Cycle lights no longer needed.

[Doug[_3_]]

"Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
driver and pick them out with a spotlight.

The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."

More:
http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles

-- .
UK Radical Campaigns.
http://www.zing.icom43.net
A driving licence is a licence to kill.

[JNugent[_7_]]

On 10/12/2010 17:32, Doug wrote:

> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.

> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
> cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
> illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
> another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."

> More:
> http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles

The government are going to replace the entire UK car fleet with free Mercs!

That is FANTASTIC news!

When do we get our two?

[Graham Harrison[_3_]]

"JNugent" > wrote in message
...
> On 10/12/2010 17:32, Doug wrote:
>
>> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
>> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
>> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>
>> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
>> cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
>> illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
>> another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>
>> More:
>> http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>
> The government are going to replace the entire UK car fleet with free
> Mercs!
>
> That is FANTASTIC news!
>
> When do we get our two?

You actually WANT a Mercedes?

[Tony Dragon]

On 10/12/2010 17:32, Doug wrote:
> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>
> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
> cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
> illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
> another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>
> More:
> http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>
> -- .
> UK Radical Campaigns.
> http://www.zing.icom43.net
> A driving licence is a licence to kill.


Where can I stake my claim to one?

But apart from that :-

1 How does that change the law?
2 What about cars that do not have this ability?
3 What would happen if another road user would be dazzled?
4 What happens this year?
5 You are always telling us that automated car systems are not reliable,
why have you changed your mind?
6 Does this system absolved cyclists looking after their own safety?
7 Why have you not answered my question about cyclists lights?



--
Tony Dragon

[francis]

On Dec 10, 5:52*pm, Tony Dragon > wrote:
> On 10/12/2010 17:32, Doug wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
> > poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
> > driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>
> > The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
> > cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
> > illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
> > another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>
> > More:
> >http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>
> > -- .
> > UK Radical Campaigns.
> > *http://www.zing.icom43.net
> > A driving licence is a licence to kill.
>
> Where can I stake my claim to one?
>
> But apart from that :-
>
> 1 How does that change the law?
> 2 What about cars that do not have this ability?
> 3 What would happen if another road user would be dazzled?
> 4 What happens this year?
> 5 You are always telling us that automated car systems are not reliable,
> why have you changed your mind?
> 6 Does this system absolved cyclists looking after their own safety?
> 7 Why have you not answered my question about cyclists lights?
>
> --
> Tony Dragon

May I add
8 Why are you an idiot?

[JNugent[_7_]]

On 10/12/2010 17:48, Graham Harrison wrote:
>
> "JNugent" > wrote:
>> On 10/12/2010 17:32, Doug wrote:

>>> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
>>> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
>>> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.

>>> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
>>> cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
>>> illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
>>> another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."

>>> More:
>>> http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles

>> The government are going to replace the entire UK car fleet with free Mercs!
>> That is FANTASTIC news!
>> When do we get our two?

> You actually WANT a Mercedes?

Only on the terms implied by Doug.

And not "a" Mercedes. It'll have to be two (three if my resident youngest son
is incuded).

[Derek C]

On Dec 10, 5:32*pm, Doug > wrote:
> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>
> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
> cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
> illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
> another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>
> More:http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>
So what about the vast majority of cars on the road that are not
Mercedes? What if the system detects another road user that may be
dazzled and overrides the cyclist detection system?

I therefore believe it is still safer for cyclists to carry working
lights at night, not that many of them do so! Doug is just trying to
find another justification for those idiotic cheapskate cyclists who
don't carry lights at night.

Derek C

[Tony Dragon]

