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chirokid
September 1st 03, 05:51 AM
I got my new Muni 3 days ago, and absolutely love it. As some of you
know, I bought a used KH24" Wheelset and the seller threw in a set of
Wellgo B-27 pedals. I love the way these pedals hold my feet, no slips
at all. Even while riding in the rain and back and forth through a big
creek (50 or more times), my feet never slipped once. In fact, here is
what I wrote just 3 days ago about my first ride with these pedals:
"My new Muni is fitted with Wellgo B-27 pin pedals. These are my
first metal pin type pedals. Having just rained prior to my ride, I
never had even one pedal slip while on this nite ride. Wherever I wanted
my feet, they were. These pedals rock."

However, the seller also told me "before the sale" that the pedals had a
"creaking" noise in them when pedaling. He said they were like this
from the first day he used them. I did not check for the cause of this
"creaking" before installing them on my new Muni. But today, the right
pedal had a complete melt-down. I felt the pedal let go as I was
riding. It actually slid off its on axle to the outside. There were
tiny fragments of what used to be a sealed bearing stuck all throughout
the grease.

The other pedal was also making this noise. I disassembled it a few
minutes ago, and the outer sealed bearing appears perfect, but the inner
race had no bearing left in it at all.

Bottom Line: I absolutely loved the feel of these Wellgo B-27 pedals.
The large base and all the pins gave me great confidence while ridingl.
Now I need help from my fellow Muni riders. What pedals should I buy
now? Remember, I am 265 lbs of big boy abuse on top of two little
pedals and one bad tire. Suggestions??? --chirokid--


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Mojoe
September 1st 03, 06:13 AM
I had the same problem with my B-27's. They had the best feel of any
pedal I've used, but they only lasted me 3 months. Right away, I noticed
that the end caps would come loose if I didn't check to make sure they
were tight from time to time. While doing some pedal grabs and 3 foot
drops, the right pedal started feeling lose. I checked the end cap and
it was tight. Not trusting these for muni, I put them on an ultimate
wheel I was learning to ride. The right pedal continued to get looser
until it finally started locking up and then fell off.

I'm not sure what pedal to suggest. I've had great luck with these;
http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=218
They're cheap and they last forever, but the platform doesn't feel as
stable as the B-27's.

I'm using SNAFU's on my muni now and they have held up great.
http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=524
They don't have as good of grip as the B-27's and they have a pretty
tall profile.



Good luck.... Joe


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paco
September 1st 03, 07:30 AM
I've never had a problem with my 'Odyssey Twisted Pro Pedals'
(http://www.unicycle.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=214), and I'm not
playing soft with these. Never done more than a couple foot drops, but
I have put on around a hundred and fifty miles with no problems at all.
They seem stable to me, but then again, I've never tried anything else.
I checked some mountain bike reviews, and they mostly seemed pretty
positive about this specific type.
Good luck!


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john_childs
September 1st 03, 07:40 AM
Bearing destruction is common, and expected, with pedals like the Wellgo
B-27 and other pedals that use a similar design.

One option is to get replacement bearings for your pedals. Bearings are
about $8 each and you'll need two (one for each pedal). Replacement
bearings are cheaper than new pedals. Figure on getting 3 months (maybe
more) use with the new bearings before needing to replace them.

The B-27's use 686ZZ bearings
13mm OD
6mm ID
5mm wide

If you want new pedals I would recommend the 'AtomLab Aircorps'
(http://tinyurl.com/79i8) or the 'Brooklyn Machine Works Shinburger'
(http://www.brooklynmachineworks.com/).

Checkernuts had the Shinburger pedals at the Vancouver Island Muni
Weekend. They looked good and not as scary as I thought they would be.
A large platform that is comfortable to stand on. Very grippy. And
they use two or three cartridge bearings per pedal. Disadvantage is
that they're heavy.

The Atomlab Aircorps are great. They use a single cartridge bearing per
pedal. I got about a year and a half out of a set of bearings with
them.

