrote:
>>>>>>"flyingdutch" == flyingdutch > writes:
>
>
> flyingdutch> "Howabout we forget the yearly carpark fee and you
> flyingdutch> gimme a one-off payment of $4K so I can buy a
> flyingdutch> super-commuter and all related gear and gym membership
> flyingdutch> so I can shower/change/etc?"
>
> flyingdutch> Well, he 'bought' it!!! I got new bike (Its still my
> flyingdutch> slicked up commuter with racks/panniers and lights that
> flyingdutch> still burn bright).
>
> Inspiring stuff. Unfortunately I'm government so doubt I'll be able to
> swing that.
>
> Very cool though :-)

Naah, it just depends as to what is on the docket, or dockets {:-)

Can you get a "two wheel trolley"?

If you get really stuck, can you swing a "business trip" to a conference
with a free bicycle?




Request: "we (local office manager) have this surplus in one of our
project budgets that we need to spend by June 30th, or we loose it back
to consolidated revenue. We want to buy another computer.

Problem: total assest freeze in government at time.

Ring my boss and say "John has some funds that he wants to use to
upgrade some of his computers, who replies "if it is his money, then he
can do it.

John makes a few orders and uses up surplus funds and everyone is happy.

A few months down the track 'ring ring' and its my boss; "you haven't
sent up those parts you upgraded.

Err, what parts?

My boss rattles off the invoice number and parts.

Oh, yes, if you add those invoices together, what do you get?

Stunned silence - "but there is an asset freze on. You are not allowed
to buy any computers"

Me: I didn't buy any computers, I repaired three computers!

The next five minutes was sent arguing about how /if it could be added
to the assets register, which ended by me asking if any of the "old
spare parts" in the storage room were on the assets register.

[trek-man]

Welcome to Liar nd Deshonky tax accountants :D

I love your work, creativity is an artform

Terry Collins Wrote:
> Euan wrote
> >>>>>>"flyingdutch" == flyingdutc
> > writes
>
>
> > flyingdutch> "Howabout we forget the yearly carpark fee and yo
> > flyingdutch> gimme a one-off payment of $4K so I can buy
> > flyingdutch> super-commuter and all related gear and gym membershi
> > flyingdutch> so I can shower/change/etc?
>
> > flyingdutch> Well, he 'bought' it!!! I got new bike (Its still m
> > flyingdutch> slicked up commuter with racks/panniers and lights tha
> > flyingdutch> still burn bright)
>
> > Inspiring stuff. Unfortunately I'm government so doubt I'll be abl
> t
> > swing that
>
> > Very cool though :-
>
> Naah, it just depends as to what is on the docket, or dockets {:-
>
> Can you get a "two wheel trolley"
>
> If you get really stuck, can you swing a "business trip" to
> conferenc
> with a free bicycle
>
>
>
>
> Request: "we (local office manager) have this surplus in one of ou
> project budgets that we need to spend by June 30th, or we loose it bac
> to consolidated revenue. We want to buy another computer
>
> Problem: total assest freeze in government at time
>
> Ring my boss and say "John has some funds that he wants to use t
> upgrade some of his computers, who replies "if it is his money, then h
> can do it
>
> John makes a few orders and uses up surplus funds and everyone i
> happy
>
> A few months down the track 'ring ring' and its my boss; "you haven'
> sent up those parts you upgraded
>
> Err, what parts
>
> My boss rattles off the invoice number and parts
>
> Oh, yes, if you add those invoices together, what do you get
>
> Stunned silence - "but there is an asset freze on. You are not allowe
> to buy any computers
>
> Me: I didn't buy any computers, I repaired three computers
>
> The next five minutes was sent arguing about how /if it could be adde
> to the assets register, which ended by me asking if any of the "ol
> spare parts" in the storage room were on the assets register

--
trek-man

[Jack Russell]

