Hawaii Maui's Haleakala

[Jee Doy]

Anyone have any info on this climb of 36 miles up to 10,000 elevation? There
seems to be tour rides going down but not up. I guess its for the very fit
cyclists. I wanted to get info on this before I try this one. So far I
learned that its a two lane highway with no bike lanes. Also some people going
down lose control and have died going off the road.

If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down. Are there any
decent rental shops with good light road bikes to do the climb? I assume they
will have a 12-25 rear cassette or better.

Any other pointers would be helpful.

[Terry Morse]

Jee Doy wrote:

> Anyone have any info on this climb of 36 miles up to 10,000 elevation?

These write-ups are pretty decent:

http://briandesousa.com/bicycling/rides/haleakala.htm
http://home.pacbell.net/d_swiger/HaleakalaRide.htm
http://www.actc.org/stories/hlk00_da.htm
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

[Rob Green]

Terry Morse wrote:

> Jee Doy wrote:
>
>
>>Anyone have any info on this climb of 36 miles up to 10,000 elevation?
>
>
> These write-ups are pretty decent:
>
> http://briandesousa.com/bicycling/rides/haleakala.htm
> http://home.pacbell.net/d_swiger/HaleakalaRide.htm
> http://www.actc.org/stories/hlk00_da.htm
> --
> terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

I found another writeup from a Feb 2004 ascent:

http://pages.prodigy.net/hamachi/Haleakala.html

and another article from Bicycling Magazine's web site from 2002:

http://www.bicycling.com/article/0,3253,s1-3621,00.html?category_id=362

[Ken]

(Jee Doy) wrote in
:
> Anyone have any info on this climb of 36 miles up to 10,000 elevation?

http://www.cycletothesun.net/

[Chuck Anderson]

Jee Doy wrote:

>Anyone have any info on this climb of 36 miles up to 10,000 elevation? There
>seems to be tour rides going down but not up. I guess its for the very fit
>cyclists. I wanted to get info on this before I try this one. So far I
>learned that its a two lane highway with no bike lanes. Also some people going
>down lose control and have died going off the road.
>
> If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down.
>
But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
that. Isn't that the reason for going up?

(..... just kinda messin' with ya')

--
*****************************
Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO
http://www.CycleTourist.com
Integrity is obvious.
The lack of it is common.
*****************************

[Terry Morse]

Chuck Anderson wrote:

> > If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down.
> >
> But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
> prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
> that. Isn't that the reason for going up?

Descending can be fun, but 30+ mile descent gets pretty tedious.
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

[GaryG]

"Chuck Anderson" > wrote in message
news:MTL2d.66779$D%.53190@attbi_s51...
> Jee Doy wrote:
>
> >Anyone have any info on this climb of 36 miles up to 10,000 elevation?
There
> >seems to be tour rides going down but not up. I guess its for the very
fit
> >cyclists. I wanted to get info on this before I try this one. So far I
> >learned that its a two lane highway with no bike lanes. Also some people
going
> >down lose control and have died going off the road.
> >
> > If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down.
> >
> But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
> prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
> that. Isn't that the reason for going up?

Ditto, Chuck...no way I'm riding up 10,000 feet and not enjoying that
downhill!!

It would be pretty cool to see if you could break 1 hour for the descent.
It's an average 5.3% grade (278 feet of climbing per mile), so I'm guessing
1 hour for the descent would be do-able.

GG

>
> (..... just kinda messin' with ya')
>
> --
> *****************************
> Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO
> http://www.CycleTourist.com
> Integrity is obvious.
> The lack of it is common.
> *****************************

[Raptor]

Terry Morse wrote:
> Chuck Anderson wrote:
>
>
>>> If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down.
>>>
>>
>>But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
>>prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
>>that. Isn't that the reason for going up?
>
>
> Descending can be fun, but 30+ mile descent gets pretty tedious.

But easy.

This is on my list of things to do, definitely. The closest to it that
I've ever done is Salt Lake to Park City (and back). Parley's Canyon
only feels like it's 38 miles long, but there's nearly 10K feet of
climbing in that ride, and it's always hot and dry.

What's Maui like later in the day? The earlier in the day you start, the
suckier in my book.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Badger_South]

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 19:51:30 -0700, Terry Morse > wrote:

>Chuck Anderson wrote:
>
>> > If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down.
>> >
>> But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
>> prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
>> that. Isn't that the reason for going up?
>
>Descending can be fun, but 30+ mile descent gets pretty tedious.

Deployable drogue chute?
http://home.att.net/~m--sandlin/pad.htm

-B

[Terry Morse]

Raptor wrote:

> The closest to it that
> I've ever done is Salt Lake to Park City (and back). Parley's Canyon
> only feels like it's 38 miles long, but there's nearly 10K feet of
> climbing in that ride, and it's always hot and dry.

You rode up I-80 to Park City? That doesn't seem to be a pleasant
route. I'll be there in a couple of weeks, but riding on I-80 wasn't
on my list. Do you have any recommendations for hilly routes that
don't incluude the interstate?

One of my favorite long climbs is the final one of the Everest
Challenge. It starts down in the Owens Valley in Big Pine, at 4,000
feet. It climbs about 21 miles into the Bristlecone Pine Forest to
10,000 feet. 2.5 hours up, 52 minutes down.

http://bike.terrymorse.com/esierra0408/pages/IMG_0597.html

--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

[Boris Foelsch]

"Terry Morse" > wrote in message
...
>
> Descending can be fun, but 30+ mile descent gets pretty tedious.


Yes, especially when you descend the pumice trails past the FAA radio
beacons, down through the forest reserves, through Polipoli state reserve
and then back down to the highway and back to Kihei. I didn't use a road
bike to climb, so I could do this off road descent and then ride single
track in the reserve. This was foolish and over-ambitious. The climb was too
hard on the mountain bike and the old (UV radiation damaged) plastic toe
clips crumbled after 1 mile of pumice strewn trails, so I decended on
platforms with no clips. Went past the single track without even considering
it. I barely made it back onto paved roads before dark. I also started too
late.

What an experience though - no regrets. Seeing the other islands from the
top was great. Next time I do it will be on a light road bike.

Boris

[Dan Birchall]

(Terry Morse) wrote:
> Raptor wrote:
>
> > The closest to it that
> > I've ever done is Salt Lake to Park City (and back). Parley's Canyon
> > only feels like it's 38 miles long, but there's nearly 10K feet of
> > climbing in that ride, and it's always hot and dry.
>
> You rode up I-80 to Park City? That doesn't seem to be a pleasant
> route. I'll be there in a couple of weeks, but riding on I-80 wasn't
> on my list. Do you have any recommendations for hilly routes that
> don't incluude the interstate?
>
> One of my favorite long climbs is the final one of the Everest
> Challenge. It starts down in the Owens Valley in Big Pine, at 4,000
> feet. It climbs about 21 miles into the Bristlecone Pine Forest to
> 10,000 feet. 2.5 hours up, 52 minutes down.

If you're ever on top of Haleakala and look to the east-southeast on
a clear day... you'll notice a mountain that's higher. :) That'd be
Mauna Kea on the Big Island of Hawaii... 13796' and you can* get to
about 13770' on wheels.

*May require superhuman endurance and a bit of insanity.

Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
to get the final 1750 feet or so.

I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
would do the whole ascent in a single day.

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Amara Graps]

In article <MTL2d.66779$D%.53190@attbi_s51>, Chuck Anderson
> wrote:

> But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
> prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
> that. Isn't that the reason for going up?
>
> (..... just kinda messin' with ya')

Perhaps the laziness factor overrules the earning factor.
A majority of the bicycle riders ready to descend who
I've seen near the summit of Etna volcano (Sicily),
arrive at that high point via a bus ride.

