? 4 all you night riders...

[Roger Buchanan]

I know how I used to ride at night, but since that likely won't
correlate to how any of you folks ride I thought I'd ask.

Given that the only difference is riding at night, same trail, same
bike, same weather, how much does your style or pace change (if at all).
Do you slow down at night, or do you change the trails that you ride?

What about those of you with experience with group night rides? Are
group night rides more relaxed, or more intense in terms of keeping the
group together. Or are they the same as groups in the day? How forgiving
are groups of "stragglers", etc.?

Any thoughts?

The reason that I'm asking is that I'm gonna get back into night riding
next year, if at *ALL* possible, and I thought I'd ask you fellow
creatures of the night.

Now if only my batteries will still hold a charge...
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- Rog

[Per Löwdin]

> Given that the only difference is riding at night, same trail, same
> bike, same weather, how much does your style or pace change (if at all).
> Do you slow down at night, or do you change the trails that you ride?

We ride a lot at night, due to the long dark Swedish winters, objectively we
probably ride just a tad slower but it does not feel so. We ride the trails
we always ride, there are a lot of them
http://www.lowdin.nu/Mtbruntuppsala/English.html and we know them quite
well, prefer rather technical trails where speed can be quite slow but you
still have to work a lot. Would be scary to ride really fast hard pack as
the light beam does not reach far. We use Niterider´s Blowtorches and in
slow riding it is almost as riding in day light.

I would be careful about riding unknown trails. Orientation can be
difficult: if you get lost you can get really lost unless you have a map and
compass along (we don´t).

> What about those of you with experience with group night rides? Are
> group night rides more relaxed, or more intense in terms of keeping the
> group together. Or are they the same as groups in the day?

We are a group that rides on Wednesdays, just came in from a ride, and we
always stay together, it is kind of fun to be a bunch of people following a
tight, twisting singletrack, when it is pitch black all around.

> How forgiving
> are groups of "stragglers", etc.?

We are having fun, not racing, and there is a collective sense of
responsibility to make sure every one comes home, or at least out of the
woods, safe and sound. However, people who do not have poor bike handling
skills usually don´t show up next Wednesday.

Per
http://lowdin.nu

[Carla A-G]

"Roger Buchanan" > wrote in message
...
> I know how I used to ride at night, but since that likely won't
> correlate to how any of you folks ride I thought I'd ask.

Hi Rog, glad to see that you're a regular AMB'r again :-)

> Given that the only difference is riding at night, same trail, same
> bike, same weather, how much does your style or pace change (if at all).
> Do you slow down at night, or do you change the trails that you ride?

We ride the same trails at night. We don't go as hard as during daylight
rides because of the risk factor involved with night riding and lack of
complete vision of the trail, but we still ride hard.

> What about those of you with experience with group night rides? Are
> group night rides more relaxed, or more intense in terms of keeping the
> group together. Or are they the same as groups in the day? How forgiving
> are groups of "stragglers", etc.?

Our night group rides often consist of a mixed group of people with
different skill levels. We always keep everyone together and always wait for
the stragglers.

> Any thoughts?

Yes, don't let the BoogieMan get you. Never ride alone at night. Always
carry some backup lighting, like a flashlight, just in case. Be prepared,
carry the tools and equipment necessary for your ride.

> The reason that I'm asking is that I'm gonna get back into night riding
> next year, if at *ALL* possible, and I thought I'd ask you fellow
> creatures of the night.
>
> Now if only my batteries will still hold a charge...

Good luck, Rog.

- CA-G

Can-Am Girls Kick Ass!

[Paladin]

Roger Buchanan wrote:

> I know how I used to ride at night, but since that likely won't
> correlate to how any of you folks ride I thought I'd ask.
>
> Given that the only difference is riding at night, same trail, same
> bike, same weather, how much does your style or pace change (if at all).
> Do you slow down at night, or do you change the trails that you ride?



Trails don't actually change, but they sure seem like it. I climb just
as fast, or faster, since the mental intimidation of seeing the whole
hill is gone on a night ride. You just pedal, and before you know it,
you've climbed the hill.


>
> What about those of you with experience with group night rides? Are
> group night rides more relaxed, or more intense in terms of keeping the
> group together.


Ours are relaxed, with an unwritten rule to stay together, or at least
to wait for everybody at each possible intersection or fork.

Or are they the same as groups in the day? How forgiving
> are groups of "stragglers", etc.?


If there's any doubt, make sure everybody knows what's expected. We joke
and horse around a lot, fake accidents, etc., but you better know each
other before screwing around too much. You don't want somebody to get
hurt or left and the leader not know about it. Counting noses is good.

Night riding will certainly double the number of available trails, since
your old favorites will be *substantially* different from when you ride
them in daylight.

Paladin


>
> Any thoughts?
>
> The reason that I'm asking is that I'm gonna get back into night riding
> next year, if at *ALL* possible, and I thought I'd ask you fellow
> creatures of the night.
>
> Now if only my batteries will still hold a charge...
>

[D H]

"Roger Buchanan" > wrote in message

> Given that the only difference is riding at night, same trail, same
> bike, same weather, how much does your style or pace change (if at all).
> Do you slow down at night, or do you change the trails that you ride?

