Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

In his own, awesome words:

http://www.alexigrewal.com/index.php...olympics-in-la

" I was not thinking what I could do to help Davis, I was thinking how
I could use the situation to work all my rivals against each other"

"Phinney was wearing a skin suit.... The skinsuit was information I
filed away. Only one pocket was sewn into it and we faced a hot,
hilly two hundred kilometer race. One feed zone per lap on a
downhill, right near the start finish, wearing a skin suit with one
pocket was to rely on the unreliable."

"Two laps to go Davis asks me for food. I lied, said I don’t have
any, I justified it in my mind by thinking I might need it myself."

....and much more, very entertaining stuff, not just about hiding food
from the team leader, but also about his tactical choices, and how he
saw the race.

I did a cursory search, and haven't seen a post in rbr that breaks
down 1984 Olympic road race race to this extent. Grewal's explanation
is as fascinating as it is Machiavellian.

There's more goodies in the rest of the site, including his story of
spitting on the camera man.

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

"That's bike racing"

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

In article ,
Ryan Cousineau wrote:

In his own, awesome words:

http://www.alexigrewal.com/index.php...he-olympics-in
-la

" I was not thinking what I could do to help Davis, I was thinking how
I could use the situation to work all my rivals against each other"

"Phinney was wearing a skin suit.... The skinsuit was information I
filed away. Only one pocket was sewn into it and we faced a hot,
hilly two hundred kilometer race. One feed zone per lap on a
downhill, right near the start finish, wearing a skin suit with one
pocket was to rely on the unreliable."

"Two laps to go Davis asks me for food. I lied, said I don¹t have
any, I justified it in my mind by thinking I might need it myself."

...and much more, very entertaining stuff, not just about hiding food
from the team leader, but also about his tactical choices, and how he
saw the race.

I did a cursory search, and haven't seen a post in rbr that breaks
down 1984 Olympic road race race to this extent. Grewal's explanation
is as fascinating as it is Machiavellian.

There's more goodies in the rest of the site, including his story of
spitting on the camera man.

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

He did what all top level racers (particularly motorcycle racers) know to do: The
person you most have to beat is your team mate. His explanations of how he did it was
pretty fascinating - the guy did not miss a single thing.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 8, 6:10*pm, "H. Fred Kveck" wrote:
*Ryan Cousineau wrote:

I did a cursory search, and haven't seen a post in rbr that breaks
down 1984 Olympic road race race to this extent. Grewal's explanation
is as fascinating as it is Machiavellian.

* *He did what all top level racers (particularly motorcycle racers) know to do: The
person you most have to beat is your team mate. His explanations of how he did it was
pretty fascinating - the guy did not miss a single thing.

Damn.
That's intense.
You know it's good when Scottsmack posts up and
just says "wow."

Fredmaster Ben

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 8, 3:58*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.



Dumbass -

I was too greedy (regarding teamwork) in two races and I regret it
both times. It didn't work out.

It's better to work with or for your teamates.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On 12/8/2010 5:58 PM, Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In his own, awesome words:

http://www.alexigrewal.com/index.php...olympics-in-la



Good read. Thanks for posting the link.


Regards

Bill

--

William R. Mattil

http://www.celestial-images.com

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 8, 7:07*pm, "Kurgan. presented by Gringioni."
wrote:
On Dec 8, 3:58*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:



I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

Dumbass -

I was too greedy (regarding teamwork) in two races and I regret it
both times. It didn't work out.

It's better to work with or for your teamates.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Dumbass,
Which Olympics were those in?
DR

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 8, 8:09*pm, "William R. Mattil" wrote:
On 12/8/2010 5:58 PM, Ryan Cousineau wrote:

In his own, awesome words:

http://www.alexigrewal.com/index.php...uit-aka-the-ol...

Good read. Thanks for posting the link.

Regards

Bill

--

William R. Mattil

http://www.celestial-images.com

Hindsight is 20/20. This smacks of jealousy for the golden boys of US
cycling at the time - the 7-Eleven team.

Interestingly, there are similarities to the 1982 pro road race in
Goodwood England

http://velonews.competitor.com/2005/...82-worlds_8043

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 8, 6:19*pm, DirtRoadie wrote:
On Dec 8, 7:07*pm, "Kurgan. presented by Gringioni."





wrote:
On Dec 8, 3:58*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

Dumbass -

I was too greedy (regarding teamwork) in two races and I regret it
both times. It didn't work out.

It's better to work with or for your teamates.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Dumbass,
Which Olympics were those in?



Dumbass -

The Special Olympics.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 8, 7:58*pm, "Kurgan. presented by Gringioni."
wrote:
On Dec 8, 6:19*pm, DirtRoadie wrote:





On Dec 8, 7:07*pm, "Kurgan. presented by Gringioni."

wrote:
On Dec 8, 3:58*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

Dumbass -

I was too greedy (regarding teamwork) in two races and I regret it
both times. It didn't work out.