On 11/12/2010 21:44, Phil W Lee wrote:
> > considered Fri, 10 Dec 2010
> 09:53:36 -0800 (PST) the perfect time to write:
>
>> On Dec 10, 5:52 pm, Tony > wrote:
>>> On 10/12/2010 17:32, Doug wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
>>>> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
>>>> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>>>
>>>> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
>>>> cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
>>>> illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
>>>> another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>>>
>>>> More:
>>>> http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>>>
>>>> -- .
>>>> UK Radical Campaigns.
>>>> http://www.zing.icom43.net
>>>> A driving licence is a licence to kill.
>>>
>>> Where can I stake my claim to one?
>>>
>>> But apart from that :-
>>>
>>> 1 How does that change the law?
>>> 2 What about cars that do not have this ability?
>>> 3 What would happen if another road user would be dazzled?
>>> 4 What happens this year?
>>> 5 You are always telling us that automated car systems are not reliable,
>>> why have you changed your mind?
>>> 6 Does this system absolved cyclists looking after their own safety?
>>> 7 Why have you not answered my question about cyclists lights?
>>>
>>> --
>>> Tony Dragon
>>
>> May I add
>> 8 Why are you an idiot?
>
> And 9, How does it illuminate the cyclist or pedestrian with one of
> the main headlights without dazzling them?
>
> If it can't manage that, it'll be illegal in the UK anyway.
>
> Highway Code:
> 114
>
> You MUST NOT
>
> * use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort
> to other road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders
>
> [Law RVLR reg 27]
>
> Restrictions on the use of lamps other than those to which regulation
> 24 refers*
>
> 27. No person shall use, or cause or permit to be used, on a road any
> vehicle on which any lamp, hazard warning signal device or warning
> beacon of a type specified in an item in column 2 of the Table below
> is used in a manner specified in that item in column 3.
> TABLE
> (1) (2) (3)
>
> Item No.Type of lamp, hazard warning
> signal device or warning
> beacon Manner of use prohibited
>
> 1 Headlamp (a)Used so as to cause undue
> dazzle or discomfort to other
> persons using the road.
>
> (b)Used so as to be lit when a
> vehicle is parked.
>
> 2 Front fog lamp (a)Used so as to cause undue
> dazzle or discomfort to other
> persons using the road.
>
> (b)Used so as to be lit at any
> time other than in conditions
> of seriously reduced
> visibility.
>
> (c)Used so as to be lit when a
> vehicle is parked.
>
> 3 Rear fog lamp (a)Used so as to cause undue
> dazzle or discomfort to the
> driver of a following vehicle.
>
> (b)Used so as to be lit at any
> time other than in conditions
> of seriously reduced
> visibility.
>
> (c)Save in the case of an
> emergency vehicle, used so as
> to be lit when a vehicle is
> parked.
>
> 4 Reversing lamp Used so as to be lit except
> for the purpose of reversing
> the vehicle.
>
> 5 Hazard warning signal device Used other than-
> (i) to warn persons using the
> road of a temporary
> obstruction when the
> vehicle is at rest; or
>
> (ii) on a motorway or
> unrestricted
> dual-carriageway, to warn
> following drivers of a
> need to slow down due to
> a temporary obstruction
> ahead; or
>
> (iii)in the case of a bus, to
> summon assistance for the
> driver or any person
> acting as a conductor or
> inspector on the vehicle.
>
> 6 Warning beacon emitting blue Used so as to be lit except-
> light and special warning lamp (i) at the scene of an
> emergency; or
>
> (ii) when it is necessary or
> desirable either to
> indicate to persons using
> the road the urgency of
> the purpose for which the
> vehicle is being used, or
> to warn persons of the
> presence of the vehicle
> or a hazard on the road.
>
> 7 Warning beacon emitting Used so as to be lit except-
> amber light
> (i) at the scene of an
> emergency;
>
> (ii) when it is necessary or
> desirable to warn persons
> of the presence of the
> vehicle; and
>
> (iii)in the case of a
> breakdown vehicle, while
> it is being used in
> connection with, and in
> the immediate vicinity
> of, an accident or
> breakdown, or while it is
> being used to draw a
> broken-down vehicle.
>
> 8 Warning beacon emitting Used so as to be lit except
> green light whilst occupied by a medical
> practitioner registered by the
> General Medical Council
> (whether with full,
> provisional or limited
> registration) and used for the
> purposes of an emergency.
>
> 9 Warning beacon emitting Used so as to be lit on a
> yellow light road.
>
> 10 Work lamp (a)Used so as to cause undue
> dazzle or discomfort to the
> driver of any vehicle.
>
> (b)Used so as to be lit except
> for the purpose of
> illuminating a working area,
> accident, breakdown or works
> in the vicinity of the
> vehicle.
>
> 11 Any other lamp Used so as to cause undue
> dazzle or discomfort to other
> persons using the road.
>
> *Regulation 24 covers the use of front and rear position lamps, rear
> registration plate lamps, side marker lamps and end-outline marker
> lamps.

This thread arises because he will not answer the question about cyclist
lights.