The Shinburger pedals are $99.99 at 'DansComp.com'
(http://www.danscomp.com/). The Aircorps are about $95 at various
online bike shops listed in my review of the pedals. 'Beyondbikes.com'
(http://www.beyondbikes.com/) has them on sale for $79.99 right now.


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john_childs
September 1st 03, 09:42 PM
Frank A. wrote:
> * You don't have to spend $100 for a good set of pedals but in my
> experience $30.00 was too little.
> *

Cost is not a good indicator of pedal robustness. The Easton platform
pedals sell for about $90 and they have the exact same problem with the
bearing as the Wellgo B-27's. The Easton platform pedals use the same
pedal design as the Wellgo's that destroys the cartridge bearings.

The Shimano MX30 platform pedal (a.k.a. Shimano DX platform pedal) has
gotten very good reviews from other muni riders too. It's a solid pedal
for muni. I have not tried the Shimano pedal because my preference is
for a larger platform, but if you like the shape and size of the DX
style pedals the Shimano MX30's are a very good choice. The Shimano
pedals usually sell in around the $90 range but I just saw them on
'PricePoint.com' (http://www.pricepoint.com/product837.html) for $59.98.
If they're going for less on eBay that's good too.

I got some of the Wellgo B-27 pedals when they were on sale at
Performance. I got them for use on the Coker. The Coker doesn't get
the abuse of a muni so the B-27's will hold up much longer. I'm not
going to use the B-27's on my muni.


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Klaas Bil
September 1st 03, 11:15 PM
On Mon, 1 Sep 2003 14:49:14 -0500, Frank A.
> wrote:

>Personally, I wouldn't try rebuilding them. From the prices John
>Childs quotes for replacement bearings, I would put that money towards a
>new pair of pedals with a better design.
>You don't have to spend $100 for a good set of pedals but in my
>experience $30.00 was too little.

But wouldn't you have eliminated the worst part of the B-27's when you
replace the bearings? Then, after their initial failure, you would
have good-feeling and longer-lasting pedals for only $16.

Klaas Bil - Newsgroup Addict
--
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john_childs
September 1st 03, 11:55 PM
Klaas Bil wrote:
> *On Mon, 1 Sep 2003 14:49:14 -0500, Frank A.
> > wrote:
>
> >Personally, I wouldn't try rebuilding them. From the prices John
> >Childs quotes for replacement bearings, I would put that money
> towards a
> >new pair of pedals with a better design.
> >You don't have to spend $100 for a good set of pedals but in my
> >experience $30.00 was too little.
>
> But wouldn't you have eliminated the worst part of the B-27's when you
> replace the bearings? Then, after their initial failure, you would
> have good-feeling and longer-lasting pedals for only $16.
>
> Klaas Bil - Newsgroup Addict
> *

With replacement bearings you'll end up with functioning pedals again.
But they won't last a long time because they bearings will self-destruct
again. Depending on how much abuse the pedals get the new bearings
could last 3 months, 6 months, more, less, it's hard to know. The fault
is the pedal design and not the bearings.

Short term it's cheaper to go with new bearings. Long term it's better
to go with new pedals like the Shimano's, Aircorp's, or Shinburger's.


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muniracer
September 2nd 03, 01:13 AM
personally, im a fan of the bulletproofs. theres no better incentive
than a bleeding shin with every mistake...


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gerblefranklin
September 2nd 03, 01:52 AM
I have the Zuzu's which are basically the bulletproofs, but with sealed
bearings and more pins, and if you crankgrab or pedalgrab too much on
ethier one, the platform will crack and eventually break off. They
usually crack at the pins. Mine have already begun this process.
I have some generic aluminum Diamondback pedals on my 20" which I bought
at the local bike shop for $5 because a bearing was a bit loose, and
they've held up great. I've done well over 500 attempted crank grabs on
them, without a problem. I've also put well over 800 miles on them and
no problems yet. They're the same as the bulletproof, except they don't
have screw-in pins, so the platform is stronger.
I've also heard good things about the DK Iron cross pedals
(non-magnesium, sealed bearings). They are a bit heavy but they're ultra
beefy, and seem to be good pedals. I don't know if they're made anymore,
though.


