New bike placebo?

[[email protected]]

Hi All,

I finally took my new bike out for a ride. I'd been saving it as a
combo birthday present to myself, and reward for reaching a certain
goal in my weigh-loss plan.

It is a bit bigger than my old bike, mostly so I can have the bars a
bit higher without resorting to extreme measures. I set up the bike
with the bars 1cm higher and 1cm farther than my old bike. Seat
relative to bb is the same. The wheels are the same, I just swapped
them over. The geometry is the same, except for a slightly longer top
tube and head-tube.

Somehow the new bike is so much better than the old one that I can't
belive it. It absolutely blew me away on the ride today. I was carving
into corners, and sprinting out of them, and just flying. Over bumpy
pavement, I just floated over like it was nothing. My old bike was
much more jarring on the same sections, and didn't urge me to wail
through turns.

So why is this bike SOOOOO much better? It is almost 3kg lighter,
which might make a difference in the sprung to unsprung ratio over
bumps, but what about cornering? The new bike is super stiff (I would
be hard pressed to find a stiffer frame). Could the stiffness of the
frame be keeping things more precise in turns? It is made from
Magnesium, which I have read has absorbtion properties that make it
good for bikes, but I always assumed that was just BS. Pinarello also
uses swoopy double curved forks and seat stays which according to
their marketing pitch help the ride, but I also figured this was BS.
Could all that actually have a hint of truth to it?

But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
really make that much difference?

Joseph

[Lou Holtman[_2_]]

wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I finally took my new bike out for a ride. I'd been saving it as a
> combo birthday present to myself, and reward for reaching a certain
> goal in my weigh-loss plan.
>
> It is a bit bigger than my old bike, mostly so I can have the bars a
> bit higher without resorting to extreme measures. I set up the bike
> with the bars 1cm higher and 1cm farther than my old bike. Seat
> relative to bb is the same. The wheels are the same, I just swapped
> them over. The geometry is the same, except for a slightly longer top
> tube and head-tube.
>
> Somehow the new bike is so much better than the old one that I can't
> belive it. It absolutely blew me away on the ride today. I was carving
> into corners, and sprinting out of them, and just flying. Over bumpy
> pavement, I just floated over like it was nothing. My old bike was
> much more jarring on the same sections, and didn't urge me to wail
> through turns.
>
> So why is this bike SOOOOO much better? It is almost 3kg lighter,
> which might make a difference in the sprung to unsprung ratio over
> bumps, but what about cornering? The new bike is super stiff (I would
> be hard pressed to find a stiffer frame). Could the stiffness of the
> frame be keeping things more precise in turns? It is made from
> Magnesium, which I have read has absorbtion properties that make it
> good for bikes, but I always assumed that was just BS. Pinarello also
> uses swoopy double curved forks and seat stays which according to
> their marketing pitch help the ride, but I also figured this was BS.
> Could all that actually have a hint of truth to it?
>
> But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
> really make that much difference?
>
> Joseph


Don't worry/overanalyse so much, just enjoy your bike damned. I'm glad
it worked out.
Every bike feels different even if the geometry/position is exactly the
same. Your shape and fitness is a much greater factor whether a ride
feels comfortable or responsive.

Lou

[[email protected]]

On May 2, 8:52*pm, Colin Campbell > wrote:
> Are you nuts? *You've had a new bike for more than 60 seconds without
> riding it? *And I suppose I have to say "Happy Birthday" and
> "Congratulations on hitting your weight loss target" to a guy who can
> resist riding a new bike, too.
>
> Part of what you experienced might be just because it's new. *What have
> you been riding? *And which model Pinarello did you get, with what
> components?

Old bike was a 2005 Pinarello Galileo with Ultegra. New bike is Dogma
with Dura Ace, but the same Ultegra Velocity Deep-V wheels. I got the
frame in November, so I have been waiting for this day for a while.

The old bike is in top condition, with new chain, cables, etc so it is
functionally as new.

> You lucky dog! *I've been having to get excited about new shoes that we
> were able to buy for half price on a club deal.

If I could find shoes that fit...

