#131
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Belt drive
On Tuesday, April 30, 2019 at 9:44:30 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/30/2019 8:28 PM, John B. wrote: rOn Tue, 30 Apr 2019 16:14:17 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-30 15:59, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Tuesday, April 30, 2019 at 6:48:51 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 4/30/2019 3:16 PM, Joerg wrote: Maybe your riding style or terrain. I tend to always go full bore, whatever the leg muscles can deliver. That ain't wrong, that's my mode of operation because I don't like to go slow. You've been all over the map with your speed claims, Joerg. When it suits your arguments at the time, you say you ride fast. When it suits your other arguments, you've said you ride slow. That's because you don't pay attention. -- - Frank Krygowski IF it were true then Joerg's going full bore over any terrain at all times would be a great part of why he has so much trouble with his stuff breaking. I don't bomb downhill on the MTB anymore. Too old for that and seen too many cases of the aftermath when it went wrong. I do often get to 20mph on regular MTB trail sections and since we have rocks embedded in the ground that's hard on the bike. Hence a FS MTB and a home-built rack system because the commercial stuff ain't good. However, we were talking about road bike tires here and there I always go full close tilt unless I am distracted. For example by aerobatics up in the sky on Friday. That was worth seeing. Full means a speed that I can hold for an hour or two, not a speed where my tongue hangs on the handlebar after 10mins. IOW the speed tat gives me the best time from A to Z, not just from A to B. Hmmm... I've always thought "full speed" was the speed you reached when that big, bad, dog, came rushing out of the drive with dinner on his mind. My experiences have been that one can reach some astonishingly high speeds in that event :-) From the bicycling movie American Flyers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8uP-dxllKQ -- - Frank Krygowski I always wondered how Eddie (the dog) got the shoe out of the pedal if the toe-clips were snug. Cheers |
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#132
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Belt drive
On 2019-04-30 17:28, John B. wrote:
rOn Tue, 30 Apr 2019 16:14:17 -0700, Joerg [...] I don't bomb downhill on the MTB anymore. Too old for that and seen too many cases of the aftermath when it went wrong. I do often get to 20mph on regular MTB trail sections and since we have rocks embedded in the ground that's hard on the bike. Hence a FS MTB and a home-built rack system because the commercial stuff ain't good. However, we were talking about road bike tires here and there I always go full close tilt unless I am distracted. For example by aerobatics up in the sky on Friday. That was worth seeing. Full means a speed that I can hold for an hour or two, not a speed where my tongue hangs on the handlebar after 10mins. IOW the speed tat gives me the best time from A to Z, not just from A to B. Hmmm... I've always thought "full speed" was the speed you reached when that big, bad, dog, came rushing out of the drive with dinner on his mind. My experiences have been that one can reach some astonishingly high speeds in that event :-) Depends on how you are with dogs. The last (really big) one which looked similar to an Anatolian Shepherd eventually stopped growling at me, sniffed my hand and then licked it. My MTB buddy had an event of the other kind. Instead of a dog a redneck came running out of a shed, all angry, hollering obscenities, rifle in hand. That warranted a very speedy departure. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#133
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Belt drive
On 2019-04-30 16:23, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 30 Apr 2019 15:51:45 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-30 15:30, John B. wrote: On Tue, 30 Apr 2019 12:13:14 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-29 21:49, John B. wrote: On Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:35:23 -0700, Joerg wrote: [...] Besides, it ain't cheap: 1. SUV, four tires, $70 each so $280 total, 1st set lasted 70000mi and still had half the tread. I only replaced them because they were around 15 years old. 70,000 miles at $280? that is what? Less than one cent a mile? and you can't afford it? Where did I say that? Just above. You wrote "1. SUV, four tires, $70 each so $280 total, 1st set lasted 70000mi and still had half the tread. I only replaced them because they were around 15 years old." $280 X 100 = 28,000 cents divided by 70000 = 0.04 cents a mile I never said that I can't afford it. Do not state words that other people did not say. You are correct. You didn't say that you couldn't afford it. But by the way that you so lovingly described the deal it certainly sounded as though the $280 made a big impression on you. Yes, I found that astonishingly cheap for the service life you get out of them when compared to bicycle tires. Yet this was not a sale price but the regular sticker price while with bicycle tires I always wait for a deal and then buy several. 