BBC Breakfast TV - Helmets

[Michael MacClancy]

Breakfast had a feature on cycle helmets this morning. It featured Angie
Lee dropping eggs onto tarmac and someone from the Reading Cycling Campaign
whose own views were too balanced to counter the pro-compulsion emphasis of
the piece. By the way, if you break your leg it can be fixed, if you break
your head it can't. One further observation ... other than the footage of
youngsters doing cycle training all of the pictures of (adult) cyclists
were of helmetless cyclists. Strange that no comment was made about this.
The vast majority of viewer emails and texts were of the 'my little Johnnie
avoided severe head injury because he was wearing a helmet' type. It's
obvious what the BBC's stance is on this subject.
--
Michael MacClancy
Random putdown - "They never open their mouths without subtracting from
the sum of human knowledge." - Thomas Brackett Reed
www.macclancy.demon.co.uk
www.macclancy.co.uk

[Scott Leckey]

The BBC is the quintessential pinky "sheeple's" news outlet. The safety
Nazis have taken over: Hammers have to be rubber; knives blunt; furniture
balsa wood. All of this cobblers is purveyed with that "dying cow" facial
expression and the "Who will save our children?" tone.

Yuck.

My stance? "Helmets yes, compulsion no."

"Michael MacClancy" > wrote in message
.. .
> Breakfast had a feature on cycle helmets this morning. It featured Angie
> Lee dropping eggs onto tarmac.
> The vast majority of viewer emails and texts were of the 'my little
Johnnie
> avoided severe head injury because he was wearing a helmet' type. It's
> obvious what the BBC's stance is on this subject.

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 11:15:16 +0100, Michael MacClancy
> wrote in message
>:

>Breakfast had a feature on cycle helmets this morning. It featured Angie
>Lee dropping eggs onto tarmac and someone from the Reading Cycling Campaign
>whose own views were too balanced to counter the pro-compulsion emphasis of
>the piece.

Unfortunately I was in London, otherwise that would have been me...

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Nathaniel Porter]

"Michael MacClancy" > wrote in message
.. .
> It's
> obvious what the BBC's stance is on this subject.
>

I would suggest they are simply representing public opinion, and that as the
public are ill-informed on the subject most of them swallow the BHIT line.

I think it would be a dangerous precedent for the BBC (or anyone else) to
misrepresent public opinion, regardless of whether this is a "good" or "bad"
thing or not.

[Zog The Undeniable]

Nathaniel Porter wrote:

> I think it would be a dangerous precedent for the BBC (or anyone else) to
> misrepresent public opinion, regardless of whether this is a "good" or "bad"
> thing or not.
>
But the majority of the public (including Swamp Monster and Martlew, I
suspect) doesn't ride bikes, therefore a minority is being oppressed by
a majority to whom it should really be no concern, but whose views differ.

Representing public opinion (or at least the audience's opinion) is what
rabble-rousing papers like the Express do. Shock horror stealth tax
asylum seeker single mother kind of thing.

[Nathaniel Porter]

"Zog The Undeniable" > wrote in message
news:40cb23b1.0@entanet...
> Nathaniel Porter wrote:
>
> > I think it would be a dangerous precedent for the BBC (or anyone else)
to
> > misrepresent public opinion, regardless of whether this is a "good" or
"bad"
> > thing or not.
> >
> But the majority of the public (including Swamp Monster and Martlew, I
> suspect) doesn't ride bikes, therefore a minority is being oppressed by
> a majority to whom it should really be no concern, but whose views differ.
>
> Representing public opinion (or at least the audience's opinion) is what
> rabble-rousing papers like the Express do. Shock horror stealth tax
> asylum seeker single mother kind of thing.

A fair point.

[Al C-F]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 12:46:30 +0100, "Nathaniel Porter"
> wrote:

>> obvious what the BBC's stance is on this subject.
>>
>
>I would suggest they are simply representing public opinion, and that as the
>public are ill-informed on the subject most of them swallow the BHIT line.

Isn't it in their charter to 'educate and inform'?
--

Cheers,

Al

[Nathaniel Porter]

"Al C-F" > wrote in
message ...
> On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 12:46:30 +0100, "Nathaniel Porter"
> > wrote:
>
> >> obvious what the BBC's stance is on this subject.
> >>
> >
> >I would suggest they are simply representing public opinion, and that as
the
> >public are ill-informed on the subject most of them swallow the BHIT
line.
>
> Isn't it in their charter to 'educate and inform'?
>

Yes (and they did go at least some way to that by reporting the anti-
lobby's concerns, although I would agree they could have done more [although
this may be the fault of the anti- lobby for not providing a spokesperson
for a sound byte or that they didn't make their point well, or something
like that]).

But if they are going to report on public opinion (which is basically what
reading out viewers emails is), they should take a representative sample of
the letters in order to accurately represent public opinion - otherwise it
would be biased.

Ideally of course they'd have a longer report detailing the arguments for
and against - but that would eat into resources and broadcasting time, and
would be difficult to justify for a relatively minor issue like helmet
compulsion.

[JohnB]

"Just zis Guy, you know?" wrote:
>
> On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 11:15:16 +0100, Michael MacClancy
> > wrote in message
> >:
>
> >Breakfast had a feature on cycle helmets this morning. It featured Angie
> >Lee dropping eggs onto tarmac and someone from the Reading Cycling Campaign
> >whose own views were too balanced to counter the pro-compulsion emphasis of
> >the piece.
>
> Unfortunately I was in London, otherwise that would have been me...

i would have like to have seen a professional spokesperson from one of
the national cycling organisations or even from the trade.
Where were the CTC?

John B

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 19:02:46 +0100, JohnB > wrote in
message >:

>i would have like to have seen a professional spokesperson from one of
>the national cycling organisations or even from the trade.
>Where were the CTC?

