Botero is back!!

[sonarrat]

1 Santiago Botero Echeverry (Col) Phonak Hearing Systems 26.29.41
2 Bradley McGee (Aus) Française des Jeux 0.25.44
3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre - Caffita 0.34.62
4 Oscar Pereiro Sio (Spa) Phonak Hearing Systems 0.35.46
5 Stefano Garzelli (Ita) Liquigas - Bianchi 0.39.03
6 Thomas Dekker (Ned) Rabobank 0.49.07
7 Laurent Brochard (Fra) Bouygues Telecom 0.49.58
8 Dario David Cioni (Ita) Liquigas - Bianchi 0.49.91
9 Paolo Savoldelli (Ita) Discovery Channel 0.51.75
10 Beat Zberg (Swi) Gerolsteiner 0.54.39
11 Laszlo Bodrogi (Hun) Crédit Agricole 1.01.45
12 Marco Fertonani (Ita) Domina Vacanze 1.03.99
13 Jurgen Van Den Broeck (Bel) Discovery Channel 1.04.19
14 Alberto Contador Velasco (Spa) Liberty Seguros-Würth Team 1.06.18

[Ewoud Dronkert]

On Sun, 01 May 2005 08:02:16 -0700, sonarrat wrote:
> 3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre - Caffita 0.34.62

Wow.


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[Si]

"Ewoud Dronkert" > wrote in message ...
> On Sun, 01 May 2005 08:02:16 -0700, sonarrat wrote:
>> 3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre - Caffita 0.34.62
>
> Wow.

Double wow!

However....

129 Joseba Beloki Dorronsoro (Spa) Liberty Seguros-Würth 5.07Did he forget to take his stabilisers off?Simon

[sonarrat]

Ewoud Dronkert wrote:
> On Sun, 01 May 2005 08:02:16 -0700, sonarrat wrote:
>
>>3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre - Caffita 0.34.62
>
>
> Wow.

Apparently he got a 2-second penalty, because the final results have him
in 4th place behind Pereiro. It didn't matter because either way,
Botero wrested the crown from him.

Oh, and how did Cunego do that well? Well, I can illustrate it by
pointing out that Botero's average speed was 26 km/h. The course has
about 7 km of climbing, culminating in a climb up to the Olympic Stadium
in Lausanne. And that stadium wasn't for the Summer Olympics.

Given a totally flat TT, I have a feeling the gap would have been far
greater.

-Sonarrat.

[amit]

sonarrat wrote:
> Ewoud Dronkert wrote:
> > On Sun, 01 May 2005 08:02:16 -0700, sonarrat wrote:
> >
> >>3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre - Caffita
0.34.62
> >
> >
> > Wow.
>
> Oh, and how did Cunego do that well? Well, I can illustrate it by
> pointing out that Botero's average speed was 26 km/h.

that was an error on cyclingnews (it's been fixed), 24:29 in 20.4 km TT
gives about 46 kph.

[sonarrat]

Jeff Jones wrote:
> sonarrat wrote:
>
>>Oh, and how did Cunego do that well? Well, I can illustrate it by
>>pointing out that Botero's average speed was 26 km/h. The course has
>>about 7 km of climbing, culminating in a climb up to the Olympic
>>Stadium in Lausanne. And that stadium wasn't for the Summer Olympics.
>>
>
> Sorry, that was a typo. 46.208 km/h. It is a hard course though.
>
> Jeff

Dang... Cunego really has come a long way then.

-Sonarrat.

[Ewoud Dronkert]

On Sun, 01 May 2005 11:18:59 -0700, sonarrat wrote:
> Cunego really has come a long way then.

He was doped to the gills with panache because of the leader's jersey.
Remember Heras in the Vuelta last year and no doubt countless others who
did better than expected when in yellow. In rowing too, those with a
yellow boat go faster.