2. Gatorskin, $45, lasted 2500mi at which point the tread surface was at bare minimum. What sort of a job do you have that you can't afford $45/2500 = 1.8 cents a mile for tires? 3. Vittoria Zafiro, $13, 2000mi. Want more? I trust you can do the math. Sure I can do the math and in my money 45 dollars is 1,440 baht. Which is literally pocket change. It won't even cover a trip to the grocery store. And you are whining about that? Our parents and grandparents instilled a good philisophy in us. "He who does not value the penny is not worth the dollar". I know scores of people who say similar things. "What? You mind the measly five bucks of a morning coffee and pastry at the drive-thru?". Well, I do. Needless to say the folks who lived that way must keep on working until they are well north of 65 and some literally until they keel over. I don't. The problem is that in your grandparents day a penny was money. Today, if you still have 1 cent coins it isn't even pocket change. If you drop one most people couldn't be bothered to bend over and pick it up. Those are typically those who run into money troubles. Pretty much everyone whom I ever heard saying things like "Oh, that's just chump change" did. Well, I didn't but not because I scrimped on the pennies but because I put half my earnings in the bank or later invested them, from the time I first went to work. I also never, with the exception of the first house I bought in the U.S., borrowed money. Same here but I always honored the penny. My father did that. When he bought a new car he would open a separate bank account and put the odd $5 or $10 dollars into the account when he had a bit extra. Eventually the account would get big enough and he'd buy a new car. I wish most "modern" parents were that way as well. Besides, being conscious about small costs has honed my design skills in electronics. When I design there is a cost calculator constantly running in my brain. Based on what I understand is California minimum salary rates a penny is a tiny fraction of one minute's salary. 10 x 100=1,000 cents/hour divided by 60 minutes = 16.6 cents/minute = 3.614 seconds per cent. If it takes you more than 3.6 seconds to bend over and pick up the penny than you are losing money :-) No, no, look at the positive side. I am getting free core muscle training :-) Or straining your back picking up the penny :-) My lower back isn't that great but MTB riding actually helps it by building up core muscle. Something none of the doctors ever told me. Most likely they didn't even know such stuff. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#135
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Belt drive
On 5/1/2019 9:46 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-04-30 17:28, John B. wrote: rOn Tue, 30 Apr 2019 16:14:17 -0700, Joerg [...] I don't bomb downhill on the MTB anymore. Too old for that and seen too many cases of the aftermath when it went wrong. I do often get to 20mph on regular MTB trail sections and since we have rocks embedded in the ground that's hard on the bike. Hence a FS MTB and a home-built rack system because the commercial stuff ain't good. However, we were talking about road bike tires here and there I always go full close tilt unless I am distracted. For example by aerobatics up in the sky on Friday. That was worth seeing. Full means a speed that I can hold for an hour or two, not a speed where my tongue hangs on the handlebar after 10mins. IOW the speed tat gives me the best time from A to Z, not just from A to B. Hmmm... I've always thought "full speed" was the speed you reached when that big, bad, dog, came rushing out of the drive with dinner on his mind. My experiences have been that one can reach some astonishingly high speeds in that event :-) Depends on how you are with dogs. The last (really big) one which looked similar to an Anatolian Shepherd eventually stopped growling at me, sniffed my hand and then licked it. My MTB buddy had an event of the other kind. Instead of a dog a redneck came running out of a shed, all angry, hollering obscenities, rifle in hand. That warranted a very speedy departure. really? Those are actual crimes (assault, brandishing). Was a police report filed? What came of it? -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#136
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Belt drive
