Re: Bicycle Registration [Archive]

kingsley

July 10th 03, 11:54 AM

On Sat, 22 Mar 2003 16:17:54 +1000, Andrew & Joanne wrote:

> I am currently compiling a paper regarding the registration of bicycles for
> use on our roads. Now at the risk of being called a troll, and evoking
> emotional and abusive replies, I would like to ask you all a few questions
> to gauge your reactions to the following questions.

Did horse & carts ever have to pay rego?
.... but we still had roads right ?

Aren't most rego taxes used for things other than roads
anyway? In NSW (Australia) I figured only the 3 cent fuel tax was
spent on roads. The RTA must spend 120% of it's budget on
their overly patronising advertising campains.

-kt

Ray Peace

July 10th 03, 11:38 PM

<html>
<head>
</head>
<body>
Greetings, 
                No, horses and carts paid tolls instead. I'm currently doing
some research on local history. Before local councils were set up, most districts
had Roads Boards, which not only charged rates, but also levied tolls on
road users. This system lasted for several decades, and like tolls of a later
era was met with degrees of abuse of the toll-keepers and evasion. Thought
that might interest you. 
Regards, 
                Ray. 
 
kingsley wrote: 
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:pan.2003.03.23.08.04.03.869725@maddogsbreakfas t.com.au">
<pre wrap="">On Sat, 22 Mar 2003 16:17:54 +1000, Andrew & Joanne wrote: </pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I am currently compiling a paper regarding the registration of bicycles for use on our roads. Now at the risk of being called a troll, and evoking emotional and abusive replies, I would like to ask you all a few questions to gauge your reactions to the following questions. </pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""> Did horse & carts ever have to pay rego? ... but we still had roads right ? Aren't most rego taxes used for things other than roads anyway? In NSW (Australia) I figured only the 3 cent fuel tax was spent on roads. The RTA must spend 120% of it's budget on their overly patronising advertising campains. -kt </pre>
</blockquote>
 
</body>
</html>

Glen F

July 11th 03, 03:43 AM

We have been hereabouts too often... Why is it that people
think the small amount they pay in car registration somehow manages
to fund construction and maintenance of our huge road network?

Registration fees from motor vehicles make NO CONTRIBUTION WHATSOEVER
to most roads cyclists use. In most states, these fund only highways
and a very few major urban arterials. For the most part, federal and
state petrol taxes are spent similarly.

Most of our urban road network was originally built by property
developers, and paid for by the people who bought the blocks they
sold. Maintenance is done by local government and paid for out of
the rates property owners (and hence renters) pay. Why cyclists
should be deemed to be not funding this network is incomprehensible.

Glen F

July 11th 03, 03:43 AM

We have been hereabouts too often... Why is it that people
think the small amount they pay in car registration somehow manages
to fund construction and maintenance of our huge road network?

Registration fees from motor vehicles make NO CONTRIBUTION WHATSOEVER
to most roads cyclists use. In most states, these fund only highways
and a very few major urban arterials. For the most part, federal and
state petrol taxes are spent similarly.

Most of our urban road network was originally built by property
developers, and paid for by the people who bought the blocks they
sold. Maintenance is done by local government and paid for out of
the rates property owners (and hence renters) pay. Why cyclists
should be deemed to be not funding this network is incomprehensible.

A bit more than

July 11th 03, 07:42 AM

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:54:18 +1000, "kingsley"
> wrote:

> Did horse & carts ever have to pay rego?
> ... but we still had roads right ?

If you can call them roads. Deep ruts and washaways were very common 100 years
ago.

A bit more than

July 11th 03, 07:42 AM

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:54:18 +1000, "kingsley"
> wrote:

> Did horse & carts ever have to pay rego?
> ... but we still had roads right ?

If you can call them roads. Deep ruts and washaways were very common 100 years
ago.

Bill Hamilton

July 11th 03, 02:52 PM

Ray Peace > wrote in
:

Please don't with the html, the posting, it hurts my head it does.

usenet is a plaintext forum, and a lot of people do not have readers that
parse html.