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[Stewart Fleming]

Jeff Jones wrote:

> sonarrat wrote:
>
>>Oh, and how did Cunego do that well? Well, I can illustrate it by
>>pointing out that Botero's average speed was 26 km/h. The course has
>>about 7 km of climbing, culminating in a climb up to the Olympic
>>Stadium in Lausanne. And that stadium wasn't for the Summer Olympics.
>>
>
> Sorry, that was a typo. 46.208 km/h. It is a hard course though.

At least you didn't write 26MPG.

[Keith]

So what's up with Botero, he hasn't been able to finish a race since
his brilliant 2002 tour with Kelme and now he's flying up the
mountains...another guy who didn't like the climate at Telekom I
guess...(see Julich), maybe Ullrich should join Phonak too !

On Sun, 01 May 2005 08:02:16 -0700, sonarrat >
wrote:

>1 Santiago Botero Echeverry (Col) Phonak Hearing Systems 26.29.41
>2 Bradley McGee (Aus) Française des Jeux 0.25.44
>3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre - Caffita 0.34.62
>4 Oscar Pereiro Sio (Spa) Phonak Hearing Systems 0.35.46
>5 Stefano Garzelli (Ita) Liquigas - Bianchi 0.39.03
>6 Thomas Dekker (Ned) Rabobank 0.49.07
>7 Laurent Brochard (Fra) Bouygues Telecom 0.49.58
>8 Dario David Cioni (Ita) Liquigas - Bianchi 0.49.91
>9 Paolo Savoldelli (Ita) Discovery Channel 0.51.75
>10 Beat Zberg (Swi) Gerolsteiner 0.54.39
>11 Laszlo Bodrogi (Hun) Crédit Agricole 1.01.45
>12 Marco Fertonani (Ita) Domina Vacanze 1.03.99
>13 Jurgen Van Den Broeck (Bel) Discovery Channel 1.04.19
>14 Alberto Contador Velasco (Spa) Liberty Seguros-Würth Team 1.06.18

[Bill C]

sonarrat wrote:
> Jeff Jones wrote:
> > sonarrat wrote:
> >
> >>Oh, and how did Cunego do that well? Well, I can illustrate it by
> >>pointing out that Botero's average speed was 26 km/h. The course
has
> >>about 7 km of climbing, culminating in a climb up to the Olympic
> >>Stadium in Lausanne. And that stadium wasn't for the Summer
Olympics.
> >>
> >
> > Sorry, that was a typo. 46.208 km/h. It is a hard course though.
> >
> > Jeff
>
> Dang... Cunego really has come a long way then.
>
> -Sonarrat.

Slow solid progress. Cunego is the next real thing, and he has a long
history of being solid. Kinda reminds me of Lemond. Let's hope he
doesn't get shot. Cunego, Boonen, and Petachi are the next generation,
and they are deserving.
Bill C

[sonarrat]

Bill C wrote:
> sonarrat wrote:
>
>>Jeff Jones wrote:
>>
>>>sonarrat wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Oh, and how did Cunego do that well? Well, I can illustrate it by
>>>>pointing out that Botero's average speed was 26 km/h. The course
>
> has
>
>>>>about 7 km of climbing, culminating in a climb up to the Olympic
>>>>Stadium in Lausanne. And that stadium wasn't for the Summer
>
> Olympics.
>
>>>Sorry, that was a typo. 46.208 km/h. It is a hard course though.
>>>
>>>Jeff
>>
>>Dang... Cunego really has come a long way then.
>>
>>-Sonarrat.
>
>
> Slow solid progress. Cunego is the next real thing, and he has a long
> history of being solid. Kinda reminds me of Lemond. Let's hope he
> doesn't get shot. Cunego, Boonen, and Petachi are the next generation,
> and they are deserving.
> Bill C

Petacchi isn't young.. he's 31, in fact. He should be good for a few
more years, but his career won't be as long and illustrious as
Cipollini's, because he found himself fairly late.

-Sonarrat.

