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View Full Version : Ullrich DESTROYED Lance!


Rene Clancy
July 18th 03, 04:18 PM
Go Jan GO!!!!

Scott Downie
July 18th 03, 04:33 PM
What was it? 1:30 over 45k ? Even the most hardcore Ullrich haters must
appreciate that one !

--
Irrationally held truths may be more harmfull than reasoned errors.
"Rene Clancy" > wrote in message
...
> Go Jan GO!!!!

Harris
July 18th 03, 04:51 PM
"Rene Clancy" wrote:

> Go Jan GO!!!!

www.eurosport.com reports that, "Lance Armstrong looks very upset. He gets
off his bike and immediately goes into his team truck."

Art Harris

jean-yves hervé
July 18th 03, 05:24 PM
In article >,
"Harris" > wrote:

>
> "Rene Clancy" wrote:
>
> > Go Jan GO!!!!
>
> www.eurosport.com reports that, "Lance Armstrong looks very upset. He gets
> off his bike and immediately goes into his team truck."

on French TV, less than 5 minutes after the race, he gave a very nice
and gracious interview (in very good french), gave credit to Ullrich,
said the expected "too early to tell, still in yellow" reply to the
idiotic questions. All in all, I am quite impressed by his gracious,
smiling, and friendly attitude so far. It's the first time in 3 years
that I watch the TdF on French TV, and I can hardly believe it is the
person as the obnoxious guy who won in 1998.
I am no Lance fan by any means (been a Jan fan since 1996), but this
year, Armstrong's behavior has been quite admirable so far (can't say
for the last couple of years). I actually find miself liking the guy
despite miself :-)

jyh.

--
================================================== ===================
jean-yves herve' /\
Department of Computer Science \/ e-mail -->
and Statistics /\
University of Rhode Island \/ Tel. --> (401) 874-4400
Kingston, RI 02881-0816 /\ Fax. --> (401) 874-4617
USA \/
================================================== ===================

Robert Oliver
July 18th 03, 05:55 PM
> I am no Lance fan by any means (been a Jan fan since 1996), but this
> year, Armstrong's behavior has been quite admirable so far (can't say
> for the last couple of years). I actually find miself liking the guy
> despite miself :-)

I can't help but wonder how you responded to Jan's behavior in the last few
years.

Nick Burns
July 18th 03, 06:11 PM
"Harris" > wrote in message
et...
>
> "Rene Clancy" wrote:
>
> > Go Jan GO!!!!
>
> www.eurosport.com reports that, "Lance Armstrong looks very upset. He gets
> off his bike and immediately goes

That has been the same thing all year. Just wait until the Tour though. You
just wait.

into his team truck."
>
> Art Harris
>
>

Kurgan Gringioni
July 18th 03, 06:21 PM
"Nev Shea" > wrote in message
rthlink.net...
> jean-yves hervé > wrote in
> :
>
>
> > on French TV, less than 5 minutes after the race, he gave a very nice
> > and gracious interview (in very good french), gave credit to Ullrich,
> > said the expected "too early to tell, still in yellow" reply to the
> > idiotic questions. All in all, I am quite impressed by his gracious,
> > smiling, and friendly attitude so far. It's the first time in 3 years
> > that I watch the TdF on French TV, and I can hardly believe it is the
> > person as the obnoxious guy who won in 1998.
> > I am no Lance fan by any means (been a Jan fan since 1996), but this
> > year, Armstrong's behavior has been quite admirable so far (can't say
> > for the last couple of years). I actually find miself liking the guy
> > despite miself :-)
>
>
> Thanks for posting this. I'd like to know if your perceptions have been
> influenced by the French press this year. The reports we've heard in the
> past have been that the French press has taken every opportunity to smear
> and criticize Armstrong; are they being less critical this year, or maybe
> even positive from caught up in the 100 years celebrations and all that?



He has gotten more relaxed and less paranoid in his dealing with the press.

Daniel Connelly
July 18th 03, 06:23 PM
Nev Shea wrote:

> I can hardly believe it is the
>person as the obnoxious guy who won in 1998.

Maybe the psychotherapy helped.