Terry Collins wrote:
> Euan wrote:
>
>>>>>>> "flyingdutch" == flyingdutch
>>>>>>> > writes:
>>
>>
>>
>> flyingdutch> "Howabout we forget the yearly carpark fee and you
>> flyingdutch> gimme a one-off payment of $4K so I can buy a
>> flyingdutch> super-commuter and all related gear and gym membership
>> flyingdutch> so I can shower/change/etc?"
>>
>> flyingdutch> Well, he 'bought' it!!! I got new bike (Its still my
>> flyingdutch> slicked up commuter with racks/panniers and lights that
>> flyingdutch> still burn bright).
>>
>> Inspiring stuff. Unfortunately I'm government so doubt I'll be able to
>> swing that.
>>
>> Very cool though :-)
>
>
> Naah, it just depends as to what is on the docket, or dockets {:-)
>
> Can you get a "two wheel trolley"?
>
> If you get really stuck, can you swing a "business trip" to a conference
> with a free bicycle?
>
>
>
>
> Request: "we (local office manager) have this surplus in one of our
> project budgets that we need to spend by June 30th, or we loose it back
> to consolidated revenue. We want to buy another computer.
>
> Problem: total assest freeze in government at time.
>
> Ring my boss and say "John has some funds that he wants to use to
> upgrade some of his computers, who replies "if it is his money, then he
> can do it.
>
> John makes a few orders and uses up surplus funds and everyone is happy.
>
> A few months down the track 'ring ring' and its my boss; "you haven't
> sent up those parts you upgraded.
>
> Err, what parts?
>
> My boss rattles off the invoice number and parts.
>
> Oh, yes, if you add those invoices together, what do you get?
>
> Stunned silence - "but there is an asset freze on. You are not allowed
> to buy any computers"
>
> Me: I didn't buy any computers, I repaired three computers!
>
> The next five minutes was sent arguing about how /if it could be added
> to the assets register, which ended by me asking if any of the "old
> spare parts" in the storage room were on the assets register.
>
>
>
>
>
My understanding (I am not boring enough to be an accountant) is that
cycles and motorcycles are not subject to FBT so the boss wins two ways!

[MikeyOz]

Euan Wrote:
> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory i
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should b
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles
>
> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the bes
> tack to take
> -
> Cheer
> Euan
I guess the other option is, that if you happen to be able to get
car through salary sacrafice, talk to the car dealer, especially if yo
know someone, they are always keen to make a sale, im sure they woul
welcome the idea of somehow packaging your favoured bike into th
package or organising the quote one way or another.

there are lots of options there, as long as they get the sale, that i
all they care about, its all about numbers in car sales, my fathe
being in the business for the last 40 years has done similar things.

the other option of course is to start your own business! amazing wha
can be used for advertising purposes

--
MikeyO

[BrettM]

Euan > wrote in :

>>>>>> "flyingdutch" == flyingdutch
>>>>>> > writes:
>
> flyingdutch> "Howabout we forget the yearly carpark fee and you
> flyingdutch> gimme a one-off payment of $4K so I can buy a
> flyingdutch> super-commuter and all related gear and gym
> membership flyingdutch> so I can shower/change/etc?"
>
> flyingdutch> Well, he 'bought' it!!! I got new bike (Its still my
> flyingdutch> slicked up commuter with racks/panniers and lights
> that flyingdutch> still burn bright).
>
> Inspiring stuff. Unfortunately I'm government so doubt I'll be able
> to swing that.
>
> Very cool though :-)

Most governments are supposed to be encouraging cycling for commuting.
So why not try writing to your DG and suggesting that you are keen to
commute but that you can't afford to use your existing expensive road
race bike for that purpose and the only thing holding you back is that
you can't salary sacrifice (?) to obtain appropriate equipment.

Might be worth a go.

Cheers
BrettM

[Theo Bekkers]

Euan wrote:
> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should
> be no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.

The Australian Tax Office.

Theo

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-06-15, Euan > wrote:
> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should be
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.
>
> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the best
> tack to take?

It won't happen. Cars and super are listed as things that do not attract
FBT, or attract it at a discounted rate, so it's worthwhile to do it.
Bikes aren't -- so it's not. Nice try, but it won't happen.

--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@" to "usenet".

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-06-15, Terry Collins > wrote:
> Something tells me that people have been getting computers under this
> scheme, so you buy a computer(bicycle of course) and OH&S approved safe
> moving device (bicycle) {:-).

The rules related to salary sacrifice for computers are simple: it must
have a built in display, and be capable of operating without mains power
for a period of time. (probably at least an hour.) In other words:
laptops and PDAs only. Not desktops, unless you can find a dodgy dealer
who'll list the desktop as a "laptop" -- but then, if you're audited (or
he's audited), you could be up for penalties for lying to tho tax
office.

Feel free to try; just don't expect it to be pulled off without a hitch.

--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@" to "usenet".