--
Tony Dragon

[Doug[_3_]]

On Dec 11, 7:52*am, Derek C > wrote:
> On Dec 10, 5:32*pm, Doug > wrote:> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
> > poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
> > driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>
> > The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
> > cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
> > illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
> > another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>
> > More:http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>
> So what about the vast majority of cars on the road that are not
> Mercedes? *What if the system detects another road user that may be
> dazzled and overrides the cyclist detection system?
>
> I therefore believe it is still safer for cyclists to carry working
> lights at night, not that many of them do so! *Doug is just trying to
> find another justification for those idiotic cheapskate cyclists who
> don't carry lights at night.
>
While you, apparently, wish to find any excuse to blame vulnerable
victims and justify their motorised killers.

-- .
UK Radical Campaigns.
http://www.zing.icom43.net
A driving licence is a licence to kill.

[Tony Dragon]

On 12/12/2010 07:39, Doug wrote:
> On Dec 11, 7:52 am, Derek > wrote:
>> On Dec 10, 5:32 pm, > wrote:> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
>>> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
>>> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>>
>>> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
>>> cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
>>> illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
>>> another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>>
>>> More:http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>>
>> So what about the vast majority of cars on the road that are not
>> Mercedes? What if the system detects another road user that may be
>> dazzled and overrides the cyclist detection system?
>>
>> I therefore believe it is still safer for cyclists to carry working
>> lights at night, not that many of them do so! Doug is just trying to
>> find another justification for those idiotic cheapskate cyclists who
>> don't carry lights at night.
>>
> While you, apparently, wish to find any excuse to blame vulnerable
> victims and justify their motorised killers.
>
> -- .
> UK Radical Campaigns.
> http://www.zing.icom43.net
> A driving licence is a licence to kill.
>


Yes Doug you are so right, he wants to blame people who are blameworthy,
can't have that can we.

By the way, you still have not answered the question asked.

--
Tony Dragon

[Ian Smith]

On Sat, 11 Dec 2010, Phil W Lee > wrote:
>
> And 9, How does it illuminate the cyclist or pedestrian with one of
> the main headlights without dazzling them?
>
> If it can't manage that, it'll be illegal in the UK anyway.

Is it not legal to UK law whetehr it dazzles or not - lights may only
pivot side-to-side if they do so as a consequence of steering inputs:

"Movement of lamps and reflectors

"12.—(1) Save as provided in paragraph (2), no person shall use, or
cause or permit to be used, on a road any vehicle to which, or to any
load or equipment of which, there is fitted a lamp, reflector or
marking which is capable of being moved by swivelling, deflecting or
otherwise while the vehicle is in motion.

"(2) Paragraph (1) does not apply in respect of–

"(a)a headlamp which can be dipped only by the movement of the
headlamp or its reflector;

"(b)a headlamp which is capable of adjustment so as to compensate for
the effect of the load carried by the vehicle;

"(c)a lamp or reflector which can be deflected to the side by the
movement of, although not necessarily through the same angle as, the
front wheel or wheels of the vehicle when turned for the purpose of
steering the vehicle;"

(continues, none of which would cover this case)

Though possibly it will be allowed if they've found a way to make it
legal in Germany and then rely on teh 'legal elsewhere in teh EC'
argument.

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

[Derek C]

On Dec 12, 7:39*am, Doug > wrote:
> On Dec 11, 7:52*am, Derek C > wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Dec 10, 5:32*pm, Doug > wrote:> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
> > > poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
> > > driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>
> > > The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
> > > cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
> > > illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
> > > another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>
> > > More:http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>
> > So what about the vast majority of cars on the road that are not
> > Mercedes? *What if the system detects another road user that may be
> > dazzled and overrides the cyclist detection system?
>
> > I therefore believe it is still safer for cyclists to carry working
> > lights at night, not that many of them do so! *Doug is just trying to
> > find another justification for those idiotic cheapskate cyclists who
> > don't carry lights at night.
>
> While you, apparently, wish to find any excuse to blame vulnerable
> victims and justify their motorised killers.
>
> -- .
Motorists are less likely to accidentally kill cyclists if they can
actually see them at night. Fitting decent lights (flashing or plain)
makes this a lot easier. Do you (Doug) realise how difficult it can be
to spot a cyclist wearing dark clothes on a dark coloured bike at
night if no lights are fitted?