Amara

--

************************************************** *****************
Amara Graps, PhD |Istituto di Fisica dello Spazio Interplanetario
| INAF, Rome, Italy
www.amara.com | http://www.mpi-hd.mpg.de/dustgroup/~graps
************************************************** ****************
"We came whirling out of Nothingness scattering stars like dust."
- Rumi

[Raptor]

Terry Morse wrote:
> Raptor wrote:
>
>
>>The closest to it that
>>I've ever done is Salt Lake to Park City (and back). Parley's Canyon
>>only feels like it's 38 miles long, but there's nearly 10K feet of
>>climbing in that ride, and it's always hot and dry.
>
>
> You rode up I-80 to Park City? That doesn't seem to be a pleasant
> route. I'll be there in a couple of weeks, but riding on I-80 wasn't
> on my list. Do you have any recommendations for hilly routes that
> don't incluude the interstate?

Yes, it's unpleasant. Fumes, sun, dry air, and there's usually a
tailwind exactly as fast as I climb. I've done it several times.

The best alternative, and it's a great one, is to mountain bike the trip
on trails. (Big Cottonwood or Mill Creek canyons as the west end.) It's
just as hard in totally different ways. You can choose single-track or
2WD vehicle gravel road. There might be snow by the time you get here.
But probably not.

There are so many other hilly routes, unless you want to get to Park
City by road bike. SLC alone has five other canyons, and the Wasatch
Back has great country road riding.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Raptor]

Dan Birchall wrote:
> *May require superhuman endurance and a bit of insanity.
>
> Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
> for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
> after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
> the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
> another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
> to get the final 1750 feet or so.
>
> I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
> Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
> folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
> would do the whole ascent in a single day.

Now THAT's an epic climb. Average 10%, with parts at 18%.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Terry Morse]

Raptor> wrote:

> There are so many other hilly routes, unless you want to get to Park
> City by road bike.

No need for us to ride to Park City, we're starting from there.

> SLC alone has five other canyons, and the Wasatch
> Back has great country road riding.

Neat, I'll get out a map. Is there a local club that posts suggested
routes?
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

[P.Hardewig]

"Terry Morse" > wrote in message
...
> Chuck Anderson wrote:
>
>> > If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down.
>> >
>> But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
>> prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
>> that. Isn't that the reason for going up?
>
> Descending can be fun, but 30+ mile descent gets pretty tedious.
> --
> terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

VERY tedious indeed! My wife & I did the Haleakala downhill and were the
only "serious" cylists in the group. The tour operator would only descend
as fast as the slowest rider in the group, so we CRAWLED down. The only
time I got to cut loose on one of their Workman bikes was when we were
getting so far behind on time, we were in danger of missing our scheduled
lunch stop, so our guide let some of us men go about 2 miles out from the
restaurant. I wish I could have had my Masi with me!

--
Wishing you flat hills, tailwind & friendly dogs,
Pat

[Janet]

P.Hardewig wrote:
> "Terry Morse" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Chuck Anderson wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down.
>>>>
>>>
>>>But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
>>>prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
>>>that. Isn't that the reason for going up?
>>
>>Descending can be fun, but 30+ mile descent gets pretty tedious.
>>--
>>terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/
>
>
> VERY tedious indeed! My wife & I did the Haleakala downhill and were the
> only "serious" cylists in the group. The tour operator would only descend
> as fast as the slowest rider in the group, so we CRAWLED down. The only
> time I got to cut loose on one of their Workman bikes was when we were
> getting so far behind on time, we were in danger of missing our scheduled
> lunch stop, so our guide let some of us men go about 2 miles out from the
> restaurant. I wish I could have had my Masi with me!
>

Yes, we did the tour group thing on Haleakala. Worst bike ride of my
life. The info said for experienced cyclist only, but it turned out that
"experience" meant you could balance on a bicycle. We also CRAWLED
downhill. Our guides were adamant about not letting us pass them. It
took us 6 hours to go 40 miles downhill!! (ok, so we did stop for
breakfast for about 45 min) I was bored out of my skull - but the
alternative was riding in their van that they took us up with.

The best part of the whole Haleakala experience was seeing the sunrise
from the summit. But I think if we do it again, we'll rent bikes and pay
someone to drive us up pre-sunrise.

Janet

[Raptor]

Terry Morse wrote:
> Raptor> wrote:
>>SLC alone has five other canyons, and the Wasatch
>>Back has great country road riding.
>
>
> Neat, I'll get out a map. Is there a local club that posts suggested
> routes?

http://www.bbtc.net/

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Brian Logan]

Janet > wrote:

>Yes, we did the tour group thing on Haleakala. Worst bike ride of my
>life. The info said for experienced cyclist only, but it turned out that
>"experience" meant you could balance on a bicycle. We also CRAWLED
>downhill. Our guides were adamant about not letting us pass them. It
>took us 6 hours to go 40 miles downhill!! (ok, so we did stop for
>breakfast for about 45 min) I was bored out of my skull - but the
>alternative was riding in their van that they took us up with.

It wasn't the worst bike ride of my life, parts of it I enjoyed. It
didn't help that I was single and all the others were couples. The
friends I was there with did not consider getting up that early was
something to do on Maui, nor was getting cold.

>The best part of the whole Haleakala experience was seeing the sunrise
>from the summit. But I think if we do it again, we'll rent bikes and pay
>someone to drive us up pre-sunrise.

Likewise, rent and get a ride up.

b.
--
We are not the victims of circumstances
but the architects of our destiny

[Janet]

Brian Logan wrote:
> Janet > wrote:
>
>
>>Yes, we did the tour group thing on Haleakala. Worst bike ride of my
>>life. The info said for experienced cyclist only, but it turned out that
>>"experience" meant you could balance on a bicycle. We also CRAWLED
>>downhill. Our guides were adamant about not letting us pass them. It
>>took us 6 hours to go 40 miles downhill!! (ok, so we did stop for
>>breakfast for about 45 min) I was bored out of my skull - but the
>>alternative was riding in their van that they took us up with.
>
>
> It wasn't the worst bike ride of my life, parts of it I enjoyed. It
> didn't help that I was single and all the others were couples. The
> friends I was there with did not consider getting up that early was
> something to do on Maui, nor was getting cold.
>

It's a really popular thing for couples on their honeymoon. That's when
we did the Haleakala ride. Yes, there were things I enjoyed (like the
great scenery), but the ride itself was awful.


>
>>The best part of the whole Haleakala experience was seeing the sunrise
>
>>from the summit. But I think if we do it again, we'll rent bikes and pay
>
>>someone to drive us up pre-sunrise.
>
>
> Likewise, rent and get a ride up.
>
> b.

[Rick Warner]

Terry Morse > wrote in message >...
> Raptor> wrote:
>
> > There are so many other hilly routes, unless you want to get to Park
> > City by road bike.
>
> No need for us to ride to Park City, we're starting from there.
>
> > SLC alone has five other canyons, and the Wasatch
> > Back has great country road riding.
>
> Neat, I'll get out a map. Is there a local club that posts suggested
> routes?

Hey Terry,

I did my BS at the U of U many, many years ago. One of our favorite
rides back then was up Big Cottonwood Canyon to either Solitude or
Brighton ski resorts. I was not counting vertical gain in those days
but that has to be about 4000 ft. Just below Brighton there was a
road that went off to Guardsman's Pass. Never tried to connect with a
bike, but in the winter we would cross country ski from Brighton or
Solitude over Guardsman's Pass and down into Park City, then reverse
the next day. Back in the 60's and 70's Guardsman's Pass was dirt,
and I cannot recall if the road actually connected down into Park
City, but you might check that out the current state and status of
that road.

You might contact a local shop for info. I have talked to Choose to
Ride in Murray (south-central Salt Lake Valley) since they are about
the closet Heron dealer to us; an interesting, eclectic shop much like
American Cyclery in the Haight. Sure there are other shops around
the University and out in Sandy (the big growth area, economically)
that could help, too.