On Tuesday, April 30, 2019 at 3:54:31 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-04-30 15:14, wrote: On Monday, April 29, 2019 at 4:35:24 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-29 16:02, John B. wrote: On Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:16:27 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-28 15:07, John B. wrote: [...] I've been told that the cheap tires in Thailand all made from a rubber mix that contains a lot of carbon black, which makes them harder and they wear less and thus are very well regarded by those who can't afford to buy tires frequently. Unfortunately hard tires also "grip the road" less well and have minimal traction. I do not need Tour de France level cornering performance and found them to be quite adequate for riding. Especially the MTB tires because there durability and sturdiness counts a lot more than sqeezing the last tenth of an mph out of a ride. On both the road bike and the MTB I want beefy sidewalls and so far tires made in Thailand gave me that, plus a decent number of miles in terms of wear. I really don't understand this fetish with how many miles a bicycle tire lasts. After all, compared to something like auto tires or egg beaters they are pretty cheap. How would you like it if you had to switch out the tires on your car every 2500mi? Besides, it ain't cheap: 1. SUV, four tires, $70 each so $280 total, 1st set lasted 70000mi and still had half the tread. I only replaced them because they were around 15 years old. 2. Gatorskin, $45, lasted 2500mi at which point the tread surface was at bare minimum. 3. Vittoria Zafiro, $13, 2000mi. Want more? I trust you can do the math. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ I don't remember those Zafiro's as having any armor layer. They don't and I also ran them almost to the bone. Thanks to thorn-resistant thick tubes plus a tire liners an armor layer is no longer required on any of my bikes and I can squeeze out the last mile. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ I did a nonstop 50 miles yesterday and almost 5,000 feet of climbing. The roads used to be bad but now they are failing or on the very verge. Riding down from Proctor to the golf course there are potholes everywhere. I had two SOB's in the group that rode by of either side of me so that I could not turn away from the potholes. It this is what the group has become, I will cease riding with the group. They also decided to have coffee at the Clairmont Hotel. Riding DOWN Ashby Ave. to the Clairmont is fine. But coming back up is really dangerous. Ashby turns into Freeway 13 and where you have to turn left the cars are trying to speed up to Freeway speeds. That they would plan a ride like that is not surprising since there seems to be a lack of thinking in that group all around. So I continued up Tunnel road as they all went down Ashby. I had some Propel in my water bottle and that was my complete sustenance. It was far colder than I was dressed for. The glove on my left hand pinched off circulation until I had to remove the glove. Then it was so cold that the hand wouldn't recover. Got home and was pulling across the lawn and the tire caught in a groove between the lawn and the pavement and I went down at nearly a dead stop. That REALLY ****ed me off. But since I did the ride on the Basso, I shouldn't have any trouble completing the Grizzly Peak Century Sunday since it has three rest stops along the way and two of them are really good. Hopefully the roads won't be as bad on that course as yesterday. They will have 76 miles and 6,000 ft of climbing. And since I have some home improvements going in today and have been getting junl out of the way I tripped across a good set of Bolle glasses that I can use. Thank the lord and pass the ammunition. The set I've been using is now scratched to the point that I can barely read the Speedo. I've tried the cheap Chinese sunglasses and while the lenses are OK they are half the size needed. Or they pull against your eyebrows so that sweat drips across them and blocks your vision. And Oakley's are WAY too expensive. A set of Oakley prescription - $700 here in California. |
#137
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Belt drive
On Wed, 01 May 2019 07:55:26 -0700, Joerg
wrote: On 2019-04-30 16:35, John B. wrote: On Tue, 30 Apr 2019 15:54:35 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-30 15:14, wrote: On Monday, April 29, 2019 at 4:35:24 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-29 16:02, John B. wrote: On Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:16:27 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-28 15:07, John B. wrote: [...] I've been told that the cheap tires in Thailand all made from a rubber mix that contains a lot of carbon black, which makes them harder and they wear less and thus are very well regarded by those who can't afford to buy tires frequently. Unfortunately hard tires also "grip the road" less well and have minimal traction. I do not need Tour de France level cornering performance and found them to be quite adequate for riding. Especially the MTB tires because there durability and sturdiness counts a lot more than sqeezing the last tenth of an mph out of a ride. On both the road bike and the MTB I want beefy sidewalls and so far tires made in Thailand gave me that, plus a decent number of miles in terms of wear. I really don't understand this fetish with how many miles a bicycle tire lasts. After all, compared to something like auto tires or egg beaters they are pretty cheap. How would you like it if you had to switch out the tires on your car every 2500mi? Besides, it ain't cheap: 1. SUV, four tires, $70 each so $280 total, 1st set lasted 70000mi and still had half the tread. I only replaced them because they were around 15 years old. 2. Gatorskin, $45, lasted 2500mi at which point the tread surface was at bare minimum. 