Joseph

[[email protected]]

On May 2, 8:52*pm, Lou Holtman > wrote:
> wrote:
> > Hi All,
>
> > I finally took my new bike out for a ride. I'd been saving it as a
> > combo birthday present to myself, and reward for reaching a certain
> > goal in my weigh-loss plan.
>
> > It is a bit bigger than my old bike, mostly so I can have the bars a
> > bit higher without resorting to extreme measures. I set up the bike
> > with the bars 1cm higher and 1cm farther than my old bike. Seat
> > relative to bb is the same. The wheels are the same, I just swapped
> > them over. The geometry is the same, except for a slightly longer top
> > tube and head-tube.
>
> > Somehow the new bike is so much better than the old one that I can't
> > belive it. It absolutely blew me away on the ride today. I was carving
> > into corners, and sprinting out of them, and just flying. Over bumpy
> > pavement, I just floated over like it was nothing. My old bike was
> > much more jarring on the same sections, and didn't urge me to wail
> > through turns.
>
> > So why is this bike SOOOOO much better? It is almost 3kg lighter,
> > which might make a difference in the sprung to unsprung ratio over
> > bumps, but what about cornering? The new bike is super stiff (I would
> > be hard pressed to find a stiffer frame). Could the stiffness of the
> > frame be keeping things more precise in turns? It is made from
> > Magnesium, which I have read has absorbtion properties that make it
> > good for bikes, but I always assumed that was just BS. Pinarello also
> > uses swoopy double curved forks and seat stays which according to
> > their marketing pitch help the ride, but I also figured this was BS.
> > Could all that actually have a hint of truth to it?
>
> > But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
> > really make that much difference?
>
> > Joseph
>
> Don't worry/overanalyse so much, just enjoy your bike damned. I'm glad
> it worked out.
> Every bike feels different even if the geometry/position is exactly the
> same. Your shape and fitness is a much greater factor whether a ride
> feels comfortable or responsive.
>
> Lou

I was so freaked by the ride that I pulled the wheels and popped them
back on the old bike and took it for a spin right after. Very strange.
And I'd ridden the old bike just yesterday too, so it was and is fresh
in my mind. Old bike was sold this afternoon, so now I have only my
memory to go by.

Joseph

[TBerk]

On May 2, 11:28 am, "
> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I finally took my new bike out for a ride. I'd been saving it as a
> combo birthday present to myself, and reward for reaching a certain
> goal in my weigh-loss plan.
<snip>
> But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
> really make that much difference?
>
> Joseph


The last time I spent funds on a brand new bike I test drove it and
ended up at the ATM where I withdrew enough cash to drive the thing
home. I barely got off the bike after 1st getting on it.

Its not just 'new car smell', I'll bet it is a combination of things
though.


TBerk

[Peter Cole[_2_]]

wrote:

> But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
> really make that much difference?

I think so, particularly in larger sizes. I noticed this right away when
I switched to a new Cannondale several years ago, switching over all
components. People claim Cannondales are harsh, I never noticed that. I
did notice it felt much more stable in turns. I think it's the
torsional rigidity.

[Jay Beattie]

On May 2, 12:32*pm, Peter Cole > wrote:
> wrote:
> > But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
> > really make that much difference?
>
> I think so, particularly in larger sizes. I noticed this right away when
> I switched to a new Cannondale several years ago, switching over all
> components. People claim Cannondales are harsh, I never noticed that. I
> * did notice it felt much more stable in turns. I think it's the
> torsional rigidity.

Weight also matters -- 3kg is a significant weight loss I'm pretty
big, too, and find that tortional stiffness in the top tube/head tube
and a stiff BB make a whole lot of difference climbing out of the
saddle. Cannondale has made real efforts to maintain stiffness in
those areas while making the frame somewhat more limber than the
original rides-like-rocks 6061 straight gauge tubing frames. They
also use fairly long top tubes (which I like) and wheel bases that are
not ridiculously short -- just short. It is a good budget bike. -- Jay
Beattie.

[[email protected]]

On May 2, 9:32*pm, Peter Cole > wrote:
> wrote:
> > But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
> > really make that much difference?
>
> I think so, particularly in larger sizes. I noticed this right away when
> I switched to a new Cannondale several years ago, switching over all
> components. People claim Cannondales are harsh, I never noticed that. I
> * did notice it felt much more stable in turns. I think it's the
> torsional rigidity.

The bike has an extremely beefy fork too. I wonder how much a more
normal fork sags under 100kg? I suppose I could ask someone ot measure
the wheelbase with me on the bike, but I don't have the old one to
compare to anymore. I wonder what effect sag would have on handling?