- rick

[Mister Max]

Janet > posted:

>
>
> P.Hardewig wrote:
>> "Terry Morse" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>Chuck Anderson wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>> If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>But, ... but! .... but .... but! ...... I'd have to kill anyone that
>>>>prevented me from being able to ride the descent after a climb like
>>>>that. Isn't that the reason for going up?
>>>
>>>Descending can be fun, but 30+ mile descent gets pretty tedious.
>>>--
>>>terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/
>>
>>
>> VERY tedious indeed! My wife & I did the Haleakala downhill and were
>> the only "serious" cylists in the group. The tour operator would
>> only descend as fast as the slowest rider in the group, so we CRAWLED
>> down.
>>
>
> Yes, we did the tour group thing on Haleakala. Worst bike ride of my
> life. The info said for experienced cyclist only, but it turned out
> that "experience" meant you could balance on a bicycle. We also
> CRAWLED downhill. Our guides were adamant about not letting us pass
> them. It took us 6 hours to go 40 miles downhill!!
>
Just for the record and any future visitors, you can get a tour that
allows you to ride downhill at your own speed. I toured with Haleakala
bike shop and came down fast!
Photos on my web site, under Maui. See sig for URL.
- Max

--
MisterMax
Slideshows of Angkor Wat, Bali, Crete, France, Malaysia, Maui,
Morocco, Mt Holly, Sicily, St Tropez, Singapore, Thailand, Tour de
France:
http://buten.net/max/

[P.Hardewig]

<snip>
> Just for the record and any future visitors, you can get a tour that
> allows you to ride downhill at your own speed. I toured with Haleakala
> bike shop and came down fast!
> Photos on my web site, under Maui. See sig for URL.
> - Max
>
> --
> MisterMax
> Slideshows of Angkor Wat, Bali, Crete, France, Malaysia, Maui,
> Morocco, Mt Holly, Sicily, St Tropez, Singapore, Thailand, Tour de
> France:
> http://buten.net/max/

Beautiful photos! Thanks for sharing.

--
Wishing you flat hills, tailwind & friendly dogs,
Pat

[Raptor]

Rick Warner wrote:
> Terry Morse > wrote in message >...
>
>>Raptor> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>There are so many other hilly routes, unless you want to get to Park
>>>City by road bike.
>>
>>No need for us to ride to Park City, we're starting from there.
>>
>>
>>>SLC alone has five other canyons, and the Wasatch
>>>Back has great country road riding.
>>
>>Neat, I'll get out a map. Is there a local club that posts suggested
>>routes?
>
>
> Hey Terry,
>
> I did my BS at the U of U many, many years ago. One of our favorite
> rides back then was up Big Cottonwood Canyon to either Solitude or
> Brighton ski resorts. I was not counting vertical gain in those days
> but that has to be about 4000 ft. Just below Brighton there was a
> road that went off to Guardsman's Pass. Never tried to connect with a
> bike, but in the winter we would cross country ski from Brighton or
> Solitude over Guardsman's Pass and down into Park City, then reverse
> the next day. Back in the 60's and 70's Guardsman's Pass was dirt,
> and I cannot recall if the road actually connected down into Park
> City, but you might check that out the current state and status of
> that road.
>
> You might contact a local shop for info. I have talked to Choose to
> Ride in Murray (south-central Salt Lake Valley) since they are about
> the closet Heron dealer to us; an interesting, eclectic shop much like
> American Cyclery in the Haight. Sure there are other shops around
> the University and out in Sandy (the big growth area, economically)
> that could help, too.
>
> - rick

Jan Sports in Park City is a good bet, but they'll also be mtb-centric.
There are other bike shops up there. Bonneville Bike Club is still a
great resource.

We got our first mountain snow last night, so the trails will probably
be very marginal if passable at all in a couple weeks. It's possible
that a significant Indian Summer will dry them out but at this point
it's about 50-50. (Too bad for me: I've hardly done any trail riding
this season.)

Guardsman Pass has been paved more over the years, but is still gravel
on most of the PC side. It has always connected to PC, via a steep
mining-type road.

If you lived in SLC for any significant time and didn't ride the Wasatch
Crest trail, you did yourself very very wrong. (But it was very
primitive before 1980. As were mountain bikes, come to think of it.)

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[McMurdoStation]

(Jee Doy) wrote in message >...
> Anyone have any info on this climb of 36 miles up to 10,000 elevation? There
> seems to be tour rides going down but not up. I guess its for the very fit
> cyclists. I wanted to get info on this before I try this one. So far I
> learned that its a two lane highway with no bike lanes. Also some people going
> down lose control and have died going off the road.
>
> If I go, I would like to go up and then get a ride down. Are there any
> decent rental shops with good light road bikes to do the climb? I assume they
> will have a 12-25 rear cassette or better.
>
> Any other pointers would be helpful.

I don't know if anyone aleady mentioned this link, but it is for a
Maui based bicycle tour company that does the climb.

http://www.gocyclingmaui.com/link.htm

[Rick Warner]

Raptor > wrote in message >...

>
> We got our first mountain snow last night, so the trails will probably
> be very marginal if passable at all in a couple weeks. It's possible
> that a significant Indian Summer will dry them out but at this point
> it's about 50-50. (Too bad for me: I've hardly done any trail riding
> this season.)

And deer season will start in 3-4 weeks, and you will not want to be
on the trails even if there is no snow .... ;-)

> Guardsman Pass has been paved more over the years, but is still gravel
> on most of the PC side. It has always connected to PC, via a steep
> mining-type road.

Always is a long time :-) I am sure it was connected when I lived
there, but I can remember PC *before* there was a ski resort there and
the town was basically an old mining ghost town.

> If you lived in SLC for any significant time and didn't ride the Wasatch
> Crest trail, you did yourself very very wrong. (But it was very
> primitive before 1980. As were mountain bikes, come to think of it.)

And there you have it; I live in the SLC *before* there were mountain
bikes. I drop in occasionally, but never long enough to do much
riding. My last trip, Labor day time period in 2003, was a 3 day trip
for a funeral - no bike. Of course I did do much of what must be the
Wasatch Crest on foot and on XC skis.

- rick

[Jee Doy]

>I don't know if anyone aleady mentioned this link, but it is for a
>Maui based bicycle tour company that does the climb.
>
>http://www.gocyclingmaui.com/link.htm

I got back from maui and there was just one company that would do the ascent.
The whole thing costs $175.00 and includes the bike, food, and a ride down.
But the main problem was that not enough riders wanted to go on the day I
planned so I had to wait and by the time enough riders wanted to go, I left to
Kauai.

So instead I just rented a road bike from South Maui Bike shop and rode a
little. What was interesting was the strength of the tradewinds. I can see
how at the IronMan in Kona the riders can get knocked down by the wind. By the
way a Trek 2200 rents for 50 bucks a day. I brought my own speedplays, shoes
and helmet but not my saddle. I had to sign an agreement not to take the bike
up Haleakala to ride down because the brakes are not equipped for such stress.
I was told that those bikes have MoPed brakes on them.

[Jee Doy]

>I don't know if anyone aleady mentioned this link, but it is for a
>Maui based bicycle tour company that does the climb.
>
>http://www.gocyclingmaui.com/link.htm

I got back from maui and there was just one company that would do the ascent.
The whole thing costs $175.00 and includes the bike, food, and a ride down.
But the main problem was that not enough riders wanted to go on the day I
planned so I had to wait and by the time enough riders wanted to go, I left to
Kauai.

So instead I just rented a road bike from South Maui Bike shop and rode a
little. What was interesting was the strength of the tradewinds. I can see
how at the IronMan in Kona the riders can get knocked down by the wind. By the
way a Trek 2200 rents for 50 bucks a day. I brought my own speedplays, shoes
and helmet but not my saddle. I had to sign an agreement not to take the bike
up Haleakala to ride down because the brakes are not equipped for such stress.
I was told that those bikes have MoPed brakes on them.

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
> for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
> after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
> the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
> another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
> to get the final 1750 feet or so.
>
> I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
> Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
> folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
> would do the whole ascent in a single day.

And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
(and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
getting to the end of the first paved stretch.

Or not.