3. Vittoria Zafiro, $13, 2000mi. Want more? I trust you can do the math. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ I don't remember those Zafiro's as having any armor layer. They don't and I also ran them almost to the bone. Thanks to thorn-resistant thick tubes plus a tire liners an armor layer is no longer required on any of my bikes and I can squeeze out the last mile. If you are so intent on saving the last penny why not just throw the bicycle away and save all that money on tires. Walking is a far better exercise, hour for hour, or mile for mile, than bicycling. Or even jogging or running. A half marathon on Sundays is good exercise. P.S. You don't even need shoes. Zola Budd broke the world record in the women's 5000 meters running barefooted. I walk our dogs every day, about 2mi. So that's around 700mi/year and I used to wear out one pair of sports shoes per year. It didn't matter whether they were $70 name brand of $20 non-name so now I always by no-name. Good sandals are much better, last years, so I wear those most of the time. However, walking isn't an option if you have to go someplace 25-30mi away from here. I wouldn't even be back home for dinner. Bare foot is the think. Sort of a self replenishing thing, the more you walk the thicker the sole gets. And that isn't a folk story. When I worked in the remote areas of Indonesia where the people didn't have shoes I've seen some of our local hire laborers walk around on a steel barge deck, in the hot sun, with no apparent discomfort. But having said that let me tell you that nobody who actually walks for a living, so to speak, wears "sports shoes" they wear "Army Boots". -- cheers, John B. |
#138
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Belt drive
On Wed, 01 May 2019 07:46:35 -0700, Joerg
wrote: On 2019-04-30 17:28, John B. wrote: rOn Tue, 30 Apr 2019 16:14:17 -0700, Joerg [...] I don't bomb downhill on the MTB anymore. Too old for that and seen too many cases of the aftermath when it went wrong. I do often get to 20mph on regular MTB trail sections and since we have rocks embedded in the ground that's hard on the bike. Hence a FS MTB and a home-built rack system because the commercial stuff ain't good. However, we were talking about road bike tires here and there I always go full close tilt unless I am distracted. For example by aerobatics up in the sky on Friday. That was worth seeing. Full means a speed that I can hold for an hour or two, not a speed where my tongue hangs on the handlebar after 10mins. IOW the speed tat gives me the best time from A to Z, not just from A to B. Hmmm... I've always thought "full speed" was the speed you reached when that big, bad, dog, came rushing out of the drive with dinner on his mind. My experiences have been that one can reach some astonishingly high speeds in that event :-) Depends on how you are with dogs. The last (really big) one which looked similar to an Anatolian Shepherd eventually stopped growling at me, sniffed my hand and then licked it. My MTB buddy had an event of the other kind. Instead of a dog a redneck came running out of a shed, all angry, hollering obscenities, rifle in hand. That warranted a very speedy departure. Seriously? Or perhaps a better question was "what was your buddy doing to cause some farmer to come roaring out of a shed with a gun"? "hollering obscenities"? I used to go "prospecting" up in the mountains along the Yuba Rivers, not that far from you, and I never had anyone come roaring out of a shed after me. Of course I didn't go tromping through anyone's cash crop, leave gates open, or any of the other foolishness that others might do. And, if I did meet someone I used to stop, introduce myself, tell them what I was doing "in this God Forsaken place" and even chat a bit before I moved on. -- cheers, John B. |
#139
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Belt drive
On Wed, 01 May 2019 07:51:01 -0700, Joerg