It's better to work with or for your teamates.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Dumbass,
Which Olympics were those in?

Dumbass -

The Special Olympics.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

But you can at least take consolation that, just by competing,
EVERYBODY wins in the Special Olympics.
DR

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 8, 7:10*pm, "H. Fred Kveck" wrote:
In article ,
*Ryan Cousineau wrote:





In his own, awesome words:

http://www.alexigrewal.com/index.php...uit-aka-the-ol...
-la

" I was not thinking what I could do to help Davis, I was thinking how
I could use the situation to work all my rivals against each other"

"Phinney was wearing a skin suit.... The skinsuit was information I
filed away. *Only one pocket was sewn into it and we faced a hot,
hilly two hundred kilometer race. *One feed zone per lap on a
downhill, right near the start finish, wearing a skin suit with one
pocket was to rely on the unreliable."

"Two laps to go Davis asks me for food. *I lied, said I don t have
any, I justified it in my mind by thinking I might need it myself."

...and much more, very entertaining stuff, not just about hiding food
from the team leader, but also about his tactical choices, and how he
saw the race.

I did a cursory search, and haven't seen a post in rbr that breaks
down 1984 Olympic road race race to this extent. Grewal's explanation
is as fascinating as it is Machiavellian.

There's more goodies in the rest of the site, including his story of
spitting on the camera man.

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

* *He did what all top level racers (particularly motorcycle racers) know to do: The
person you most have to beat is your team mate. His explanations of how he did it was
pretty fascinating - the guy did not miss a single thing.

Steve Tilford has a comment on time and distance on his blog,
recently.

Addressing the title line: third and fourth finishers, Dag-Otto
Lauritzen and Morten Saether, were teammates riding for Norway.
Morten dragged Dag-Otto to the line and got outsprinted for the last
medal. Dag-Otto went on to a pro contract; Morten rode the Tour of
Texas (amateur) in '86 and I think subsequently went back to school
and got a degree.

The moral of the story: "That's bike racing!".
--D-y

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

--D-y wrote:
Addressing the title line: third and fourth finishers, Dag-Otto
Lauritzen and Morten Saether, were teammates riding for Norway.
Morten dragged Dag-Otto to the line and got outsprinted for the last
medal. Dag-Otto went on to a pro contract; Morten rode the Tour of
Texas (amateur) in '86 and I think subsequently went back to school
and got a degree.

I know who really won.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 9, 5:05*pm, --D-y wrote:

Addressing the title line: third and fourth finishers, Dag-Otto
Lauritzen and Morten Saether, were teammates riding for Norway.
Morten dragged Dag-Otto to the line and got outsprinted for the last
medal. Dag-Otto went on to a pro contract; Morten rode the Tour of

Dag-Otto Lauritzen was also somewhat famous in Norway for dragging one
L. Armstrong up to the Indurain-driven break on the last lap of World
Champs, Oslo 1993.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

Because anyone that's got to that level will tell you when the race
starts - it's every man for himself.

(of course this is different in stage racing but one day races you're
on your own)

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On 12/8/2010 8:07 PM, Kurgan. presented by Gringioni. wrote:
On Dec 8, 3:58 pm, Ryan wrote:

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.



Dumbass -

I was too greedy (regarding teamwork) in two races and I regret it
both times. It didn't work out.

It's better to work with or for your teamates.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

If you read between the lines in what Alexi writes in the
comments it isn't obvious that he disagrees with you.

"One can use your brain, for good or for things that are
not so good. Imagine my brain being used to support Davis
and Ron. A little bit different perspective and I could
have easily controlled that entire race and brought Ron
and Davis to the finish on an armchair.

Think perhaps of how that would have affected my lifetime
goal of being a Tour de France rider. One can never go
back, but we can change how we go forward."

Fred Flintstein

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 9, 6:23*am, Fred Flintstein
wrote:
On 12/8/2010 8:07 PM, Kurgan. presented by Gringioni. wrote:





On Dec 8, 3:58 pm, Ryan *wrote:

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

Dumbass -

I was too greedy (regarding teamwork) in two races and I regret it
both times. It didn't work out.

It's better to work with or for your teamates.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

If you read between the lines in what Alexi writes in the
comments it isn't obvious that he disagrees with you.

"One can use your brain, for good or for things that are
not so good. Imagine my brain being used to support Davis
and Ron. A little bit different perspective and I could
have easily controlled that entire race and brought Ron
and Davis to the finish on an armchair.

Think perhaps of how that would have affected my lifetime
goal of being a Tour de France rider. One can never go
back, but we can change how we go forward."



Dumbass -

I didn't even read the article. That is some good introspection.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 9, 8:23*am, Fred Flintstein
wrote:
On 12/8/2010 8:07 PM, Kurgan. presented by Gringioni. wrote:



On Dec 8, 3:58 pm, Ryan *wrote:

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

Dumbass -

I was too greedy (regarding teamwork) in two races and I regret it
both times. It didn't work out.