Love your photos of the Big Island, by the way. We were hoping to see a
lava flow when we were there (Sept 14-17th, then we moved on to Kauai), but
no such luck. Did bring home some Volcano Wine though...

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
> for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
> after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
> the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
> another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
> to get the final 1750 feet or so.
>
> I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
> Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
> folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
> would do the whole ascent in a single day.

And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
(and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
getting to the end of the first paved stretch.

Or not.

Love your photos of the Big Island, by the way. We were hoping to see a
lava flow when we were there (Sept 14-17th, then we moved on to Kauai), but
no such luck. Did bring home some Volcano Wine though...

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
> > for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
> > after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
> > the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
> > another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
> > to get the final 1750 feet or so.
> >
> > I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
> > Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
> > folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
> > would do the whole ascent in a single day.
>
> And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
> (and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
> Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
> getting to the end of the first paved stretch.
>
> Or not.

I want to get to 9000' on my bike someday. I need to drop 20kg first...

But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...

I prefer Hilo to the Waipio Valley overlook beyond Honoka'a. The elevation
stays at 1200 feet or less, and it's 50-plus miles one way if you're thinking
century. That's not to say it's flat; there's a 500' crest in Pepe'ekeo, 10
miles out of Hilo, 3 "down one side, up the other" horseshoe curves around
river valleys from Ninole through Laupahoehoe to O'okala (the last of which
ends in a long uphill), and if you head back, the ride from the Waipio Valley
overlook back into Honoka'a town is largely a slow grind up a deceptive
uphill.

-Dan

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
> > for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
> > after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
> > the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
> > another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
> > to get the final 1750 feet or so.
> >
> > I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
> > Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
> > folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
> > would do the whole ascent in a single day.
>
> And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
> (and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
> Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
> getting to the end of the first paved stretch.
>
> Or not.

I want to get to 9000' on my bike someday. I need to drop 20kg first...

But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...

I prefer Hilo to the Waipio Valley overlook beyond Honoka'a. The elevation
stays at 1200 feet or less, and it's 50-plus miles one way if you're thinking
century. That's not to say it's flat; there's a 500' crest in Pepe'ekeo, 10
miles out of Hilo, 3 "down one side, up the other" horseshoe curves around
river valleys from Ninole through Laupahoehoe to O'okala (the last of which
ends in a long uphill), and if you head back, the ride from the Waipio Valley
overlook back into Honoka'a town is largely a slow grind up a deceptive
uphill.

-Dan

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
> > for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
> > after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
> > the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
> > another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
> > to get the final 1750 feet or so.
> >
> > I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
> > Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
> > folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
> > would do the whole ascent in a single day.
>
> And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
> (and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
> Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
> getting to the end of the first paved stretch.
>
> Or not.

I want to get to 9000' on my bike someday. I need to drop 20kg first...

But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...

I prefer Hilo to the Waipio Valley overlook beyond Honoka'a. The elevation
stays at 1200 feet or less, and it's 50-plus miles one way if you're thinking
century. That's not to say it's flat; there's a 500' crest in Pepe'ekeo, 10
miles out of Hilo, 3 "down one side, up the other" horseshoe curves around
river valleys from Ninole through Laupahoehoe to O'okala (the last of which
ends in a long uphill), and if you head back, the ride from the Waipio Valley
overlook back into Honoka'a town is largely a slow grind up a deceptive
uphill.

-Dan

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[denisegoldberg]

Andrew Jensen's Cruisin' Maui journal
('http://maui04.crazyguyonabike.com'
(http://maui04.crazyguyonabike.com/)) about his tour around Maui in
late February of 2004 includes a description of his ride up Haleakala.
Take a look at the journal pages titled The Ride to the House of the
Sun, and The House of the Rising Sun.

-----------------
http://www.denisegoldberg.com


--
denisegoldberg

[denisegoldberg]

Andrew Jensen's Cruisin' Maui journal
('http://maui04.crazyguyonabike.com'
(http://maui04.crazyguyonabike.com/)) about his tour around Maui in
late February of 2004 includes a description of his ride up Haleakala.
Take a look at the journal pages titled The Ride to the House of the
Sun, and The House of the Rising Sun.

-----------------
http://www.denisegoldberg.com


--
denisegoldberg

[denisegoldberg]

Andrew Jensen's Cruisin' Maui journal
('http://maui04.crazyguyonabike.com'
(http://maui04.crazyguyonabike.com/)) about his tour around Maui in
late February of 2004 includes a description of his ride up Haleakala.
Take a look at the journal pages titled The Ride to the House of the
Sun, and The House of the Rising Sun.

-----------------
http://www.denisegoldberg.com


--
denisegoldberg

[Ken]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in
:
> But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
> and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
> miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
> volcanoes...

2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a recreational
cyclist.

[Ken]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in
:
> But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
> and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
> miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
> volcanoes...

2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a recreational
cyclist.

[Ken]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in
:
> But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
> and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
> miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
> volcanoes...

2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a recreational
cyclist.

[Dan Birchall]

(Ken) wrote:
> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
> :
> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
> > and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
> > miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
> > volcanoes...
>
> 2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a recreational
> cyclist.

Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
training, or fairly serious touring folks.

(And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
of fairly steady 5%...)

I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
I think of 5% grades. :)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Ken) wrote:
> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
> :
> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
> > and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
> > miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
> > volcanoes...
>
> 2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a recreational
> cyclist.

Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
training, or fairly serious touring folks.

(And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
of fairly steady 5%...)

I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
I think of 5% grades. :)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Ken) wrote:
> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
> :
> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
> > and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
> > miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
> > volcanoes...
>
> 2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a recreational
> cyclist.

Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
training, or fairly serious touring folks.

(And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
of fairly steady 5%...)

I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
I think of 5% grades. :)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Ken]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in
:
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile.

You should try it. It might be a lot easier than you think.

There is one 4500 foot climb near me (Mt. Hamilton in San Jose, California)
that has an average grade of about 5%. I see all kinds of cyclists on that
road. I suspect the number of cyclists on your hill has a lot to do with the
size of local cycling population.

[Ken]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in
:
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile.

You should try it. It might be a lot easier than you think.

There is one 4500 foot climb near me (Mt. Hamilton in San Jose, California)
that has an average grade of about 5%. I see all kinds of cyclists on that
road. I suspect the number of cyclists on your hill has a lot to do with the
size of local cycling population.

[Ken]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in
:
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile.

You should try it. It might be a lot easier than you think.

There is one 4500 foot climb near me (Mt. Hamilton in San Jose, California)
that has an average grade of about 5%. I see all kinds of cyclists on that
road. I suspect the number of cyclists on your hill has a lot to do with the
size of local cycling population.

[Raptor]

Ken wrote:
> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
> :
>
>>Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
>>with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
>>mile.
>
>
> You should try it. It might be a lot easier than you think.

Under pleasant conditions, yes. But any hill is bad if you haven't
ridden a lot of hills.

Parley's Canyon is roughly 5%, 10 miles or so long. The hill itself is
something most can set up a barely comfortable rhythm on, and if your
fuel and air conditioning holds up all you need to do is keep the pedals
turning over. But Parleys is always hot and stinky with 3
vehicles/second flying by. Sigh.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Raptor]

Ken wrote:
> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
> :
>
>>Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
>>with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
>>mile.
>
>
> You should try it. It might be a lot easier than you think.

Under pleasant conditions, yes. But any hill is bad if you haven't
ridden a lot of hills.

Parley's Canyon is roughly 5%, 10 miles or so long. The hill itself is
something most can set up a barely comfortable rhythm on, and if your
fuel and air conditioning holds up all you need to do is keep the pedals
turning over. But Parleys is always hot and stinky with 3
vehicles/second flying by. Sigh.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Raptor]

Ken wrote:
> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
> :
>
>>Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
>>with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
>>mile.
>
>
> You should try it. It might be a lot easier than you think.

Under pleasant conditions, yes. But any hill is bad if you haven't
ridden a lot of hills.