Jamce1
July 18th 03, 06:50 PM
did anybody notice the gaps ullrich made over the last 6k?

armstrong - 26 secs
vino - 19 secs
zubeldia - 20 secs
hamilton - 21 secs

that much in about 3.5 miles! he was rolling.

interesting to see that all the players took time out of armstrong over the
last portion. whats up with that?

chris

Ken Very Big Liar
July 18th 03, 08:19 PM
On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 18:05:09 +0200, Hasse R. Hansen >
wrote:

>On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 17:18:01 +0200, "Rene Clancy"
> wrote:
>
>>Go Jan GO!!!!
>
>I always said that Jan is winning this years tour,
>
>like he said : Ill be back
>mvh.
>Hasse R. Hansen

Funny how he's winning without wearing The Jersey. Now all he needs to do is
climb those mountains a little better.
---
Kelly Beard, a.k.a. Mr. K.V.B. Liar

Nick Burns
July 18th 03, 08:44 PM
"Marlene Blanshay" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, "Rene Clancy"
> > wrote:
>
> > Go Jan GO!!!!
>
> JAN!!!
>
> But Thhhbbtttt! for OLN for not sticking around to show the podium
> presentation. WTF!!! The guy wins his first stage in who knows how long,
> it's his big comeback, stick around for the presentation, ya shmucks!

On the west coast they have the final showing from 5:30 to 8:00 so I hope
they will show it since they have an extra 30 minutes to fit it in.

Raptor
July 18th 03, 10:05 PM
Jamce1 wrote:
> did anybody notice the gaps ullrich made over the last 6k?
>
> armstrong - 26 secs
> vino - 19 secs
> zubeldia - 20 secs
> hamilton - 21 secs
>
> that much in about 3.5 miles! he was rolling.
>
> interesting to see that all the players took time out of armstrong over the
> last portion. whats up with that?
>
> chris

Reading through the lines of the interviews, it looks like the heat hit
LANCE upside the head. He said he ran out of water.

I don't mind riding semi-hard in 100 degree heat, but competing? That
seems kind of hard. :-)

It's gonna be interesting. I suspect LANCE will attack Ullrich in the
mountains. It'll probably play out like Alpe d'Huez, where LANCE got
attacked and in responding, dropped Ullrich (at least temporarily). If
LANCE is in a position to gain another minute on Jan, he'll probably go
for it. If Jan hangs with LANCE, it'll be a nail-biter.

Is there any chance of some Vuelta-style flat-land tactics working in
the Tour de France? How strong is Bianchi?

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"I'm not proud. We really haven't done everything we could to protect
our customers. Our products just aren't engineered for security."
--Microsoft VP in charge of Windows OS Development, Brian Valentine.

Dave
July 18th 03, 11:41 PM
"dwjones" > wrote in message
et...
> ullrich had a spectaular time trial. however he does not have the team to be
> able to match lance in the Pyrenees


Sure he does...the team of the current 2nd place rider, Vinokurov

Dave

Marlene Blanshay
July 19th 03, 01:05 AM
In article >, "Nick Burns"
> wrote:

> "Marlene Blanshay" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In article >, "Rene Clancy"
> > > wrote:
> >
> > > Go Jan GO!!!!
> >
> > JAN!!!
> >
> > But Thhhbbtttt! for OLN for not sticking around to show the podium
> > presentation. WTF!!! The guy wins his first stage in who knows how long,
> > it's his big comeback, stick around for the presentation, ya shmucks!
>
> On the west coast they have the final showing from 5:30 to 8:00 so I hope
> they will show it since they have an extra 30 minutes to fit it in.

Yeah, I'll watch the end of the evening coverage, or the coverage on canal
evasion. They seem to stay on a few minutes longer. I bet if Lance won the
stage they'd have stayed with him.

dwjones
July 19th 03, 01:33 AM
no he doesn't. vinokurov is a member of his previous team
"Dave" > wrote in message
.. .
>
> "dwjones" > wrote in message
> et...
> > ullrich had a spectaular time trial. however he does not have the team
to be
> > able to match lance in the Pyrenees
>
>
> Sure he does...the team of the current 2nd place rider, Vinokurov
>
> Dave
>
>

warren
July 19th 03, 02:37 AM
In article >, Dave
> wrote:

> "dwjones" > wrote in message
> et...
> > ullrich had a spectaular time trial. however he does not have the team to be
> > able to match lance in the Pyrenees
>
>
> Sure he does...the team of the current 2nd place rider, Vinokurov

So far this Tour, when the bunch has been reduced to 7-10 guys how many
USPA were there and how many Bianchi and Telekom were there?

