New Inventors ABC last night

[DeF]

There was a bicycle related invention on this
program last night. Difficult to describe but
I'll try. The invention consisted of inserting
some planetary gears between the cranks and the
chain ring. This meant that the cranks went
around twice for each rotation of the chainring
but more bizarrely was the change to the pedal
action. It was no longer circular and consisted
of what looked like two nested cardiods. The
inventor claimed that it improved efficiency.
I agreed with the engineer on the panel that
this was utter ********.

You can check it out here:
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/txt/s1952528.htm

DeF

--
e-mail: d.farrow@your finger.murdoch.edu.au
To reply, you'll have to remove your finger.

[thefathippy]

On Jun 21, 12:56 pm, DeF <""d.farrow\"@your finger.murdoch.edu.au">
wrote:
> There was a bicycle related invention on this
> program last night. Difficult to describe but
> I'll try. The invention consisted of inserting
> some planetary gears between the cranks and the
> chain ring. This meant that the cranks went
> around twice for each rotation of the chainring
> but more bizarrely was the change to the pedal
> action. It was no longer circular and consisted
> of what looked like two nested cardiods. The
> inventor claimed that it improved efficiency.
> I agreed with the engineer on the panel that
> this was utter ********.
>
> You can check it out here:http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/txt/s1952528.htm

But the inventor said it was brilliant. And he said it was a huge
improvement...

I say it's an interesting engineering exercise, but not a useful
invention, unless there are hard facts to support his claims.

Tony F

[Bleve]

On Jun 21, 12:56 pm, DeF <""d.farrow\"@your finger.murdoch.edu.au">
wrote:
> There was a bicycle related invention on this
> program last night. Difficult to describe but
> I'll try. The invention consisted of inserting
> some planetary gears between the cranks and the
> chain ring. This meant that the cranks went
> around twice for each rotation of the chainring
> but more bizarrely was the change to the pedal
> action. It was no longer circular and consisted
> of what looked like two nested cardiods. The
> inventor claimed that it improved efficiency.
> I agreed with the engineer on the panel that
> this was utter ********.

And the old nutter who 'invented' it hadn't done his history, as well
as not understanding basic mechanical engineering. All this kind of
thing was tried in the 1800's.

Trivia: yesterday at the LBS, we got shown a 'new' fluid drive
transmission system, that worked by (I think, they wouldn't let us
pull it to bits or show us a diagram) by moving some baffles around in
a drum to create an infinatly variable transmission. I can't help but
think it's been done before too ...
It sure was heavy ... and I bet they'd done no real testing of its
efficiency either or if they had, that they weren't too keen on
advertising it. It looked pretty though, and had a nice grip shift.
RRP for it will be around $800 AUD I think (just the hub and
gripshifter). Probably ok for town bikes, competing with the Rolhoff,
Nexus etc.

[DeF]

Bleve wrote:
> On Jun 21, 12:56 pm, DeF <""d.farrow\"@your finger.murdoch.edu.au">
> wrote:
>> There was a bicycle related invention on this
>> program last night. Difficult to describe but
>> I'll try. The invention consisted of inserting
>> some planetary gears between the cranks and the
>> chain ring. This meant that the cranks went
>> around twice for each rotation of the chainring
>> but more bizarrely was the change to the pedal
>> action. It was no longer circular and consisted
>> of what looked like two nested cardiods. The
>> inventor claimed that it improved efficiency.
>> I agreed with the engineer on the panel that
>> this was utter ********.
>
> And the old nutter who 'invented' it hadn't done his history, as well
> as not understanding basic mechanical engineering. All this kind of
> thing was tried in the 1800's.
>
> Trivia: yesterday at the LBS, we got shown a 'new' fluid drive
> transmission system, that worked by (I think, they wouldn't let us
> pull it to bits or show us a diagram) by moving some baffles around in
> a drum to create an infinatly variable transmission. I can't help but
> think it's been done before too ...
> It sure was heavy ... and I bet they'd done no real testing of its
> efficiency either or if they had, that they weren't too keen on
> advertising it. It looked pretty though, and had a nice grip shift.
> RRP for it will be around $800 AUD I think (just the hub and
> gripshifter). Probably ok for town bikes, competing with the Rolhoff,
> Nexus etc.
>
>

It wasn't a Da Vinci drive was it?
http://tinyurl.com/3d85at
I reckon that could work on a town bike.