Parley's Canyon is roughly 5%, 10 miles or so long. The hill itself is
something most can set up a barely comfortable rhythm on, and if your
fuel and air conditioning holds up all you need to do is keep the pedals
turning over. But Parleys is always hot and stinky with 3
vehicles/second flying by. Sigh.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Rick Warner]

Raptor > wrote in message >...

> Under pleasant conditions, yes. But any hill is bad if you haven't
> ridden a lot of hills.

Easy fix for that: ride more hills ;-)

> Parley's Canyon is roughly 5%, 10 miles or so long. The hill itself is
> something most can set up a barely comfortable rhythm on, and if your
> fuel and air conditioning holds up all you need to do is keep the pedals
> turning over. But Parleys is always hot and stinky with 3
> vehicles/second flying by. Sigh.

Parley's was ugly when the road was US40; once it got replaced with
I-80 and growth occurred it got even worse. I much preferred Big
Cottonwood as the long climb out of the valley, would still if I were
living in that area. I know that it is a ways from SLC, even from
Parley's, but now there is that light rail down the valley it should
be easier to get to the south, right?

- rick

[Rick Warner]

Raptor > wrote in message >...

> Under pleasant conditions, yes. But any hill is bad if you haven't
> ridden a lot of hills.

Easy fix for that: ride more hills ;-)

> Parley's Canyon is roughly 5%, 10 miles or so long. The hill itself is
> something most can set up a barely comfortable rhythm on, and if your
> fuel and air conditioning holds up all you need to do is keep the pedals
> turning over. But Parleys is always hot and stinky with 3
> vehicles/second flying by. Sigh.

Parley's was ugly when the road was US40; once it got replaced with
I-80 and growth occurred it got even worse. I much preferred Big
Cottonwood as the long climb out of the valley, would still if I were
living in that area. I know that it is a ways from SLC, even from
Parley's, but now there is that light rail down the valley it should
be easier to get to the south, right?

- rick

[Rick Warner]

Raptor > wrote in message >...

> Under pleasant conditions, yes. But any hill is bad if you haven't
> ridden a lot of hills.

Easy fix for that: ride more hills ;-)

> Parley's Canyon is roughly 5%, 10 miles or so long. The hill itself is
> something most can set up a barely comfortable rhythm on, and if your
> fuel and air conditioning holds up all you need to do is keep the pedals
> turning over. But Parleys is always hot and stinky with 3
> vehicles/second flying by. Sigh.

Parley's was ugly when the road was US40; once it got replaced with
I-80 and growth occurred it got even worse. I much preferred Big
Cottonwood as the long climb out of the valley, would still if I were
living in that area. I know that it is a ways from SLC, even from
Parley's, but now there is that light rail down the valley it should
be easier to get to the south, right?

- rick

[Rick Warner]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in message >...

>
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
> miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
> few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
> training, or fairly serious touring folks.

Folks, at least around here, seem to relish a few nice grades. Lots
of hills, most over 5-6%, most much more than a mile. How about 3.25
of 7-8%? Or 8 miles of 6.5% average (but with a couple of 14-15%
sections)? Lots more roads ...

> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)

How about 16 miles of about 7.2% average, but 8-9% average on the last
7 miles? Curiously, that is nearly the same elevation gain as your 24
miles of 5% (just over 6000 ft vs just over 6300 ft). And that is
what we climbed (on fully loaded tourers) one day this summer, and
there were plenty of other cyclists joining us for that little jaunt
up from Prato to Passo dello Stelvio. Just do not see cyclists being
as afraid of the grades as you imply.

> I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
> I think of 5% grades. :)

Do it. 5% is really not bad at all.

- rick

[Rick Warner]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in message >...

>
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
> miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
> few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
> training, or fairly serious touring folks.

Folks, at least around here, seem to relish a few nice grades. Lots
of hills, most over 5-6%, most much more than a mile. How about 3.25
of 7-8%? Or 8 miles of 6.5% average (but with a couple of 14-15%
sections)? Lots more roads ...

> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)

How about 16 miles of about 7.2% average, but 8-9% average on the last
7 miles? Curiously, that is nearly the same elevation gain as your 24
miles of 5% (just over 6000 ft vs just over 6300 ft). And that is
what we climbed (on fully loaded tourers) one day this summer, and
there were plenty of other cyclists joining us for that little jaunt
up from Prato to Passo dello Stelvio. Just do not see cyclists being
as afraid of the grades as you imply.

> I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
> I think of 5% grades. :)

Do it. 5% is really not bad at all.

- rick

[Rick Warner]

(Dan Birchall) wrote in message >...

>
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
> miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
> few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
> training, or fairly serious touring folks.

Folks, at least around here, seem to relish a few nice grades. Lots
of hills, most over 5-6%, most much more than a mile. How about 3.25
of 7-8%? Or 8 miles of 6.5% average (but with a couple of 14-15%
sections)? Lots more roads ...

> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)

How about 16 miles of about 7.2% average, but 8-9% average on the last
7 miles? Curiously, that is nearly the same elevation gain as your 24
miles of 5% (just over 6000 ft vs just over 6300 ft). And that is
what we climbed (on fully loaded tourers) one day this summer, and
there were plenty of other cyclists joining us for that little jaunt
up from Prato to Passo dello Stelvio. Just do not see cyclists being
as afraid of the grades as you imply.

> I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
> I think of 5% grades. :)

Do it. 5% is really not bad at all.

- rick

[Mike Vermeulen]

> If you're ever on top of Haleakala and look to the east-southeast on
> a clear day... you'll notice a mountain that's higher. :) That'd be
> Mauna Kea on the Big Island of Hawaii... 13796' and you can* get to
> about 13770' on wheels.

Mauna Kea has been on my "list" for a while, though I would likely
ride it in two days rather than a single day. I've had two almost
forays in that area. In January 1997, I cycled the big island and
stayed at Mauna Kea State Park (6500ft) to investigate. I returned
Thanksgiving 1997 with intent to bicycle up Mauna Kea. However,
previous extremely hectic changes at work and little conditioning
meant that ugly headwinds and a time to finally think was enough to
convince me to turn back at only ~2500ft. I did drive a rental car
that weekend to investigate the route further.

A December 31st ascent of Mauna Kea was on my list for 2001, in middle
of a 12 month cycle trip. Events such as 9/11 and my travel agency
going bankrupt meant a disruption in pre-arranged flight plans and the
rearrangement meant skipping Hawaii...

However those two half forays meant it still is on my list. There are
stretches of the paved road marked with 18% grade signs that I'd
probably walk, but still a challenge to see if I could make it to the
top under my own power.

--mev, Mike Vermeulen

[Mike Vermeulen]

> If you're ever on top of Haleakala and look to the east-southeast on
> a clear day... you'll notice a mountain that's higher. :) That'd be
> Mauna Kea on the Big Island of Hawaii... 13796' and you can* get to
> about 13770' on wheels.

Mauna Kea has been on my "list" for a while, though I would likely
ride it in two days rather than a single day. I've had two almost
forays in that area. In January 1997, I cycled the big island and
stayed at Mauna Kea State Park (6500ft) to investigate. I returned
Thanksgiving 1997 with intent to bicycle up Mauna Kea. However,
previous extremely hectic changes at work and little conditioning
meant that ugly headwinds and a time to finally think was enough to
convince me to turn back at only ~2500ft. I did drive a rental car
that weekend to investigate the route further.

A December 31st ascent of Mauna Kea was on my list for 2001, in middle
of a 12 month cycle trip. Events such as 9/11 and my travel agency
going bankrupt meant a disruption in pre-arranged flight plans and the
rearrangement meant skipping Hawaii...

However those two half forays meant it still is on my list. There are
stretches of the paved road marked with 18% grade signs that I'd
probably walk, but still a challenge to see if I could make it to the
top under my own power.