The Beeb specifically asked for someone else, AIUI, because the piece
was the Swamp Monster's response to the BBC's effrontery in allowing
Roger Geffen to put a balanced view after the Martlew Debate.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 12:46:30 +0100, "Nathaniel Porter"
> wrote in message
>:

>I would suggest [BBC] are simply representing public opinion, and that as the
>public are ill-informed on the subject most of them swallow the BHIT line.

Their job is to inform the public, not to go along with ill-informed
and mischievous propaganda.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[dailuggs]

Michael Macclan wrote:
> Breakfast had a feature on cycle helmets this morning. It featured Angie
> Lee dropping eggs onto tarmac and someone from the Reading Cycling
> Campaign whose own views were too balanced to counter the pro-compulsion
> emphasis of the piece. By the way, if you break your leg it can be
> fixed, if you break your head it can't. One further observation ...
> other than the footage of youngsters doing cycle training all of the
> pictures of (adult) cyclists were of helmetless cyclists. Strange that
> no comment was made about this. The vast majority of viewer emails and
> texts were of the 'my little Johnnie avoided severe head injury because
> he was wearing a helmet' type. It's obvious what the BBC's stance is on
> this subject.
> --
> Michael MacClancy Random putdown - "They never open their mouths without
> subtracting from the sum of human knowledge."
> - Thomas Brackett Reed www.macclancy.demon.co.uk www.macclancy.co.uk


sure i heard on that report that 3000 cyclists were killed each yea
aswell, when im dur the figure i read in a paper lately was 2 a day
which is 730 a year, not 3000 a year


-

[Tony Raven]

dailuggs wrote:
>
> sure i heard on that report that 3000 cyclists were killed each year
> aswell, when im dur the figure i read in a paper lately was 2 a day,
> which is 730 a year, not 3000 a year!

3000 is road deaths, cyclist deaths are around 130 a year IIRC

Tony

[Nathaniel Porter]

"Tony Raven" > wrote in message
...
> dailuggs wrote:
> >
> > sure i heard on that report that 3000 cyclists were killed each year
> > aswell, when im dur the figure i read in a paper lately was 2 a day,
> > which is 730 a year, not 3000 a year!
>
> 3000 is road deaths, cyclist deaths are around 130 a year IIRC
>

The stat claimed on the report was 3000 cyclists killed or injured. I don't
know how accurate this is.

[Tony Raven]

Nathaniel Porter wrote:
> "Tony Raven" > wrote in message
> ...
>> dailuggs wrote:
>>>
>>> sure i heard on that report that 3000 cyclists were killed each year
>>> aswell, when im dur the figure i read in a paper lately was 2 a day,
>>> which is 730 a year, not 3000 a year!
>>
>> 3000 is road deaths, cyclist deaths are around 130 a year IIRC
>>
>
> The stat claimed on the report was 3000 cyclists killed or injured. I don't
> know how accurate this is.

That's about right for killed or seriously injured but killed is only around
130.

Tony

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 21:45:46 +0100, "Nathaniel Porter"
> wrote in message
>:

>The stat claimed on the report was 3000 cyclists killed or injured. I don't
>know how accurate this is.

I think it's about right - just don't inquire too closely about how
serious the injuries are (most are trivial) or how many ar head
injuries (under half, IIRC) or how many of the head injury deaths and
serious injuries could be prevented by helmets (most optimistic
plausible estimate being about 10%).

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Andy Dingley]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 11:29:47 +0100, "Scott Leckey"
> wrote:

>The BBC is the quintessential pinky "sheeple's" news outlet.

Do you mind ? I'm the quintessential tomato (looks green, but turns
red when allowed to ripen) and I neither bleat, nor own a TV.

Remember - if you ever laughed at a comedy carrot back in the '70s,
you share the collective guilt for encouraging Enid Rancid and her
"Any child with a blowlamp" hysteria.


--
Smert' spamionam

[Michael MacClancy]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 21:45:46 +0100, Nathaniel Porter wrote:

> "Tony Raven" > wrote in message
> ...
>> dailuggs wrote:
>>>
>>> sure i heard on that report that 3000 cyclists were killed each year
>>> aswell, when im dur the figure i read in a paper lately was 2 a day,
>>> which is 730 a year, not 3000 a year!
>>
>> 3000 is road deaths, cyclist deaths are around 130 a year IIRC
>>
>
> The stat claimed on the report was 3000 cyclists killed or injured. I don't
> know how accurate this is.

Yes, it was quoted as 3000 killed or injured. The report seemed to be
trying to be balanced but it needed someone with a better soundbite to
balance the Swampmonster's views. Also, Bill Turnbull waded in (outside
the report) with a stupid off the cuff remark about the number of serious
head injuries seen in casualty units as a result of people not wearing
helmets.
--
Michael MacClancy
Random putdown - "A modest little person, with much to be modest about."-
Winston Churchill
www.macclancy.demon.co.uk
www.macclancy.co.uk

[Marc Brett]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 08:17:53 +0100, Michael MacClancy
> wrote:

> Also, Bill Turnbull waded in (outside
>the report) with a stupid off the cuff remark about the number of serious
>head injuries seen in casualty units as a result of people not wearing
>helmets.

Since most injuries in casualty are from drinking, we'd get better
results if pub-crawlers were made to wear bike helmets.

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 00:03:35 +0100, Andy Dingley
> wrote in message
>:

>>The BBC is the quintessential pinky "sheeple's" news outlet.

>Do you mind ? I'm the quintessential tomato (looks green, but turns
>red when allowed to ripen) and I neither bleat, nor own a TV.

BBC is also available via the wireless and the new-fangled Interweb
thingy.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 08:17:53 +0100, Michael MacClancy
> wrote in message
>:

>The report seemed to be
>trying to be balanced but it needed someone with a better soundbite to
>balance the Swampmonster's views.

