Standing while climbing bad?

[Destroy]

This may be a dumb post but...

I was low on energy today and tried standing up for the first time in
order to try and clear a fairly steep medium length climb and it seemed
like a total waste.

Seems stepping down hard on the pedals while standing did nothing but
create massive 'bob' or bounce. Or it spun up the rear tire.

Was really amazing 'feeling' how much energy was lost in the bounce when
standing. I don't notice this at all when in the normal sitting leaned
slightly forward stance. Heck, when sitting I feel like I have traction
control or something. I just pedal smoothly and hard, and I ride right
up the hill; over bumps and all.

As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
steep climbs?

[Mark Webb]

> As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> steep climbs?

It's hard to judge - sometimes on the sandy stuff it is the only way to get
the momentum back up.

Eventually you can feel the terrain and pedal slowly to avoid the spin and
bob. Of course I ride the Epic or a RockHopper, so effectively always have a
hard tail in these situ's ;-)

[Raptor]

Destroy wrote:
> This may be a dumb post but...
>
> I was low on energy today and tried standing up for the first time in
> order to try and clear a fairly steep medium length climb and it seemed
> like a total waste.
>
> Seems stepping down hard on the pedals while standing did nothing but
> create massive 'bob' or bounce. Or it spun up the rear tire.
>
> Was really amazing 'feeling' how much energy was lost in the bounce when
> standing. I don't notice this at all when in the normal sitting leaned
> slightly forward stance. Heck, when sitting I feel like I have traction
> control or something. I just pedal smoothly and hard, and I ride right
> up the hill; over bumps and all.
>
> As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> steep climbs?

Depends on your technique, I believe. As a roadie from way back, I've
learned an efficient circular pedaling motion, and can do a pretty good
job of standing and pedaling without bouncing the sx too much. I won't
assert that my standing is more efficient or powerful than sitting,
since I could be scrubbing off power before it gets to the pedals, just
trying to move smoothly.

And yes, on the typical dirt trail the rear wheel spins easily. But you
can sit your butt back to dig it in. I find that that's not all that
useful for me - it's hard.

The slopes on the Slickrock Trail are steep enough that standing is a
virtual necessity, and also any bouncing you do is very costly since you
need all your power to get up the hill.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"I'm not proud. We really haven't done everything we could to protect
our customers. Our products just aren't engineered for security."
--Microsoft VP in charge of Windows OS Development, Brian Valentine.

[bloocow]

"Destroy" > wrote in message
...
> This may be a dumb post but...
>
> I was low on energy today and tried standing up for the first time in
> order to try and clear a fairly steep medium length climb and it seemed
> like a total waste.
>
> Seems stepping down hard on the pedals while standing did nothing but
> create massive 'bob' or bounce. Or it spun up the rear tire.
>
> Was really amazing 'feeling' how much energy was lost in the bounce when
> standing. I don't notice this at all when in the normal sitting leaned
> slightly forward stance. Heck, when sitting I feel like I have traction
> control or something. I just pedal smoothly and hard, and I ride right
> up the hill; over bumps and all.
>
> As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> steep climbs?

I think it depends on how the full sus bike is built (how it handles). When
you climb standing, you usually try to use your body weight to help your
pedalling force. As a result, you create more vertical momentum, and
therefore the suspension kicks in. I think more bob will occur on bikes that
have their suspension designed to react more to vertical movements(?), for
lack of a better description. When you climb seated (assuming you don't bob
your head or pull on your arms too much), most of the pedalling force will
be in a circular motion round the BB so there's less vertical momentum.

Traction is all about where your weight is on the bike when you're climbing.
When seated, more weight is on the rear tyre (usually), so the rear wheel
seldom spins out. When you climb standing, you move your weight forward and
also increase your pedalling force(supposedly), so your rear wheel would be
more likely to spin. You could move your weight more to the rear while
climbing standing but your position might be more uncomfortable and result
in poorer energy efficiency (i.e. get tired from climbing standing faster).
Hope you get a better idea now.

bloocow - thesis of a rigid rider

[Mark Hickey]

Destroy > wrote:

>As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> steep climbs?

The smoother you can spin, the less pedal induced bobbing you'll get.
There will always be some (no matter how many links the whizbang
suspension design uses), but if you're not just lurching from front
pedal to front pedal it won't be too bad. Smooth circles also help
you prevent the rear wheel from breaking loose. I've been able to get
up steep sandy pitches my more technically adept MTB buddies can't,
simply because years of spinning smooth circles on the road allow me
to maintain traction (on a hard tail, BTW).

As far as it not "feeling right", just remember - the more you do it,
the better it will feel. Theoretically you'll use a little more
energy overall, but it also gives you a chance to recruit some fresh
muscles and to stretch the ones that have been doing the most work.
If you get to the point where you can stand for several minutes at a
time you'll find you're a much better climber with more endurance.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $695 ti frame

[JD]

Destroy > wrote in message >...
> As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> steep climbs?