--mev, Mike Vermeulen

[Mike Vermeulen]

> If you're ever on top of Haleakala and look to the east-southeast on
> a clear day... you'll notice a mountain that's higher. :) That'd be
> Mauna Kea on the Big Island of Hawaii... 13796' and you can* get to
> about 13770' on wheels.

Mauna Kea has been on my "list" for a while, though I would likely
ride it in two days rather than a single day. I've had two almost
forays in that area. In January 1997, I cycled the big island and
stayed at Mauna Kea State Park (6500ft) to investigate. I returned
Thanksgiving 1997 with intent to bicycle up Mauna Kea. However,
previous extremely hectic changes at work and little conditioning
meant that ugly headwinds and a time to finally think was enough to
convince me to turn back at only ~2500ft. I did drive a rental car
that weekend to investigate the route further.

A December 31st ascent of Mauna Kea was on my list for 2001, in middle
of a 12 month cycle trip. Events such as 9/11 and my travel agency
going bankrupt meant a disruption in pre-arranged flight plans and the
rearrangement meant skipping Hawaii...

However those two half forays meant it still is on my list. There are
stretches of the paved road marked with 18% grade signs that I'd
probably walk, but still a challenge to see if I could make it to the
top under my own power.

--mev, Mike Vermeulen

[Raptor]

Rick Warner wrote:
> Parley's was ugly when the road was US40; once it got replaced with
> I-80 and growth occurred it got even worse. I much preferred Big
> Cottonwood as the long climb out of the valley, would still if I were
> living in that area. I know that it is a ways from SLC, even from
> Parley's, but now there is that light rail down the valley it should
> be easier to get to the south, right?
>
> - rick

BC is still just 12 miles from downtown. If you're ready to (try to)
ride Big Cottonwood, you can ride to the canyon too. At least in
concept: last time I tried it I rode hard on a 95 degree day and was too
toasted to make it up the steep bottom part.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Raptor]

Rick Warner wrote:
> Parley's was ugly when the road was US40; once it got replaced with
> I-80 and growth occurred it got even worse. I much preferred Big
> Cottonwood as the long climb out of the valley, would still if I were
> living in that area. I know that it is a ways from SLC, even from
> Parley's, but now there is that light rail down the valley it should
> be easier to get to the south, right?
>
> - rick

BC is still just 12 miles from downtown. If you're ready to (try to)
ride Big Cottonwood, you can ride to the canyon too. At least in
concept: last time I tried it I rode hard on a 95 degree day and was too
toasted to make it up the steep bottom part.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Raptor]

Rick Warner wrote:
> Parley's was ugly when the road was US40; once it got replaced with
> I-80 and growth occurred it got even worse. I much preferred Big
> Cottonwood as the long climb out of the valley, would still if I were
> living in that area. I know that it is a ways from SLC, even from
> Parley's, but now there is that light rail down the valley it should
> be easier to get to the south, right?
>
> - rick

BC is still just 12 miles from downtown. If you're ready to (try to)
ride Big Cottonwood, you can ride to the canyon too. At least in
concept: last time I tried it I rode hard on a 95 degree day and was too
toasted to make it up the steep bottom part.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
> about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
> and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...

As I mentioned I didn't have a bike with me, but we did drive it, and it
didn't seem so bad. I would prefer a more twisty road, of course. In
general, an 8 mile climb of "only" 2000 feet isn't too tough. However, that
doesn't factor in the weather (very high humidity with temps in the
mid-80s). And of course there's the issue of wind, which can be a much more
dramatic factor on a mild climb than on a really steep one.

Now, the road I was *really* salivating over was "Chain of Craters Road"
which takes you from the 4,000 foot level in Volcano National Park all the
way down to sea level, where the laval flows did their thing and wiped out a
subdivision and a whole lot of road. Absolutely breathtaking, things that
most people see in a movie but never in real life (and in real life it's far
more dramatic).

But Chain of Craters Road is a far tougher grade than anything on the roads
circling the island.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
> about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
> and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...

As I mentioned I didn't have a bike with me, but we did drive it, and it
didn't seem so bad. I would prefer a more twisty road, of course. In
general, an 8 mile climb of "only" 2000 feet isn't too tough. However, that
doesn't factor in the weather (very high humidity with temps in the
mid-80s). And of course there's the issue of wind, which can be a much more
dramatic factor on a mild climb than on a really steep one.

Now, the road I was *really* salivating over was "Chain of Craters Road"
which takes you from the 4,000 foot level in Volcano National Park all the
way down to sea level, where the laval flows did their thing and wiped out a
subdivision and a whole lot of road. Absolutely breathtaking, things that
most people see in a movie but never in real life (and in real life it's far
more dramatic).

But Chain of Craters Road is a far tougher grade than anything on the roads
circling the island.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
> about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
> and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...

As I mentioned I didn't have a bike with me, but we did drive it, and it
didn't seem so bad. I would prefer a more twisty road, of course. In
general, an 8 mile climb of "only" 2000 feet isn't too tough. However, that
doesn't factor in the weather (very high humidity with temps in the
mid-80s). And of course there's the issue of wind, which can be a much more
dramatic factor on a mild climb than on a really steep one.

Now, the road I was *really* salivating over was "Chain of Craters Road"
which takes you from the 4,000 foot level in Volcano National Park all the
way down to sea level, where the laval flows did their thing and wiped out a
subdivision and a whole lot of road. Absolutely breathtaking, things that
most people see in a movie but never in real life (and in real life it's far
more dramatic).

But Chain of Craters Road is a far tougher grade than anything on the roads
circling the island.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)

So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"Dan Birchall" > wrote in message
...
> (Ken) wrote:
>> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
>> :
>> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
>> > and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
>> > miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
>> > volcanoes...
>>
>> 2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a
>> recreational
>> cyclist.
>
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
> miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
> few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
> training, or fairly serious touring folks.
>
> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)
>
> I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
> I think of 5% grades. :)
>
> --
> Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words,
> technology
>

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)

So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"Dan Birchall" > wrote in message
...
> (Ken) wrote:
>> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
>> :
>> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
>> > and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
>> > miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
>> > volcanoes...
>>
>> 2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a
>> recreational
>> cyclist.
>
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
> miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
> few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
> training, or fairly serious touring folks.
>
> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)
>
> I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
> I think of 5% grades. :)
>
> --
> Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words,
> technology
>

[Mike Jacoubowsky]

> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)

So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"Dan Birchall" > wrote in message
...
> (Ken) wrote:
>> (Dan Birchall) wrote in
>> :
>> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain,
>> > and about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20
>> > miles, and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang
>> > volcanoes...
>>
>> 2000 feet in 8 miles is less than 5%, a very easy grade for a
>> recreational
>> cyclist.
>
> Grade percentage isn't everything, Ken. Yes, a recreational cyclist
> with granny gears might think nothing of going up a 5% grade for a
> mile. (My C'dale XR lacks granny gears, alas!) But when you throw 8
> miles of it at them, after 20 miles of 2%... strangely, I see very
> few cyclists up there, and most of them look to be either racers
> training, or fairly serious touring folks.
>
> (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> of fairly steady 5%...)
>
> I've really got to drop these 20 kilos, and then get back to you on what
> I think of 5% grades. :)
>
> --
> Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words,
> technology
>

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
> > about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
> > and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...
>
> As I mentioned I didn't have a bike with me, but we did drive it, and it
> didn't seem so bad. I would prefer a more twisty road, of course. In
> general, an 8 mile climb of "only" 2000 feet isn't too tough. However, that
> doesn't factor in the weather (very high humidity with temps in the
> mid-80s). And of course there's the issue of wind, which can be a much more
> dramatic factor on a mild climb than on a really steep one.
>
> Now, the road I was *really* salivating over was "Chain of Craters Road"
> which takes you from the 4,000 foot level in Volcano National Park all the
> way down to sea level, where the laval flows did their thing and wiped out a
> subdivision and a whole lot of road. Absolutely breathtaking, things that
> most people see in a movie but never in real life (and in real life it's far
> more dramatic).
>
> But Chain of Craters Road is a far tougher grade than anything on the roads
> circling the island.

