frame painting question

[Joshua Goldberg]

I am going to paint a frame in order to cut down on the # of times I have to
remove the rust, the Acid Rain in my area is really bad on unpained steel.

I don't really care about a hi-quality paint job now, I'll get it powder
coated in 4 months anyway.

Question = Should I use Spray or Brush on enamel and IS a base primer coat
needed?

I will be removing the rust and then running an Angle Grinder over the frame
with a brass brush and add paint asap so I am not painting over rust.

I am leaning more to cans of spray enamel...yes?

[rorschandt]

"Joshua Goldberg" > wrote in
:

> I am going to paint a frame in order to cut down on the # of times I
> have to remove the rust, the Acid Rain in my area is really bad on
> unpained steel.
>
> I don't really care about a hi-quality paint job now, I'll get it
> powder coated in 4 months anyway.
>
> Question = Should I use Spray or Brush on enamel and IS a base primer
> coat needed?
>
> I will be removing the rust and then running an Angle Grinder over the
> frame with a brass brush and add paint asap so I am not painting over
> rust.
>
> I am leaning more to cans of spray enamel...yes?
>
>
>

There are some cool colors of spray paint that look similar to anodized
metal. These allegedly don't require primer if applied on clean metal.
(Duplicolor~ MetalCast)Its also not expensive. When you are finished with
the wire brush, get some latex gloves and wear them while you handle the
frame. Next get some lacquer thinner and a rag and wipe the entire frame
with the stuff. Then you can hang the frame up by a couple of metal
coathangers and spray it. With paint.
Josh, please don't breathe or drink any of the stuff. We don' want your
condition to worsen.(^;

Rorschandt

--

May all beings be happy.
May they be joyous and live in safety.
All living beings, whether weak or strong,
in high or middle or low realms of existence,
small or great, visible or invisible,
near or far, born or to be born,
Let no one deceive another, nor despise any being in any state;
Let none by anger or hatred wish harm to another.
Even as a mother at the risk of her life watches over
and protects her only child,
so with a boundless mind should one cherish all living things,

[Joshua Goldberg]

I was going to ask you 1st, but I cleared my address book to prevent any
virus attacks leaking out and I forgot to record your email on paper....and
thanks for replying.

Gotta get the trikes ready for winter driving really soon and the paint will
help....I tried a thing called Krylon Spray Enamel on a delta and it peels
off using your finger nail. Was thinking Tremclad 1st for the rust protector
and then sumethin purdy on top.
********************

"rorschandt" > wrote in message
. 97.132...
> "Joshua Goldberg" > wrote in
> :
>
> > I am going to paint a frame in order to cut down on the # of times I
> > have to remove the rust, the Acid Rain in my area is really bad on
> > unpained steel.
> >
> > I don't really care about a hi-quality paint job now, I'll get it
> > powder coated in 4 months anyway.
> >
> > Question = Should I use Spray or Brush on enamel and IS a base primer
> > coat needed?
> >
> > I will be removing the rust and then running an Angle Grinder over the
> > frame with a brass brush and add paint asap so I am not painting over
> > rust.
> >
> > I am leaning more to cans of spray enamel...yes?
> >
> >
> >
>
> There are some cool colors of spray paint that look similar to anodized
> metal. These allegedly don't require primer if applied on clean metal.
> (Duplicolor~ MetalCast)Its also not expensive. When you are finished with
> the wire brush, get some latex gloves and wear them while you handle the
> frame. Next get some lacquer thinner and a rag and wipe the entire frame
> with the stuff. Then you can hang the frame up by a couple of metal
> coathangers and spray it. With paint.
> Josh, please don't breathe or drink any of the stuff. We don' want your
> condition to worsen.(^;
>
> Rorschandt
>
> --
>
> May all beings be happy.
> May they be joyous and live in safety.
> All living beings, whether weak or strong,
> in high or middle or low realms of existence,
> small or great, visible or invisible,
> near or far, born or to be born,
> Let no one deceive another, nor despise any being in any state;
> Let none by anger or hatred wish harm to another.
> Even as a mother at the risk of her life watches over
> and protects her only child,
> so with a boundless mind should one cherish all living things,

[skip]

"Joshua Goldberg" > wrote in message
.. .
> I am going to paint a frame in order to cut down on the # of times I have
to
> remove the rust, the Acid Rain in my area is really bad on unpained steel.
>
> I don't really care about a hi-quality paint job now, I'll get it powder
> coated in 4 months anyway.
>
> Question = Should I use Spray or Brush on enamel and IS a base primer coat
> needed?
>
> I will be removing the rust and then running an Angle Grinder over the
frame
> with a brass brush and add paint asap so I am not painting over rust.
>
> I am leaning more to cans of spray enamel...yes?
>

Who was it that said Rust Never Dies? Classic car buffs tell me the best
way to keep rust from returning is either sandblasting or immersion into a
vat of some kind of rust hating acid. Specifically they tell me sanding
doesn't cut it.