[DaveB]

Stuart Lamble wrote:
> On 2005-06-15, Terry Collins > wrote:
>
>>Something tells me that people have been getting computers under this
>>scheme, so you buy a computer(bicycle of course) and OH&S approved safe
>>moving device (bicycle) {:-).
>
>
> The rules related to salary sacrifice for computers are simple: it must
> have a built in display, and be capable of operating without mains power
> for a period of time. (probably at least an hour.) In other words:
> laptops and PDAs only. Not desktops, unless you can find a dodgy dealer
> who'll list the desktop as a "laptop" -- but then, if you're audited (or
> he's audited), you could be up for penalties for lying to tho tax
> office.
>
> Feel free to try; just don't expect it to be pulled off without a hitch.
>

So I could salary sacrifice a bike computer? Ooooh under that definition
I could probably go the top of the line Polar HRM or a garmin GPS. WooHoo!

DaveB "grasping at the only chance at ever getting those toys"

[Tamyka Bell]

Stuart Lamble wrote:
>
> On 2005-06-15, Terry Collins > wrote:
> > Something tells me that people have been getting computers under this
> > scheme, so you buy a computer(bicycle of course) and OH&S approved safe
> > moving device (bicycle) {:-).
>
> The rules related to salary sacrifice for computers are simple: it must
> have a built in display, and be capable of operating without mains power
> for a period of time. (probably at least an hour.) In other words:
> laptops and PDAs only. Not desktops, unless you can find a dodgy dealer
> who'll list the desktop as a "laptop" -- but then, if you're audited (or
> he's audited), you could be up for penalties for lying to tho tax
> office.
>
> Feel free to try; just don't expect it to be pulled off without a hitch.
>

My cycle computer has a built in display and is capable of operating
without mains power for a period of time.

Tam

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-06-15, Tamyka Bell > wrote:
> Stuart Lamble wrote:
>>
>> On 2005-06-15, Terry Collins > wrote:
>> > Something tells me that people have been getting computers under this
>> > scheme, so you buy a computer(bicycle of course) and OH&S approved safe
>> > moving device (bicycle) {:-).
>>
>> The rules related to salary sacrifice for computers are simple: it must
>> have a built in display, and be capable of operating without mains power
>> for a period of time. (probably at least an hour.) In other words:
>> laptops and PDAs only. Not desktops, unless you can find a dodgy dealer
>> who'll list the desktop as a "laptop" -- but then, if you're audited (or
>> he's audited), you could be up for penalties for lying to tho tax
>> office.
>>
>> Feel free to try; just don't expect it to be pulled off without a hitch.
>
> My cycle computer has a built in display and is capable of operating
> without mains power for a period of time.

From the ATO:

A number of benefits are exempt from FBT. Although they satisfy the
general definition of a "benefit", there is a specific provision of the
FBT legislation which states that they are exempt from FBT.

For example, expense payment, property or residual benefits arising for
the following items commonly provided in salary sacrifice arrangements
are exempt benefits:

* a notebook computer, lap computer or similar portable computer.
The exemption for portable computers will be limited to the
purchase or reimbursement of one computer per year per employee

I doubt you could class a cycle computer as a "similar portable
computer" ... but as I said, feel free to try. Your life to live, not
mine ...

--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@" to "usenet".

[Tamyka Bell]

Stuart Lamble wrote:
>
> On 2005-06-15, Tamyka Bell > wrote:
> > Stuart Lamble wrote:
> >>
> >> On 2005-06-15, Terry Collins > wrote:
> >> > Something tells me that people have been getting computers under this
> >> > scheme, so you buy a computer(bicycle of course) and OH&S approved safe
> >> > moving device (bicycle) {:-).
> >>
> >> The rules related to salary sacrifice for computers are simple: it must
> >> have a built in display, and be capable of operating without mains power
> >> for a period of time. (probably at least an hour.) In other words:
> >> laptops and PDAs only. Not desktops, unless you can find a dodgy dealer
> >> who'll list the desktop as a "laptop" -- but then, if you're audited (or
> >> he's audited), you could be up for penalties for lying to tho tax
> >> office.
> >>
> >> Feel free to try; just don't expect it to be pulled off without a hitch.
> >
> > My cycle computer has a built in display and is capable of operating
> > without mains power for a period of time.
>
> From the ATO:
>
> A number of benefits are exempt from FBT. Although they satisfy the
> general definition of a "benefit", there is a specific provision of the
> FBT legislation which states that they are exempt from FBT.
>
> For example, expense payment, property or residual benefits arising for
> the following items commonly provided in salary sacrifice arrangements
> are exempt benefits:
>
> * a notebook computer, lap computer or similar portable computer.
> The exemption for portable computers will be limited to the
> purchase or reimbursement of one computer per year per employee
>
> I doubt you could class a cycle computer as a "similar portable
> computer" ... but as I said, feel free to try. Your life to live, not
> mine ...