Derek C

[Tony Dragon]

On 12/12/2010 10:57, Derek C wrote:
> On Dec 12, 7:39 am, > wrote:
>> On Dec 11, 7:52 am, Derek > wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Dec 10, 5:32 pm, > wrote:> "Mercedes cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
>>>> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
>>>> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>>
>>>> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to detect
>>>> cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They are then
>>>> illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the system detects
>>>> another road user that may be dazzled by the light..."
>>
>>>> More:http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>>
>>> So what about the vast majority of cars on the road that are not
>>> Mercedes? What if the system detects another road user that may be
>>> dazzled and overrides the cyclist detection system?
>>
>>> I therefore believe it is still safer for cyclists to carry working
>>> lights at night, not that many of them do so! Doug is just trying to
>>> find another justification for those idiotic cheapskate cyclists who
>>> don't carry lights at night.
>>
>> While you, apparently, wish to find any excuse to blame vulnerable
>> victims and justify their motorised killers.
>>
>> -- .
> Motorists are less likely to accidentally kill cyclists if they can
> actually see them at night. Fitting decent lights (flashing or plain)
> makes this a lot easier. Do you (Doug) realise how difficult it can be
> to spot a cyclist wearing dark clothes on a dark coloured bike at
> night if no lights are fitted?
>
> Derek C

Of course he realises it, but he is scared to admit it because the
cyclist would be a t fault, & in DougWorld no cyclist could be at fault.

If a car hit an unlit cyclist then in DougWorld the motorist would be
totally to blame.

Happily in the real world most cyclists see the need for lights.

--
Tony Dragon

[Mrcheerful[_2_]]

Tony Dragon wrote:
> On 12/12/2010 10:57, Derek C wrote:
>> On Dec 12, 7:39 am, > wrote:
>>> On Dec 11, 7:52 am, Derek > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Dec 10, 5:32 pm, > wrote:> "Mercedes
>>>> cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
>>>>> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
>>>>> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>>>
>>>>> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to
>>>>> detect cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They
>>>>> are then illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the
>>>>> system detects another road user that may be dazzled by the
>>>>> light..."
>>>
>>>>> More:http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>>>
>>>> So what about the vast majority of cars on the road that are not
>>>> Mercedes? What if the system detects another road user that may be
>>>> dazzled and overrides the cyclist detection system?
>>>
>>>> I therefore believe it is still safer for cyclists to carry working
>>>> lights at night, not that many of them do so! Doug is just trying
>>>> to find another justification for those idiotic cheapskate cyclists
>>>> who don't carry lights at night.
>>>
>>> While you, apparently, wish to find any excuse to blame vulnerable
>>> victims and justify their motorised killers.
>>>
>>> -- .
>> Motorists are less likely to accidentally kill cyclists if they can
>> actually see them at night. Fitting decent lights (flashing or plain)
>> makes this a lot easier. Do you (Doug) realise how difficult it can
>> be to spot a cyclist wearing dark clothes on a dark coloured bike at
>> night if no lights are fitted?
>>
>> Derek C
>
> Of course he realises it, but he is scared to admit it because the
> cyclist would be a t fault, & in DougWorld no cyclist could be at
> fault.
> If a car hit an unlit cyclist then in DougWorld the motorist would be
> totally to blame.
>
> Happily in the real world most cyclists see the need for lights.

theu ,ay do, but the majority still don't use them

[Derek C]