We already have an excellent soundbyte which I think should be used in
every interview and response to the Beeb: there is no known case where
cyclist safety has improved with increasing helmet use. The authority
for this is road safety minister David Jamieson.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Alex Ferrier]

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
>
> Nathaniel Porter wrote:
> >
> >The stat claimed on the report was 3000 cyclists killed or injured. I
don't
> >know how accurate this is.
>
> I think it's about right - just don't inquire too closely about how
> serious the injuries are (most are trivial) or how many ar head
> injuries (under half, IIRC) or how many of the head injury deaths and
> serious injuries could be prevented by helmets (most optimistic
> plausible estimate being about 10%).
>

Dunno, I'm not going to guess at the stats, but from personal
experience I believe that the majority of these 'injuries' will
be trivial. I had a motorcycle accident years ago where I was
overtaking a car which decided to pull out and overtake the car
in front without looking or indicating. I was so far forward that
I could have reached out and put his cigarette out for him as he
started the manoeuvre and when we finally made contact I ripped his
front bumper off. Anyway, I digress. The end result was, me getting
thrown over the handlebars and the bike ending up a twisted mess in
the ditch. Amazingly I was uninjured, having rolled as I hit the ground.
Later when being questioned by the police, they kept returning again
and again to the question of any injuries I might have received. I
assured them several times that I was fine, but they kept asking if
I was cut anywhere. Eventually I looked down pulled up a trouser leg
and found a small graze where the skin had been rubbed off and the
bruised area underneath was just 'weeping' ever so slightly. The
investigating copper looked chuffed and ticked the relevant box.
So down I went as an accident statistic. I've never taken these
accident statistics seriously ever since.

--
Alex
BMW R1150GS
DIAABTCOD#3 MSWF#4 UKRMFBC#6 Ibw#35 BOB#8
http://www.team-ukrm.co.uk
Windy's "little soldier"

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 10:25:32 +0100, "Alex Ferrier"
> wrote in message
>:

> I'm not going to guess at the stats, but from personal
>experience I believe that the majority of these 'injuries' will
>be trivial.

Well, it's a funny thing really. DfT KSI stats are collected I
believe by the pleece officers investigating a crash; thus the
definition of "serious" is open to interpretation. A cut head which
bleeds profusely may be logged as serious, while a closed head wound
which masks a potentially life-threatening injury might not. But I
compared the DoH hospital admissions data with DfT stats and I believe
that DfT KSI stats are probably fairly close. Fatality is the most
accurate measure, followed by KSI. All injury stats are no better
than a guess,which is why few people use them except for indicative
purposes (being a large enough number for statisticians to play with).

However...

As usual BeHIT are being mischievous. They want you to believe that
every one of those deaths and injuries would have been prevented by a
Magic Hat. The truth is, of course, that few cyclists die, even fewer
of head injuries alone, many of the serious injuries will be to other
parts of the body, and in any case the cause of the problem is motor
traffic not failure to wear a PFDB.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Graeme]

"Just zis Guy, you know?" > wrote in
:

> As usual BeHIT are being mischievous. They want you to believe that
> every one of those deaths and injuries would have been prevented by a
> Magic Hat.

I've always thought they were used as Joe Public hears the phrase as
"*KILLED* <whisper> or seriously injured </whisper>", or at least
interprets it as such and BHIT are well aware of this. So, many people will
now think the huge figure is for deaths.


Graeme

[Tony Raven]

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
>
> We already have an excellent soundbyte which I think should be used in
> every interview and response to the Beeb: there is no known case where
> cyclist safety has improved with increasing helmet use. The authority
> for this is road safety minister David Jamieson.
>

Yebbut nobody beleives government ministers these days

Tony

[Andy Dingley]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 10:12:37 +0100, "Just zis Guy, you know?"
> wrote:

>BBC is also available via the wireless and the new-fangled Interweb
>thingy.

But it's the TV version that offers the worst of this attitude. On
Radio 4, You and Yours is an aberration. On TV, it's the default.

--
Smert' spamionam

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 13:07:26 +0100, Andy Dingley
> wrote in message
>:

>On Radio 4, You and Yours is an aberration. On TV, it's the default.

"Brassed Off Briatin - That's Life without the intellectual rigour"
(c) Dead Ringers

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 13:01:23 +0100, "Tony Raven"
> wrote in message
>:

>nobody beleives government ministers these days

How true. What amazes me is that, according to the evidence, people
having become ****ed off with the Labour Party's duplicity are
switching back to the Monster Raving Tory Party, who gave us the Scott
Report, sleaze and - well - an almost indistinguishably different sort
of duplicity. I suppose a week is a long time in politics, and after
nearly a decade people have forgotten the unedifying spectacle of a
government trying to send innocent people to jail rather than admit
ministers lied to parliament.

My choice of candidate(s) in every election is strongly influenced by
which party is most likely to bring in a change in the current
scandalous voting system.

Although even if the MRTP did pledge to introduce PR I might still be
challenged to support them with Michael "Creature of the Night" Howard
at the helm.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Nathaniel Porter]

"Just zis Guy, you know?" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 13:01:23 +0100, "Tony Raven"
> > wrote in message
> >:
>
> ...the unedifying spectacle of a
> government trying to send innocent people to jail rather than admit
> ministers lied to parliament.
>

I would suggest this is insignificant compared to sending thousands of
innocent people to their deaths rather than admit ministers lied to
parliament....

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 13:44:21 +0100, "Nathaniel Porter"
> wrote in message
>:

>> ...the unedifying spectacle of a
>> government trying to send innocent people to jail rather than admit
>> ministers lied to parliament.

>I would suggest this is insignificant compared to sending thousands of
>innocent people to their deaths rather than admit ministers lied to
>parliament....