Frankly the thought of having a frame with rust and a determined Joshua
Goldberg with an angle grinder in the same room gives me a wee bit of
concern.

Here's my suggestion. Since you must wait four months to powder coat you
should sand the frame, prime & paint with your spray cans, ride it until you
are ready to powder coat, and then have the frame sandblasted or dipped
immediately before powder coating. And don't forget to spray rust
preventative inside the frame after powder coating. This, I believe, would
give you a satisfactory long term result.

skip

[Joshua Goldberg]

yeah the place I will use dips the bike frame into a vat of something nasy,
blow dries the frame and does the sandblasting. Frames get 5 powder coats
and a clear coat. In USD about $120.00 total, which I have been told is a
really good price..
*************************
"skip" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Joshua Goldberg" > wrote in message
> .. .
> > I am going to paint a frame in order to cut down on the # of times I
have
> to
> > remove the rust, the Acid Rain in my area is really bad on unpained
steel.
> >
> > I don't really care about a hi-quality paint job now, I'll get it powder
> > coated in 4 months anyway.
> >
> > Question = Should I use Spray or Brush on enamel and IS a base primer
coat
> > needed?
> >
> > I will be removing the rust and then running an Angle Grinder over the
> frame
> > with a brass brush and add paint asap so I am not painting over rust.
> >
> > I am leaning more to cans of spray enamel...yes?
> >
>
> Who was it that said Rust Never Dies? Classic car buffs tell me the best
> way to keep rust from returning is either sandblasting or immersion into a
> vat of some kind of rust hating acid. Specifically they tell me sanding
> doesn't cut it.
>
> Frankly the thought of having a frame with rust and a determined Joshua
> Goldberg with an angle grinder in the same room gives me a wee bit of
> concern.
>
> Here's my suggestion. Since you must wait four months to powder coat you
> should sand the frame, prime & paint with your spray cans, ride it until
you
> are ready to powder coat, and then have the frame sandblasted or dipped
> immediately before powder coating. And don't forget to spray rust
> preventative inside the frame after powder coating. This, I believe,
would
> give you a satisfactory long term result.
>
> skip
>
>

[DrJoel]

A while back a friend took his frame to a local body shop, and picked a
color they had left over in stock. They sprayed and baked the frame, looks
real great in metallic red. Total cost $75.00.

"Joshua Goldberg" > wrote in message
.. .
> yeah the place I will use dips the bike frame into a vat of something
nasy,
> blow dries the frame and does the sandblasting. Frames get 5 powder coats
> and a clear coat. In USD about $120.00 total, which I have been told is a
> really good price..
> *************************
> "skip" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "Joshua Goldberg" > wrote in message
> > .. .
> > > I am going to paint a frame in order to cut down on the # of times I
> have
> > to
> > > remove the rust, the Acid Rain in my area is really bad on unpained
> steel.
> > >
> > > I don't really care about a hi-quality paint job now, I'll get it
powder
> > > coated in 4 months anyway.
> > >
> > > Question = Should I use Spray or Brush on enamel and IS a base primer
> coat
> > > needed?
> > >
> > > I will be removing the rust and then running an Angle Grinder over the
> > frame
> > > with a brass brush and add paint asap so I am not painting over rust.
> > >
> > > I am leaning more to cans of spray enamel...yes?
> > >
> >
> > Who was it that said Rust Never Dies? Classic car buffs tell me the
best
> > way to keep rust from returning is either sandblasting or immersion into
a
> > vat of some kind of rust hating acid. Specifically they tell me sanding
> > doesn't cut it.
> >
> > Frankly the thought of having a frame with rust and a determined Joshua
> > Goldberg with an angle grinder in the same room gives me a wee bit of
> > concern.
> >
> > Here's my suggestion. Since you must wait four months to powder coat
you
> > should sand the frame, prime & paint with your spray cans, ride it until
> you
> > are ready to powder coat, and then have the frame sandblasted or dipped
> > immediately before powder coating. And don't forget to spray rust
> > preventative inside the frame after powder coating. This, I believe,
> would
> > give you a satisfactory long term result.
> >
> > skip
> >
> >
>
>

[Don]

Joshua, That is an unbelievable price. 5 coats plus clear? In
Sacramento, CA that would be a great price for blasting and a single
coat of a stock booring industrial color (no clear coat). Where do
you live to get such great prices and have so much rust to worry
about?