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evilewan
September 2nd 03, 04:40 AM
i rode a pair of shinburgers in germany, they feel realy good, but like
the name says they tear up flesh realy easily. and they weigh about a
ton.
unless you unicycle is more about looks than performance then the extra
weight just isn`t worth it. the profile hub is heavy enough as it is.

i`ve got some shimano dx alikes by outland. and they still work after
over a years hardcore abuse. i`ve nearly ground the pins off on my
grab/grind side. i don`t actualy cover huge distances on my trials uni
though, but i do ride at skateparks and do urban trials verry regularly,
i.e. at least every other day.

pedal fetish aside i`d just buy the next set i saw with sealed bearings,
a large cnc`d platform, replacable hex pins and a place to open a beer
bottle.


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gerblefranklin
September 3rd 03, 12:49 AM
johnglazer wrote:
> *800 miles on a 20"? over how long? *


I've been commuting on that uni averaging about 5-15 miles a week over
the past year and a half. I'll break the thousand mark sometime before
January, by my estimate.


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john_childs
September 3rd 03, 02:04 AM
chirokid wrote:
> *
> They are called "Free Agent" Factory Racing Pedals. They are your
> basic black, with a slight twisted look. They are ball bearing style
> and the box says they are "one piece alloy construction." But,
> truthfully, they do NOT feel very good. I guess I will have to wait
> and see how they perform.
>
> Anyone have experience with the "Free Agent" Factory Racing Platform
> Pin Pedals? If they are really bad, please don't tell me, :D because
> I already bought, installed and used them. But the good news, my Muni
> is Back in Action!!! --chirokid-- *

You can grease up unsealed pedals and they'll spin more smoothly. It's
a bit of a pain because you have to keep track of all the loose ball
bearings when you take them apart. Adjusting the tightness on bearing
cups when you put them back together is also tricky. If you get them
too tight the pedals won't spin smoothly. If you get them too loose the
pedal will wobble and wiggle on the spindle. There is a very line
between too loose and too tight.

When you do take the pedals apart do it in a shoe box so you don't loose
any of the ball bearings. Pack some grease on the spindle and around
the ball bearings. Put it all back together. Tighten the nut that
squeezes the bearing races together. Put the end cap back on. And
you're good to go.

The unsealed pedals will last you longer than the B-27's. The bearings
won't fall apart on you like the cartridge bearings in the B-27's.

If you do get pedal envy you can splurge on the Shimano or AtomLab
pedals. It's always good to have a spare set of pedals on hand anyways,
as you have just found out.

Don't worry about "wasting" money on pedals. I've made some poor pedal
purchase decisions buying pedals that didn't end up lasting very long.
I bought some $90 Easton platform pedals that destroyed bearings just
like your B-27's did. I stopped using the Easton pedals because I could
never trust them to stay together for an entire ride. Then I tried some
$80 Kore platform pedals that lasted about three months before the
needle bearings self-destructed. That was an $80 learning experience.
Now that I've found the AtomLab Aircorps I'm a happy camper and pedal
problems are not a big problem any more.

So buy a nice pair of pedals, keep the Free Agent's as a spare, and
don't feel any guilt. The Shimano's and Aircorp's are on sale right now
so go for it.