DeF

--
e-mail: d.farrow@your finger.murdoch.edu.au
To reply, you'll have to remove your finger.

[cfsmtb[_272_]]

thefathippy Wrote:
>
> But the inventor said it was brilliant. And he said it was a huge
> improvement...

Needed improvements, like being drilled out to minimize weight. Or
machined on a lathe. Or something. Although, with a similarly designed
disc wheelset, it would be an absolute ******* in a crosswind.


--
cfsmtb

[Bleve]

On Jun 21, 1:24 pm, DeF <""d.farrow\"@your finger.murdoch.edu.au">
wrote:
>
> It wasn't a Da Vinci drive was it?http://tinyurl.com/3d85at
> I reckon that could work on a town bike.

It looks quite similar from the outside.

[Bleve]

On Jun 21, 1:25 pm, cfsmtb <cfsmtb.2si...@no-
mx.forums.cyclingforums.com> wrote:
> thefathippy Wrote:
>
>
>
> > But the inventor said it was brilliant. And he said it was a huge
> > improvement...
>
> Needed improvements, like being drilled out to minimize weight. Or
> machined on a lathe. Or something. Although, with a similarly designed
> disc wheelset, it would be an absolute ******* in a crosswind.

Adding extra gears that a machine has to turn always introduces
inefficiency. The reason a bicycle is so efficient in its current
form is because it's very simple. Not many things to have to move, or
having to link through, leads to less losses.

No amount of 'improvement' for that thing would make it efficient. It
was too complex, even if the different pedaling paths made any sense
biomechanically, the losses introduced by the mechanical complexity of
it means it will always be a loss, and making it strong enough to deal
with the torque generated by humans (which is suprisingly high, per
revolution) means they're not only horribly inefficient in terms of
transmission losses, but they're very heavy.

The fact is, bicycle transmission design is where it is because it has
evolved to as close to a perfect design as possible. All these
crackpot ideas were tried in the 1800s, but they won't go away
because crank inventors don't do their homework and don't understand
mechanical engineering.

If the old nut wants to do his high compression drive thing in a car
engine, he really needs to do his history, it *has* been done before,
and every 10 years some loony gets on TV because they think they've
got some new idea which is invariably a rehash of something done 100
years ago and discarded then because it doesn't work as well as the
current design. If the TV shows (and the lazy 'inventor') did their
homework, they'd know it wasn't new. Still, some exercise bike might
end up with something similar one day, but it won't save the world
from carbon emissions or energy depletion.

[cfsmtb[_274_]]

Bleve Wrote:
> If the TV shows (and the lazy 'inventor') did their
> homework, they'd know it wasn't new. Still, some exercise bike might
> end up with something similar one day, but it won't save the world
> from carbon emissions or energy depletion.

There's a long-standing Australian culture of Blokes Tinkering The
Shed, and despite this gents rather obvious failings, it's pleasing to
see eccentricity is still out there in the brick & tile wonderlands.



"Without question, the greatest invention in the history of mankind is
beer. Oh, I grant you that the wheel was also a fine invention, but the
wheel does not go nearly as well with pizza.”


--
cfsmtb

[John Tserkezis]

DeF > wrote:
> There was a bicycle related invention on this
> program last night. Difficult to describe but
> I'll try. The invention consisted of inserting
> some planetary gears between the cranks and the
> chain ring. This meant that the cranks went
> around twice for each rotation of the chainring
> but more bizarrely was the change to the pedal
> action. It was no longer circular and consisted
> of what looked like two nested cardiods. The
> inventor claimed that it improved efficiency.
> I agreed with the engineer on the panel that
> this was utter ********.

As per usual from most of the crap they have on the program: It's already
been invented, a long time ago, and it's been refined.