ROFLMAO

Sure thing... how about I get a job first?

Tam

[DeF]

Euan wrote:

> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should be
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.
>
> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the best
> tack to take?

Short answer: Don't like your chances.

Long answer: Salary sacrifice only works in your favor because
of our bizarre tax law. Car use for work is tax deductible on
a per km basis - and this is how you and your employer come out
ahead. Basically, less tax gets paid by you and your employer.
Cars are usually used under a leasing arrangement for some fixed
time and you must do some predetermined number of kms during that
time (not too much, not too little). The cost of the sacrifice
is also affected by the resale value of the car at the end of
the leasing period. This has the bizarre effect of it being
cheaper to get a lexus than a commodore or a smaller car -
small/cheap cars depreciate faster.

I looked into this a bit for getting a motorbike and it wasn't worth
it. I imagine that it would be even less the case for bikes.

Not sure how you claim work related cycling on your tax return.
Any cycle couriers care to comment?

That's pretty much the extent of my understanding.

Cheers,
Duncan.



--
e-mail:
To reply, you'll have to remove finger.

[roshea]

Euan wrote:
> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should be
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.
>
> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the best
> tack to take?

Maybe you could buy one of the "car branded" bikes from a car dealer
and get it invoiced in a particular way. Who's selling these now?
Porsche, Mercedes etc. Normally the novated leases for salary sacrifice
include maintenance (petrol and mechanics) so maybe you can include
"fuel" etc too.

[Carl Brewer]

On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 09:52:36 +0800, DeF
> wrote:

>Euan wrote:
>
>> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
>> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should be
>> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.
>>
>> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the best
>> tack to take?
>
>Short answer: Don't like your chances.
>
>Long answer: Salary sacrifice only works in your favor because
>of our bizarre tax law. Car use for work is tax deductible on
>a per km basis - and this is how you and your employer come out
>ahead. Basically, less tax gets paid by you and your employer.
>Cars are usually used under a leasing arrangement for some fixed
>time and you must do some predetermined number of kms during that
>time (not too much, not too little). The cost of the sacrifice
>is also affected by the resale value of the car at the end of
>the leasing period. This has the bizarre effect of it being
>cheaper to get a lexus than a commodore or a smaller car -
>small/cheap cars depreciate faster.
>
>I looked into this a bit for getting a motorbike and it wasn't worth
>it. I imagine that it would be even less the case for bikes.
>
>Not sure how you claim work related cycling on your tax return.
>Any cycle couriers care to comment?

I'm not a courier, but I can claim some stuff according to my
beancounter. Obviously coaching is a no-brainer, but I can
also claim travel expenses - the bike is my main method
of transport between client sites (my day job is IT insultant).
Keep yer receipts!

[SteveA]

Carl Brewer Wrote:
> On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 09:52:36 +0800, De
> > wrote
>
> >Euan wrote
>
> >> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory i
> >> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there shoul
> b
> >> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles
> >
> >> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on th
> bes
> >> tack to take
>
> >Short answer: Don't like your chances
>
> >Long answer: Salary sacrifice only works in your favor becaus
> >of our bizarre tax law. Car use for work is tax deductible o
> >a per km basis - and this is how you and your employer come ou
> >ahead. Basically, less tax gets paid by you and your employer
> >Cars are usually used under a leasing arrangement for some fixe
> >time and you must do some predetermined number of kms during tha
> >time (not too much, not too little). The cost of the sacrific
> >is also affected by the resale value of the car at the end o
> >the leasing period. This has the bizarre effect of it bein
> >cheaper to get a lexus than a commodore or a smaller car
> >small/cheap cars depreciate faster
>
> >I looked into this a bit for getting a motorbike and it wasn't wort
> >it. I imagine that it would be even less the case for bikes
>
> >Not sure how you claim work related cycling on your tax return
> >Any cycle couriers care to comment
>
> I'm not a courier, but I can claim some stuff according to m
> beancounter. Obviously coaching is a no-brainer, but I ca
> also claim travel expenses - the bike is my main metho
> of transport between client sites (my day job is IT insultant)
> Keep yer receipts!

Generally (ie, I'm not going to get a copy of the Tax Act out or loo
anyhting up)

You can claim the costs of travel between workplaces but not trave
between home and a workplace

You need log books, receipts etc to substantiate what you clai

you can claim expenses of earning your living (with exemption o
expenses that are of a domestic or personal nature, eg buying lunch a
work). If you use a bike or motor bike or wheelbarrow to earn you
living, you can claim it.