wrote: On 2019-04-30 16:23, John B. wrote: On Tue, 30 Apr 2019 15:51:45 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-30 15:30, John B. wrote: On Tue, 30 Apr 2019 12:13:14 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2019-04-29 21:49, John B. wrote: On Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:35:23 -0700, Joerg wrote: [...] Besides, it ain't cheap: 1. SUV, four tires, $70 each so $280 total, 1st set lasted 70000mi and still had half the tread. I only replaced them because they were around 15 years old. 70,000 miles at $280? that is what? Less than one cent a mile? and you can't afford it? Where did I say that? Just above. You wrote "1. SUV, four tires, $70 each so $280 total, 1st set lasted 70000mi and still had half the tread. I only replaced them because they were around 15 years old." $280 X 100 = 28,000 cents divided by 70000 = 0.04 cents a mile I never said that I can't afford it. Do not state words that other people did not say. You are correct. You didn't say that you couldn't afford it. But by the way that you so lovingly described the deal it certainly sounded as though the $280 made a big impression on you. Yes, I found that astonishingly cheap for the service life you get out of them when compared to bicycle tires. Yet this was not a sale price but the regular sticker price while with bicycle tires I always wait for a deal and then buy several. 2. Gatorskin, $45, lasted 2500mi at which point the tread surface was at bare minimum. What sort of a job do you have that you can't afford $45/2500 = 1.8 cents a mile for tires? 3. Vittoria Zafiro, $13, 2000mi. Want more? I trust you can do the math. Sure I can do the math and in my money 45 dollars is 1,440 baht. Which is literally pocket change. It won't even cover a trip to the grocery store. And you are whining about that? Our parents and grandparents instilled a good philisophy in us. "He who does not value the penny is not worth the dollar". I know scores of people who say similar things. "What? You mind the measly five bucks of a morning coffee and pastry at the drive-thru?". Well, I do. Needless to say the folks who lived that way must keep on working until they are well north of 65 and some literally until they keel over. I don't. The problem is that in your grandparents day a penny was money. Today, if you still have 1 cent coins it isn't even pocket change. If you drop one most people couldn't be bothered to bend over and pick it up. Those are typically those who run into money troubles. Pretty much everyone whom I ever heard saying things like "Oh, that's just chump change" did. Well, I didn't but not because I scrimped on the pennies but because I put half my earnings in the bank or later invested them, from the time I first went to work. I also never, with the exception of the first house I bought in the U.S., borrowed money. Same here but I always honored the penny. My father did that. When he bought a new car he would open a separate bank account and put the odd $5 or $10 dollars into the account when he had a bit extra. Eventually the account would get big enough and he'd buy a new car. I wish most "modern" parents were that way as well. My Lord! That is almost Un-American. After all God gave the people a credit it is up to them to use it! snip No, no, look at the positive side. I am getting free core muscle training :-) Or straining your back picking up the penny :-) My lower back isn't that great but MTB riding actually helps it by building up core muscle. Something none of the doctors ever told me. Most likely they didn't even know such stuff. Just about anything that exercises a muscle strengthens it. I suspect that your doctor knew that. He probably also knew that suggesting that you did bending and stretching exercises every day was an example of futility on his part as almost everyone will ignore any suggestion to do anything that smacks of "work". -- cheers, John B. |
#140
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Belt drive
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/30/2019 4:53 PM, Joerg wrote: You won't believe how many people in our town still do it, blissfully unaware that $5/workday times two people is a cost of more than $200/month. Then they also go to lunch at $10 a pop and there goes another $400. Then they "need" $50/mo/person smart phone plans, a $100 cable TV subscription, $80 for the gym, new cars every 3-4 years and thus eternally revolving car payments, house mortgaged to the hilt, et cetera. Typically those are the people who can least afford it. Is it any wonder that the average American has net zero savings at retirement age? FWIW, I've done none of those things; and our retirement is very secure. And as I've said many times, I don't have a connoisseur mentality. But I won't ride $15 tires. There are limits. In fairness the Vittoria Zafiro folks seem to like, personally I never found a huge difference between the feel of budget but from a known brand tyres and more expensive ones, for road tyres ie 23/25mm. Though did notice the amazing lack of grip from Gatorskins! I do notice the difference with gravel and MTB tyres but road tyres I don’t or it’s so slight to not be worth it. I presume that with road tyres it’s the high pressures and the fact that compounds are fairly high, at least compared Gravel/MTB. Roger Merriman |
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