Skip, It was Neil Young and the phrase was "Rust Never Sleeps".

Don, (aging rocker).


"Joshua Goldberg" > wrote in message >...
> yeah the place I will use dips the bike frame into a vat of something nasy,
> blow dries the frame and does the sandblasting. Frames get 5 powder coats
> and a clear coat. In USD about $120.00 total, which I have been told is a
> really good price..
>

[Tom Sherman]

rorschandt wrote:
> ...
> May all beings be happy.
> May they be joyous and live in safety.
> All living beings, whether weak or strong,
> in high or middle or low realms of existence,
> small or great, visible or invisible,
> near or far, born or to be born,
> Let no one deceive another, nor despise any being in any state;
> Let none by anger or hatred wish harm to another.
> Even as a mother at the risk of her life watches over
> and protects her only child,
> so with a boundless mind should one cherish all living things,

Even Fabrizio? ;)

Tom Sherman - Near the confluence of the Mississippi and Rock Rivers

[Sticker Jim]

I paint aircraft for a living, and I would do the following, if you can:

1. Wipe the whole frame down FIRST with Naphtha. I use this because it has
enough solvent power to wipe off just about all contaminants and it is weak
enough that it can't cause contamination/fish-eye problems later. For
things like bug guts or tar, use a more powerful solvent, but then go back
and re-wipe with naphtha.
2. Use as fine of a steel wire wheel instead of the brass one. The steel
will lightly scuff the frame tubes and greatly improve paint adhesion and
still not be so hard on the steel that the scuff marks will show through the
paint. I use a small wire wheel with a ¼" shaft and put it in my electric
drill. If you are planning to powder coat later, you DEFINITELY won't see
the scratch marks later.
3. As for primer, if I'm going to use primer on steel, I use an epoxy (a
base component and a catalyst/hardner component). Reason being, the epoxy
primer is tougher and far more durable than any enamel or lacquer primer,
especially red oxide (which I never use). The only problem with 2 part
coatings, is you can't use a store-bought spray can. I have some small
glass bottles that are screwed into a small aerosol container so you can
custom make your own "spray cans" - but not sure of the name. Will get it
tomorrow and post the name.

If simple corrosion protection is the primary concern, don't even worry
about primer. I am not a big fan of Krylon products, and for a straight
store-bought spray paint, I have found the Tremclad brand to be every bit as
durable and cheaper than some of the "dedicated" brands like Krylon. A
light tack coat, then a couple good thick wet coats and you will have more
than enough protection til you powder coat them.

After shooting the paint job on my first two trikes, I took the last two I
built to powder coat places and let them coat my frames in plastic. Very
happy with the jobs and the powder coat is multitudes tougher than even the
multiple coats of epoxy I put on them myself. The Mk I and Battleship were
painted by me. The Mk III and IV were powder coated.

Pics are here: http://jkcc.com/speednviolence/bikes/

"Joshua Goldberg" > wrote in message
.. .
> I am going to paint a frame in order to cut down on the # of times I have
to
> remove the rust, the Acid Rain in my area is really bad on unpained steel.
>
> I don't really care about a hi-quality paint job now, I'll get it powder
> coated in 4 months anyway.
>
> Question = Should I use Spray or Brush on enamel and IS a base primer coat
> needed?
>
> I will be removing the rust and then running an Angle Grinder over the
frame
> with a brass brush and add paint asap so I am not painting over rust.
>
> I am leaning more to cans of spray enamel...yes?
>
>

[rorschandt]

"Sticker Jim" > wrote in
ble.rogers.com:

> After shooting the paint job on my first two trikes, I took the last
> two I built to powder coat places and let them coat my frames in
> plastic. Very happy with the jobs and the powder coat is multitudes
> tougher than even the multiple coats of epoxy I put on them myself.
> The Mk I and Battleship were painted by me. The Mk III and IV were
> powder coated.
>
> Pics are here: http://jkcc.com/speednviolence/bikes/

What great craftsmanship! Really. I've built a few trikes and know how it
sometimes seems that all the planning breaks down to sticking things on
because "Oops, I mis-measured" or "Hmmm, forgot about THAT thing!"
I wish I had a locl powder coater that did frames that cheap. Here it is
about U$130 - 200, with a very limited color choice.

