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Old March 19th 17, 12:52 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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On 3/18/2017 3:51 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, March 18, 2017 at 3:12:02 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/18/2017 2:29 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Wed, 15 Mar 2017 14:08:44 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

Thing is, nobody's demonstrated any need for so much stationary "be
seen" light, beyond the usual "well, it _could_ happen" safety inflation
mentality.

True, but you're thinking like engineering, not marketing.


I do have too strong of a tendency to do that.

See http://dilbert.com/strip/2014-12-18

That has a place of honor on our refrigerator door.

--
- Frank Krygowski


Many many years ago I read an article and also books on bicycling that stated thatthe two most dangerous p;aces to ride a bicycle was #1 a parking lot and #2 an intersection.


That may be true. Parking lots are chaotic, but that has little to do
with standlights. Intersections are more dangerous than
non-intersection stretches of road, but the danger doesn't come from
being stationary. For legal cyclists, the sources of crashes are 1)
Right hooks 2) Left crosses, and 3) Pull-outs. In all those cases, the
cyclists are moving. Illegal cyclists can add other intersection
hazards, but again, those occur while the cyclist is moving.

You might try describing the specific traffic situation where a motorist
would be likely to hit a stationary cyclist because he has no headlight.

So, you guys are saying that having a bright standlight right where a lot of bicycling accidents happen (at an intersection) is a bad thing?


Nobody is saying it's a bad thing to have a standlight. However, I'm
saying it's not a critical thing. And it's certainly not true (as Joerg
implied) that there's a big risk in having a standlight that's dimmer
than a headlight, or one whose duration is only a couple minutes.

In Ohio, the law specifically states that dynamo lights that go out when
stationary are legal. I was not involved with getting that law passed,
but IIRC the Ohio Bicycle Federation was. They did so in part because
they judged there was no significant hazard.

I don't know about you but I like to know that a driver coming towards me at night whilst I'm stopped at an intersection can at least see my bicycle light.


Your personal preference is fine. But if the risk of crash due to lack
of standlight was really great, that source of crashes would have been
listed in the studies that examined car-bike crash sources. Those
studies have no such entries.

YMMV Why not paint your bike flat black and wear flat black clothing or camouflage clothing if being visible to other road users is of so little consequence even when you're stopped and they are moving?


sigh First, the color of a bike is completely negligible.

Second, I reject the idea that a cyclist is at fault if he chooses to
wear ordinary clothing, no matter its color.

IIRC, all but two U.S. states require no taillight, and allow mere rear
reflectors. I think if the resulting danger were great, there wouldn't
be 48 states disagreeing.

I do advocate taillights, but I think anything except the tiniest
coin-cell taillights are adequate. And back when I did night lighting
workshops with my bike club (where we observed lights on bikes to test
them) everyone else agreed.

And BTW, I think reflectors on pedals or cranks are extremely
conspicuous. I'd be more in favor of mandating them than mandating
taillights.

--
- Frank Krygowski
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