It's better to work with or for your teamates.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

If you read between the lines in what Alexi writes in the
comments it isn't obvious that he disagrees with you.

"One can use your brain, for good or for things that are
not so good. Imagine my brain being used to support Davis
and Ron. A little bit different perspective and I could
have easily controlled that entire race and brought Ron
and Davis to the finish on an armchair.

Think perhaps of how that would have affected my lifetime
goal of being a Tour de France rider. One can never go
back, but we can change how we go forward."

Fred Flintstein

Good talk. I see similarities in attitudes between the young Grewal
and young Armstrong. Speaking of changing how we go forward, Armstrong
figured it out but it doesn't appear that Grewal did.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 9, 4:05*am, "A. Dumas" wrote:
--D-y wrote:
Addressing the title line: third and fourth finishers, Dag-Otto
Lauritzen and Morten Saether, were teammates riding for Norway.
Morten dragged Dag-Otto to the line and got outsprinted for the last
medal. Dag-Otto went on to a pro contract; Morten rode the Tour of
Texas (amateur) in '86 and I think subsequently went back to school
and got a degree.

I know who really won.

The guy with the most toys at the end?
--D-y

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On 12/8/2010 6:58 PM, Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In his own, awesome words:

http://www.alexigrewal.com/index.php...olympics-in-la

" I was not thinking what I could do to help Davis, I was thinking how
I could use the situation to work all my rivals against each other"

"Phinney was wearing a skin suit.... The skinsuit was information I
filed away. Only one pocket was sewn into it and we faced a hot,
hilly two hundred kilometer race. One feed zone per lap on a
downhill, right near the start finish, wearing a skin suit with one
pocket was to rely on the unreliable."

"Two laps to go Davis asks me for food. I lied, said I don’t have
any, I justified it in my mind by thinking I might need it myself."

...and much more, very entertaining stuff, not just about hiding food
from the team leader, but also about his tactical choices, and how he
saw the race.

I did a cursory search, and haven't seen a post in rbr that breaks
down 1984 Olympic road race race to this extent. Grewal's explanation
is as fascinating as it is Machiavellian.

There's more goodies in the rest of the site, including his story of
spitting on the camera man.

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.


Awesome is right!

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 9, 5:55*am, Anton Berlin wrote:
Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. *If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

Because anyone that's got to that level will tell you when the race
starts - it's every man for himself.

(of course this is different in stage racing but one day races you're
on your own)
On Dec 9, 5:55*am, Anton Berlin wrote:
Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. *If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

Because anyone that's got to that level will tell you when the race
starts - it's every man for himself.

(of course this is different in stage racing but one day races you're
on your own)

I said "worst teammate," not "worst racer." As you note, Grewal
achieved cycling greatness that day.

But he took an awful risk. He relied on being able to outsprint Bauer
heads-up, but he got away with it. As he notes, the good-teammate plan
would have meant delivering Kiefel and Phinney to the finish, with
extremely good odds for the USA.

The meta-problem at the Olympics and Worlds is that national "teams"
are largely a crock, featuring minimal functional loyalties (as
opposed to pro teams, where the personal and financial ties are
usually stronger). Even club teams are more of a real team.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 9, 8:33*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:
On Dec 9, 5:55*am, Anton Berlin wrote: Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. *If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

Because anyone that's got to that level will tell you when the race
starts - it's every man for himself.

(of course this is different in stage racing but one day races you're
on your own)

On Dec 9, 5:55*am, Anton Berlin wrote:

Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. *If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

Because anyone that's got to that level will tell you when the race
starts - it's every man for himself.

(of course this is different in stage racing but one day races you're
on your own)

I said "worst teammate," not "worst racer." As you note, Grewal
achieved cycling greatness that day.

But he took an awful risk. He relied on being able to outsprint Bauer
heads-up, but he got away with it. As he notes, the good-teammate plan
would have meant delivering Kiefel and Phinney to the finish, with
extremely good odds for the USA.

The meta-problem at the Olympics and Worlds is that national "teams"
are largely a crock, featuring minimal functional loyalties (as
opposed to pro teams, where the personal and financial ties are
usually stronger). Even club teams are more of a real team.

Exactly ! How is anyone (Alexi especially) expected to have
allegiance to guys he barely rode with? Just because they all have
the same super gay stars and stripes jersey on?

This is the exact same problem that haunted the US 100k teams for the
80s and 90s. The ten speed drive boys - working as friends that rode
together often - typically went 4-8 minutes faster than the ad hoc
teams the coaches threw together again and again (the definition of
insanity) and sent to international events.

Alexi had one allegiance that day and that was to work for himself.
Anyone that's won eventually second guesses (often much later in
life ) as much as the guys that got second or sixteenth.