[HB]

"Keith" > skrev i en meddelelse
...
> So what's up with Botero, he hasn't been able to finish a race since
> his brilliant 2002 tour with Kelme and now he's flying up the
> mountains...another guy who didn't like the climate at Telekom I
> guess...(see Julich), maybe Ullrich should join Phonak too !
>

Yeah, more than a few riders have had great, uhm, development after joining
Phony, uhm Phonak...

HB

[Keith]

>"Keith" > skrev i en meddelelse
...
>> So what's up with Botero, he hasn't been able to finish a race since
>> his brilliant 2002 tour with Kelme and now he's flying up the
>> mountains...another guy who didn't like the climate at Telekom I
>> guess...(see Julich), maybe Ullrich should join Phonak too !
>>
>
>Yeah, more than a few riders have had great, uhm, development after joining
>Phony, uhm Phonak...

I'm not one to believe in conspiracy theories, but It does have to
make you wonder though...guys riding great at Kelme (Botero, Aitor
Gonzales, Sevilla), Phonak and TSC and not at Telekom...

[[email protected]]

sonarrat wrote:
> 1 Santiago Botero Echeverry (Col) Phonak Hearing Systems
26.29.41
> 2 Bradley McGee (Aus) Fran=E7aise des Jeux
0=2E25.44
> 3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre - Caffita
0=2E34.62
> 4 Oscar Pereiro Sio (Spa) Phonak Hearing Systems
0=2E35.46
> 5 Stefano Garzelli (Ita) Liquigas - Bianchi
0=2E39.03
> 6 Thomas Dekker (Ned) Rabobank
0=2E49.07
> 7 Laurent Brochard (Fra) Bouygues Telecom
0=2E49.58
> 8 Dario David Cioni (Ita) Liquigas - Bianchi
0=2E49.91
> 9 Paolo Savoldelli (Ita) Discovery Channel
0=2E51.75
> 10 Beat Zberg (Swi) Gerolsteiner
0=2E54.39
> 11 Laszlo Bodrogi (Hun) Cr=E9dit Agricole
1=2E01.45
> 12 Marco Fertonani (Ita) Domina Vacanze
1=2E03.99
> 13 Jurgen Van Den Broeck (Bel) Discovery Channel
1=2E04.19
> 14 Alberto Contador Velasco (Spa) Liberty Seguros-W=FCrth Team
1=2E06.18

Following the usually rbr posting custom...

Winning is proof :. Botero is doping

[[email protected]]

Keith wrote:
> So what's up with Botero, he hasn't been able to finish a race since
> his brilliant 2002 tour with Kelme and now he's flying up the
> mountains...another guy who didn't like the climate at Telekom I
> guess...(see Julich), maybe Ullrich should join Phonak too !

Wouldn't help Jan. Telekom/T-mobile is a meatgrinder of talent which
only outputs brats for Jan to get fat on. You'd think Kloden's feat
last year made some impression. These other guys the team hires to
support Jan have talent wasting away.

Granted, Botero was pretty short in the talent department at T.

"I seem to be having a bad year, bust just keep sending those paychecks
just in case."

[sonarrat]

Keith wrote:
>>"Keith" > skrev i en meddelelse
...
>>
>>>So what's up with Botero, he hasn't been able to finish a race since
>>>his brilliant 2002 tour with Kelme and now he's flying up the
>>>mountains...another guy who didn't like the climate at Telekom I
>>>guess...(see Julich), maybe Ullrich should join Phonak too !
>>>
>>
>>Yeah, more than a few riders have had great, uhm, development after joining
>>Phony, uhm Phonak...
>
>
> I'm not one to believe in conspiracy theories, but It does have to
> make you wonder though...guys riding great at Kelme (Botero, Aitor
> Gonzales, Sevilla), Phonak and TSC and not at Telekom...

Too early to judge for Sevilla. Early indicators suggest history
repeating itself, though. I hope he likes being in a support role,
because that's what he's signed up for...

-Sonarrat.