-Bill Hamilton

> <head>
> </head>
> <body>
> Greetings, 
>            
>     No, horses and carts paid tolls instead. I'm
> currently doing some research on local history. Before local councils
> were set up, most districts had Roads Boards, which not only charged
> rates, but also levied tolls on road users. This system lasted for
> several decades, and like tolls of a later era was met with degrees of
> abuse of the toll-keepers and evasion. Thought that might interest
> you. Regards, 
>            
>     Ray. 
> kingsley wrote: 
> <blockquote type="cite"
> cite="mid:pan.2003.03.23.08.04.03.869725@maddogsbreakfas t.com.au">
> <pre wrap="">On Sat, 22 Mar 2003 16:17:54 +1000, Andrew & Joanne
> wrote: </pre> <blockquote type="cite">
> <pre wrap="">I am currently compiling a paper regarding the
> registration of bicycles for use on our roads. Now at the risk
> of being called a troll, and evoking emotional and abusive
> replies, I would like to ask you all a few questions to gauge
> your reactions to the following questions. </pre> </blockquote>
> <pre wrap=""> Did horse & carts ever have to pay
> rego? ... but we still had roads right ? Aren't most
> rego taxes used for things other than roads anyway? In NSW
> (Australia) I figured only the 3 cent fuel tax was spent on
> roads. The RTA must spend 120% of it's budget on their overly
> patronising advertising campains. -kt </pre>
> </blockquote>
> 
> </body>
> </html>
> Attachment decoded: untitled-1.htm
>

Bill Hamilton

July 11th 03, 02:52 PM

Ray Peace > wrote in
:

Please don't with the html, the posting, it hurts my head it does.

usenet is a plaintext forum, and a lot of people do not have readers that
parse html.

-Bill Hamilton

> <head>
> </head>
> <body>
> Greetings, 
>            
>     No, horses and carts paid tolls instead. I'm
> currently doing some research on local history. Before local councils
> were set up, most districts had Roads Boards, which not only charged
> rates, but also levied tolls on road users. This system lasted for
> several decades, and like tolls of a later era was met with degrees of
> abuse of the toll-keepers and evasion. Thought that might interest
> you. Regards, 
>            
>     Ray. 
> kingsley wrote: 
> <blockquote type="cite"
> cite="mid:pan.2003.03.23.08.04.03.869725@maddogsbreakfas t.com.au">
> <pre wrap="">On Sat, 22 Mar 2003 16:17:54 +1000, Andrew & Joanne
> wrote: </pre> <blockquote type="cite">
> <pre wrap="">I am currently compiling a paper regarding the
> registration of bicycles for use on our roads. Now at the risk
> of being called a troll, and evoking emotional and abusive
> replies, I would like to ask you all a few questions to gauge
> your reactions to the following questions. </pre> </blockquote>
> <pre wrap=""> Did horse & carts ever have to pay
> rego? ... but we still had roads right ? Aren't most
> rego taxes used for things other than roads anyway? In NSW
> (Australia) I figured only the 3 cent fuel tax was spent on
> roads. The RTA must spend 120% of it's budget on their overly
> patronising advertising campains. -kt </pre>
> </blockquote>
> 
> </body>
> </html>
> Attachment decoded: untitled-1.htm
>

Theo Bekkers

July 11th 03, 03:54 PM

"Andre S." wrote

> they also think its a simple matter to attach standardised number
plates to every bicycle!
> none of which have been designed for such.

Err, what crap is that? The bicycle I was riding in WA in the 1950's
had a standardised numberplate, as did everybody else's. Yes, we had
registration, it cost 2/6 ($0.25) per annum. Attaching the numberplate
was not a problem.

Theo

Theo Bekkers

July 11th 03, 03:54 PM

"Andre S." wrote

> they also think its a simple matter to attach standardised number
plates to every bicycle!
> none of which have been designed for such.

Err, what crap is that? The bicycle I was riding in WA in the 1950's
had a standardised numberplate, as did everybody else's. Yes, we had
registration, it cost 2/6 ($0.25) per annum. Attaching the numberplate
was not a problem.

Theo

Jerry Rhodes

July 11th 03, 04:04 PM

A bit more than > wrote in message >...
> On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:54:18 +1000, "kingsley"
> > wrote:
>>
>If you can call them roads. Deep ruts and washaways were very common
100 > > >years ago.

Here in the good old US of A it was the clamoring by the bicycling
public that caused the improvement and paving of roads. Even the Via
Appia was great for carts and foot traffic but would have been hell on
bicycles.

It seems that "we have been hoisted by our own petard".

Jerry

Jerry Rhodes

July 11th 03, 04:04 PM

A bit more than > wrote in message >...
> On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:54:18 +1000, "kingsley"
> > wrote:
>>
>If you can call them roads. Deep ruts and washaways were very common
100 > > >years ago.

Here in the good old US of A it was the clamoring by the bicycling
public that caused the improvement and paving of roads. Even the Via
Appia was great for carts and foot traffic but would have been hell on
bicycles.

It seems that "we have been hoisted by our own petard".

Jerry

Peter Cremasco

July 11th 03, 11:42 PM

On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 22:54:46 +0800, "Theo Bekkers" >
wrote:

>Err, what crap is that? The bicycle I was riding in WA in the 1950's
>had a standardised numberplate, as did everybody else's. Yes, we had
>registration, it cost 2/6 ($0.25) per annum. Attaching the numberplate
>was not a problem.