**** Davis Phinney - if he didn't have the sense to bring enough food
and drink or try to gain advantage be wearing a skinsuit with only 1
pocket then he deserves the place he got.

I'll venture this - in a three up sprint with Phinney, Bauer and
Grewal - Grewal still could win because he would be smart enough to
take advantage of those 2 marking each other and would enter the end
zone untouched.

From reading his blogs and news stories it's clear Alexi (as a human)
is going through a stage where he's trying to rationalize his life,
justify or pardon his past and have it all make sense.

That day in 1984 he inspired 10s of thousands to ride and put in the
miles (me included) and that vision kept me riding many times for many
years.

If you or even he wants to **** on that candy now - well OK that's
everyone's right - but it doesn't change the fact that for years his
ride inspired every loner, every misfit and every one that wanted to
do something for themselves and prove to the world and lastly the
internal doubts we all have that they have value and can do something
incredible.

I don't know him, never raced against him but Alexi Grewal is the
greatest "teammate" ever because at 23 he got it right.

The race is with ourselves. The things we do only mark our souls. And
no one really keeps our score but ourselves.

And independent ****ers like Henry Chang, Magilla, Alexi and maybe
Anton make this world 100x better than a million ass grabbing glad
handing yes-men team players.

I am in the business world and I can tell you for a fact that the
"teammates" and "team players" are the most detestable untrustworthy
****s out there.

So in the end - maybe your subject line isn't so bad - calling someone
like Alexi "the worst teammate ever" is about the best damn compliment
one can make.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 10, 5:56*am, Anton Berlin wrote:
On Dec 9, 8:33*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:

On Dec 9, 5:55*am, Anton Berlin wrote:

Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. *If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

I said "worst teammate," not "worst racer." As you note, Grewal
achieved cycling greatness that day.

But he took an awful risk. He relied on being able to outsprint Bauer
heads-up, but he got away with it. As he notes, the good-teammate plan
would have meant delivering Kiefel and Phinney to the finish, with
extremely good odds for the USA.

The meta-problem at the Olympics and Worlds is that national "teams"
are largely a crock, featuring minimal functional loyalties (as
opposed to pro teams, where the personal and financial ties are
usually stronger). Even club teams are more of a real team.

Exactly ! *How is anyone (Alexi especially) expected to have
allegiance to guys he barely rode with? *Just because they all have
the same super gay stars and stripes jersey on?

There's merit to this.

This is the exact same problem that haunted the US 100k teams for the
80s and 90s. *The ten speed drive boys - working as friends that rode
together often - typically went 4-8 minutes faster than the ad hoc
teams the coaches threw together again and again (the definition of
insanity) *and sent to international events.

I'm just boggling here at the idea that anyone cares about 100k TTTs
outside of England.

Alexi had one allegiance that day and that was to work for himself.
Anyone that's won eventually second guesses (often much later in
life ) as much as the guys that got second or sixteenth.

**** Davis Phinney - if he didn't have the sense to bring enough food
and drink or try to gain advantage be wearing a skinsuit with only 1
pocket then he deserves the place he got.



I'll venture this - in a three up sprint with Phinney, Bauer and
Grewal - Grewal still could win because he would be smart enough to
take advantage of those 2 marking each other and would enter the end
zone untouched.

Maybe. On the day, he strived to make them work each other, while he
sat on breaks until Bauer finally started stretching him. That wasn't
the bad-teammate part, that was pretty much where he should have been.

From reading his blogs and news stories it's clear Alexi (as a human)
is going through a stage where he's trying to rationalize his life,
justify or pardon his past and have it all make sense.

I think he's trying to get something to do. Reading it, you realize
he's got no money, can hardly find work, and they didn't even bring
the big new Sponsored Race to his preferred town. None of that is a
knock on Grewal, but I will use it as a whip for my favorite
hobbyhorse: pro bike racing is a stupid career.

That day in 1984 he inspired 10s of thousands to ride and put in the
miles (me included) and that vision kept me riding many times for many
years.

I'm going to anonymously quote a friend of mine: "When Grewal made his
final move and pipped Bauer at the finish, it was the closest I've
ever come to putting something through a TV Elvis-style."

Let's just say that Canada was not inspired.

If you or even he wants to **** on that candy now - well OK that's
everyone's right - but it doesn't change the fact that for years his
ride inspired every loner, every misfit and every one that wanted to
do something for themselves and prove to the world and lastly the
internal doubts we all have that they have value and can do something
incredible.

Let's be clear: bike racing isn't real. Grewal didn't steal penicillin
from children; he "stole" a gold medal from a "teammate" who went on
to live a happy life (and great pro career) regardless. Indeed, I'll
go so far as to suggest that had Grewal not medaled, he would have
been out of cycling much sooner, and likely ended up as a carpenter
much earlier, and likely have sufficiently more practice and so much
longer of a client list that today he wouldn't have to be content with
being a month ahead on the rent and scavenging insoles among the
collection of his dead friend.