Joseph

[[email protected]]

On May 2, 10:57*pm, Colin Campbell > wrote:
> wrote:
> > On May 2, 8:52 pm, Colin Campbell > wrote:
> >> Are you nuts? *You've had a new bike for more than 60 seconds without
> >> riding it? *And I suppose I have to say "Happy Birthday" and
> >> "Congratulations on hitting your weight loss target" to a guy who can
> >> resist riding a new bike, too.
>
> >> Part of what you experienced might be just because it's new. *What have
> >> you been riding? *And which model Pinarello did you get, with what
> >> components?
>
> > Old bike was a 2005 Pinarello Galileo with Ultegra. New bike is Dogma
> > with Dura Ace, but the same Ultegra Velocity Deep-V wheels. I got the
> > frame in November, so I have been waiting for this day for a while.
>
> > The old bike is in top condition, with new chain, cables, etc so it is
> > functionally as new.
>
> >> You lucky dog! *I've been having to get excited about new shoes that we
> >> were able to buy for half price on a club deal.
>
> > If I could find shoes that fit...
>
> > Joseph
>
> Well, these shoes LOOK good; it remains to be seen how well they fit.
>
> DMT Magnesium shoes in white (I wasn't brave enough to go for the
> Petacchi yellow). *I learned that these shoes are incompatible with
> Campagnolo Record Pro-Fit cleats. *DMT said that they'll have a fix for
> next model year; meanwhile, they say they are sending me special screws
> from Italy.
>
> It took a trip to the bike shop and using some washers from some Shimano
> cleats to get the cleats on. *I haven't finished setting the position yet.

[Dan O]

On May 2, 11:28 am, "
> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I finally took my new bike out for a ride. I'd been saving it as a
> combo birthday present to myself, and reward for reaching a certain
> goal in my weigh-loss plan.
>
> It is a bit bigger than my old bike, mostly so I can have the bars a
> bit higher without resorting to extreme measures. I set up the bike
> with the bars 1cm higher and 1cm farther than my old bike. Seat
> relative to bb is the same. The wheels are the same, I just swapped
> them over. The geometry is the same, except for a slightly longer top
> tube and head-tube.
>
> Somehow the new bike is so much better than the old one that I can't
> belive it. It absolutely blew me away on the ride today. I was carving
> into corners, and sprinting out of them, and just flying. Over bumpy
> pavement, I just floated over like it was nothing. My old bike was
> much more jarring on the same sections, and didn't urge me to wail
> through turns.
>
> So why is this bike SOOOOO much better? It is almost 3kg lighter,
> which might make a difference in the sprung to unsprung ratio over
> bumps, but what about cornering? The new bike is super stiff (I would
> be hard pressed to find a stiffer frame). Could the stiffness of the
> frame be keeping things more precise in turns? It is made from
> Magnesium, which I have read has absorbtion properties that make it
> good for bikes, but I always assumed that was just BS. Pinarello also
> uses swoopy double curved forks and seat stays which according to
> their marketing pitch help the ride, but I also figured this was BS.
> Could all that actually have a hint of truth to it?
>
> But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
> really make that much difference?
>
> Joseph

(Sorry for not trimming the context, but I am really replying to the
whole thing.)

Placebo effect is real, of course, but I think in this case there's
probably more going on. You've been intimately getting familiar with
this bike for some time - selecting, building, thinking about and
patiently working toward the end objectives. When the time to ride
finally came, things worked out like they should and hopefully would.

When I was 16 years old, I spent the winter building a racing bike
(motorcycle). On the first race day, I had hardly ever ridden the
thing at all, but had been living and working with it for some time.
On the track everything felt fast and just about perfect, IIRC. The
bike just disappeared under me (or vice-versa... or something), and we
were a unified entity. I finished very well the first time out, and a
highly respected friend simply said, "You should have been riding that
bike all along."

I think I can relate to the feeling you describe, and it made me smile
to read it.

(Luck can be a factor, too.)