His orbital pattern is completely useless, it's LESS efficient, involves a
LARGER leg movement than otherwise. And the size of the front chainring is
just simply a joke.

It's been done before, a LONG time before, but the most recent that I recall
tries to "fix" the standard circular pattern by changing to an orbital
pattern, largely up and down. Because that's where all the power happens, not
while you're moving your feet front and back, and that's where it tries to
capitalise.

It was a WHOLE lot more portable, the "mechanics" were mostly within the
bottom bracket. So it was much smaller.

This guy on the new inventors hopes his joke appears in competition racing.
If the more highly refined orbital pattern hasn't done it, his huge joke has
no chance at all.

It could be classed only as a "concept vehicle" and nothing more. (costs
lots of money and will never make it to production).

--
Linux Registered User # 302622
<http://counter.li.org>

[Theo Bekkers]

thefathippy wrote:

> But the inventor said it was brilliant. And he said it was a huge
> improvement...
>
> I say it's an interesting engineering exercise, but not a useful
> invention, unless there are hard facts to support his claims.

Looked like the Perth foreshore.

Theo

[[email protected]]

On Jun 21, 1:20 pm, cfsmtb <cfsmtb.2si...@no-
mx.forums.cyclingforums.com> wrote:
> "Without question, the greatest invention in the history of mankind is
> beer. Oh, I grant you that the wheel was also a fine invention, but the
> wheel does not go nearly as well with pizza."

Surely you mean red wine? Beer is more of a curry thing.
I bet you put pineapple on pizza...

[Stuart Lamble[_12_]]

On 2007-06-21, > wrote:
> I bet you put pineapple on pizza...

Mmmm... pineapple ... pizza ... must order a nice Hawaiian pizza for
dinner ...

--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@" to "usenet".

[cfsmtb[_277_]]

Stuart Lamble Wrote:
>
> Mmmm... pineapple ... pizza ... must order a nice Hawaiian pizza for
> dinner ...


Perfect for tonight - 4C overnight Melb minimum. Practically t-shirt
weather!


--
cfsmtb

[TimC]

On 2007-06-21, cfsmtb (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
>
> Stuart Lamble Wrote:
>>
>> Mmmm... pineapple ... pizza ... must order a nice Hawaiian pizza for
>> dinner ...

'roo here. Pre-frozen roadkill, tenderised by the bus a couple of
times over the last couple of days.

> Perfect for tonight - 4C overnight Melb minimum. Practically t-shirt
> weather!

4C? I read that as -4. -4 is expected here overnight, -5 the next
morning. Sooks. The lot of ya.

Did I tell you about the snow I had last time I was on nights 2 weeks
ago?

Or the ice the day before yesterday? I know I didn't mention the
latter, but I shall eventually get around to putting the photos up on
the webbage. We can only get through one door into the building now,
because of all the fencing around the place for asbestos removal, and
that doorway and path was wearing the brunt of the ice that was
falling off the building. There was a block, 2 foot by 2 foot, by
about 3 inches, sitting about a metre from the door. Despite the wind
dragging everything off (upturned wheelbarrows and ladders all over
the place), this thing obviously just fell straight *down*, and
*fast*. It was all still there by 4pm. I was able to keep a foothold
on the dome catwalk though, because the ice was rather crystalline,
and embedded into my shoes, as opposed to the teflon-like ice I had 2
weeks prior.

Going to the lunchroom was a case of sitting outside the front door
for 60 seconds, scoping the wind and the chunks of falling ice, then
when the wind lulled, peering up past the awnings, ascertaining the
lack of falling blocks of ice, and *running*. Oh, and freezer jackets
are nice.

-- Ti "Melbourne people are sooks. Come here for a holiday. Please.
I need the company." mC.

[cfsmtb[_278_]]

TimC Wrote:
>
> 4C? I read that as -4. -4 is expected here overnight, -5 the next
> morning. Sooks. The lot of ya..

Pfffffffff!

-9 in Mt Hotham tonight. Parr-tay time!


TimC Wrote:
>
> -- Ti "Melbourne people are sooks. Come here for a holiday. Please.
> I need the company." mC.

