I am convinced bicycling is not safe
 

On Nov 19, 12:37*pm, Peter Clinch wrote:

See, things are not as simple as "roads are good, bike paths/lanes are
bad"...

"Where I live now in Tigard, OR scored a 69, so it is an effort to
walk as most stores are about 1.5 miles away, but it is a pleasure to
bike as there are good paths and bike lanes. For example there's an
Albertsons 2.08 miles away at the end of a multiuse path that crosses
no streets, ends in their parking lot and with only 0.28miles of
narrow two lane between by apt and the start of the path. In contrast,
where I grew up in New Brunswick, NJ scored in the 80's as more stores
are nearby, but has no bike lanes and lots more traffic.
The walkable site is a good start but needs to account for road/
sidewalk conditions and traffic volume."

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...=487455&page=2

A March on Washington... on Bicycle?
 

What does the word "banana" tell you?

"BANANA? Yes, it appeals to the monkey within us, yearning for the
simple life in the jungle. Well, perhaps it's a symbol of a better
world to come in frugality and peace."

As I was watching '2001: A Space Odyssey,' it perfectly made sense
that the monkeys were first vegetarian (banana eaters) before
acquiring the "knowledge" of killing and eating meat. So a Banana
Revolution would appeal to that world in the treetops, rather than the
technological advanced world depicted later in the movie.

Then I sat down and wrote the deep thought above. What's our future,
KILLING MONKEYS OR BANANA-PEACE-LOVING MONKEYS?

'Over images of an African desert, a caption reads "The Dawn of Man".
A tribe of herbivore apes is foraging for food. One of them is
attacked and killed by a leopard. They are driven from their water
hole by another tribe. Defeated, they sleep overnight in a small
exposed rock crater. Waking at sunrise, they find that a mysterious
black, rectangular monolith has appeared in front of their shelter.
They approach the monolith shrieking and jumping. Subsequently, one of
the apes (Daniel Richter) realizes how to use a bone as both tool and
a weapon while having mental flashbacks to the monolith, indicating
that the monolith has 'taught' him this knowledge. The apes are now
able to kill animals and eat meat. Next morning they wrest control of
the water hole away from the other tribe, killing their leader in the
process. Exultant in victory, the ape leader throws his bone into the
air which switches via match cut to a shot of an orbital satellite
millions of years in the future, circa 2000. This satellite and three
more immediately following it are generally identified as orbiting
nuclear weapons.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001:_A...sey_%28film%29


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Banana Revolution
(for vegetarian monkeys)

http://webspawner.com/users/bananarevolution

I am convinced bicycling is not safe
 

KingOfTheApes wrote:

Not on major streets. It depends whether you are talking about a
bikeable place or just a "hole"...

(and there's a lot of people living in it, see poll)

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=487455

For some values of "a lot". That's a statistically meaningless sample.

Now the question is how many decades we will take to make drivers, who
are used to the law of the jungle, more civilized?

It takes time, but it can (and does) happen. For example, not too
long ago in the UK "one for the road" was perfectly acceptable
amongst the general population. Nowadays drink driving is a pretty
major no-no for the general public.

Though I suspect the most important driver of changing attitudes
will be the price if fuel going up, as that puts more peple on bikes.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

You expect Obama to change America, or just waiting for Jesus?
 

On Nov 18, 8:53 pm, wrote:
Doug wrote:
I was surprised that my old neighborhood in New Orleans was a
“walker’s paradise” at 100%,

Interesting. I put the address of the house I grew up in--just off
the cemetery end of Canal St and got an 82%

Cemeteries are safer to walk than most places in America. Main risk of
walking in America is crime.

But people who got enough money to live in gated communities can so
pretty freely.

I am convinced bicycling is not safe
 

On Nov 20, 8:09*am, Peter Clinch wrote:
KingOfTheApes wrote:
Not on major streets. It depends whether you are talking about a
bikeable place or just a "hole"...

(and there's a lot of people living in it, see poll)

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=487455

For some values of "a lot". *That's a statistically meaningless sample.

Now the question is how many decades we will take to make drivers, who
are used to the law of the jungle, more civilized?

It takes time, but it can (and does) happen. *For example, not too
long ago in the UK "one for the road" was perfectly acceptable
amongst the general population. *Nowadays drink driving is a pretty
major no-no for the general public.

Though I suspect the most important driver of changing attitudes
will be the price if fuel going up, as that puts more peple on bikes.

OK, OK, but here is NOT EVEN AN ISSUE, nor will I expect it to be.
Before you can even fix the problem, you must accept you have a
jungle, right?

Just browse...

http://www.lulu.com/content/186268

One question, one characteristic that hints at a jungle is GATED
COMMUNITIES, where the Rich and Powerful isolate themselves in
relative safety, and then let the world fall prey to the Law of the
Jungle.

Is the UK like that? How often you find them in Europe for that
matter?