[[email protected]]

On May 3, 5:52*pm, Dan O > wrote:
> On May 2, 11:28 am, "
>
>
>
> > wrote:
> > Hi All,
>
> > I finally took my new bike out for a ride. I'd been saving it as a
> > combo birthday present to myself, and reward for reaching a certain
> > goal in my weigh-loss plan.
>
> > It is a bit bigger than my old bike, mostly so I can have the bars a
> > bit higher without resorting to extreme measures. I set up the bike
> > with the bars 1cm higher and 1cm farther than my old bike. Seat
> > relative to bb is the same. The wheels are the same, I just swapped
> > them over. The geometry is the same, except for a slightly longer top
> > tube and head-tube.
>
> > Somehow the new bike is so much better than the old one that I can't
> > belive it. It absolutely blew me away on the ride today. I was carving
> > into corners, and sprinting out of them, and just flying. Over bumpy
> > pavement, I just floated over like it was nothing. My old bike was
> > much more jarring on the same sections, and didn't urge me to wail
> > through turns.
>
> > So why is this bike SOOOOO much better? It is almost 3kg lighter,
> > which might make a difference in the sprung to unsprung ratio over
> > bumps, but what about cornering? The new bike is super stiff (I would
> > be hard pressed to find a stiffer frame). Could the stiffness of the
> > frame be keeping things more precise in turns? It is made from
> > Magnesium, which I have read has absorbtion properties that make it
> > good for bikes, but I always assumed that was just BS. Pinarello also
> > uses swoopy double curved forks and seat stays which according to
> > their marketing pitch help the ride, but I also figured this was BS.
> > Could all that actually have a hint of truth to it?
>
> > But there must be some explanation beyond placebo. Could the stiffness
> > really make that much difference?
>
> > Joseph
>
> (Sorry for not trimming the context, but I am really replying to the
> whole thing.)
>
> Placebo effect is real, of course, but I think in this case there's
> probably more going on. *You've been intimately getting familiar with
> this bike for some time - selecting, building, thinking about and
> patiently working toward the end objectives. *When the time to ride
> finally came, things worked out like they should and hopefully would.
>
> When I was 16 years old, I spent the winter building a racing bike
> (motorcycle). *On the first race day, I had hardly ever ridden the
> thing at all, but had been living and working with it for some time.
> On the track everything felt fast and just about perfect, IIRC. *The
> bike just disappeared under me (or vice-versa... or something), and we
> were a unified entity. *I finished very well the first time out, and a
> highly respected friend simply said, "You should have been riding that
> bike all along."
>
> I think I can relate to the feeling you describe, and it made me smile
> to read it.
>
> (Luck can *be a factor, too.)

Sounds like a very similar experience. I did indeed spend a lot of
time over several months thinking about and detrmining things like bar
angle, etc. On the first ride I had with me hex keys and was planning
on making adjustments. Everything was perfect. I had high hopes for
the bike, but I was also a little concerned I would be let down by
having such perhaps unrealistically high expectations. Any worries
were completely unfounded. It is awsome. Today it was just as good.

Joseph

[Ron Ruff]

On May 2, 12:28*pm, "
> wrote:
> So why is this bike SOOOOO much better?

I'm envious. I built up a new frame last Nov... went from a flexy
3.5lb Ti frame with heavy fork to 2.4lb stiff carbon frame with a
light fork. Unfortunately the maiden voyage was after a forced 2 week
layoff because of a back injury... and I was super slow. Stiff frame,
yes... I liked that part... but my first time up a local hill I was a
full 20% off the pace I'd set only a few weeks early. I figured I'd
lost some fitness, but 20%? I found myself looking at Ti frames on
ebay. Anyway, I'm still a long way from matching my performances from
last fall.

How did you lose 3kg on the bike? That seems like an incredible amount
considering that your old one was pretty good.

[A Muzi]

> > wrote:
>> So why is this bike SOOOOO much better?

Ron Ruff wrote:
> I'm envious. I built up a new frame last Nov... went from a flexy
> 3.5lb Ti frame with heavy fork to 2.4lb stiff carbon frame with a
> light fork. Unfortunately the maiden voyage was after a forced 2 week
> layoff because of a back injury... and I was super slow. Stiff frame,
> yes... I liked that part... but my first time up a local hill I was a
> full 20% off the pace I'd set only a few weeks early. I figured I'd
> lost some fitness, but 20%? I found myself looking at Ti frames on
> ebay. Anyway, I'm still a long way from matching my performances from
> last fall.
> How did you lose 3kg on the bike? That seems like an incredible amount
> considering that your old one was pretty good.

Maybe it's shiny red, a known 'fast color'.
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

[datakoll]

ITS ITS ITS MAGNESIUM

now we know why joe has feet larger than our feet ?