We're agreeing, really, about all of this: the team structure at these
events is notoriously loose, to the point that "Ted" publishes an
annual list of pro teammates at the Worlds, since that is noteworthy
information when watching how the race develops.

I don't know him, never raced against him but Alexi Grewal is the
greatest "teammate" ever because at 23 he got it right.

The race is with ourselves. *The things we do only mark our souls. And
no one really keeps our score but ourselves.

I'm more simplistic than that: I think the meaning of Grewal's story
is that bike racing is fascinating, and the race doesn't always go to
the swift, nor the battle to the strong (but that's the way to
bet...).

So in the end - maybe your subject line isn't so bad - calling someone
like Alexi "the worst teammate ever" is about the best damn compliment
one can make.

1) Yay! I get the gold medal in Usenet Arguing! I feel like Loretta
Claiborne!

2) My subject line was a bit facetious (or at least putting the most
sensationalist light on Grewal's cool story), but if there was one
"worst teammate" moment that stood out, it was him withholding food
from Phinney at the end. He didn't have to hand it over, and he
understood the effect, but in terms of sportsmanship, we've seen
rivals share food and drink before. And note that Grewal admits to
having a secret feed zone just for himself, too. He made a (post-hoc
justifiable) decision to profoundly screw Phinney in that moment,
though Phinney unwittingly handed Grewal the screwdriver when he put
on a skinsuit.

It's just a great story, really.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

Ryan Cousineau wrote:

In his own, awesome words:

http://www.alexigrewal.com/index.php...olympics-in-la

" I was not thinking what I could do to help Davis, I was thinking how
I could use the situation to work all my rivals against each other"

"Phinney was wearing a skin suit.... The skinsuit was information I
filed away. Only one pocket was sewn into it and we faced a hot,
hilly two hundred kilometer race. One feed zone per lap on a
downhill, right near the start finish, wearing a skin suit with one
pocket was to rely on the unreliable."

"Two laps to go Davis asks me for food. I lied, said I don’t have
any, I justified it in my mind by thinking I might need it myself."


The 1984 Olympics was not only all-amateur, but a boycotted Games. Winning it was
meaningless. After Grewal won his gold medal he got all Bill Johnson about it.
That explains why he believes in God and thinks he's going to race Quiznos. Both
are delusions.

Although I am grateful he beat Phinney because had he won the gold medal him and
Connie would be wearing those meaningless medallions to sleep every night and still
talking about them everytime someone comes to interview them about their son.

Okay, I'm ready for you, Carl.

Magilla

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

It's just a great story, really.

whatever way it evolves - it's a great story

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

"Kurgan. presented by Gringioni." wrote:

On Dec 8, 3:58*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:

I remind you this reinforces my "amateur bike racing is awesome"
theory, since in 1984 this was an amateurs-only race.

Dumbass -

I was too greedy (regarding teamwork) in two races and I regret it
both times. It didn't work out.

It's better to work with or for your teamates.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

The purpose of teammates is to get chicks, get water bottles, and to
keep their mouth shut when the doping authorities come knockin.' Well,
at least according to Lance, that is.

Magilla

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

Anton Berlin wrote:

Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

Because anyone that's got to that level will tell you when the race
starts - it's every man for himself.

(of course this is different in stage racing but one day races you're
on your own)

Correct, Phinney should have brought his own ****ing lunch. Phinney
reminds me of one of those faggots on group rides who's always asking for
spare tubes and a pump when they flat. I can't tell you have many
****hole riders I know whose way of fixing a flat is to call their
girlfriend to pick them up.


Magilla

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

Ryan Cousineau wrote:

On Dec 9, 5:55*am, Anton Berlin wrote:
Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. *If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

Because anyone that's got to that level will tell you when the race
starts - it's every man for himself.

(of course this is different in stage racing but one day races you're
on your own)
On Dec 9, 5:55*am, Anton Berlin wrote:
Sorry Ryan but this subject line makes you look like a putz. *If a guy
holds support from a teammate and then drops out or gets 18th then
he's a selfish ****ing **** and deserves the worst.

But if a guy does these things believing he can win and then does it -
that makes him a god.

Because anyone that's got to that level will tell you when the race
starts - it's every man for himself.

(of course this is different in stage racing but one day races you're
on your own)

I said "worst teammate," not "worst racer." As you note, Grewal
achieved cycling greatness that day.

But he took an awful risk. He relied on being able to outsprint Bauer
heads-up, but he got away with it. As he notes, the good-teammate plan
would have meant delivering Kiefel and Phinney to the finish, with
extremely good odds for the USA.

The meta-problem at the Olympics and Worlds is that national "teams"
are largely a crock, featuring minimal functional loyalties (as
opposed to pro teams, where the personal and financial ties are
usually stronger). Even club teams are more of a real team.