For items of a substantial cost (generally over $300) they should b
depreciated unless they are used up in a single year

If you used that bike for work and leisure, you would need to apportio
based on mileage/time and could only deduct costs associated with wor
use. Riding between home and work would be classified as 'non-work
for this purpose

This comes with the usual disclaimer that you should not rely on it a
it could be absolute crap

(By the way, if I use my car parking bay in the building where I work
my employer pays FBT and it is added to my income assessment for Supe
Surcharge purposes etc. If I park my bike on its rack in the sam
building just metres from my car bay, no FBT and nothing to increase m
income assessment for Surcharge etc.)

Steve

--
SteveA

[Tamyka Bell]

SteveA wrote:
<snip>
> (By the way, if I use my car parking bay in the building where I work,
> my employer pays FBT and it is added to my income assessment for Super
> Surcharge purposes etc. If I park my bike on its rack in the same
> building just metres from my car bay, no FBT and nothing to increase my
> income assessment for Surcharge etc.)
>
> SteveA

Is that a good thing, or a bad thing? (This is a serious question.
There's only one year since I started work in 1995 that I've had a
taxable income above the threshold, and it was casual work.)

Tam, the tax-free income gal, phone 13 19 01

[LotteBum]

>This has the bizarre effect of it being cheaper to get a lexus than
>commodore or a smaller car - small/cheap cars depreciate faster

I know that this is what the taxation law says, but in all reality
small and medium sized cars are the ones that depreciate least in m
experience.

LotteBum who just sold a 1992 Corolla with 200,000km on the clock fo
$4.5k. Now if that were a Commodore/Falcon, you would be fairly luck
to get $3.5k. BECAUSE THEY'RE SH!TBOXES!!!!

P.P.S. Did anyone say "Ban 6 cylinder cars!!!"

--
LotteBum

[SteveA]

Tamyka Bell Wrote:
> SteveA wrote:
> <snip>
> > (By the way, if I use my car parking bay in the building where I
> work,
> > my employer pays FBT and it is added to my income assessment for
> Super
> > Surcharge purposes etc. If I park my bike on its rack in the same
> > building just metres from my car bay, no FBT and nothing to increase
> my
> > income assessment for Surcharge etc.)
> >
> > SteveA
>
> Is that a good thing, or a bad thing? (This is a serious question.
> There's only one year since I started work in 1995 that I've had a
> taxable income above the threshold, and it was casual work.)
>
> Tam, the tax-free income gal, phone 13 19 01



Serious answer (and I apologise if I am stating the obvious in any of
the below):

FBT is a tax payable by the employer, not the employee. It does not
get added to your taxable income on which you pay tax.

However (there's always a however) it gets added notionally to your
'real' income when the Govt works out some things which are linked to
income.

For example - the Superannuation Surcharge kicks in when your income
(including Fringe Benefits) is above a certain level - the Govt then
takes extra tax out of the superannuation contributions your employer
makes for your superannuation. Also I understand the higher notional
income figure gets used for calculating some social security benefits
like some of the family type payments.

Because of this, minimising the FBT your employer pays by not using a
car bay is a good thing. Riding to work is a better thing.

Having an accountant who can minimise your taxable income to below the
threshhold is an even better thing. I hope you sacked your accountant
the year he couldn't get your taxable income below the threshhold.:D


Hope the above was not too serious and boring.

Steve(get rid of FBT, bring back long tax deductible lunches and let's
all get fat together)A


--
SteveA

[SteveA]

LotteBum Wrote:
> >This has the bizarre effect of it being cheaper to get a lexus than
> >commodore or a smaller car - small/cheap cars depreciate faster
>
> I know that this is what the taxation law says, but in all reality
> small and medium sized cars are the ones that depreciate least in m
> experience.
>
> LotteBum who just sold a 1992 Corolla with 200,000km on the clock fo
> $4.5k. Now if that were a Commodore/Falcon, you would be fairly luck
> to get $3.5k. BECAUSE THEY'RE SH!TBOXES!!!!
>
> P.P.S. Did anyone say "Ban 6 cylinder cars!!!"?

