Best spokes to use for Coker wheel?

[knobbytracks]

I've lurked in the shadows here for a while and enjoy the bits of info
and humor but now I need a little help. I've searched the threads for
coker spokes and there doesn't seem to be a consensus on the best
spokes to use for a strong but lighter wheel build.

I'm building a Hunter frame w/magura brake rolling on a aifoil rim
w/UDC wide hub. I'd like to use the UDC 14g stainless spokes for a
lighter wheel but a little affraid of flex and brake rub. Someone have
experience with these newer spokes yet? How do they compare to Tom
Miller's varitey and does he still sell spokes? Or should I get the
old school 12g corrosive steel bars? :)

Someone throw me a bone here.


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[trials_uni]

I'm pretty sure that PDC one these forums had a good run on his 12g
spokes from udc...You could send him a pm.


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[pdc]

I'm not sure if UDC or Tommy Miller are better, but I would go SS. If I
were doing it again I would pay a little extra and get Dave Stockton to
build my wheel.


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[unitoon]

long ones ;) i dunno really.


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[knobbytracks]

pdc wrote:
> I'm not sure if UDC or Tommy Miller are better, but I would go SS. If I
> were doing it again I would pay a little extra and get Dave Stockton to
> build my wheel.



I remember seeing your post cus we both liked the lighter wheel weight.
I don't know if I'm serious enough to go the Dave Stockton route but
that's a nice wheel he builds. I'm told all airfoil rims from here on
out will be powder coated which was very dissapointing to hear but
could be good business for Dave.

Who powder coats the braking surface of a cycling wheel?! I remember
years ago when they used to anodize the sides of *ike rims but then
quickly wised up to the poor braking surface and asstetic problems
which develop down the road. It may all be good but I have no faith.
Powder coat is a type of plastic material I think so what keeps it from
melting when I'm trying to haul it down from 30mph comming off the
pass. :D


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[harper]

knobbytracks wrote:
> I remember seeing your post cus we both liked the lighter wheel weight.
> I don't know if I'm serious enough to go the Dave Stockton route but
> that's a nice wheel he builds.



It's a tough decision but Dave does make the finest wheels out there. I
doubt that the spoke gauge weight differential is significant compared
to the massive Coker tire.

Opinions differ on zinc plated steel spokes which are hardly if at all
available in 14 gauge anymore. They should eventually rust and weaken
but that should take a long, long time. In my opinion, steel spokes are
less ductile than stainless and therefore stiffer. They should make
superior wheels but nobody likes rust. If you go to a bike shop and ask
which alloy is used in stainless steel spokes and which alloy is used
in zinc plated spokes and they can tell you, I think you will find the
stainless to be more ductile; they will stretch. It depends on the
alloys used. But try to find a bike shop that can tell you this. What a
bike shop will tell you is that stainless steel spokes are stronger
(without mentioning ductility) as if they are metalurgists whereas all
they want to do is sell you what they have.

A guy I work with researched it in detail when stainless steel spokes
were taking over the market and found that they were structurally
inferior. This is a guy who wanted to know every last detail and was
really steamed when he could no longer get zinc spokes. I wonder what
Sheldon Brown has to say about it.


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[U-Turn]

Thank you for the nice words, guys. :)


harper wrote:
> A guy I work with researched it in detail when stainless steel spokes
> were taking over the market and found that they were structurally
> inferior. This is a guy who wanted to know every last detail and was
> really steamed when he could no longer get zinc spokes. I wonder what
> Sheldon Brown has to say about it.

Other factors count too; such as what salt air will do to spokes. I
rode my stock Coker at a park on the Long Island Sound and it was soon
a mess - both rim and spokes. I'm sure that the quality of the zinc
coat is a big factor as well. The rim was scratched from the brake,
and the salt air went right for those scratches.

For the LWU wheels, which use the Airfoil rim, the rim machining itself
is a very time-consuming, labor-intensive, dirty, messy, wet process,
and I'm sorry to say is not much of a money maker, really like the rest
of custom uni building. However, it really makes a huge difference in
the resulting wheel's utility. I'm glad that Scott took the time to
develop the machine and basic process that I use to do the rims. It
would not pay, in the slightest bit at this point, to machine
individual rims alone for people because the return is just not worth
it, not to mention the shipping costs. I may end up having to increase
the cost of machining again (after lowering it) because of all that is
involved.

Here are three photos of a rim mid-process. The first shows a place on
the rim that is not at the weld; the second shows the weld area. It's
easy to see that not only does the process remove the powdercoating in
the braking area, but also improves the flatness of the surface
significantly. The third shows a different kind of irregularity. The
fourth shows the final result.

Although, strictly speaking, one can no longer see the irregularities
in the final result since the coating is gone, and although we have no
optical instrument to measure the differences, the improvement in the
rim surface is apparent when truing up the resulting wheel.

The yellow garment in the background of the 3rd photo is a sailing
jacket I use to try to keep dry during the process - it is not too
effective! Imagine dumping a bowlful of copier toner over your head in
a rainstorm... :rolleyes:

I've looked at the newer spokes now and so far so good, but I haven't
had a chance yet to build a wheel with them. That should happen soon,
though. There is a slight difference in thickness; the Tom Miller
spokes are actually a bit thicker than 14g. I doubt that will make any
difference in the build process or resulting wheel, but only experience
will tell.


+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
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|Download: http://www.unicyclist.com/attachment/13425 |
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[knobbytracks]

Thanks for sharing Dave. I've never seen one of your wheels in person
but judging from the pics, I would say you should be proud of your
work. Very nice.


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