The Falklands, you mean? Never looked into it that closely.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[dwb]

"Just zis Guy, you know?" > wrote in message
...
> parts of the body, and in any case the cause of the problem is motor
> traffic not failure to wear a PFDB.

I've injured myself twice on a bicycle, once where a helmet did save me
injury and the second where I ended up in a pile of grass at a rather high
speed.

In both cases, motor traffic was not a problem - I was totally at fault.

Motor traffic contributes, but don't ever think people aren't stupid enough
to injure themselves all on their own.

[Tony Raven]

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
>
> The Falklands, you mean? Never looked into it that closely.
>

Obviously

Tony

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 14:12:04 +0100, "dwb" >
wrote in message >:

>Motor traffic contributes, but don't ever think people aren't stupid enough
>to injure themselves all on their own.

But, looking at the stats for children, 90% of the injuries are due to
road traffic, and 90% of child cycling is offroad. All but one of the
fatalities in 2003 were offroad as well. And although road traffic
accounts for only 10% of all child injury admissions it makes up half
of the fatalities.

So, in as much as there is a single predominant problem, motor traffic
is it.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Nathaniel Porter]

"Just zis Guy, you know?" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 13:44:21 +0100, "Nathaniel Porter"
> > wrote in message
> >:
>
> >> ...the unedifying spectacle of a
> >> government trying to send innocent people to jail rather than admit
> >> ministers lied to parliament.
>
> >I would suggest this is insignificant compared to sending thousands of
> >innocent people to their deaths rather than admit ministers lied to
> >parliament....
>
> The Falklands, you mean? Never looked into it that closely.
>

What was the lie to parliament w.r.t. the Falklands?

[Patrick Herring]

"Just zis Guy, you know?" > wrote:

| On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 08:17:53 +0100, Michael MacClancy
| > wrote in message
| >:
|
| >The report seemed to be
| >trying to be balanced but it needed someone with a better soundbite to
| >balance the Swampmonster's views.
|
| We already have an excellent soundbyte which I think should be used in
| every interview and response to the Beeb: there is no known case where
| cyclist safety has improved with increasing helmet use. The authority
| for this is road safety minister David Jamieson.

Yep, a good'un, except it doesn't counter "it still might help for
me", that would take some risk compensation research...

Another good line is "The most worrying statistic is from Alberta,
Canada where...". Any news on the progress of facts from there?

--
Patrick Herring, Sheffield, UK
http://www.anweald.co.uk

[Michael MacClancy]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 15:31:04 GMT, Patrick Herring wrote:

> "Just zis Guy, you know?" > wrote:
>
>| On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 08:17:53 +0100, Michael MacClancy
>| > wrote in message
>| >:
>|
>|>The report seemed to be
>|>trying to be balanced but it needed someone with a better soundbite to
>|>balance the Swampmonster's views.
>|
>| We already have an excellent soundbyte which I think should be used in
>| every interview and response to the Beeb: there is no known case where
>| cyclist safety has improved with increasing helmet use. The authority
>| for this is road safety minister David Jamieson.
>
> Yep, a good'un, except it doesn't counter "it still might help for
> me", that would take some risk compensation research...
>
> Another good line is "The most worrying statistic is from Alberta,
> Canada where...". Any news on the progress of facts from there?

"Anyone who thinks that a bit of moulded polystyrene can protect them from
serious head injury ... needs to have their head examined."
--
Michael MacClancy
Random putdown - "His mother should have thrown him away and kept the
stork." - Mae West
www.macclancy.demon.co.uk
www.macclancy.co.uk

[Colin McKenzie]

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

> But, looking at the stats for children, 90% of the injuries are due to
> road traffic, and 90% of child cycling is offroad. All but one of the
> fatalities in 2003 were offroad as well.

Misprint?

> And although road traffic
> accounts for only 10% of all child injury admissions it makes up half
> of the fatalities.
>
> So, in as much as there is a single predominant problem, motor traffic
> is it.
>
Colin McKenzie

--
The great advantage of not trusting statistics is that
it leaves you free to believe the damned lies instead!

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 20:20:03 +0100, Colin McKenzie
> wrote in message
>:

>> But, looking at the stats for children, 90% of the injuries are due to
>> road traffic, and 90% of child cycling is offroad. All but one of the
>> fatalities in 2003 were offroad as well.

>Misprint?

Eh? Oh, I see. Yes, all but one were road transport. Ta.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[audrey]

Breakfast TV in our house is of the CBeebies variety. Helmet
propoganda still going strong on Tikabilla


--

email = audmad aaatttt hhhottt mmmaailll dddoottt ccccoommm

[Al C-F]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 08:42:41 +0100, audrey > wrote:

>Breakfast TV in our house is of the CBeebies variety. Helmet
>propoganda still going strong on Tikabilla
>
>
I've been looking for a semicircle of paper to wear.
--

Cheers,

Al

[audrey]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 09:04:59 +0100, Al C-F
> wrote:

>On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 08:42:41 +0100, audrey > wrote:
>
>>Breakfast TV in our house is of the CBeebies variety. Helmet
>>propoganda still going strong on Tikabilla
>>
>>
>I've been looking for a semicircle of paper to wear.

I'm still looking for my invisible helmet, I know I left it round here
somewhere ...
--

email = audmad aaatttt hhhottt mmmaailll dddoottt ccccoommm

[Ian G Batten]

In article >,
Tony Raven > wrote:
> That's about right for killed or seriously injured

If this is anything like the statistics I recall being bandied around
during the rows about motorcycle licensing in the early 80s, the
definition of ``seriously injured'' is incredibly weak, and doesn't mean
what you would naively think it means.

ian

[Ian G Batten]

In article >,
Just zis Guy, you know? > wrote:
> Although even if the MRTP did pledge to introduce PR I might still be
> challenged to support them with Michael "Creature of the Night" Howard
> at the helm.