Before I became an (almost) full-time cycle commuter, I had had compan
cars for many years. At one point in time, I was attempting to reall
minimise costs in my area of responsibility. My vehicle came up fo
replacement and so I chose a smaller and less luxurious car. Th
person who ran our vehicle fleet rang and told me that I could not hav
the car I had chosen. I had to have the higher specification car wit
electric windows, CD sound system, flash wheels and tyres etc. It wa
because the bigger cars with all the bits and pieces sold for muc
higher prices at auction and the lease payments we made were based o
whole of life costs. Bugger me, the higher spec cars were cheaper t
lease

As a youngster in Brisbane I once did an analysis of a large governmen
department's vehicle fleet. My report showed that the departmen
could make significant savings by getting rid of its fleet of
cylinder Falcons and replacing them with 4 cylinder BMWs. Of course
it would not have been acceptable for public servants to drive aroun
town in BMWs so I had to re-write the report. There is probably stil
a copy of the first report in government archives somewhere

Steve

--
SteveA

[BrettM]

SteveA > wrote in
:


> As a youngster in Brisbane I once did an analysis of a large
government
> department's vehicle fleet. My report showed that the department
> could make significant savings by getting rid of its fleet of 6
> cylinder Falcons and replacing them with 4 cylinder BMWs. Of course,
> it would not have been acceptable for public servants to drive around
> town in BMWs so I had to re-write the report. There is probably still
> a copy of the first report in government archives somewhere.
>
> SteveA
>
>

Same thing with heavy fleet. Cats, Macks and Kennies come out on top in
whole of life due to lower maintenance costs and higher resale. Also
the reason why government fleets, in some departments, are migrating
back to 4wd.

But not Prado's (for those with issues). No we have Landbruser wagons
that are pathetic off road. The old Hiluxs were ok but the new one is a
POS. Bring on the Navara/Tritons.

Cheers
BrettM

[Gags]

"Euan" > wrote in message
...
> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should be
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.
>
> Has anyone had success with this sort of thing? Any advice on the best
> tack to take?
> --
> Cheers
> Euan

I was discussing this with a mate only last week........if I use my bike as
my only means to travel to and from work then why shouldn't I be allowed to
salary sacrifice it??? I do more km on the bike per annum than I do in the
car!!

My alternate plan is to take some long service leave at some stage (got
about 4.5 months or so owing) and get a job as a bike courier for 3 or 4
days a week. I assume that I could then claim bike parts, cycling clothes,
etc as legitimate tax deductions?? I am not too sure about claiming a bike
on tax but if I just so happen to have to replace nearly all of the
components on my current bike (for say Record or Durace 10 spd), then surely
that would be legit??

Ride On,

Gags

[Terry Collins]

Stuart Lamble wrote:
> On 2005-06-15, Terry Collins > wrote:
>
>>Something tells me that people have been getting computers under this
>>scheme, so you buy a computer(bicycle of course) and OH&S approved safe
>>moving device (bicycle) {:-).
>
>
> The rules related to salary sacrifice for computers are simple: it must
> have a built in display, and be capable of operating without mains power
> for a period of time. (probably at least an hour.)

Hey, my bike computer has a built in display and it's battery/batteries
last for years {;-). Technically it is a computer, it has I & O,
registers and CPU {:-) Do any of the fancy ones link to other computers?

Do they define display?
Wondering if a LCD console message display in 5.25" bay might pass. {:-)

> In other words: laptops and PDAs only.

Well, there are projects around to adapt these to sensing various things
on a bicycle. A simple prog to give you speed (current, max) time (real
& elasped, even GPS co-ords etc should be easy.


Anyway, thanks for the details, but I think you make have misunderstood
my point. It was that they allow mickey mouse crap like computers under
this system, there must be someway of getting a bicycle, OR there should
be.

Perhaps it is time for (real) letter writing campaign to your federal
member asking why bicycles are not allowed and listing all the usual
reasons.

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-06-16, Gags <gags_44nospamatnospamtpg.com.au> wrote:
> My alternate plan is to take some long service leave at some stage (got
> about 4.5 months or so owing) and get a job as a bike courier for 3 or 4
> days a week. I assume that I could then claim bike parts, cycling clothes,
> etc as legitimate tax deductions??

Nope. The law, as I understand it, says that you cannot take another job
whilst on long service leave, unless you resign your old job first.
Already thought about that myself (six years until I get LSL ...)

--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@" to "usenet".

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-06-16, Terry Collins > wrote:
> Anyway, thanks for the details, but I think you make have misunderstood
> my point. It was that they allow mickey mouse crap like computers under
> this system, there must be someway of getting a bicycle, OR there should
> be.

Oh, I fully agree with you. I'm simply pointing out that the law, as
currently written, doesn't allow for this, not disagreeing with the
argument that it *should*.

--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@" to "usenet".