Hmmm... Chain of Craters drops 4000 feet in 18 miles, overall - not really
such a bad grade. But... I imagine miles, hmm, 9-15 I suppose it'd be, down
the face of the pali and through the horseshoe curve... would be a lot less
fun coming back up. ;)

If we were really insane, we'd bike down into Waipio Valley. Aside from not
being much of a road, I think that's something like 20-25%. :)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
> > about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
> > and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...
>
> As I mentioned I didn't have a bike with me, but we did drive it, and it
> didn't seem so bad. I would prefer a more twisty road, of course. In
> general, an 8 mile climb of "only" 2000 feet isn't too tough. However, that
> doesn't factor in the weather (very high humidity with temps in the
> mid-80s). And of course there's the issue of wind, which can be a much more
> dramatic factor on a mild climb than on a really steep one.
>
> Now, the road I was *really* salivating over was "Chain of Craters Road"
> which takes you from the 4,000 foot level in Volcano National Park all the
> way down to sea level, where the laval flows did their thing and wiped out a
> subdivision and a whole lot of road. Absolutely breathtaking, things that
> most people see in a movie but never in real life (and in real life it's far
> more dramatic).
>
> But Chain of Craters Road is a far tougher grade than anything on the roads
> circling the island.

Hmmm... Chain of Craters drops 4000 feet in 18 miles, overall - not really
such a bad grade. But... I imagine miles, hmm, 9-15 I suppose it'd be, down
the face of the pali and through the horseshoe curve... would be a lot less
fun coming back up. ;)

If we were really insane, we'd bike down into Waipio Valley. Aside from not
being much of a road, I think that's something like 20-25%. :)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > But there's always Hilo to Volcano, too... only about 4000 feet gain, and
> > about 28 miles. Of course, the first 2000 feet are in the first 20 miles,
> > and the next 2000 feet are in the last 8 miles... dang volcanoes...
>
> As I mentioned I didn't have a bike with me, but we did drive it, and it
> didn't seem so bad. I would prefer a more twisty road, of course. In
> general, an 8 mile climb of "only" 2000 feet isn't too tough. However, that
> doesn't factor in the weather (very high humidity with temps in the
> mid-80s). And of course there's the issue of wind, which can be a much more
> dramatic factor on a mild climb than on a really steep one.
>
> Now, the road I was *really* salivating over was "Chain of Craters Road"
> which takes you from the 4,000 foot level in Volcano National Park all the
> way down to sea level, where the laval flows did their thing and wiped out a
> subdivision and a whole lot of road. Absolutely breathtaking, things that
> most people see in a movie but never in real life (and in real life it's far
> more dramatic).
>
> But Chain of Craters Road is a far tougher grade than anything on the roads
> circling the island.

Hmmm... Chain of Craters drops 4000 feet in 18 miles, overall - not really
such a bad grade. But... I imagine miles, hmm, 9-15 I suppose it'd be, down
the face of the pali and through the horseshoe curve... would be a lot less
fun coming back up. ;)

If we were really insane, we'd bike down into Waipio Valley. Aside from not
being much of a road, I think that's something like 20-25%. :)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> > of fairly steady 5%...)
>
> So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
> rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?

*Some* car rental companies make you do that. Saddle Road is narrow,
winding, hilly, largely devoid of street lights, "services" and population
as a whole. It's also the only way to get to the roads that go up from
the saddle to 11555' on Mauna Loa and 13760' on Mauna Kea... and if you
don't find a way to get into trouble on Saddle, you can give it a go on
one of those. ;)

I work on top of Mauna Kea, and I've volunteered at the visitor station
part-way up, and... I will just say we get some folks who are unfamiliar
with the area, unfamiliar with the *right way* to drive on a mountain,
and ill-equipped in terms of vehicles for what's up there. I've seen
things being towed out, and those were the lucky ones.

(It costs ~$200 to get a tow from the visitor station, ~$1200 from the
summit... and that's if the car's upright and towable, which most certainly
is NOT always the case. ;)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> > of fairly steady 5%...)
>
> So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
> rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?

*Some* car rental companies make you do that. Saddle Road is narrow,
winding, hilly, largely devoid of street lights, "services" and population
as a whole. It's also the only way to get to the roads that go up from
the saddle to 11555' on Mauna Loa and 13760' on Mauna Kea... and if you
don't find a way to get into trouble on Saddle, you can give it a go on
one of those. ;)

I work on top of Mauna Kea, and I've volunteered at the visitor station
part-way up, and... I will just say we get some folks who are unfamiliar
with the area, unfamiliar with the *right way* to drive on a mountain,
and ill-equipped in terms of vehicles for what's up there. I've seen
things being towed out, and those were the lucky ones.

(It costs ~$200 to get a tow from the visitor station, ~$1200 from the
summit... and that's if the car's upright and towable, which most certainly
is NOT always the case. ;)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Mike Jacoubowsky) wrote:
> > (And if they don't like that, Saddle Road will give them about 24 miles
> > of fairly steady 5%...)
>
> So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
> rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?

*Some* car rental companies make you do that. Saddle Road is narrow,
winding, hilly, largely devoid of street lights, "services" and population
as a whole. It's also the only way to get to the roads that go up from
the saddle to 11555' on Mauna Loa and 13760' on Mauna Kea... and if you
don't find a way to get into trouble on Saddle, you can give it a go on
one of those. ;)

I work on top of Mauna Kea, and I've volunteered at the visitor station
part-way up, and... I will just say we get some folks who are unfamiliar
with the area, unfamiliar with the *right way* to drive on a mountain,
and ill-equipped in terms of vehicles for what's up there. I've seen
things being towed out, and those were the lucky ones.

(It costs ~$200 to get a tow from the visitor station, ~$1200 from the
summit... and that's if the car's upright and towable, which most certainly
is NOT always the case. ;)

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Janet]

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>
> So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
> rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>
>

Well, if you're from NJ, like us, it wasn't any problem. By Hawaii
standards there are too many potholes, "rough road" rather than really
smooth pavement. And they've had problems with people driving too fast
and wrecking the rental cars. There is (or was when we were there 9 yrs
ago) a rental company that DID let you go on Saddle road and to the
summit of Mona Kea in their SUV's. (The unpaved part of the road up Mona
Kea does need an SUV for the ground clearance - lots of rocks and such
on the road). I don't recall the name of the rental company, but we
found it in the "Let's GO..." guidebook.

Janet

[Janet]

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>
> So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
> rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>
>

Well, if you're from NJ, like us, it wasn't any problem. By Hawaii
standards there are too many potholes, "rough road" rather than really
smooth pavement. And they've had problems with people driving too fast
and wrecking the rental cars. There is (or was when we were there 9 yrs
ago) a rental company that DID let you go on Saddle road and to the
summit of Mona Kea in their SUV's. (The unpaved part of the road up Mona
Kea does need an SUV for the ground clearance - lots of rocks and such
on the road). I don't recall the name of the rental company, but we
found it in the "Let's GO..." guidebook.

Janet

[Janet]

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>
> So tell me about the infamous Saddle Road. What makes it so bad that car
> rental companies make you sign something that says you won't drive it?
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>
>

Well, if you're from NJ, like us, it wasn't any problem. By Hawaii
standards there are too many potholes, "rough road" rather than really
smooth pavement. And they've had problems with people driving too fast
and wrecking the rental cars. There is (or was when we were there 9 yrs
ago) a rental company that DID let you go on Saddle road and to the
summit of Mona Kea in their SUV's. (The unpaved part of the road up Mona
Kea does need an SUV for the ground clearance - lots of rocks and such
on the road). I don't recall the name of the rental company, but we
found it in the "Let's GO..." guidebook.

Janet

[Dan Birchall]

(Janet) wrote:
> There is (or was when we were there 9 yrs
> ago) a rental company that DID let you go on Saddle road and to the
> summit of Mona Kea in their SUV's. (The unpaved part of the road up Mona
> Kea does need an SUV for the ground clearance - lots of rocks and such
> on the road). I don't recall the name of the rental company, but we
> found it in the "Let's GO..." guidebook.