[Peter Cole[_2_]]

Jay Beattie wrote:
> Cannondale [...] It is a good budget bike. -- Jay
> Beattie.

Ouch. I've always considered it my "good" bike. I had no idea things had
gone so upscale. Looks like I'll have to start riding at night.

[Tom Sherman[_2_]]

datakoll aka GENE daniels wrote:
> ITS ITS ITS MAGNESIUM
>
> now we know why joe has feet larger than our feet ?

A breakthrough in dietary science!

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[[email protected]]

On May 3, 10:23*pm, Ron Ruff > wrote:
> On May 2, 12:28*pm, "
>
> > wrote:
> > So why is this bike SOOOOO much better?
>
> I'm envious. I built up a new frame last Nov... went from a flexy
> 3.5lb Ti frame with heavy fork to 2.4lb stiff carbon frame with a
> light fork. Unfortunately the maiden voyage was after a forced 2 week
> layoff because of a back injury... and I was super slow. Stiff frame,
> yes... I liked that part... but my first time up a local hill I was a
> full 20% off the pace I'd set only a few weeks early. I figured I'd
> lost some fitness, but 20%? I found myself looking at Ti frames on
> ebay. Anyway, I'm still a long way from matching my performances from
> last fall.
>
> How did you lose 3kg on the bike? That seems like an incredible amount
> considering that your old one was pretty good.

I steered clear of any hills! I stuck to where I and the bike had a
chance to shine. One part that stands out is an off camber left I take
that is often strewn with gravel. The approach is also blind to
oncoming traffic, and immediately after the turn, the road sweeps to
the right. I normally approach preoccupied with the potential oncoming
traffic, ready to stop if needed and take it easy in the turn, wary of
the camber and gravel and once around the second curve, resume
pedalling. This time I stormed toward the turn, confident that if a
car were coming, I could just go straight instead of turning, and I
blazed through the turn leaning well farther than I have done for 20
years, and stood and sprinted out of the turn into the next one, the
bike doing that mid-turn sprint side to side, tracking perfectly the
whole time in total control.

If I had gone to some steep hill, I'm sur ethe bike would still have
felt better than the other one, but I would have still felt slow and
not really have noticed how much the bike is better.

I was mistaken. 3kg is too much. That would be counting the
lightweight wheels I wasn't using. More like 1.9kg from lighter frame,
fork, seat, post, bars, stem, Dura Ace vs Ultegra, etc.

Joseph

[[email protected]]

On May 3, 10:41*pm, A Muzi > wrote:
> > > wrote:
> >> So why is this bike SOOOOO much better?
> Ron Ruff wrote:
> > I'm envious. I built up a new frame last Nov... went from a flexy
> > 3.5lb Ti frame with heavy fork to 2.4lb stiff carbon frame with a
> > light fork. Unfortunately the maiden voyage was after a forced 2 week
> > layoff because of a back injury... and I was super slow. Stiff frame,
> > yes... I liked that part... but my first time up a local hill I was a
> > full 20% off the pace I'd set only a few weeks early. I figured I'd
> > lost some fitness, but 20%? I found myself looking at Ti frames on
> > ebay. Anyway, I'm still a long way from matching my performances from
> > last fall.
> > How did you lose 3kg on the bike? That seems like an incredible amount
> > considering that your old one was pretty good.
>
> Maybe it's shiny red, a known 'fast color'.
> --
> Andrew Muzi
> * <www.yellowjersey.org/>
> * Open every day since 1 April, 1971
> ** Posted fromhttp://www.teranews.com**

Matte white and satin black. Now I need a new helmet! Color
coordination has a slimming effect you know...

Joseph

[[email protected]]

On May 3, 11:39*pm, Tom Sherman >
wrote:
> datakoll aka GENE daniels wrote:
>
> > ITS ITS ITS MAGNESIUM
>
> > now we know why joe has feet larger than our feet ?
>
> A breakthrough in dietary science!
>
> --
> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
> The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

I try not to put my feet in my mouth. At least not both at the same
time.

Joseph

[datakoll]

WHY IS THAT ?

how cum ?

IT DOESN'T ROT WHEN YOU SNEEZE AT IT

why is that ? metallurgy

THEY PAINT IT NOW

[datakoll]

golly I do hope IT IS made from Magnesium

[datakoll]

his brother in law hijacked a truck full of it

[datakoll]

WHY ARE MAGNESIUM BIKES GOOD FOR TOURING IN COLD CLIMATES ?