I'd agree with others here that the pace does drop off some, especially
if descending anything technical at all. The trail comes up in your face
FAST on night rides because you can't see as far and therefore can't track
things way ahead of you. Even if you know every curve, log, rock, and tree
on the trail, they all come up on you faster than you are used to on day
rides.

> What about those of you with experience with group night rides? Are
> group night rides more relaxed, or more intense in terms of keeping the
> group together. Or are they the same as groups in the day? How forgiving
> are groups of "stragglers", etc.?

I wish I had the luxury of only riding with others as Carla suggests,
but I'm stuck with a gorgeous state park all to myself for most night rides.
Don't have enough riders in the area to be able to arrange group rides
except once in a great while. (I hope to get a few together this
fall/winter, though.)
In the few group rides I've enjoyed here, they are definitely more
relaxed. Even the guys usually running too much testosterone tend to turn it
down a notch on night rides. And we always keep each other in sight or very
nearly, in case anyone needs any assistance. Mechanical problems, let alone
crashes, increase in seriousness at night, just because you MUST have lights
not only to see to repair, but also have lights left to get back down the
mountain. And in winter cold, the frostbite/exposure issue is very real,
even down here in western Virginia.
You mention stragglers. You have to check this out with your group, as
every one is a bit different. I think most groups will be very forgiving on
any given night, but on the other hand, if your abilities are TOO widely
spread out, it can be tougher on the faster folks if they are waiting around
too long, but this doesn't bother everyone to the same degree. If the ride
area is pretty condensed so you are all never far from the starting point
anyway, that minimizes the problems even more because there is less need for
constant head counts, etc.

> The reason that I'm asking is that I'm gonna get back into night riding
> next year, if at *ALL* possible, and I thought I'd ask you fellow
> creatures of the night.
>
> Now if only my batteries will still hold a charge...

I rode from the house late this afternoon, with dark coming on as I got
in a second short lap, and I was thinking to myself, "I wonder if I should
run back into the house and grab my lights for a 3rd lap?" I decided not to
because I have not freshened the charge on the batteries since last spring
and I'm afraid it may hurt them if I run them without a freshen-up charge.
(Or that's what the manual says, anyway.) In any case, the season is
certainly here to start keeping the batteries ready for that spur of the
moment night ride.
Enjoy one when you can!
--
Off to ride the mountains, D H
Reply to newsgroup. Spam is out of control.

[Roger Buchanan]

Carla A-G wrote:
> Hi Rog, glad to see that you're a regular AMB'r again :-)

Hi Carla! Well, I'm more like an "irregular regular" <grin>... you know
what I mean though.

> Yes, don't let the BoogieMan get you. Never ride alone at night. Always
> carry some backup lighting, like a flashlight, just in case. Be prepared,
> carry the tools and equipment necessary for your ride.

Oh I did that, 'cept for the not riding alone. I always rode alone at
night. Mainly because there was nobody to ride with, or my pace was too
pokey... My concession to Linda is that I find a ride buddy if I am to
start riding at night again.

The night ride stuff I have down. It's the riding with others at night
that I'm not too familiar with.

> > Now if only my batteries will still hold a charge...
>
> Good luck, Rog.

Thanks! I had only bought my lights in the late fall of 2001, then had
that surgery in the spring of 2002. *That* cost me the whole season. I
only started riding again in the spring of 2003, so I didn't bother to
get back into night riding until I was sure that just riding was
something that I was gonna be able to resume. (one of those "cart before
the horse" type of rationale's)

Now that I know that riding is no problem, as long as I stick to the
more tame trails, I'll be able to start night riding again in '04. All I
have to do is find a group that I'd fit with, or a ride buddy that is
amenable with my pace/skills... Easy as pie! (While I'm at it I think
I'll go out and buy a lottery ticket)

Say Hi to Jim for me.

I still have my bobble-head proudly on display!
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- Rog

[Roger Buchanan]

Paladin wrote:

> Trails don't actually change, but they sure seem like it.

Yeah, I've often thought that it's like riding in a little "bubble".
There's all the blackness, and then there's the little bit of light and
trail in front of you.

I remember coming around a fast corner only to find 5-6 whitetail deer
standing in a group on the trail. They stood there "blinking" at me for
what seemed quite a long time before they bounded away. Helmet lights
are great for shining in deers eyes. <blink> <blink> <blink> Really
weird.

> > What about those of you with experience with group night rides? Are
> > group night rides more relaxed, or more intense in terms of keeping the
> > group together.
>
> Ours are relaxed, with an unwritten rule to stay together, or at least
> to wait for everybody at each possible intersection or fork.

If I had to take a guess I'd say that I'm probably best suited for a
ride buddy, rather than being part of a group. That's just a hunch, but
I'm limited in the trails that I can ride, and the chances that I can
take on them. I'd just figure a ride buddy with the same requirements
for night riding would be the best.