Absence makes the heart grow fonder, huh?


--
cfsmtb

[Bleve]

wrote:

[chomp]

> It's weird arriving at a shop, ambient is about 5C (add
> windchill and it felt more like -2) and the employees are rugged up
> moaining about the cold and I'm standing there sweating.

That doesn't last long though, does it? :)

[Theo Bekkers]

Stuart Lamble wrote:
> On 2007-06-21, > wrote:
>> I bet you put pineapple on pizza...
>
> Mmmm... pineapple ... pizza ... must order a nice Hawaiian pizza for
> dinner ...

Nah, pineapple ruins the anchovies.

Theo

[Theo Bekkers]

cfsmtb wrote:
> TimC Wrote:
>>
>> 4C? I read that as -4. -4 is expected here overnight, -5 the next
>> morning. Sooks. The lot of ya..
>
> Pfffffffff!
>
> -9 in Mt Hotham tonight. Parr-tay time!

We get the occasional frost at home but Perth recorded its lowest ever
official temp two years ago at 0.0ºC.

I lived in the US (Ohio) during the winter of 69-70. The lowest the temp got
was -28ºF. You don't go outside unless your ears are covered.

Theo

[Rory Williams[_16_]]

Theo Bekkers Wrote:
> cfsmtb wrote:
> > TimC Wrote:
> >>
> >> 4C? I read that as -4. -4 is expected here overnight, -5 the next
> >> morning. Sooks. The lot of ya..
> >
> > Pfffffffff!
> >
> > -9 in Mt Hotham tonight. Parr-tay time!
>
> We get the occasional frost at home but Perth recorded its lowest ever
> official temp two years ago at 0.0ºC.
>
> I lived in the US (Ohio) during the winter of 69-70. The lowest the
> temp got
> was -28ºF. You don't go outside unless your ears are covered.
>
> Theo

Northern Alberta January 1989. Raced at -18C, trained at -26C (big
mistake) saw -32C.

We don't have much to complain about here in the winter

RoryW


--
Rory Williams

[TimC]

On 2007-06-22, Rory Williams (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
>
> Theo Bekkers Wrote:
>> cfsmtb wrote:
>> > TimC Wrote:
>> >>
>> >> 4C? I read that as -4. -4 is expected here overnight, -5 the next
>> >> morning. Sooks. The lot of ya..
>> >
>> > Pfffffffff!
>> >
>> > -9 in Mt Hotham tonight. Parr-tay time!
>>
>> We get the occasional frost at home but Perth recorded its lowest ever
>> official temp two years ago at 0.0ºC.
>>
>> I lived in the US (Ohio) during the winter of 69-70. The lowest the
>> temp got
>> was -28ºF. You don't go outside unless your ears are covered.
>
> Northern Alberta January 1989. Raced at -18C, trained at -26C (big
> mistake) saw -32C.

Uphill? Both ways? In the snow?

;)

--
TimC
Usage: fortune -P [-f] -a [xsz] Q: file [rKe9] -v6[+] file1 ...

[Theo Bekkers]

TimC wrote:
> On 2007-06-22, Rory Williams (aka Bruce)
> was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
>>
>> Theo Bekkers Wrote:
>>> cfsmtb wrote:
>>>> TimC Wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 4C? I read that as -4. -4 is expected here overnight, -5 the
>>>>> next morning. Sooks. The lot of ya..
>>>>
>>>> Pfffffffff!
>>>>
>>>> -9 in Mt Hotham tonight. Parr-tay time!
>>>
>>> We get the occasional frost at home but Perth recorded its lowest
>>> ever official temp two years ago at 0.0ºC.
>>>
>>> I lived in the US (Ohio) during the winter of 69-70. The lowest the
>>> temp got
>>> was -28ºF. You don't go outside unless your ears are covered.
>>
>> Northern Alberta January 1989. Raced at -18C, trained at -26C (big
>> mistake) saw -32C.
>
> Uphill? Both ways? In the snow?

With a headwind!

Ohio is fairly flat, and flat=windy. The forecasters would happily talk
about a wind-chill factor of -70ºF or lower.