That's why USA Cycling gets their ass kicked every year at worlds...they
continue to perpetuate the myth that "Team USA" works together. No, you
dumb **** Jim Miller, the Italians and Spaniards work together.

Magilla

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 10, 11:16*am, Anton Berlin wrote:
It's just a great story, really.

whatever way it evolves - it's a great story



Dumbass -

I finally read it.

It is very, very well written, perhaps the best first person narrative
of a race I've ever laid eyes on.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

Anton Berlin wrote:


**** Davis Phinney - if he didn't have the sense to bring enough food
and drink or try to gain advantage be wearing a skinsuit with only 1
pocket then he deserves the place he got.

I'll venture this - in a three up sprint with Phinney, Bauer and
Grewal - Grewal still could win because he would be smart enough to
take advantage of those 2 marking each other and would enter the end
zone untouched.

From reading his blogs and news stories it's clear Alexi (as a human)
is going through a stage where he's trying to rationalize his life,
justify or pardon his past and have it all make sense.

That day in 1984 he inspired 10s of thousands to ride and put in the
miles (me included) and that vision kept me riding many times for many
years.

If you or even he wants to **** on that candy now - well OK that's
everyone's right - but it doesn't change the fact that for years his
ride inspired every loner, every misfit and every one that wanted to
do something for themselves and prove to the world and lastly the
internal doubts we all have that they have value and can do something
incredible.

I don't know him, never raced against him but Alexi Grewal is the
greatest "teammate" ever because at 23 he got it right.

The race is with ourselves. The things we do only mark our souls. And
no one really keeps our score but ourselves.

And independent ****ers like Henry Chang, Magilla, Alexi and maybe
Anton make this world 100x better than a million ass grabbing glad
handing yes-men team players.

I am in the business world and I can tell you for a fact that the
"teammates" and "team players" are the most detestable untrustworthy
****s out there.

So in the end - maybe your subject line isn't so bad - calling someone
like Alexi "the worst teammate ever" is about the best damn compliment
one can make.

Yeah, I guess Grewal isn't that bad after all. I especially like the fact that he lied to Phinney, and that Phinney lost the race.

"Greg...look what Zanoli did to me...Greg...GREG!!"

As for all teammates being ****s....that's exactly what teammates are. Ask Lance what he thinks of his former teammate Fraud. Ask Chuck
****ing Coyle too, if you believe that chump's story.

Ask Danny Pate what he thinks of Tom Danielson banging his wife.


Magilla

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On 10/12/2010 20:15, MagillaGorilla wrote:
I can't tell you have many
****hole riders I know whose way of fixing a flat is to call their
girlfriend to pick them up.

There's another way...????

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 8, 3:58*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:
snip
...and much more, very entertaining stuff
snip

Agree... this Alexi stuff is entertaining and awesome. Particularly so
for me and the generation of riders who were around when he started.
Indulge me a few brief Alexi stories with a common theme...

1. Berkeley Hills RR, late 1970's, junior race to earn points (10
deep) to go to world championship trials: Two riders off the front,
Alexi and his teammate working their asses off to pull them back, most
all the rest of us sitting on waiting to sprint for 3rd. The two stay
away. I got 2nd in the sprint, and thus 4th in the race. Alexi and his
teammate didn't place. My friends and I walk by Alexi afterward, and
he's livid and spitting and cussing at us, "You fukkin wheelsuckers,
you race like losers, blah, blah, blah..."

2. Team Time Trial at junior worlds team trials in Colorado Springs
that same year: Groups of four were chosen to ride together based on
the staff's assessment of similar abilities. I don't remember the
following due to oxygen deprivation most likely, but one of my
teammates that day (Sterling McBride) recalls it clearly. In the
latter half of the race, the four of us were plugging away into the
wind when out of nowhere, Alexi comes blowing by us ALL BY HIMSELF!!!
He had dropped his teammates in a TTT because he could go faster
alone! Who knows, maybe he attacked them?!?!

3. The following year at some OTC camp: Alexi pees on a guy's bike who
he doesn't respect ...but then gets the **** beaten out of him by said
bike's owner.

My point is, from an early age, he showed the fire and scrappiness
that would define his entire bike racing career. In my experience, 95+
% of the riders that take the line at any level don't have the passion
to win. I know I didn't, and still don't. Clearly there are good
genetics in the family (e.g., Rishi too) but I think Alexi did as well
as he did because of his rare ability to tap into and fuel off of raw
emotion.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

Agree... this Alexi stuff is entertaining and awesome. Particularly so
for me and the generation of riders who were around when he started.
Indulge me a few brief Alexi stories with a common theme...

1. Berkeley Hills RR, late 1970's, junior race to earn points (10
deep) to go to world championship trials: Two riders off the front,
Alexi and his teammate working their asses off to pull them back, most
all the rest of us sitting on waiting to sprint for 3rd. The two stay
away. I got 2nd in the sprint, and thus 4th in the race. Alexi and his
teammate didn't place. My friends and I walk by Alexi afterward, and
he's livid and spitting and cussing at us, "You fukkin wheelsuckers,
you race like losers, blah, blah, blah..."