[Tom Sherman[_2_]]

datakoll aka gene daniels wrote:
>
> golly I do hope IT IS made from Magnesium

Or?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[Tom Sherman[_2_]]

datakoll aka GENE DANIELS wrote:
>
> WHY ARE MAGNESIUM BIKES GOOD FOR TOURING IN COLD CLIMATES ?

You can burn the frame for heat in an emergency?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[Tom Sherman[_2_]]

datakoll aka GeNe DaNiElS wrote:
>
> WHY IS THAT ?
>
It started out farther behind.

> how cum ?
>
Er, family newsgroup.

> IT DOESN'T ROT WHEN YOU SNEEZE AT IT
>
And that is nothing to sneeze at.

> why is that ? metallurgy
>
Ask Bourbon Man.

> THEY PAINT IT NOW
>
Indeed.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[datakoll]

On May 3, 9:32*pm, Tom Sherman >
wrote:
> datakoll aka GENE DANIELS wrote:
>
>
>
> > WHY ARE MAGNESIUM BIKES GOOD FOR TOURING IN COLD CLIMATES ?
>
> You can burn the frame for heat in an emergency?
>
> --
> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
> The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

YES !! and a free can of BLUBBER for Tom Sherman of Lower Canada

[datakoll]

costs too much to send the stuff to italy to get it hijacked by
Pinerallo's brother in law

[Tom Sherman[_2_]]

datakoll aka gene daniels wrote:
>
> costs too much to send the stuff to italy to get it hijacked by
> Pinerallo's brother in law

Demand has dropped since the VW Type I finally ceased production.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[Tom Sherman[_2_]]

datakoll aka gene daniels wrote:
> On May 3, 9:32 pm, Tom Sherman >
> wrote:
>> datakoll aka GENE DANIELS wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> WHY ARE MAGNESIUM BIKES GOOD FOR TOURING IN COLD CLIMATES ?
>> You can burn the frame for heat in an emergency?
>
> YES !! and a free can of BLUBBER for Tom Sherman of Lower Canada

Mmmm, blubber. Yum.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[Nate Nagel[_2_]]

Tom Sherman wrote:
> datakoll aka GENE DANIELS wrote:
>
>>
>> WHY ARE MAGNESIUM BIKES GOOD FOR TOURING IN COLD CLIMATES ?
>
>
> You can burn the frame for heat in an emergency?
>

Heh. I had a very similar thought when I replaced the anode in my water
heater late last year. I had a pocketknife in my hand, and the old
anode in another, and sadly, common sense kicked in...

nate

http://youtube.com/watch?v=GZ8iFwlYBrI

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

[Chalo]

The inscrutable datakoll wrote:
>
> WHY IS THAT ?
>
> how cum ?
>
> IT DOESN'T ROT WHEN YOU SNEEZE AT IT
>
> why is that ? metallurgy
>
> THEY PAINT IT NOW

A few years ago (in 1999 if I remember correctly) I machined a
handlebar stem for my sweetheart's bike from a block of magnesium,
with a stainless steel quill press-fitted into the stem extension. I
did not paint of otherwise coat the stem at that time, and she still
has that bike. The stem looks as crusty as if it had been salvaged
from a shipwreck. So far, there has not been enough corrosion to
undermine the quill's press fit or the threads for clamping down the
pillow block.

If I were to make another bike part from magnesium now, I'd be certain
to paint it or powdercoat it.

Chalo

[datakoll]

NAME 3 USES FOR MAGNESIUM BICYCLES

A. you can carry one in the MG's trunk

[datakoll]

On May 3, 10:29*pm, Chalo > wrote:
> The inscrutable datakoll wrote:
>
> > WHY IS THAT ?
>
> > how cum ?
>
> > IT DOESN'T ROT WHEN YOU SNEEZE AT IT
>
> > why is that ? metallurgy
>
> > THEY PAINT *IT NOW
>
> A few years ago (in 1999 if I remember correctly) I machined a
> handlebar stem for my sweetheart's bike from a block of magnesium,
> with a stainless steel quill press-fitted into the stem extension. *I
> did not paint of otherwise coat the stem at that time, and she still
> has that bike. *The stem looks as crusty as if it had been salvaged
> from a shipwreck. *So far, there has not been enough corrosion to
> undermine the quill's press fit or the threads for clamping down the
> pillow block.
>
> If I were to make another bike part from magnesium now, I'd be certain
> to paint it or powdercoat it.
>
> Chalo

"So far, there has not been enough corrosion to
undermine the quill's press fit or the threads for clamping down the
pillow block."