Theo

Theo

[Rory Williams[_17_]]

Theo Bekkers Wrote:
> TimC wrote:
> >> Northern Alberta January 1989. Raced at -18C, trained at -26C (big
> >> mistake) saw -32C.
> >
> > Uphill? Both ways? In the snow?
>
> With a headwind!
>
> Ohio is fairly flat, and flat=windy. The forecasters would happily
> talk
> about a wind-chill factor of -70ºF or lower.
>
> Theo
>
> Theo[/color]

Biathlon races on cross-country skis on the course built for the '88
winter games at Calgary /Canmore.
Amazing facility with not a lot of people using it. one 2.5 km loop
lit everynight until 9pm. We went there to train and race and by
joining the local club had full access to the facilities.

Cant remember much about the wind, the tracks were mostly down in the
trees so it wasn't a big issue.

RoryW


--
Rory Williams

[ProfTournesol[_25_]]

cfsmtb Wrote:
>
>
>
>
> "Without question, the greatest invention in the history of mankind is
> beer. Oh, I grant you that the wheel was also a fine invention, but the
> wheel does not go nearly as well with pizza.”

whatdya mean? You put your pizza on a disc wheel!


--
ProfTournesol

[Resound[_2_]]

"Theo Bekkers" > wrote in message
...
> Stuart Lamble wrote:
>> On 2007-06-21, > wrote:
>>> I bet you put pineapple on pizza...
>>
>> Mmmm... pineapple ... pizza ... must order a nice Hawaiian pizza for
>> dinner ...
>
> Nah, pineapple ruins the anchovies.
>
Oh I dunno about that. As long as there are planty of jalapenos on there as
well.

You think I'm kidding don't you?

[Aeek]

On Fri, 22 Jun 2007 23:19:03 +1000, "Resound" >
wrote:

>
>"Theo Bekkers" > wrote in message
...

>>
>> Nah, pineapple ruins the anchovies.
>>
>Oh I dunno about that. As long as there are planty of jalapenos on there as
>well.
>
>You think I'm kidding don't you?

I've ordered that, nice!

[cfsmtb[_281_]]

Resound Wrote:
>
> Oh I dunno about that. As long as there are planty of jalapenos on
> there as
> well.

Our Jalapeno & Habaneros plants is still attempting to fruit, hopefully
having them in a corner with bricks either side will help them to
winter. Funny thing is, the Jalapeno fruit have been actually hotter
than the Habanero. Probably several variables made that occur, but
shouldn't it be the other way around? ;) Types in the word bicycle to
stay within the a.b terms of reference.


--
cfsmtb

[Resound[_2_]]

"cfsmtb" > wrote in message
...
>
> Resound Wrote:
>>
>> Oh I dunno about that. As long as there are planty of jalapenos on
>> there as
>> well.
>
> Our Jalapeno & Habaneros plants is still attempting to fruit, hopefully
> having them in a corner with bricks either side will help them to
> winter. Funny thing is, the Jalapeno fruit have been actually hotter
> than the Habanero. Probably several variables made that occur, but
> shouldn't it be the other way around? ;) Types in the word bicycle to
> stay within the a.b terms of reference.

I find that the jalapenos are hotter but sweeter. They play particularly
well with fruity stuff like pineapple.

[Resound[_2_]]

"Resound" > wrote in message
u...
>
> "cfsmtb" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> Resound Wrote:
>>>
>>> Oh I dunno about that. As long as there are planty of jalapenos on
>>> there as
>>> well.
>>
>> Our Jalapeno & Habaneros plants is still attempting to fruit, hopefully
>> having them in a corner with bricks either side will help them to
>> winter. Funny thing is, the Jalapeno fruit have been actually hotter
>> than the Habanero. Probably several variables made that occur, but
>> shouldn't it be the other way around? ;) Types in the word bicycle to
>> stay within the a.b terms of reference.
>
> I find that the jalapenos are hotter but sweeter. They play particularly
> well with fruity stuff like pineapple.

Oh, and preferably immediately before or after riding a Colnago framed
fixie. Or something.