The socializing of the group is something that would be great fun for me
though.

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- Rog

[Roger Buchanan]

D H wrote:
> You mention stragglers. You have to check this out with your group, as
> every one is a bit different. I think most groups will be very forgiving on
> any given night, but on the other hand, if your abilities are TOO widely
> spread out, it can be tougher on the faster folks if they are waiting around
> too long, but this doesn't bother everyone to the same degree.

I would think that it would be hard on everyone. The faster ones that
have to wait AND the slower ones that might do something unwise in an
attempt to keep up.


> certainly here to start keeping the batteries ready for that spur of the
> moment night ride.
> Enjoy one when you can!

I'm really looking forward to my first night back on the bike. I run
both a helmet and bar lights and found them to be a great combo. I don't
need wild trails to ride at night. All I need is some rolling
singletrack, darkness, charged lights, and now a ride buddy.

--
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- Rog

[Carla A-G]

"Roger Buchanan" > wrote in message
...
> Say Hi to Jim for me.

I certainly will :-)

> I still have my bobble-head proudly on display!

Our Ken Morrow bobble-head twin of yours is currently sitting beside a few
other hockey player characters (Leafs, of course). Still waiting for a brawl
to ensue...

- CA-G

Can-Am Girls Kick Ass!

[Roger Buchanan]

"Per Löwdin" wrote:
>
> > Given that the only difference is riding at night, same trail, same
> > bike, same weather, how much does your style or pace change (if at all).
> > Do you slow down at night, or do you change the trails that you ride?

> I would be careful about riding unknown trails. Orientation can be
> difficult: if you get lost you can get really lost unless you have a map and
> compass along (we don´t).

Oh no, I didn't mean changing to new trails. I meant changing to other
trails, ones that might be more suited to riding at night. I like slower
trails that twist and weave through the woods to ride at night, not fast
flowing hardpacked singletrack. I'd never suggest to anyone to ride a
trail at night that they first hadn't ridden at least a few times during
the light of day.

> However, people who do not have poor bike handling
> skills usually don´t show up next Wednesday.

That's what makes me think that I'd be better off with a ride buddy,
someone who's just into to night riding to get out and enjoy some
singletrack in a different way, and isn't worried about riding technical
stuff, or riding at a certain pace.

Well, I've got until next spring to find someone that's interested in
night riding at my pace with my technical limitations.
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- Rog

[Roger Buchanan]

Carla A-G wrote:
> > I still have my bobble-head proudly on display!
>
> Our Ken Morrow bobble-head twin of yours is currently sitting beside a few
> other hockey player characters (Leafs, of course)

"Leafs"?

What a waste of a bobble-head... GD&R'ing...

--
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- Rog

[Per Löwdin]

> > I would be careful about riding unknown trails. Orientation can be
> > difficult: if you get lost you can get really lost unless you have a map
and
> > compass along (we don´t).
>
> Oh no, I didn't mean changing to new trails. I meant changing to other
> trails, ones that might be more suited to riding at night. I like slower
> trails that twist and weave through the woods to ride at night, not fast
> flowing hardpacked singletrack. I'd never suggest to anyone to ride a
> trail at night that they first hadn't ridden at least a few times during
> the light of day.

Yes, of course, I just offered a general observation. Initially, you will
find that the trails you have ridden a lot appear completely different at
night. One of the first time we rode at night on a trail we have ridden lots
of times we managed to lose it and it took us a good while to find it again.
I think if you have to look for the trail, to orient your self, a head torch
is preferable, as you can scan the surroundings without lifting your whole
bike twisting it to get the light beam where you want it. It is cumbersome
and feels pretty silly.
Per
http://www.lowdin.nu/MTB/MTB.html

[D H]

"Roger Buchanan" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> D H wrote:
> > You mention stragglers. You have to check this out with your group,
as
> > every one is a bit different. I think most groups will be very forgiving
on
> > any given night, but on the other hand, if your abilities are TOO widely
> > spread out, it can be tougher on the faster folks if they are waiting
around
> > too long, but this doesn't bother everyone to the same degree.
>
> I would think that it would be hard on everyone. The faster ones that
> have to wait AND the slower ones that might do something unwise in an
> attempt to keep up.

Good point. And it's also harder because they typically get robbed of
getting breathers because others are ready to take off by that time.

> > certainly here to start keeping the batteries ready for that spur of the
> > moment night ride.
> > Enjoy one when you can!
>
> I'm really looking forward to my first night back on the bike. I run
> both a helmet and bar lights and found them to be a great combo. I don't
> need wild trails to ride at night. All I need is some rolling
> singletrack, darkness, charged lights, and now a ride buddy.
>
Good luck with that last one. I hope someone steps up to join you and
finds out that having a buddy helps both of you to get out and ride even
more often!
--
Off to ride the mountains, D H
Reply to newsgroup. Spam is out of control.