[lazysegall]

Keith Wrote:
> >"Keith" > skrev i en meddelelse
> ...
> >> So what's up with Botero, he hasn't been able to finish a race
> since
> >> his brilliant 2002 tour with Kelme and now he's flying up the
> >> mountains...another guy who didn't like the climate at Telekom I
> >> guess...(see Julich), maybe Ullrich should join Phonak too !
> >>
> >
> >Yeah, more than a few riders have had great, uhm, development after
> joining
> >Phony, uhm Phonak...
>
> I'm not one to believe in conspiracy theories, but It does have to
> make you wonder though...guys riding great at Kelme (Botero, Aitor
> Gonzales, Sevilla), Phonak and TSC and not at Telekom...

I think telekom just doesn;t know how to mangage a team. Zabel in the
tour every year when Jan wants a ttt, and who was it that told botero
that it would be ok to train the whole winter in Columbia when they
were with team. Oh yeah who's idea was it to fire Jan the year that he
has done best since 1997. What is that guys name walter godfote, or
something. Honestly, you have to be kidding me that team does the
worst job with a ton of money. I think that Zabel is a good guy too,
and he used to be a green jersey threat, but it wasn't even fair to
zabel to give him no support for his race.


--
lazysegall

[Ewoud Dronkert]

On 2 May 2005 16:20:31 -0700, wrote:
> Granted, Botero was pretty short in the talent department at T.
> "I seem to be having a bad year, bust just keep sending those paychecks
> just in case."

Actually, Botero was all class and handed his contract back, saying he
didn't earn it, but management wouldn't accept.


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[Donald Munro]

Jeff Jones wrote:
>> Sorry, that was a typo. 46.208 km/h. It is a hard course though.

Stewart Fleming wrote:
> At least you didn't write 26MPG.

You're saying Botero is using a higher octane fuel this year ?

[John Forrest Tomlinson]

On Tue, 03 May 2005 10:11:25 +0200, Ewoud Dronkert
> wrote:

>On 2 May 2005 16:20:31 -0700, wrote:
>> Granted, Botero was pretty short in the talent department at T.
>> "I seem to be having a bad year, bust just keep sending those paychecks
>> just in case."
>
>Actually, Botero was all class and handed his contract back, saying he
>didn't earn it, but management wouldn't accept.

Interesting. Thanks for the info.

JT


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[h squared]

lazysegall wrote:

> I think telekom just doesn;t know how to mangage a team. Zabel in the
> tour every year when Jan wants a ttt, and who was it that told botero
> that it would be ok to train the whole winter in Columbia when they
> were with team.

i'm not sure of the details, but it sounds like he trained there again
this last winter-
"Today, I think I'm the happiest man in the world," Botero told
Cyclingnews at the post-race press conference. "In the sport, you need
everything to be perfect. That hasn't happened the last few years, but
now I am healthy and I trained very hard in Colombia during the winter
[16,000 kilometres to be exact - ed.]. This is the result of all my
efforts."
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2005/may05/may02news

hh

[Keith]

>> I'm not one to believe in conspiracy theories, but It does have to
>> make you wonder though...guys riding great at Kelme (Botero, Aitor
>> Gonzales, Sevilla), Phonak and TSC and not at Telekom...
>
>I think telekom just doesn;t know how to mangage a team. Zabel in the
>tour every year when Jan wants a ttt, and who was it that told botero
>that it would be ok to train the whole winter in Columbia when they
>were with team. Oh yeah who's idea was it to fire Jan the year that he
>has done best since 1997.

Actually I think he was let go in 2002 after that car
crash+runaway+recreatinal drugs...not terribly imrpessive, eh ! He did
do well in 2003 though, that was certainly his best year since 1997,
too bad he didn't win the tour.

> What is that guys name walter godfote, or
>something. Honestly, you have to be kidding me that team does the
>worst job with a ton of money. I think that Zabel is a good guy too,
>and he used to be a green jersey threat, but it wasn't even fair to
>zabel to give him no support for his race.