A SAFETY FEATURE !!

[datakoll]

doesn't take paint ?

no, it floats

[Tom Sherman[_2_]]

datakoll aka gene daniels wrote:
>
> NAME 3 USES FOR MAGNESIUM BICYCLES
>
> A. you can carry one in the MG's trunk
>
KINDLING!

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[datakoll]

HARBOR PATROL !!

[Jay Beattie]

On May 3, 2:38*pm, Peter Cole > wrote:
> Jay Beattie wrote:
> > Cannondale [...] *It is a good budget bike. -- Jay
> > Beattie.
>
> Ouch. I've always considered it my "good" bike. I had no idea things had
> gone so upscale. Looks like I'll have to start riding at night.

I am talking about my cheap-o CAAD3, which I got free as a replacement
for a broken 2.8. I guess that Cannondale does have some pretty
spendy frames now, but IMO, they are still bargains compared to many
of the CF show bikes I see promenading around here. -- Jay Beattie.

[Carl Sundquist]

"datakoll" > wrote in message
...
>
> HARBOR PATROL !!
>

I thought it was Kirk.

[datakoll]

poisons the water table causing birth defects and a craving for blubber

[datakoll]

AND BRACYOSUBLIMNAL CRAINIAL SYMBIALYSIS

amung other health risks

[datakoll]

On May 4, 2:29*pm, datakoll > wrote:
> AND BRACYOSUBLIMNAL CRAINIAL SYMBIALYSIS
>
> amung other health risks

email suggests soaking the foot in a solution of warm water and apple
vinegar for 10 minutes dissolving the tubing.

[Carl Sundquist]

"datakoll" > wrote in message
...
On May 4, 2:29 pm, datakoll > wrote:
> AND BRACYOSUBLIMNAL CRAINIAL SYMBIALYSIS
>
> amung other health risks

email suggests soaking the foot in a solution of warm water and apple
vinegar for 10 minutes dissolving the tubing.


What if it's coated with linseed oil?

[datakoll]

> What if it's coated with linseed oil?

you're coating emails with linseed ?

[datakoll]

http://www.sunfood.com/b2c/ecom/ecomEnduser/items/xt_itemDetailNF.aspx?itemNum=1325&siteId=1&bulkexists=0&gclid=COKciKmDjpMCFQezsgodvBwbAA


I wonder what a Qt of oil costs in Norway?

[Tom Sherman[_2_]]

datakoll aka gene daniels wrote:
>
> http://www.sunfood.com/b2c/ecom/ecomEnduser/items/xt_itemDetailNF.aspx?itemNum=1325&siteId=1&bulkexists=0&gclid=COKciKmDjpMCFQezsgodvBwbAA
>
>
> I wonder what a Qt of oil costs in Norway?
>
Probably more than a liter of oil despite the slightly lower volume,
since they do not normally use quarts in Norway.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

[A Muzi]

datakoll wrote:
> http://www.sunfood.com/b2c/ecom/ecomEnduser/items/xt_itemDetailNF.aspx?itemNum=1325&siteId=1&bulkexists=0&gclid=COKciKmDjpMCFQezsgodvBwbAA
> I wonder what a Qt of oil costs in Norway?


Some good it will do:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/29/health/research/29nost.html
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

[Carl Sundquist]

"datakoll" > wrote in message
...
>
>> What if it's coated with linseed oil?
>
> you're coating emails with linseed ?
>

Just the keyboard and monitor.

[datakoll]

On May 4, 9:53*pm, "Carl Sundquist" > wrote:
> "datakoll" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
>
>
> >> What if it's coated with linseed oil?
>
> > you're coating emails with linseed ?
>
> Just the keyboard and monitor.