[Theo Bekkers]

SteveA wrote:

> Serious answer (and I apologise if I am stating the obvious in any of
> the below):
>
> FBT is a tax payable by the employer, not the employee. It does not
> get added to your taxable income on which you pay tax.

And it is a serious tax. Our company (Bekkers) owns five cars on which we
have an FBT liability. We pay the ATO $25,000 for letting our employees
drive the cars to and from work. It is also included in our Payroll Tax
liability so we get to pay the State Government Revenue Dept another $3,000
as well. That comes to $28,000, or $5,600 per annum, $108 per week, per
vehicle. Then we have to pay for the cars and running costs.

I think people who drive company cars are on a pretty good deal. I certainly
appreciate mine. :-)

Theo

[Graeme]

Euan > wrote in :

> My employer offers salary sacrifice for super and cars. My theory is
> that if they can justify salary sacrifice for cars then there should be
> no reason why salary sacrifice can't be justified for bicycles.

My wife has just started a part time job that provides some sort of salary
sacrifice "account". As I understand it a proportion of your pay (however
much you want) is put into this account and then you can use it for paying
for certain permitted things (mortgage, super etc.) but she's been told
that credit card bills are one of the things that can be paid from it. Now
this doesn't sound right to me as this effectively means that you can buy
more or less *anything* on salary sacrifice via your credit card.

Graeme

[Theo Bekkers]

Graeme wrote:

> My wife has just started a part time job that provides some sort of
> salary sacrifice "account". As I understand it a proportion of your
> pay (however much you want) is put into this account and then you can
> use it for paying for certain permitted things (mortgage, super etc.)
> but she's been told that credit card bills are one of the things that
> can be paid from it. Now this doesn't sound right to me as this
> effectively means that you can buy more or less *anything* on salary
> sacrifice via your credit card.

Additional Super is OK but the mortgage is suss. I hope the ATO doesn't
audit them anytime soon. They, and your wife, will have some serious
problems.

Theo

[Graeme]

"Theo Bekkers" > wrote in news:42b22f8e$1
@news.bekkers.com.au:

> Additional Super is OK but the mortgage is suss. I hope the ATO doesn't
> audit them anytime soon. They, and your wife, will have some serious
> problems.

We're not at the stage where we've done anything with the money (she's not
even been paid yet). I'm going to check out exactly what can be done and
still remain in the ATO's good books, having run my own business back in
the UK I know not to **** off any tax collectors! I think there may be more
lax regulations for healthcare/government jobs as a relative who works in a
government job is able to SS her mortgage.

Graeme

[BrettS]

Graeme wrote:
> "Theo Bekkers" > wrote in news:42b22f8e$1
> @news.bekkers.com.au:
>
>
>>Additional Super is OK but the mortgage is suss. I hope the ATO doesn't
>>audit them anytime soon. They, and your wife, will have some serious
>>problems.
>
>
> We're not at the stage where we've done anything with the money (she's not
> even been paid yet). I'm going to check out exactly what can be done and
> still remain in the ATO's good books, having run my own business back in
> the UK I know not to **** off any tax collectors! I think there may be more
> lax regulations for healthcare/government jobs as a relative who works in a
> government job is able to SS her mortgage.
>
> Graeme

I believe you are right. I understand that you are able to package a
significant portion of your income into car, mortgage, health insurance,
school fees etc if you work for the government health dept, at least in WA

--
Brett""Hey honey I found you a new job..."S

[SteveA]

Graeme Wrote:
> "Theo Bekkers" > wrote in news:42b22f8e$
> @news.bekkers.com.au
>
> > Additional Super is OK but the mortgage is suss. I hope the AT
> doesn'
> > audit them anytime soon. They, and your wife, will have some seriou
> > problems
>
> We're not at the stage where we've done anything with the money (she'
> no
> even been paid yet). I'm going to check out exactly what can be don
> an
> still remain in the ATO's good books, having run my own business bac
> i
> the UK I know not to **** off any tax collectors! I think there may b
> mor
> lax regulations for healthcare/government jobs as a relative who work
> in
> government job is able to SS her mortgage
>
> Graeme
There are no salary sacrifice/FBT advantages to government jobs per se
The key will be that she is working in a public hospital or in publi
healthcare which gives significant FBT advantages. Including salar
sacrificing family restaurant meals. And other things. I know of
doc who salary sacrificed the cost of his duaghter's lavish 21s
birthday party.


Steve

--
SteveA

[Euan]

>>>>> "graeme" == graeme > writes:

graeme> I think there may be more lax regulations for
graeme> healthcare/government jobs as a relative who works in a
graeme> government job is able to SS her mortgage.