Only if you are riding a poorly designed bike and/or have poor
technique. The more you ride your bike, the more you learn on your
own instead of desperately trying to glean "experience" from others
who may not have much.

JD

[Zilla]

You heart rate goes 10% faster (according to my doc)
when standing during a clime, but sometimes you have to.

--
- Zilla
Cary, NC
(Remove XSPAM)


"Destroy" > wrote in message
...
> This may be a dumb post but...
>
> I was low on energy today and tried standing up for the first time in
> order to try and clear a fairly steep medium length climb and it seemed
> like a total waste.
>
> Seems stepping down hard on the pedals while standing did nothing but
> create massive 'bob' or bounce. Or it spun up the rear tire.
>
> Was really amazing 'feeling' how much energy was lost in the bounce when
> standing. I don't notice this at all when in the normal sitting leaned
> slightly forward stance. Heck, when sitting I feel like I have traction
> control or something. I just pedal smoothly and hard, and I ride right
> up the hill; over bumps and all.
>
> As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> steep climbs?
>

[Pete]

"Destroy" > wrote

>
> As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> steep climbs?

Whatever gets you up the hill.

Pete

[wanguard]

> I was low on energy today and tried standing up for the first time in
> order to try and clear a fairly steep medium length climb and it seemed
> like a total waste.
>
> Seems stepping down hard on the pedals while standing did nothing but
> create massive 'bob' or bounce. Or it spun up the rear tire.
>
> Was really amazing 'feeling' how much energy was lost in the bounce when
> standing. I don't notice this at all when in the normal sitting leaned
> slightly forward stance. Heck, when sitting I feel like I have traction
> control or something. I just pedal smoothly and hard, and I ride right
> up the hill; over bumps and all.
>
> As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> steep climbs?

General answer would be, yes it's bad. Lock suspension and then it's start
to make sense.
But, with some experience one can pedal smooth out of seat and distribute
weight so the he does not lose grip.

But, but, correct me if I'm wrong, this is not an energy saver.

So I would say, lock if you ride out of saddle or switch to lower gear if
you are tired.

D'

[[email protected]]

I most never stand or walk. When I see someone
walking up a hill I call out thats why you have pedals now get on and
pedal. During racing when I want and need to pass I do stand and
along with the way I have my bike set up total package I won 1st place
in a race every racer were half my age and more. I turn 50 in just 4
months.

Fire up MTB 03

[bomba]

wrote:
> I most never stand or walk. When I see someone
> walking up a hill I call out thats why you have pedals now get on and
> pedal. During racing when I want and need to pass I do stand and
> along with the way I have my bike set up total package I won 1st place
> in a race every racer were half my age and more. I turn 50 in just 4
> months.

What a pity that at your age, you haven't learned to form a coherent
sentence.

--
a.m-b FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/ambfaq.htm

a.bmx FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/bmx_faq.htm

[Gman]

On Fri, 01 Aug 2003 22:51:08 -0500, Destroy > wrote:
> This may be a dumb post but...
>
> I was low on energy today and tried standing up for the first time in
> order to try and clear a fairly steep medium length climb and it seemed
> like a total waste.
>
> Seems stepping down hard on the pedals while standing did nothing but
> create massive 'bob' or bounce. Or it spun up the rear tire.

Rigid singlespeed baby!

G

[Kathleen]

Bill Wheeler wrote:

> On Fri, 01 Aug 2003 22:51:08 -0500, Destroy > wrote:
>
>
>>This may be a dumb post but...
>
>
> ..seen worse.
>
> [snip bad technique]
>
>
>>As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
>> steep climbs?
>
>
> Why would you be riding a full susp bike when you can ride a rigid?
>

Why? Because I can. Lots of other, more specific reasons, but in the
end, it boils down to that. God bless free choice.

When climbing, for the most part, if I'm out of the saddle, it's about
balance, not power. I haven't got an ounce of extra power to spare, and
standing and honkin' on the pedals wastes a noticable amount of energy.
The individual situation determines if it's worth it or not, but
usually, for me, it's not.

Kathleen

[Bill Wheeler]

On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 17:15:45 -0500, Kathleen >
wrote:

>Bill Wheeler wrote:
[snip]
>> Why would you be riding a full susp bike when you can ride a rigid?
>>
>
>Why? Because I can. Lots of other, more specific reasons, but in the
>end, it boils down to that. God bless free choice.

Someone pinch me. Finally someone who makes sense....although on the
flip side.

Freedom of choice is what you got, freedom from choice is what you
want.

>
>When climbing, for the most part, if I'm out of the saddle, it's about
>balance, not power.

Once again this makes sense.


>I haven't got an ounce of extra power to spare, and
>standing and honkin' on the pedals wastes a noticable amount of energy.

There are times to stand and times to sit when climbing.


>The individual situation determines if it's worth it or not, but
>usually, for me, it's not.

Freedom of choice.

>
>Kathleen

I thought for sure you'd somehow throw something about "Fly Ball" in
here.....perhaps I missed it.