On Dec 12, 12:44*pm, "Mrcheerful" > wrote:
> Tony Dragon wrote:
> > On 12/12/2010 10:57, Derek C wrote:
> >> On Dec 12, 7:39 am, > *wrote:
> >>> On Dec 11, 7:52 am, Derek > *wrote:
>
> >>>> On Dec 10, 5:32 pm, > *wrote:> *"Mercedes
> >>>> cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
> >>>>> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
> >>>>> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>
> >>>>> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to
> >>>>> detect cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They
> >>>>> are then illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the
> >>>>> system detects another road user that may be dazzled by the
> >>>>> light..."
>
> >>>>> More:http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>
> >>>> So what about the vast majority of cars on the road that are not
> >>>> Mercedes? *What if the system detects another road user that may be
> >>>> dazzled and overrides the cyclist detection system?
>
> >>>> I therefore believe it is still safer for cyclists to carry working
> >>>> lights at night, not that many of them do so! *Doug is just trying
> >>>> to find another justification for those idiotic cheapskate cyclists
> >>>> who don't carry lights at night.
>
> >>> While you, apparently, wish to find any excuse to blame vulnerable
> >>> victims and justify their motorised killers.
>
> >>> -- .
> >> Motorists are less likely to accidentally kill cyclists if they can
> >> actually see them at night. Fitting decent lights (flashing or plain)
> >> makes this a lot easier. Do you (Doug) realise how difficult it can
> >> be to spot a cyclist wearing dark clothes on a dark coloured bike at
> >> night if no lights are fitted?
>
> >> Derek C
>
> > Of course he realises it, but he is scared to admit it because the
> > cyclist would be a t fault, & in DougWorld no cyclist could be at
> > fault.
> > If a car hit an unlit cyclist then in DougWorld the motorist would be
> > totally to blame.
>
> > Happily in the real world most cyclists see the need for lights.
>
> theu ,ay do, but the majority still don't use them- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

In my experience about half the cyclists you see (hopefully) at night
have working lights. The other half don't and some of these don't even
have reflectors on their bikes.

Derek C

[NM]

On Dec 12, 2:16*pm, Derek C > wrote:
> On Dec 12, 12:44*pm, "Mrcheerful" > wrote:
>
>
>
> > Tony Dragon wrote:
> > > On 12/12/2010 10:57, Derek C wrote:
> > >> On Dec 12, 7:39 am, > *wrote:
> > >>> On Dec 11, 7:52 am, Derek > *wrote:
>
> > >>>> On Dec 10, 5:32 pm, > *wrote:> *"Mercedes
> > >>>> cars will from next year have the ability at night and in
> > >>>>> poor visibility to detect cyclists and pedestrians long before the
> > >>>>> driver and pick them out with a spotlight.
>
> > >>>>> The Active Night View Assist Plus uses an infra-red camera to
> > >>>>> detect cyclists and pedestrians at a distance of up to 80m. They
> > >>>>> are then illuminated by one of the main headlights, unless the
> > >>>>> system detects another road user that may be dazzled by the
> > >>>>> light..."
>
> > >>>>> More:http://www.eta.co.uk/2010/12/09/car-shines-spotlight-bicycles
>
> > >>>> So what about the vast majority of cars on the road that are not
> > >>>> Mercedes? *What if the system detects another road user that may be
> > >>>> dazzled and overrides the cyclist detection system?
>
> > >>>> I therefore believe it is still safer for cyclists to carry working
> > >>>> lights at night, not that many of them do so! *Doug is just trying
> > >>>> to find another justification for those idiotic cheapskate cyclists
> > >>>> who don't carry lights at night.
>
> > >>> While you, apparently, wish to find any excuse to blame vulnerable
> > >>> victims and justify their motorised killers.
>
> > >>> -- .
> > >> Motorists are less likely to accidentally kill cyclists if they can
> > >> actually see them at night. Fitting decent lights (flashing or plain)
> > >> makes this a lot easier. Do you (Doug) realise how difficult it can
> > >> be to spot a cyclist wearing dark clothes on a dark coloured bike at
> > >> night if no lights are fitted?
>
> > >> Derek C
>
> > > Of course he realises it, but he is scared to admit it because the
> > > cyclist would be a t fault, & in DougWorld no cyclist could be at
> > > fault.
> > > If a car hit an unlit cyclist then in DougWorld the motorist would be
> > > totally to blame.
>
> > > Happily in the real world most cyclists see the need for lights.
>
> > theu ,ay do, but the majority still don't use them- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> In my experience about half the cyclists you see (hopefully) at night
> have working lights. The other half don't and some of these don't even
> have reflectors on their bikes.
>
> Derek C

I got pulled by the pigs a couple of nights ago in the icy period for
cycling with no lights, I was gobsmacked I couldn't
believe it, the countless times I have seen others do this with no
reaction yet the one time in five years of living here I crossed the
bridge on a push bike without lights I get pulled.

Luckily for me I was only accosted through the window from the comfort
of his warm car and told to push it home (200 yards, no problem,
probably safer judging by the ice).

I got caught out by the early darkness due to the inclement weather
and the fact that the little spindly thing that rubs on the tyre
failed to generate useable electricity. I have flashy new led lights
now, from the pound shop, the old method has been binned.