Widdecombe should have watched her language. I doubt she is openly
anti-semitic herself, but her comment reeked of it and pandered to that
constituency in the Tory party. And it clearly resonates with the
anti-semitic lunatic fringe:

http://www.nationalvanguard.org/story.php?id=1046

ian

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

Ian G Batten wrote:

> Widdecombe should have watched her language. I doubt she is openly
> anti-semitic herself, but her comment reeked of it and pandered to
> that constituency in the Tory party. And it clearly resonates with
> the anti-semitic lunatic fringe:

Eh? I read it as an attack on vampires. Howard is almost certainly a
vampire. I'm sure of it ;-)

--
Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

[Dave Larrington]

audrey wrote:
> I'm still looking for my invisible helmet, I know I left it round here
> somewhere ...

Did you look under the fridge? Remember: /fridge suck/ is the most poweful
force in the Universe.

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
================================================== =========
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
================================================== =========

[Robert Bruce]

mae > wedi ysgrifennu:
> Howard is almost certainly a
> vampire. I'm sure of it ;-)
>
> --
> Guy


For those unaware of the evidence for this:

http://www.lgib.gov.uk/news/story.html?newsId=1075

http://tinyurl.com/24m74

"It appears that there is ‘something of the Transylvanian’ about Michael
Howard, as the town of Ruscova has invited the Conservative leader to
reclaim his family’s estates in the region. Vasile Pop, the Mayor of Ruscova
in northern Romania, has written to Mr Howard, offering his help in
recovering the extensive lands that his family owned prior to the Nazi
invasion. The Mayor believes that, under Romania’s post-Communist
restitution laws, the Conservative leader will be allowed to reclaim his
family’s holdings."

--
Rob

Please keep conversations in the newsgroup so that all may contribute
and benefit.

[audrey]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 16:25:12 +0100, "Dave Larrington" >
wrote:

>audrey wrote:
>> I'm still looking for my invisible helmet, I know I left it round here
>> somewhere ...
>
>Did you look under the fridge? Remember: /fridge suck/ is the most poweful
>force in the Universe.

The Tikabilla Invisi-Helmet (tm) is immune from Fridge Suck

A
--

email = audmad aaatttt hhhottt mmmaailll dddoottt ccccoommm

[Tony Raven]

audrey wrote:
>
> The Tikabilla Invisi-Helmet (tm) is immune from Fridge Suck
>

Nothing can resist the irresistable force of fridge suck other than things you
don't mind losing.

Tony

[audrey]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 17:15:32 +0100, "Tony Raven"
> wrote:


>
>Nothing can resist the irresistable force of fridge suck other than things you
>don't mind losing.

We do seem to have an invisibility field on top of the fridge,
rendering anything you put there unfindable until you are at least 15
minutes late leaving the house

A

--

email = audmad aaatttt hhhottt mmmaailll dddoottt ccccoommm

[Tony Raven]

audrey wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 17:15:32 +0100, "Tony Raven"
> > wrote:
>
>
>>
>> Nothing can resist the irresistable force of fridge suck other than things
>> you don't mind losing.
>
> We do seem to have an invisibility field on top of the fridge,
> rendering anything you put there unfindable until you are at least 15
> minutes late leaving the house
>

You seem to have a rare variant of the invisibility field there - worthy of
further investigation. The standard fridge invisibility field means you can
only see the objects you are not looking for. Its also quite subtle in that
it knows when you are trying to fool it by pretending to look for something
else in the hope that the thing you are really looking for becomes visible.

Tony

[Ambrose Nankivell]

In ,
Robert Bruce > typed:
> mae > wedi ysgrifennu:
>> Howard is almost certainly a
>> vampire. I'm sure of it ;-)
>
> For those unaware of the evidence for this:
>
<snip link to Transylvania>

So it's OK to be anti-Romanian, then? Good to hear it.

A

[Keith Willoughby]

Ian G Batten wrote:

> In article >,
> Just zis Guy, you know? > wrote:
>> Although even if the MRTP did pledge to introduce PR I might still be
>> challenged to support them with Michael "Creature of the Night" Howard
>> at the helm.
>
> Widdecombe should have watched her language. I doubt she is openly
> anti-semitic herself

But you think she might be in private?

> , but her comment reeked of it

It did? I thought she was pointing out his vampiric qualities.

--
Keith Willoughby http://flat222.org/keith/
This is the year

[james]

audrey > wrote in message >...
> Breakfast TV in our house is of the CBeebies variety. Helmet
> propoganda still going strong on Tikabilla

I noticed Sarah-Louise-Can't-Sing-In-Tune riding around on
Jason-Fatboy's back the other day wearing what appeared to be a
bicycle helmet. What was that about? I prefer Beverley and Paul
myself

best wishes
james

[james]

audrey > wrote in message >...
> Breakfast TV in our house is of the CBeebies variety. Helmet
> propoganda still going strong on Tikabilla

I noticed Sarah-Louise-Can't-Sing-In-Tune riding around on
Jason-Fatboy's back the other day wearing what appeared to be a
bicycle helmet. What was that about? I prefer Beverley and Paul
myself

best wishes
james

[Ian G Batten]

In article >,
Keith Willoughby > wrote:
> It did? I thought she was pointing out his vampiric qualities.

Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make it
questionable.

ian

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 20:02:40 +0100, "Ambrose Nankivell"
> wrote in message
>:

>So it's OK to be anti-Romanian, then? Good to hear it.

I have no problem with those Romanians who are able to go out in
daylight and see their reflections in mirrors ;-)

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 20:49:10 +0000 (UTC), Ian G Batten
> wrote in message
>:


>> It did? I thought she was pointing out his vampiric qualities.

>Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make it
>questionable.

I don't think enough people have even heard of the blood libel these
days for that to be an issue.

And did he threaten to overrule him?

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Ian G Batten]

In article >,
Just zis Guy, you know? > wrote:
> >Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make it
> >questionable.
>
> I don't think enough people have even heard of the blood libel these
> days for that to be an issue.

Oh, I rather think you'll find the nutters have.

> And did he threaten to overrule him?

Who cares? He's a politician. He's a liar. He lies no more and
perhaps even less than most other politicians. That the worst people
can think of is a Paxman egotrip (go on: bet you can't remember who was
being overruled, and about which issue), rather than, say, lying to the
house in order to force through a vote on a war on fake evidence, shows
that he's not recently been lying as much as others.

ian

[James Annan]

Ian G Batten wrote:

> In article >,
> Keith Willoughby > wrote:
>
>>It did? I thought she was pointing out his vampiric qualities.
>
>
> Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make it
> questionable.

Eh? WTF are you on about?

James

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 21:17:31 +0000 (UTC), Ian G Batten
> wrote in message
>:

>bet you can't remember who was
>being overruled, and about which issue

Director of the prison service, on the sacking of a governor. Can't
remember the name of the rpson service bloke. Derek Lewis?

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Thu, 17 Jun 2004 06:26:54 +0900, James Annan
> wrote in message
>:

>> Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make it
>> questionable.

>Eh? WTF are you on about?

A mediaeval antisemitic myth (google for blood libel, plenty of
sources).

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 22:39:33 +0100, "Just zis Guy, you know?"
> wrote in message
>:

>>bet you can't remember who was
>>being overruled, and about which issue

>Director of the prison service, on the sacking of a governor. Can't
>remember the name of the rpson service bloke. Derek Lewis?

Ah, and here it is in full for Paxman fans everywhere:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/video/newsnight/howard.ram

A superb example of Operation Spiked Pit: first asks Howard if he has
ever lied, then gives the facts which show that one or other of them
(Lewis or Howard) was lying, then asked Howard outright whether what
Lewis said was true - and Howard falls straight into the hole.
Genius!

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Ian G Batten]

In article >,
Just zis Guy, you know? > wrote:
> >bet you can't remember who was
> >being overruled, and about which issue
>
> Director of the prison service, on the sacking of a governor. Can't
> remember the name of the rpson service bloke. Derek Lewis?

I seem to recall Martin Nairy was involved, but I may be wrong. Over
what issue was the governer being sacked, and why was it a scandal?
I honestly can't recall.

ian

[Ian G Batten]

In article >,
Just zis Guy, you know? > wrote:
> mediaeval

If only. http://fp.thebeers.f9.co.uk/blood_libel.htm

ian

[Ambrose Nankivell]

In ,
Just zis Guy, you know? > typed:
> On Thu, 17 Jun 2004 06:26:54 +0900, James Annan
> > wrote in message
> >:
>
>>> Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to
>>> make it questionable.
>
>> Eh? WTF are you on about?
>
> A mediaeval antisemitic myth (google for blood libel, plenty of
> sources).

As opposed to the current view that it's acceptable to call someone from
Romania a vampire.* (And just as I type this, an Amazon ad in a browser
window tells me to buy a Buffy book)

Ambrose

*obviously this is less offensive than the blood libel, but it still doesn't
mean it's polite.

[Ian G Batten]

In article >,
Just zis Guy, you know? > wrote:
> A superb example of Operation Spiked Pit: first asks Howard if he has
> ever lied, then gives the facts which show that one or other of them
> (Lewis or Howard) was lying, then asked Howard outright whether what
> Lewis said was true - and Howard falls straight into the hole.
> Genius!

For debate Usenet-style, yes. Later Paxman will be along to tell us the
name of the politician who hasn't lied. ``Politician tells lies'' is
only news if you're still reeling from the revelation that Santa Claus
is actually your dad. But it's all good knockabout stuff.

ian

[James Annan]

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

> On Thu, 17 Jun 2004 06:26:54 +0900, James Annan
> > wrote in message
> >:
>
>
>>>Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make it
>>>questionable.
>
>
>>Eh? WTF are you on about?
>
>
> A mediaeval antisemitic myth (google for blood libel, plenty of
> sources).
>

Well that put me in my place. Having never heard of it before, and
noting that it has been aimed at a wide range of ethnic groups and is
not related in any way to vampirism, I contend that Ian Batten's
imagined slight is rather speculative at best.

James

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 21:51:58 +0000 (UTC), Ian G Batten
> wrote in message
>:

>I seem to recall Martin Nairy was involved, but I may be wrong. Over
>what issue was the governer being sacked, and why was it a scandal?
>I honestly can't recall.

Martin Neary was the organist at Westminster Abbey, there was lots of
fuss about his sacking; Martin Nairy? I don't recall him being
controversial.

I don't recall what the problem was at Parkhurst, but I think it might
have been riots.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

[Simon Brooke]

in message >, Ian G Batten
') wrote:

> In article >,
> Keith Willoughby > wrote:
>> It did? I thought she was pointing out his vampiric qualities.
>
> Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make
> it questionable.

Isn't this taking paranoid conspiracy theories just a little too far?

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; 'I think we should trust our president in every decision
;; that he makes and we should just support that'
;; Britney Spears of George W Bush, CNN 04:09:03

[Robert Bruce]

mae > wedi ysgrifennu:
> In ,
> Robert Bruce > typed:
>> mae > wedi ysgrifennu:
>>> Howard is almost certainly a
>>> vampire. I'm sure of it ;-)
>>
>> For those unaware of the evidence for this:
>>
> <snip link to Transylvania>
>
> So it's OK to be anti-Romanian, then? Good to hear it.
>
> A

Ah come on. Michael Howard comes across as one of those incredibly camp
vampires from a low budget 'seventies Hammer Horror film. That's funny. It
turns out that his father was from Transylvania, where, traditionally,
vampires are said to originate. That's ironic and therefore adds to the
humour. There is not a hint of anti-Romanianism(?) about this.