NO ! I feed my monitor fresh burrowing owls

[datakoll]

4 TASTY RECIPES FOR BLUBBER
by Albut Juan

and

http://209.85.207.104/search?q=cache:_vOLbf3vWd4J:www.amazon.com/Mountain-Biking-Eastern-Sierras-Trails/dp/0938665421+Mountain+Biking+the+Eastern+Sierra%27s+ Best+100+Trails&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

and the always popular

SAVING YOUR MAGNESIUM BICYCLE
by Antoine Alexandre Brutus Bussy

[Carl Sundquist]

"datakoll" > wrote in message
...
On May 4, 9:53 pm, "Carl Sundquist" > wrote:
> "datakoll" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
>
>
> >> What if it's coated with linseed oil?
>
> > you're coating emails with linseed ?
>
> Just the keyboard and monitor.

NO ! I feed my monitor fresh burrowing owls


There are (or at least were) burrowing owls at the velodrome in Broward
County.

[[email protected][_2_]]

On May 4, 12:29*pm, datakoll > wrote:
> AND BRACYOSUBLIMNAL CRAINIAL SYMBIALYSIS
>
> amung other health risks

They also promotes peristalsis. You end up getting the runs in the
middle of a ride.

[datakoll]

On May 5, 12:44*am, " > wrote:
> On May 4, 12:29*pm, datakoll > wrote:
>
> > AND BRACYOSUBLIMNAL CRAINIAL SYMBIALYSIS
>
> > amung other health risks
>
> They also promotes peristalsis. You end up getting the runs in the
> middle of a ride.

cudbe yawl eating too many grits

[Carl Sundquist]

"datakoll" > wrote in message
...
On May 5, 12:44 am, " > wrote:
> On May 4, 12:29 pm, datakoll > wrote:
>
> > AND BRACYOSUBLIMNAL CRAINIAL SYMBIALYSIS
>
> > amung other health risks
>
> They also promotes peristalsis. You end up getting the runs in the
> middle of a ride.

cudbe yawl eating too many grits

Magnesium grits?

[Werehatrack]

On Sat, 3 May 2008 16:47:36 -0700 (PDT), datakoll >
may have said:

>
>
>WHY IS THAT ?
>
>how cum ?
>
>IT DOESN'T ROT WHEN YOU SNEEZE AT IT
>
>why is that ? metallurgy
>
>THEY PAINT IT NOW

Magnesium still sucks as a structural material for a vibratory load.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Typoes are not a bug, they're a feature.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

[Peter Cole[_2_]]

Jay Beattie wrote:
> On May 3, 2:38 pm, Peter Cole > wrote:
>> Jay Beattie wrote:
>>> Cannondale [...] It is a good budget bike. -- Jay
>>> Beattie.
>> Ouch. I've always considered it my "good" bike. I had no idea things had
>> gone so upscale. Looks like I'll have to start riding at night.
>
> I am talking about my cheap-o CAAD3, which I got free as a replacement
> for a broken 2.8. I guess that Cannondale does have some pretty
> spendy frames now, but IMO, they are still bargains compared to many
> of the CF show bikes I see promenading around here. -- Jay Beattie.

I think I spent $450 9 years ago for my CAAD2 frame & fork, on sale. I
thought it was a lot, but then I was used to buying complete bikes for
not a lot more.

I think the reality is that anything aluminum is going to be compared to
mass-produced frames which are unbelievably cheap because of Asian
production and/or automated manufacturing. I bought a complete MTB last
year just for the frame. CF still commands a premium because of the
labor costs, although the price of CF forks have plummeted, probably a
predictor of future frame prices.

Bike stuff has a real steep knee in the price/performance curve
(whatever "performance' is -- usually weight). It's easy to get swept
up, particularly in a fancy LBS. My epiphany came when I was heading to
the cash register with a pair of $60 tires.

[Chalo]

Werehatrack wrote:
>
> Magnesium still sucks as a structural material for a vibratory load.

I'm curious what you mean by that.

I don't know much about Mg alloy's properties, but the only glaring
shortcomings I've noted are susceptibility to corrosion and iffy
thread holding.

Is there an exaggerated fatigue issue with Mg that I've not heard
about? Cast Mg fork lowers seem to hold up OK, and it looks like they
see some vibratory loads.

Chalo

[John Everett]

On Sun, 4 May 2008 05:47:12 -0700 (PDT), datakoll >
wrote:

>
>
>NAME 3 USES FOR MAGNESIUM BICYCLES
>
>A. you can carry one in the MG's trunk

B. You can use it as a road flare when your MG is stalled at the side
of the road because it's a little humid.


--
jeverett3<AT>sbcglobal<DOT>net (John V. Everett)