2. Team Time Trial at junior worlds team trials in Colorado Springs
that same year: Groups of four were chosen to ride together based on
the staff's assessment of similar abilities. I don't remember the
following due to oxygen deprivation most likely, but one of my
teammates that day (Sterling McBride) recalls it clearly. In the
latter half of the race, the four of us were plugging away into the
wind when out of nowhere, Alexi comes blowing by us ALL BY HIMSELF!!!
He had dropped his teammates in a TTT because he could go faster
alone! Who knows, maybe he attacked them?!?!

3. The following year at some OTC camp: Alexi pees on a guy's bike who
he doesn't respect ...but then gets the **** beaten out of him by said
bike's owner.

My point is, from an early age, he showed the fire and scrappiness
that would define his entire bike racing career. In my experience, 95+
% of the riders that take the line at any level don't have the passion
to win. I know I didn't, and still don't. Clearly there are good
genetics in the family (e.g., Rishi too) but I think Alexi did as well
as he did because of his rare ability to tap into and fuel off of raw
emotion.

Great stories -This is why people love Alexi Grewal - he's got the
**** that cowards and team players dream they had.

Alexi probably doesn't even remember these things - just another day
at the office for him.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 10, 4:06*pm, Anton Berlin wrote:
Agree... this Alexi stuff is entertaining and awesome. Particularly so
for me and the generation of riders who were around when he started.
Indulge me a few brief Alexi stories with a common theme...

1. Berkeley Hills RR, late 1970's, junior race to earn points (10
deep) to go to world championship trials: Two riders off the front,
Alexi and his teammate working their asses off to pull them back, most
all the rest of us sitting on waiting to sprint for 3rd. The two stay
away. I got 2nd in the sprint, and thus 4th in the race. Alexi and his
teammate didn't place. My friends and I walk by Alexi afterward, and
he's livid and spitting and cussing at us, "You fukkin wheelsuckers,
you race like losers, blah, blah, blah..."

2. Team Time Trial at junior worlds team trials in Colorado Springs
that same year: Groups of four were chosen to ride together based on
the staff's assessment of similar abilities. I don't remember the
following due to oxygen deprivation most likely, but one of my
teammates that day (Sterling McBride) recalls it clearly. In the
latter half of the race, the four of us were plugging away into the
wind when out of nowhere, Alexi comes blowing by us ALL BY HIMSELF!!!
He had dropped his teammates in a TTT because he could go faster
alone! Who knows, maybe he attacked them?!?!

3. The following year at some OTC camp: Alexi pees on a guy's bike who
he doesn't respect ...but then gets the **** beaten out of him by said
bike's owner.

My point is, from an early age, he showed the fire and scrappiness
that would define his entire bike racing career. In my experience, 95+
% of the riders that take the line at any level don't have the passion
to win. I know I didn't, and still don't. Clearly there are good
genetics in the family (e.g., Rishi too) but I think Alexi did as well
as he did because of his rare ability to tap into and fuel off of raw
emotion.

Great stories -This is why people love Alexi Grewal - he's got the
**** that cowards and team players dream they had.

Alexi probably doesn't even remember these things - just another day
at the office for him.

I'm not an Alexi fan so maybe someone else should tell the story of
how Alexi lost the GC for the Tour of Texas at the Zilker Park crit.
--D-y

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 10, 4:47*pm, Marco wrote:


My point is, from an early age, he showed the fire and scrappiness
that would define his entire bike racing career. In my experience, 95+
% of the riders that take the line at any level don't have the passion
to win. I know I didn't, and still don't. Clearly there are good
genetics in the family (e.g., Rishi too) but I think Alexi did as well
as he did because of his rare ability to tap into and fuel off of raw
emotion.

dumbass,

some riders can be very good but they can't be a good pro because they
are injury prone or they get sick too often, a disability if you will.
in grewal's case it was his emotions.

he sabotaged what could've been a long pro career. a guy like andreu
did not have the same ability but he was a solid pro for over a decade
not to mention some of the others that he beat at the olympics.

these emotional type guys (decanio is another) are actually
narcissists. guys that succeed long term are always more level
headed.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 11, 10:51*am, Amit Ghosh wrote:
On Dec 10, 4:47*pm, Marco wrote:

My point is, from an early age, he showed the fire and scrappiness
that would define his entire bike racing career. In my experience, 95+
% of the riders that take the line at any level don't have the passion
to win. I know I didn't, and still don't. Clearly there are good
genetics in the family (e.g., Rishi too) but I think Alexi did as well
as he did because of his rare ability to tap into and fuel off of raw
emotion.

dumbass,

some riders can be very good but they can't be a good pro because they
are injury prone or they get sick too often, a disability if you will.
in grewal's case it was his emotions.

he sabotaged what could've been a long pro career. a guy like andreu
did not have the same ability but he was a solid pro for over a decade
not to mention some of the others that he beat at the olympics.

these emotional type guys (decanio is another) are actually
narcissists. guys that succeed long term are always more level
headed.