I predict Heras and Armstrong will attack hard because Ullrich can't do
that.

-WG

Dave
July 19th 03, 03:17 AM
"dwjones" > wrote in message
et...
> "Dave" > wrote in message
> .. .
> >
> > "dwjones" > wrote in message
> > et...
> > > ullrich had a spectaular time trial. however he does not have the team
> to be
> > > able to match lance in the Pyrenees
> >
> >
> > Sure he does...the team of the current 2nd place rider, Vinokurov
> >
> > Dave

> no he doesn't. vinokurov is a member of his previous team


Duh!...think outside the box for a moment..
Dave

Fred Marx
July 19th 03, 04:38 AM
Dave wrote:
> "dwjones" > wrote in message
> et...
>
>>"Dave" > wrote in message
.. .
>>
>>>"dwjones" > wrote in message
et...
>>>
>>>>ullrich had a spectaular time trial. however he does not have the team
>>
>>to be
>>
>>>>able to match lance in the Pyrenees
>>>
>>>
>>>Sure he does...the team of the current 2nd place rider, Vinokurov
>>>
>>>Dave
>
>
>>no he doesn't. vinokurov is a member of his previous team
>
>
>
> Duh!...think outside the box for a moment..
> Dave
>
>

Let's see Vinokourov is actually in 3rd overall and I'll just bet they
ride for him.... and then for Vino and Zabel in the following flat
stages... no way I see JU getting help form the pink and black... Now
ONCE on the other hand.... Figure Basque riders beating each other into
the ground and they have lost Beloki... I bet they're available for deal
making.... Plus JU can be opportunistic and jump on Basque attacks that
look promising.. In reality? he rides right there with LA and Vino and
limits the damage till the final ITT.



>

James Thomson
July 19th 03, 06:49 AM
"jean-yves hervé" > wrote

> It's the first time in 3 years that I watch the TdF on French
> TV, and I can hardly believe it is the person as the obnoxious
> guy who won in 1998.

It isn't: the obnoxious guy who won in '98 was Marco Pantani.

James Thomson

jumphress
July 19th 03, 08:19 AM
>but if he gets gapped, who knows what will go through his mind.

In 2000 Lance on the Joux-Plane Lance accelerated and shed everyone
but Heras (then with Kelme) and Virinque. Then Heras attacked, Lance
started going backwards, and a bunch of riders, including Ullrich,
came back to him. Ullrich ended up taking 1:35 back from Lance. (Both
Livingston and Bruyneel were fined for irregular feeding.)

In 1998 Ullrich, wearing the yellow jersey, lost almost 9 minutes on
Stage 15, dropping him to 5th overall. The next day (another mountain
stage) he came back and beat Pantani in a sprint to move back into
3rd. If Ullrich cracks, it won't be because of psychological
pressure.

And for those doubting Ullrich's TT ability, in 1997 he won an uphill
time trail by more than 3 minutes.

Dave
July 19th 03, 02:48 PM
"Fred Marx" > wrote in message ...
>
>
> Dave wrote:
> > "dwjones" > wrote in message
> > et...
> >
> >>"Dave" > wrote in message
> .. .
> >>
> >>>"dwjones" > wrote in message
> et...
> >>>
> >>>>ullrich had a spectaular time trial. however he does not have the team
> >>
> >>to be
> >>
> >>>>able to match lance in the Pyrenees
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Sure he does...the team of the current 2nd place rider, Vinokurov
> >>>
> >>>Dave
> >
> >
> >>no he doesn't. vinokurov is a member of his previous team
> >
> >
> >
> > Duh!...think outside the box for a moment..
> > Dave
> >
> >
>
> Let's see Vinokourov is actually in 3rd overall and I'll just bet they
> ride for him.... and then for Vino and Zabel in the following flat
> stages... no way I see JU getting help form the pink and black... Now
> ONCE on the other hand.... Figure Basque riders beating each other into
> the ground and they have lost Beloki... I bet they're available for deal
> making.... Plus JU can be opportunistic and jump on Basque attacks that
> look promising.. In reality? he rides right there with LA and Vino and
> limits the damage till the final ITT.