I am convinced bicycling is not safe
 

KingOfTheApes wrote:

One question, one characteristic that hints at a jungle is GATED
COMMUNITIES, where the Rich and Powerful isolate themselves in
relative safety, and then let the world fall prey to the Law of the
Jungle.

Is the UK like that? How often you find them in Europe for that
matter?

There's one just around the corner from me. Since we're in a very
un-troubled neighbourhood the consensus around where I live is it's a
complete waste of time for those who've bought houses in there.

So they're not isolating themselves in relative safety, they're just
isolating themselves. Their problem, not mine, rather than the other
way about.

You seem obsessed that you're living in a jungle. While I'm sure there
are parts of our respective nations that conform to the description I've
not seen much that suggests it's the rule rather than the exception.
Certainly not the case that it's a fair generalisation, yet that's what
you will persist in doing.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

I am convinced bicycling is not safe
 

On Nov 20, 11:41*am, Peter Clinch wrote:
KingOfTheApes wrote:
One question, one characteristic that hints at a jungle is GATED
COMMUNITIES, where the Rich and Powerful isolate themselves in
relative safety, and then let the world fall prey to the Law of the
Jungle.

Is the UK like that? How often you find them in Europe for that
matter?

There's one just around the corner from me. *Since we're in a very
un-troubled neighbourhood the consensus around where I live is it's a
complete waste of time for those who've bought houses in there.

So they're not isolating themselves in relative safety, they're just
isolating themselves. *Their problem, not mine, rather than the other
way about.

You seem obsessed that you're living in a jungle. *While I'm sure there
are parts of our respective nations that conform to the description I've
not seen much that suggests it's the rule rather than the exception.
Certainly not the case that it's a fair generalisation, yet that's what
you will persist in doing.


Are you watching too many American shows? That may account for an
excess in SUVs and gated communities.

They are here everywhere, so they must mean something. Actually, I
think they mean the same as in Mexico or Costa Rica...

"about the EU and gated communities. I have not seen one. You can find
certain suburban towns where poverty is higher than the norm..
Certainly precautions such as bullet proof glass, I have yet to
find... What I notice.. No trailer parks.. Trailer parks are often sub
income and in a state of squalor.. It's rare to find such an invention
thourghout the EU.. Why. For the most part, you go to the biggest
towns we have extensively walked about town centers and not felt
unsafe. Places such as Barcelona, you might find your pockets picked,
but you are safe. So why a need for gated communities."

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=488100

I am convinced bicycling is not safe
 

"KingOfTheApes" wrote in message
...
[...]
Are you watching too many American shows? That may account for an
excess in SUVs and gated communities.

They are here everywhere, so they must mean something. Actually, I
think they mean the same as in Mexico or Costa Rica...

Yes, I think it does mean the same thing. As civilization breaks down, those
with the wherewithal seek safety above all else. They will not only move to
gated communities, but they will fortify their homes with walls in the end.
Go to any third world country and you will see what I mean.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

I am convinced bicycling is not safe
 

In rec.bicycles.misc Peter Clinch wrote:
KingOfTheApes wrote:

Now the question is how many decades we will take to make drivers, who
are used to the law of the jungle, more civilized?

It takes time, but it can (and does) happen. For example, not too
long ago in the UK "one for the road" was perfectly acceptable
amongst the general population. Nowadays drink driving is a pretty
major no-no for the general public.

Though I suspect the most important driver of changing attitudes
will be the price if fuel going up, as that puts more peple on bikes.

That's what I've observed for myself. That the thing that really
motivates most poeple is when the cost to their pocketbook rises. This
is especially true if it's a rapid rise. Inconveinence in the form of
traffic jams, poor parking and other things help also. But cost seems
to be a big driver (no pun intended) of people's change in behaviour.

--
Dane Buson -
"Never draw fire; it irritates the people around you."

I am convinced bicycling is not safe
 

On Nov 20, 2:24*pm, Dane Buson wrote:
In rec.bicycles.misc Peter Clinch wrote:

KingOfTheApes wrote:

Now the question is how many decades we will take to make drivers, who
are used to the law of the jungle, more civilized?

It takes time, but it can (and does) happen. *For example, not too
long ago in the UK "one for the road" was perfectly acceptable
amongst the general population. *Nowadays drink driving is a pretty
major no-no for the general public.

Though I suspect the most important driver of changing attitudes
will be the price if fuel going up, as that puts more peple on bikes.

That's what I've observed for myself. *That the thing that really
motivates most poeple is when the cost to their pocketbook rises. *This
is especially true if it's a rapid rise. *Inconveinence in the form of
traffic jams, poor parking and other things help also. *But cost seems
to be a big driver (no pun intended) of people's change in behaviour.


Yeah, that's why I get so depressed... the price of oil is going
down. :(

But then I remember that we are in the middle of a huge economic
crisis and that the Big Three are trying to survive after producing so
many fat SUVs, and finally I get happy. ;)