+1

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 11, 11:33*am, Plano Dude wrote:
On Dec 11, 10:51*am, Amit Ghosh wrote:



On Dec 10, 4:47*pm, Marco wrote:

My point is, from an early age, he showed the fire and scrappiness
that would define his entire bike racing career. In my experience, 95+
% of the riders that take the line at any level don't have the passion
to win. I know I didn't, and still don't. Clearly there are good
genetics in the family (e.g., Rishi too) but I think Alexi did as well
as he did because of his rare ability to tap into and fuel off of raw
emotion.

dumbass,

some riders can be very good but they can't be a good pro because they
are injury prone or they get sick too often, a disability if you will.
in grewal's case it was his emotions.

he sabotaged what could've been a long pro career. a guy like andreu
did not have the same ability but he was a solid pro for over a decade
not to mention some of the others that he beat at the olympics.

these emotional type guys (decanio is another) are actually
narcissists. guys that succeed long term are always more level
headed.

+1

Some serious cumguzzlers on this thread. All they're missing is a
silicone wristband.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

In article
,
Marco wrote:

On Dec 8, 3:58Â*pm, Ryan Cousineau wrote:
snip
...and much more, very entertaining stuff
snip

Agree... this Alexi stuff is entertaining and awesome. Particularly so
for me and the generation of riders who were around when he started.
Indulge me a few brief Alexi stories with a common theme...

1. Berkeley Hills RR, late 1970's, junior race to earn points (10
deep) to go to world championship trials: Two riders off the front,
Alexi and his teammate working their asses off to pull them back, most
all the rest of us sitting on waiting to sprint for 3rd. The two stay
away. I got 2nd in the sprint, and thus 4th in the race. Alexi and his
teammate didn't place. My friends and I walk by Alexi afterward, and
he's livid and spitting and cussing at us, "You fukkin wheelsuckers,
you race like losers, blah, blah, blah..."

2. Team Time Trial at junior worlds team trials in Colorado Springs
that same year: Groups of four were chosen to ride together based on
the staff's assessment of similar abilities. I don't remember the
following due to oxygen deprivation most likely, but one of my
teammates that day (Sterling McBride) recalls it clearly. In the
latter half of the race, the four of us were plugging away into the
wind when out of nowhere, Alexi comes blowing by us ALL BY HIMSELF!!!
He had dropped his teammates in a TTT because he could go faster
alone! Who knows, maybe he attacked them?!?!

3. The following year at some OTC camp: Alexi pees on a guy's bike who
he doesn't respect ...but then gets the **** beaten out of him by said
bike's owner.

My point is, from an early age, he showed the fire and scrappiness
that would define his entire bike racing career. In my experience, 95+
% of the riders that take the line at any level don't have the passion
to win. I know I didn't, and still don't. Clearly there are good
genetics in the family (e.g., Rishi too) but I think Alexi did as well
as he did because of his rare ability to tap into and fuel off of raw
emotion.

Sound as if he learned something from event 1.

--
Michael Press

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

Some serious cumguzzlers on this thread. All they're missing is a
silicone wristband.

Everyone recognizes that Plano Douche has had more testicles lodged in
his throat than Liz Hatch fantasizes about and masturbates to.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

On Dec 11, 8:51*am, Amit Ghosh wrote:
On Dec 10, 4:47*pm, Marco wrote:

My point is, from an early age, he showed the fire and scrappiness
that would define his entire bike racing career. In my experience, 95+
% of the riders that take the line at any level don't have the passion
to win. I know I didn't, and still don't. Clearly there are good
genetics in the family (e.g., Rishi too) but I think Alexi did as well
as he did because of his rare ability to tap into and fuel off of raw
emotion.

dumbass,

some riders can be very good but they can't be a good pro because they
are injury prone or they get sick too often, a disability if you will.
in grewal's case it was his emotions.

he sabotaged what could've been a long pro career. a guy like andreu
did not have the same ability but he was a solid pro for over a decade
not to mention some of the others that he beat at the olympics.

these emotional type guys (decanio is another) are actually
narcissists. guys that succeed long term are always more level
headed.



Dumbass -

The biggest problem was no one wanted him on their team. I guess you
could call it "emotional", but it's a bit more than that. Some people
are emotional and manifest it outwardly in a positive way.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

Alexi Grewal: worst teammate ever
 

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni. wrote:
could call it "emotional", but it's a bit more than that. Some people
are emotional and manifest it outwardly in a positive way.

Definitely agreed. Lots of emotional people who make it big in sports,
cycling included. Think of hothead sprinters or nervous climbers.