--
Rob

Please keep conversations in the newsgroup so that all may contribute
and benefit.

[Dave Larrington]

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

> Eh? I read it as an attack on vampires. Howard is almost certainly a
> vampire. I'm sure of it ;-)

Him and Norman Tebbit. Those stories about him having been an airline pilot
are horse - the only flying he ever did is coz he can transmute himself into
a bat at will.

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
================================================== =========
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
================================================== =========

[Dave Larrington]

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

> Director of the prison service, on the sacking of a governor. Can't
> remember the name of the rpson service bloke. Derek Lewis?

An FLJS chum swears that Paxo only asked Count Howard the same question
fourteen times because he couldn't think of anything else to say...

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
================================================== =========
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
================================================== =========

[Simon Brooke]

in message >, Ian G Batten
') wrote:

> In article >,
> Just zis Guy, you know? > wrote:
>> A superb example of Operation Spiked Pit: first asks Howard if he has
>> ever lied, then gives the facts which show that one or other of them
>> (Lewis or Howard) was lying, then asked Howard outright whether what
>> Lewis said was true - and Howard falls straight into the hole.
>> Genius!
>
> For debate Usenet-style, yes. Later Paxman will be along to tell us
> the
> name of the politician who hasn't lied. ``Politician tells lies'' is
> only news if you're still reeling from the revelation that Santa Claus
> is actually your dad. But it's all good knockabout stuff.

Actually, seriously, it isn't. It's the death of democracy in the UK.
We're becoming so (justifiably) cynical about our politicians because
our political culture has become so childish, petty and deceitful that
we no longer have any respect either for the politicians or the
process, which is why so many people don't bother to vote.

We desperately, urgently, need politicians with higher standards of
personal ethics: people who are not afraid to admit their mistakes;
people who do not either lie or use carefully constructed statements to
decieve. The problem is that, even if such people were attracted to
politics, they could not rise to the top in our present system.

But this is _way_ off topic.

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; this is not a .sig

[Mark Thompson]

> Actually, seriously, it isn't. It's the death of democracy in
the UK.
> We're becoming so (justifiably) cynical about our politicians
because
> our political culture has become so childish, petty and
deceitful that
> we no longer have any respect either for the politicians or
the
> process, which is why so many people don't bother to vote.
>
> We desperately, urgently, need politicians with higher
standards of
> personal ethics: people who are not afraid to admit their
mistakes;
> people who do not either lie or use carefully constructed
statements
> to decieve. The problem is that, even if such people were
attracted to
> politics, they could not rise to the top in our present
system.
>
> But this is _way_ off topic.

Hey, you can't whack in something like that then imply that its
all so
off topic no one should reply!

IMHO voter apathy/low turnout in elections is a sign of a mature
and
stable political democracy and social and economic wellbeing &
consensus. For proof, look what happens every time the BNP come
along -
higher turnout to stop 'em getting (back) in and the rest of the
time it
doesn't matter about voting 'cos there is so much consensus
between the
parties. Blue Labour and the New Conservatives further prove my
point.
Whilst they claim to disagree vehemently with each others
policies, no
one can actually tell them apart.[1]


Mark.

[1] It's true. I asked a colour blind person and he said
they're very
slightly different shades of grey.

PS
Whilst readers of this ng may disagree vehemently with my
position there
is so much consensus between our differing opinions, and the
whole thing
is _way_ too off topic, that it really isn't worth posting a
reply to
disagree.

[Ian G Batten]

In article >,
Simon Brooke > wrote:
> Actually, seriously, it isn't. It's the death of democracy in the UK.
> We're becoming so (justifiably) cynical about our politicians because
> our political culture has become so childish, petty and deceitful that
> we no longer have any respect either for the politicians or the
> process, which is why so many people don't bother to vote.

Anyone clever enough to be a politician is clever enough to do something
more interesting, more lucrative and more relaxing instead. Why do you
think Tony gets to be Prime Minister, while Cherie is a high powered
barrister?

> We desperately, urgently, need politicians with higher standards of
> personal ethics: people who are not afraid to admit their mistakes;
> people who do not either lie or use carefully constructed statements to
> decieve. The problem is that, even if such people were attracted to
> politics, they could not rise to the top in our present system.

Unfortunately, honest politicians are more dangerous than bent ones.
Bent ones usually spend their time filling their own pockets, and let
the country run itself. Which, usually, it manages pretty well. It's
the ones that _believe_ in things --- Blair, Bush Jr --- who are the
menace, because they believe they have a direct line to righteousness.

> But this is _way_ off topic.

It's not. The reason why transport policy in this country is bust is
because the politicians are stupid and dishonest.

ian

[Gawnsoft]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 22:05:03 GMT, Simon Brooke >
wrote (more or less):

>in message >, Ian G Batten
') wrote:
>
>> In article >,
>> Keith Willoughby > wrote:
>>> It did? I thought she was pointing out his vampiric qualities.
>>
>> Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make
>> it questionable.
>
>Isn't this taking paranoid conspiracy theories just a little too far?

It remind sme of the US Anti-defamation League boycotting David Icke
for saying some world-leaders turn into lizards.

Because it was an 'anti-semitic' statement.