Yep, I've heard that too from a colleague.
--
Cheers
Euan

[SteveA]

BrettS Wrote:
> Graeme wrote
> > "Theo Bekkers" > wrote in news:42b22f8e$
> > @news.bekkers.com.au
>
>
> >>Additional Super is OK but the mortgage is suss. I hope the AT
> doesn'
> >>audit them anytime soon. They, and your wife, will have some seriou
> >>problems
>
>
> > We're not at the stage where we've done anything with the mone
> (she's no
> > even been paid yet). I'm going to check out exactly what can be don
> an
> > still remain in the ATO's good books, having run my own business bac
> i
> > the UK I know not to **** off any tax collectors! I think there ma
> be mor
> > lax regulations for healthcare/government jobs as a relative wh
> works in
> > government job is able to SS her mortgage
>
> > Graem
>
> I believe you are right. I understand that you are able to package
> significant portion of your income into car, mortgage, healt
> insurance
> school fees etc if you work for the government health dept, at least i
> W
>
> -
> Brett""Hey honey I found you a new job..."S

Public Servants who work for the WA Dept of Health are not able to tak
advantage of the more generous FBT/packaging arrangements BUT if
person works in a State Govt hospital or health service then they ar
able to. Technically, different employer and employed under differne
awards

And it is in a bit of a state of flux too with the ATO changing som
definitions that impact on how it applies

Steve

--
SteveA

[Stomper]

"Stuart Lamble" > wrote in message
...
> On 2005-06-15, Terry Collins > wrote:
>> Something tells me that people have been getting computers under this
>> scheme, so you buy a computer(bicycle of course) and OH&S approved safe
>> moving device (bicycle) {:-).
>
> The rules related to salary sacrifice for computers are simple: it must
> have a built in display, and be capable of operating without mains power
> for a period of time. (probably at least an hour.) In other words:
> laptops and PDAs only. Not desktops, unless you can find a dodgy dealer
> who'll list the desktop as a "laptop" -- but then, if you're audited (or
> he's audited), you could be up for penalties for lying to tho tax
> office.
>
> Feel free to try; just don't expect it to be pulled off without a hitch.
>


Hmmmmm.... sounds a lot like my bicycle computer..

Now to find a LBS who will cut the invoice correctly

Karl aka Stomper

[Gags]

"Stuart Lamble" > wrote in message
...
> On 2005-06-16, Gags <gags_44nospamatnospamtpg.com.au> wrote:
> > My alternate plan is to take some long service leave at some stage (got
> > about 4.5 months or so owing) and get a job as a bike courier for 3 or 4
> > days a week. I assume that I could then claim bike parts, cycling
clothes,
> > etc as legitimate tax deductions??
>
> Nope. The law, as I understand it, says that you cannot take another job
> whilst on long service leave, unless you resign your old job first.
> Already thought about that myself (six years until I get LSL ...)
>
I don't think that this is the case.......I know plenty of guys who have
gotten a job whilst on LSL and all they had to do was get permission from
work to do it. A lot of guys use it as a bit of a "try before you buy" of a
new career.

Gags

[TimC]

On 2005-06-17, SteveA (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
> The key will be that she is working in a public hospital or in public
> healthcare which gives significant FBT advantages. Including salary
> sacrificing family restaurant meals. And other things. I know of a
> doc who salary sacrificed the cost of his duaghter's lavish 21st
> birthday party.

WTF?

Probably his gold watch too.

--
TimC
Yesterday, after years of trying, I finally managed to take a photo of a
subway train that said "INSTRUCTION CAR" just so that someday I can caption
it "...but where's the DATA CDR?" when I'm ready to make a joke that's
nerdy even by the standards of jokes about LISP. -- James "Kibo" Perry

[ronni51]

Hello, I -work in a bike shop and we have ,on average 1 person a wee
who salary sacrifice bikes. The amount is max $550.00 above that the
can add more
They don't have to purchace bikes , anything cycle related , shoe
wheels heart rate monitors etc


--
ronni51

[slaw]

Publicly Benevolent or some such term. Wife has just started part tim
at a research institute attached to a public hospital so she's entitle
to this scheme. Up to about $15k per year salary sacrificed to a larg
range of things, mortgage, school fees etc.. is not subject to FBT
Also, I think it's any amount of meal costs, not subject to FBT

Some third party administers this, ie. paying the mortgage, paying int
the Diner's Card, for a small percentage

--
slaw