That would be Harper's, in Hilo and Kona. www.harpershawaii.com. One
of the observatories actually leases their vehicles from them (mainly
because when they first started out and *owned* vehicles, their employees
kept crashing them... ;)

-Dan

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Janet) wrote:
> There is (or was when we were there 9 yrs
> ago) a rental company that DID let you go on Saddle road and to the
> summit of Mona Kea in their SUV's. (The unpaved part of the road up Mona
> Kea does need an SUV for the ground clearance - lots of rocks and such
> on the road). I don't recall the name of the rental company, but we
> found it in the "Let's GO..." guidebook.

That would be Harper's, in Hilo and Kona. www.harpershawaii.com. One
of the observatories actually leases their vehicles from them (mainly
because when they first started out and *owned* vehicles, their employees
kept crashing them... ;)

-Dan

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Janet) wrote:
> There is (or was when we were there 9 yrs
> ago) a rental company that DID let you go on Saddle road and to the
> summit of Mona Kea in their SUV's. (The unpaved part of the road up Mona
> Kea does need an SUV for the ground clearance - lots of rocks and such
> on the road). I don't recall the name of the rental company, but we
> found it in the "Let's GO..." guidebook.

That would be Harper's, in Hilo and Kona. www.harpershawaii.com. One
of the observatories actually leases their vehicles from them (mainly
because when they first started out and *owned* vehicles, their employees
kept crashing them... ;)

-Dan

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://dan.birchalls.net/ - images, words, technology

[Dario Wolfish]

Are there relatively flat places to ride in Maui? I am planning a vacation
and I am undecided between Costa Rica and Maui. Besides the usual stuff, I'd
like to do a couple of 50 mile day rides.

"Mike Jacoubowsky" > wrote in message
om...
>> Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
>> for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
>> after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
>> the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
>> another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
>> to get the final 1750 feet or so.
>>
>> I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
>> Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
>> folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
>> would do the whole ascent in a single day.
>
> And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
> (and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
> Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
> getting to the end of the first paved stretch.
>
> Or not.
>
> Love your photos of the Big Island, by the way. We were hoping to see a
> lava flow when we were there (Sept 14-17th, then we moved on to Kauai),
> but no such luck. Did bring home some Volcano Wine though...
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>

[Dario Wolfish]

Are there relatively flat places to ride in Maui? I am planning a vacation
and I am undecided between Costa Rica and Maui. Besides the usual stuff, I'd
like to do a couple of 50 mile day rides.

"Mike Jacoubowsky" > wrote in message
om...
>> Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
>> for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
>> after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
>> the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
>> another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
>> to get the final 1750 feet or so.
>>
>> I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
>> Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
>> folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
>> would do the whole ascent in a single day.
>
> And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
> (and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
> Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
> getting to the end of the first paved stretch.
>
> Or not.
>
> Love your photos of the Big Island, by the way. We were hoping to see a
> lava flow when we were there (Sept 14-17th, then we moved on to Kauai),
> but no such luck. Did bring home some Volcano Wine though...
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>

[Dan Birchall]

(Dario Wolfish) wrote:
> Are there relatively flat places to ride in Maui? I am planning a vacation
> and I am undecided between Costa Rica and Maui. Besides the usual stuff, I'd
> like to do a couple of 50 mile day rides.

Take a look at http://www.topozone.com/ for topographic maps. Coastal
routes (southwest coast to Lahaina or northeast coast to Hana) shouldn't
have too much variation in elevation, although they might be twisty and
have narrow bridges, I dunno. There's also the "valley" between the two
main upland areas, which would go from the Wailuku/Kahului (airport) area
south to Kihei and places like that - I'd expect that to be relatively
flat. I haven't ridden on Maui yet myself, though.

You're talking 50-mile round trip, yes?

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://hilom.multiply.com/ - images, words, technology

[Dan Birchall]

(Dario Wolfish) wrote:
> Are there relatively flat places to ride in Maui? I am planning a vacation
> and I am undecided between Costa Rica and Maui. Besides the usual stuff, I'd
> like to do a couple of 50 mile day rides.

Take a look at http://www.topozone.com/ for topographic maps. Coastal
routes (southwest coast to Lahaina or northeast coast to Hana) shouldn't
have too much variation in elevation, although they might be twisty and
have narrow bridges, I dunno. There's also the "valley" between the two
main upland areas, which would go from the Wailuku/Kahului (airport) area
south to Kihei and places like that - I'd expect that to be relatively
flat. I haven't ridden on Maui yet myself, though.

You're talking 50-mile round trip, yes?

--
Dan Birchall, Hilo HI - http://hilom.multiply.com/ - images, words, technology

[Alan]

I rented a bike last yr when I was in Maui while staying in Lahina. I was
not impressed with the roads on Maui near Lahina. They are very busy and
there are just not many roads on Maui and a lot of cars. I got so many
flats that I gave up on the whole thing. Maybe if you stay on the other
side of the island riding may be better. It may be better to ride a couple
of days with one of the overpriced tour companies as they will know the
area.

"Dario Wolfish" > wrote in message
...
> Are there relatively flat places to ride in Maui? I am planning a vacation
> and I am undecided between Costa Rica and Maui. Besides the usual stuff,
> I'd like to do a couple of 50 mile day rides.
>
> "Mike Jacoubowsky" > wrote in message
> om...
>>> Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
>>> for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
>>> after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
>>> the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
>>> another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
>>> to get the final 1750 feet or so.
>>>
>>> I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
>>> Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
>>> folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
>>> would do the whole ascent in a single day.
>>
>> And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
>> (and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
>> Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
>> getting to the end of the first paved stretch.
>>
>> Or not.
>>
>> Love your photos of the Big Island, by the way. We were hoping to see a
>> lava flow when we were there (Sept 14-17th, then we moved on to Kauai),
>> but no such luck. Did bring home some Volcano Wine though...
>>
>> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
>> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>>
>
>

[Alan]

I rented a bike last yr when I was in Maui while staying in Lahina. I was
not impressed with the roads on Maui near Lahina. They are very busy and
there are just not many roads on Maui and a lot of cars. I got so many
flats that I gave up on the whole thing. Maybe if you stay on the other
side of the island riding may be better. It may be better to ride a couple
of days with one of the overpriced tour companies as they will know the
area.

"Dario Wolfish" > wrote in message
...
> Are there relatively flat places to ride in Maui? I am planning a vacation
> and I am undecided between Costa Rica and Maui. Besides the usual stuff,
> I'd like to do a couple of 50 mile day rides.
>
> "Mike Jacoubowsky" > wrote in message
> om...
>>> Coming out of Hilo, the narrow twisty road climbs about 250' a mile
>>> for the first... oh, 26 or so miles, I'd guess. There's a turnoff
>>> after mile 27, and in 6.2 miles you pick up another 3000 feet. Then
>>> the road turns to dirt and switchbacks for 5 miles, gaining around
>>> another 3000 feet... and then there's 5 miles of pavement at the top
>>> to get the final 1750 feet or so.
>>>
>>> I work up there sometimes. The highest I've made it from a start in
>>> Hilo is about 2000' around the 8-mile marker... so far. I've seen
>>> folks heading up the dirt part above 9000' but I don't know many who
>>> would do the whole ascent in a single day.
>>
>> And I was just there! No bike though, but dang, if I were doing it again
>> (and it wasn't our 25th anniversary), no way I'd leave the bike behind.
>> Don't think I'd try getting to the top though; might be OK to rationalize
>> getting to the end of the first paved stretch.
>>
>> Or not.
>>
>> Love your photos of the Big Island, by the way. We were hoping to see a
>> lava flow when we were there (Sept 14-17th, then we moved on to Kauai),
>> but no such luck. Did bring home some Volcano Wine though...
>>
>> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
>> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>>
>
>