Peace,
Bill
The mind serves properly as a window glass rather
than as a reflector, that is, the mind should give
an immediate view instead of an interpretation of the world.
:-]

[Kathleen]

Bill Wheeler wrote:
<snip>
>
> Freedom of choice is what you got, freedom from choice is what you
> want.<snip>


What the heck are you talking about?

Don't drop acid and post, Bill. Even though we can't see your pupils,
we can still tell.

Ai yi yi, indeed....

Kathleen

[Bob M]

On Tue, 05 Aug 2003 06:27:04 -0500, Kathleen > wrote:

> Bill Wheeler wrote:
> <snip>
>>
>> Freedom of choice is what you got, freedom from choice is what you
>> want.<snip>
>
>
> What the heck are you talking about?
>
> Don't drop acid and post, Bill. Even though we can't see your pupils, we
> can still tell.
>
> Ai yi yi, indeed....
>
> Kathleen
>
>

I thought that any time you made any decision, you made a choice. If you
choose to go riding, you're not reading a book, watching TV, etc. If you
choose to sleep in, there's stuff you could be doing (like riding), and
you're not. You never really have freedom from choice, so I think the best
we can do is choose wisely. For me, that's riding my multi-speeded
mountain bike and longing for a fully suspended bike. For others, it's
getting that single speed. Sadly, I bought a new racing bike and won't be
able to afford a full suspension bike 'till next year. OK, so my
priorities are screwed up!

--
Bob M in CT
Remove 'x.' to reply

[Paladin]

Bob M > wrote in message >...
> On Tue, 05 Aug 2003 06:27:04 -0500, Kathleen > wrote:
>
> > Bill Wheeler wrote:
> > <snip>
> >>
> >> Freedom of choice is what you got, freedom from choice is what you
> >> want.<snip>
> >
> >
> > What the heck are you talking about?
> >
> > Don't drop acid and post, Bill. Even though we can't see your pupils, we
> > can still tell.
> >
> > Ai yi yi, indeed....
> >
> > Kathleen
> >
> >
>
> I thought that any time you made any decision, you made a choice. If you
> choose to go riding, you're not reading a book, watching TV, etc. If you
> choose to sleep in, there's stuff you could be doing (like riding), and
> you're not. You never really have freedom from choice, so I think the best
> we can do is choose wisely. For me, that's riding my multi-speeded
> mountain bike and longing for a fully suspended bike. For others, it's
> getting that single speed. Sadly, I bought a new racing bike and won't be
> able to afford a full suspension bike 'till next year. OK, so my
> priorities are screwed up!


What's a "racing bike" and why did buying it make you sad?

Paladin

[[email protected]]

On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 21:20:54 -0400, Bill Wheeler >
wrote:
> On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 17:15:45 -0500, Kathleen >
> wrote:
>
> >Bill Wheeler wrote:
> [snip]
> >> Why would you be riding a full susp bike when you can ride a rigid?
> >>
> >
> >Why? Because I can. Lots of other, more specific reasons, but in the
> >end, it boils down to that. God bless free choice.
>
> Someone pinch me. Finally someone who makes sense....although on the
> flip side.
>
> Freedom of choice is what you got, freedom from choice is what you
> want.

Mmmmm, Devo.

[Bill Wheeler]

On Tue, 05 Aug 2003 18:45:49 GMT,
wrote:

[snip]
>> Freedom of choice is what you got, freedom from choice is what you
>> want.
>
>Mmmmm, Devo.
>
>
Survey says...... Ding Ding Ding. We have a winner!

Peace,
Bill


The mind serves properly as a window glass rather
than as a reflector, that is, the mind should give
an immediate view instead of an interpretation of the world.
:-]

[Adam]

(JD) wrote in message >...
> Destroy > wrote in message >...
> > As a general rule, is it bad to stand on a full susp mtn bike when doing
> > steep climbs?
>
> Only if you are riding a poorly designed bike and/or have poor
> technique. The more you ride your bike, the more you learn on your
> own instead of desperately trying to glean "experience" from others
> who may not have much.
>

Well, there ya go. No point in having usenet any more[1]. Work out
how to do it yourself, don't get any pointers by asking for the
benefit of others' "experience". You'll never be able to tell those
who nothing from those who have enough "experience", except that the
latter won't help, they'll just post gibes...

[1] except, of course, for the free exchange of abuse.

Adam...

[Dave W]

On Tue, 05 Aug 2003 18:45:49 GMT,
wrote:

>On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 21:20:54 -0400, Bill Wheeler >
>wrote:
>> On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 17:15:45 -0500, Kathleen >
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Bill Wheeler wrote:
>> [snip]
>> >> Why would you be riding a full susp bike when you can ride a rigid?
>> >>
>> >
>> >Why? Because I can. Lots of other, more specific reasons, but in the
>> >end, it boils down to that. God bless free choice.
>>
>> Someone pinch me. Finally someone who makes sense....although on the
>> flip side.
>>
>> Freedom of choice is what you got, freedom from choice is what you
>> want.
>
>Mmmmm, Devo.
>
>


ding ding, we have a winner....