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chirokid
September 3rd 03, 06:48 AM
john_childs wrote:
> *
> You can grease up unsealed pedals and they'll spin more smoothly.*
>
> >
> >
> > How ironic! As soon as I got home tonight, I broke down one of my
> > new pedals to grease and adjust it. It spun a little rough, right
> > out of the box, so I planned to work on it at my first opportunity.
> > What I found was a pedal with almost no grease. I packed it full of
> > grease and adjusted it really well. I had no problem with the
> > bearings because I have done this fix many times as a kid on the
> > front hub of my bikes and re-packing/adjusting roller skate wheels.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > john_childs wrote:
> > > *If you do get pedal envy you can splurge on the Shimano or
> > > AtomLab pedals. It's always good to have a spare set of pedals on
> > > hand anyways, as you have just found out.*
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Oh how I understand that fact. I have checked out the DX and
> > > > Aircorps, thanks for all the info. I may try some of the
> > > > Odyssey Twisted Pro Pedals for three reasons: 1. Cheap price 2.
> > > > Yellow (I like yellow) and 3. Paco recommeded (I want to ride
> > > > like paco, will the pedals he use help me to ride like Paco?) :D
> > > > When I break the Odysseys, I'll spring for the high $$ Shimano
> > > > or Aircorps, they both look awesome. For the time being, the
> > > > Free Agents will make great spares (for Labor Day weekend
> > > > Breaks). One question on teh Shimano and Aircorps: You
> > > > recommend the SEALED bearing on each of these, Right?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > john_childs wrote:
> > > > > *Don't worry about "wasting" money on pedals. I've made some
> > > > > poor pedal purchase decisions buying pedals that didn't end up
> > > > > lasting very long.*
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The sharing of all this info has sure saved me some $$ in
> > > > > > the long run. I appreciate everyone's input about my pedal
> > > > > > dilemma.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > BTW, after tonights ride, I still do not care for my new
> > > > > > Free Agent Pedals. The seem to hold my foot in place, but
> > > > > > my feet just never felt perfect. On the B-27's, my feet
> > > > > > always felt perfect. For the first 3 days at least :D!!!
> > > > > > --chirokid--



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paco
September 3rd 03, 10:22 AM
chirokid wrote:
> (I want to ride like paco, will the pedals he use help me to ride like
> Paco?) :D[/B]

You mean, ride up semi-steep hills and give up right before getting to
the hard parts? I pretend that I'm good at MUni (mostly to make me feel
like I'm good at something), but I huff and puff my way up and down
things like anyone else. The stuff that I find "extreme" would probably
make a John Childs or a John Foss ashamed for me for how much I'm
fooling myself.
But I appreciate you trying to make me feel good! ;)


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paco
September 3rd 03, 10:22 AM
chirokid wrote:
> (I want to ride like paco, will the pedals he use help me to ride like
> Paco?) :D[/B]

You mean, ride up semi-steep hills and give up right before getting to
the hard parts? I pretend that I'm good at MUni (mostly to make me feel
like I'm good at something), but I huff and puff my way up and down
things like anyone else. The stuff that I find "extreme" would probably
make a John Childs or a John Foss ashamed for me for how much I'm
fooling myself.
But I appreciate you trying to make me feel good! ;)


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sp4rky-m4rky
May 11th 07, 10:24 PM
I have snafu pedals on my 07 kh 20 I have only been riding it for maybe
a month or two but now they keep making a strange noise which sounds
very unhealthy but there is no play in them. any suggestions on what I
should do to/with them? I was thinking of taking them apart and packing
them wih grease, is this wise or will I loose berrings or dammage it
more if I try?


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feel the light
May 12th 07, 02:57 AM
I thought John's price estimate was a little high, OK for wheel
bearings, but high for little ones. My local tool repair shop was
cheaper then that.
So I did a google and found
this.http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/MBB/686zz10 24 $/10
You should be able to buy these locally for 3 or 4 $
A tip on installing sealed bearings. Never stress across the
bearings. If the outer race is pressed in, use a socket that just
touches the outer race. If it presses on a shaft, only tap the inner
race. Putting a part in the freezer to shrink it a bit is a good idea
sometimes. Banging on the wrong race will cause premature failure.


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