I have no doubt they ride for Vino, but in an interview (pre-tour) Zabel said he would have no
problem working for Jan in the right setting. If for some reason Vinokurov falters, I think that
may be the right setting
Dave

jean-yves hervé
July 19th 03, 04:30 PM
In article >,
"James Thomson" > wrote:

> "jean-yves hervé" > wrote
>
> > It's the first time in 3 years that I watch the TdF on French
> > TV, and I can hardly believe it is the person as the obnoxious
> > guy who won in 1998.
>
> It isn't: the obnoxious guy who won in '98 was Marco Pantani.

my bad, I keep confusing these two. :-)

jyh.

--
================================================== ===================
jean-yves herve' /\
Department of Computer Science \/ e-mail -->
and Statistics /\
University of Rhode Island \/ Tel. --> (401) 874-4400
Kingston, RI 02881-0816 /\ Fax. --> (401) 874-4617
USA \/
================================================== ===================

Nick Burns
July 19th 03, 06:43 PM
"Corey Green" > wrote in message
...
> It will all come down to the ability to change pace. We all saw what
> happened when Manuel Beltran picked up the pace - Jan was gone. Jan is
still
> a one-pace climber. When he comes back, he does it at his own pace - he is
> still strong, but if he gets gapped, who knows what will go through his
> head.
>
It is not so much "one pace" but rather that he accelerates more slowly. He
needs to attack first.

>
> "TritonRider" > wrote in message
> ...
> > >From: warren
> > >Date: 7/18/2003 9:37 PM Eastern
> >
> > >I predict Heras and Armstrong will attack hard because Ullrich can't do
> > >that.
> > >
> > >-WG
> > >
> >
> > Warren, I'm not sure that Jan won't be able to respond this time. He
> looks
> > lighter and much fitter than he has been for years. Granted he's more
of
> a
> > power climber. What happens if Bianchi and Telekom set a high pace for
Jan
> and
> > Vino to keep Lance and the Postie climbers at bay?
> > Gonna be a lot of fun though, isn't it?
> > Bill C
>
>

David Ryan
July 19th 03, 07:35 PM
Nick Burns wrote:
>
> "Corey Green" > wrote in message
> ...
> > It will all come down to the ability to change pace. We all saw what
> > happened when Manuel Beltran picked up the pace - Jan was gone. Jan is
> still
> > a one-pace climber. When he comes back, he does it at his own pace - he is
> > still strong, but if he gets gapped, who knows what will go through his
> > head.
> >
> It is not so much "one pace" but rather that he accelerates more slowly. He
> needs to attack first.

You cannot accelerate more slowly and get away.

urhome
July 19th 03, 08:08 PM
I've never met one. I congratulate him on his weight loss and not waiting
'til next year to give it his best shot.

"Scott Downie" > wrote in message
...
> What was it? 1:30 over 45k ? Even the most hardcore Ullrich haters must
> appreciate that one !
>
> --
> Irrationally held truths may be more harmfull than reasoned errors.
> "Rene Clancy" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Go Jan GO!!!!
>
>

Nick Burns
July 19th 03, 08:16 PM
"David Ryan" > wrote in message
...
> Nick Burns wrote:
> >
> > "Corey Green" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > It will all come down to the ability to change pace. We all saw what
> > > happened when Manuel Beltran picked up the pace - Jan was gone. Jan is
> > still
> > > a one-pace climber. When he comes back, he does it at his own pace -
he is
> > > still strong, but if he gets gapped, who knows what will go through
his
> > > head.
> > >
> > It is not so much "one pace" but rather that he accelerates more slowly.
He
> > needs to attack first.
>
> You cannot accelerate more slowly and get away.

To be successful, he would have to accelerate at a time that Armstrong is
not able to in order to. I am obviously not comparing their side by side
performance. I am comparing one riders attacking style to another's.

Stewart Fleming
July 20th 03, 10:11 PM
Jamce1 wrote:

> interesting to see that all the players took time out of armstrong over the
> last portion. whats up with that?

How do you lose 7kg of fluid body weight in an hour?

David Ryan
July 20th 03, 11:46 PM
Stewart Fleming wrote:
>
> Jamce1 wrote:
>
> > interesting to see that all the players took time out of armstrong over the
> > last portion. whats up with that?
>
> How do you lose 7kg of fluid body weight in an hour?

Slicing your wrists will do it :)

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