But but but ... Theo! What about the turbulence effecting the
aerodynamic handling at normal commuting speeds? As far as I know, most
bicycles haven't been wind tunnel tested or designed to cope with the
perturbations in air flow that a number plate would cause.

---
Cheers

PeterC

[Rushing headlong: out of control - and there ain't no stopping]
[and there's nothing you can do about it at all]

Peter Cremasco

July 11th 03, 11:42 PM

On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 22:54:46 +0800, "Theo Bekkers" >
wrote:

>Err, what crap is that? The bicycle I was riding in WA in the 1950's
>had a standardised numberplate, as did everybody else's. Yes, we had
>registration, it cost 2/6 ($0.25) per annum. Attaching the numberplate
>was not a problem.

But but but ... Theo! What about the turbulence effecting the
aerodynamic handling at normal commuting speeds? As far as I know, most
bicycles haven't been wind tunnel tested or designed to cope with the
perturbations in air flow that a number plate would cause.

---
Cheers

PeterC

[Rushing headlong: out of control - and there ain't no stopping]
[and there's nothing you can do about it at all]

Peter Signorini

July 12th 03, 03:56 AM

"Theo Bekkers" > wrote in message
...
> "Andre S." wrote
>
> > they also think its a simple matter to attach standardised number
> plates to every bicycle!
> > none of which have been designed for such.
>
> Err, what crap is that? The bicycle I was riding in WA in the 1950's
> had a standardised numberplate, as did everybody else's. Yes, we had
> registration, it cost 2/6 ($0.25) per annum. Attaching the numberplate
> was not a problem.

About 25 years ago I paid an organisation called the Bicycle Register Co. to
provide 'registration' of my bike (really just keeping their own record)
with insurance coverage against theft. They gave me a numbered disc a bit
bigger than a 50c piece, simple to attach with one bolt to a rack eyelet or
brake mount. Trouble was of course, any fool with a spanner can nick it too.
I didn't perservere with the insurance for long.

We're not in the 50s. These days the security of our bikes is a more serious
issue. We have enough trouble ensuring the bike, or it's pedals, saddle,
wheels...etc. don't get stolen. How would VicRoads deal with me when I tell
them my rego plate was stolen?

Cheers
Peter

Peter Signorini

July 12th 03, 03:56 AM

"Theo Bekkers" > wrote in message
...
> "Andre S." wrote
>
> > they also think its a simple matter to attach standardised number
> plates to every bicycle!
> > none of which have been designed for such.
>
> Err, what crap is that? The bicycle I was riding in WA in the 1950's
> had a standardised numberplate, as did everybody else's. Yes, we had
> registration, it cost 2/6 ($0.25) per annum. Attaching the numberplate
> was not a problem.

About 25 years ago I paid an organisation called the Bicycle Register Co. to
provide 'registration' of my bike (really just keeping their own record)
with insurance coverage against theft. They gave me a numbered disc a bit
bigger than a 50c piece, simple to attach with one bolt to a rack eyelet or
brake mount. Trouble was of course, any fool with a spanner can nick it too.
I didn't perservere with the insurance for long.

We're not in the 50s. These days the security of our bikes is a more serious
issue. We have enough trouble ensuring the bike, or it's pedals, saddle,
wheels...etc. don't get stolen. How would VicRoads deal with me when I tell
them my rego plate was stolen?

Cheers
Peter

Ray

July 12th 03, 05:23 AM

In article >,
says...
> On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:54:18 +1000, "kingsley"
> > wrote:
>
> > Did horse & carts ever have to pay rego?
> > ... but we still had roads right ?
>
> If you can call them roads. Deep ruts and washaways were very common
> 100 years
> ago.
>
>
>
Hmmm, not much different to the northern end of the Merri Creek bike
path.

I can't see bicycle registration fixing this problems, or indeed any
other problems, after all a bike path is a "road" "designed" (in a very
loose sense of the word :) for bicycles and therefore any registration
attacted from bicycle registration should address such problems first
IMHO.

Ray

July 12th 03, 05:23 AM

In article >,
says...
> On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:54:18 +1000, "kingsley"
> > wrote:
>
> > Did horse & carts ever have to pay rego?
> > ... but we still had roads right ?
>
> If you can call them roads. Deep ruts and washaways were very common
> 100 years
> ago.
>
>
>
Hmmm, not much different to the northern end of the Merri Creek bike
path.

I can't see bicycle registration fixing this problems, or indeed any
other problems, after all a bike path is a "road" "designed" (in a very
loose sense of the word :) for bicycles and therefore any registration
attacted from bicycle registration should address such problems first
IMHO.