Happy trails,
rorschandt
http://pictures.care2.com/view/1/174801833

[Sticker Jim]

> > After shooting the paint job on my first two trikes, I took the last
> > two I built to powder coat places and let them coat my frames in
> > plastic. Very happy with the jobs and the powder coat is multitudes
> > tougher than even the multiple coats of epoxy I put on them myself.
> > The Mk I and Battleship were painted by me. The Mk III and IV were
> > powder coated.
> >
> > Pics are here: http://jkcc.com/speednviolence/bikes/
>
> What great craftsmanship! Really. I've built a few trikes and know how it
> sometimes seems that all the planning breaks down to sticking things on
> because "Oops, I mis-measured" or "Hmmm, forgot about THAT thing!"
> I wish I had a locl powder coater that did frames that cheap. Here it is
> about U$130 - 200, with a very limited color choice.
>
> Happy trails,
> rorschandt
> http://pictures.care2.com/view/1/174801833

Did you build the Tulpa? It looks pretty cool. I was toying with the idea
of A arm full suspension on a trike too, but it seemed a little over my head
at the present. I like the front end, and I like the seat too. Looks
pretty swanky.

There are 2 powder coat shops I know of. Both do a basic single coat job on
a trike for $60 Cdn. The dual coat candy apple purple was $80 Cdn. The one
powder coat place does big production runs but they will hang you bike parts
up with the rest of the production run, and only charge $60 for it. Maybe
down where you are, there might be a shop that does production runs too and
they might consent to hanging your work up in the runs like the guys up here
too. The only drawback, is you have to take the colour they are shooting at
the time. No big deal for me - especially for only $60. :)

[rorschandt]

"Sticker Jim" > wrote in
le.rogers.com:

>> > After shooting the paint job on my first two trikes, I took the
>> > last two I built to powder coat places and let them coat my frames
>> > in plastic. Very happy with the jobs and the powder coat is
>> > multitudes tougher than even the multiple coats of epoxy I put on
>> > them myself. The Mk I and Battleship were painted by me. The Mk
>> > III and IV were powder coated.
>> >
>> > Pics are here: http://jkcc.com/speednviolence/bikes/
>>
>> What great craftsmanship! Really. I've built a few trikes and know
>> how it sometimes seems that all the planning breaks down to sticking
>> things on because "Oops, I mis-measured" or "Hmmm, forgot about THAT
>> thing!" I wish I had a locl powder coater that did frames that cheap.
>> Here it is about U$130 - 200, with a very limited color choice.
>>
>> Happy trails,
>> rorschandt
>> http://pictures.care2.com/view/1/174801833
>
> Did you build the Tulpa? It looks pretty cool. I was toying with the
> idea of A arm full suspension on a trike too, but it seemed a little
> over my head at the present. I like the front end, and I like the
> seat too. Looks pretty swanky.


Thanks. Yes, I did build it. That was before I discovered just how thin of
tubing was strong enough. I've a tendency to overbuild things. The original
rod/lever steering worked well with the suspension, the newer more
conventional handlebar style causes problems with suspension and alignment.
I am considering a re-design and rebuild over the winter. It will also help
prevent me from going insane during "The Season of Death and Gloom".

As for the powder coat "color of the day" technique, it does save money. I
really prefer brighter colors for asthetic and safety reasons. Most of the
powder coaters here are using dingy colors, gray and black; don't want the
bike to blend in with the pavement. Haven't checked around in a while, I'll
do that.

happy trails,
rorschandt

--

May all beings be happy.
May they be joyous and live in safety.
All living beings, whether weak or strong,
in high or middle or low realms of existence,
small or great, visible or invisible,
near or far, born or to be born,
Let no one deceive another, nor despise any being in any state;
Let none by anger or hatred wish harm to another.
Even as a mother at the risk of her life watches over
and protects her only child,
so with a boundless mind should one cherish all living things,