--
Cheers,
Euan
Gawnsoft: http://www.gawnsoft.co.sr
Symbian/Epoc wiki: http://html.dnsalias.net:1122
Smalltalk links (harvested from comp.lang.smalltalk) http://html.dnsalias.net/gawnsoft/smalltalk

[Simon Brooke]

in message >, Gawnsoft
t') wrote:

> On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 22:05:03 GMT, Simon Brooke >
> wrote (more or less):
>
>>in message >, Ian G Batten
') wrote:
>>
>>> In article >,
>>> Keith Willoughby > wrote:
>>>> It did? I thought she was pointing out his vampiric qualities.
>>>
>>> Enough people see a linkage between that and the blood libel to make
>>> it questionable.
>>
>>Isn't this taking paranoid conspiracy theories just a little too far?
>
> It remind sme of the US Anti-defamation League boycotting David Icke
> for saying some world-leaders turn into lizards.
>
> Because it was an 'anti-semitic' statement.

Come again? How did they work _that_ one out?

Although, come to think of it, perhaps he and they deserve one another.

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

The Conservative Party now has the support of a smaller proportion of
the electorate in Scotland than Sinn Fein have in Northern Ireland.

[Jon Senior]

Just zis Guy, you know? opined the
following...
> A superb example of Operation Spiked Pit: first asks Howard if he has
> ever lied, then gives the facts which show that one or other of them
> (Lewis or Howard) was lying, then asked Howard outright whether what
> Lewis said was true - and Howard falls straight into the hole.
> Genius!

I have little time for Paxman, I much prefer the old vanguard of the
Today Program, but that is truely entertaining. The almost comic pause
between each repetition of "Did you threaten to overrule him?" and the
slight movements of Paxman each time he asks it. Fantastic!

Jon

[Jon Senior]

Simon Brooke opined the following...
> > It remind sme of the US Anti-defamation League boycotting David Icke
> > for saying some world-leaders turn into lizards.

Not "turn into". Are lizards in disguise.

> > Because it was an 'anti-semitic' statement.
>
> Come again? How did they work _that_ one out?
>
> Although, come to think of it, perhaps he and they deserve one another.

The best story I heard regarding David Icke was from Canada. It was
suggested to the Canadian Premier that he should turn down a visa
application by Mr Icke on the grounds that he (Icke) was going to accuse
the Canadian Premier of being a lizard alien in disguise. The premier's
response went something like:

"I have enough faith in the intelligence of my people to allow them to
listen to this man and not be concerned."

A quick google didn't reveal the actual quote. Does anyone have a record
of it?

Jon

[Dr Curious]

"Jon Senior" <jon_AT_restlesslemon_DOTco_DOT_uk> wrote in message
...
> Simon Brooke opined the following...
> > > It remind sme of the US Anti-defamation League boycotting David Icke
> > > for saying some world-leaders turn into lizards.
>
> Not "turn into". Are lizards in disguise.
>
> > > Because it was an 'anti-semitic' statement.
> >
> > Come again? How did they work _that_ one out?
> >
> > Although, come to think of it, perhaps he and they deserve one another.
>
> The best story I heard regarding David Icke was from Canada. It was
> suggested to the Canadian Premier that he should turn down a visa
> application by Mr Icke on the grounds that he (Icke) was going to accuse
> the Canadian Premier of being a lizard alien in disguise. The premier's
> response went something like:
>
> "I have enough faith in the intelligence of my people to allow them to
> listen to this man and not be concerned."
>
> A quick google didn't reveal the actual quote. Does anyone have a record
> of it?
>
> Jon


There's this which may be related, although with no actual quote.

Looks like he's in good, or bad, company.

http://books.guardian.co.uk/extracts/story/0,6761,457988,00.html

The Canadian hate crimes unit had been alerted. So had the media.
The coalition had also written to the former Canadian prime minister,
Brian Mulroney, to inform him that David Icke was accusing him of
being a reptilian, child-sacrificing paedophile. But so far, to the
coalition's bafflement, Mulroney had declined to initiate legal
action. Indeed, every individual accused of reptilian paedophilia
by David Icke had so far failed to sue, including Bob Hope, George
Bush, George Bush Jr, Ted Heath, the Rothschild family, Boxcar Willie,
the Queen of England, the Queen Mother, Prince Philip, Kris Kristofferson,
Al Gore and the steering committee of the Bilderberg Group.

------------------------------------------------------------------------


Curious

[Just zis Guy, you know?]

Jon Senior wrote:

> I have little time for Paxman, I much prefer the old vanguard of the
> Today Program

John Timpson and Brian Redhead, the A-Team!

--
Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

[Jon Senior]

Just zis Guy, you know? opined the
following...
> John Timpson and Brian Redhead, the A-Team!

I was brought up to the sound of Brian Redhead taking politicians to
pieces every morning. I hold the today programme responsible for 50% of
my cynicism. (I blame the other 50% on my family!)

Jon

[Aloysius]

audrey > wrote in message >...
> On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 09:04:59 +0100, Al C-F
> > wrote:
>
> >On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 08:42:41 +0100, audrey > wrote:
> >
> >>Breakfast TV in our house is of the CBeebies variety. Helmet
> >>propoganda still going strong on Tikabilla
> >>
> >>
> >I've been looking for a semicircle of paper to wear.
>
> I'm still looking for my invisible helmet, I know I left it round here
> somewhere ...

This morning, the presenter managed her imaginary cycle ride without
her imaginary helmet. Shock. Horror.

[Tony Raven]

Aloysius wrote:
> audrey > wrote in message
> >...
>> On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 09:04:59 +0100, Al C-F
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 08:42:41 +0100, audrey > wrote:
>>>
>>>> Breakfast TV in our house is of the CBeebies variety. Helmet
>>>> propoganda still going strong on Tikabilla
>>>>
>>>>
>>> I've been looking for a semicircle of paper to wear.
>>
>> I'm still looking for my invisible helmet, I know I left it round here
>> somewhere ...
>
> This morning, the presenter managed her imaginary cycle ride without
> her imaginary helmet. Shock. Horror.

I imagine she died.

Tony ;-)