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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
From the article:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------- The American won the Tour de France three times, twice with shotgun pellets lodged in his heart after a shooting accident. But his triumphs felt hollow as he struggled with the secret of his abuse as a child The Big Interview: Greg LeMond ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Read it at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...cle2010066.ece J. Spaceman |
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#2
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article: ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- The American won the Tour de France three times, twice with shotgun pellets lodged in his heart after a shooting accident. But his triumphs felt hollow as he struggled with the secret of his abuse as a child The Big Interview: Greg LeMond ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Read it at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...cle2010066.ece Yes, I'm sure he didn't enjoy being the first American to win the Tour. At all. That totally explains the 'virtual victories'. ~bob s. |
#3
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
On Jul 2, 9:50 am, bob sullivan wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote: From the article: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------*-- The American won the Tour de France three times, twice with shotgun pellets lodged in his heart after a shooting accident. But his triumphs felt hollow as he struggled with the secret of his abuse as a child The Big Interview: Greg LeMond ---------------------------------------------------------------------------*- Read it at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...de_france/arti... Yes, I'm sure he didn't enjoy being the first American to win the Tour. At all. That totally explains the 'virtual victories'. Dumbass - I wonder if he has any idea at all of how narcissitic he is. thanks, K. Gringioni. |
#4
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
In article ,
bob sullivan wrote: Jason Spaceman wrote: From the article: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - The American won the Tour de France three times, twice with shotgun pellets lodged in his heart after a shooting accident. But his triumphs felt hollow as he struggled with the secret of his abuse as a child The Big Interview: Greg LeMond ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Read it at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...ce/article2010 066.ece Yes, I'm sure he didn't enjoy being the first American to win the Tour. At all. That totally explains the 'virtual victories'. ~bob s. At the risk of engaging in the shallowest sort of pop-psychoanalysis, a lot of incredibly driven, very successful people have a hard time enjoying their success. There's a lot of reasons for this (psychologically, we tend to overestimate both the amount of joy we would feel at a good outcome, and the amount of sorrow we would feel at a bad turn), but one aspect for the sort of Type-As who win big bike races is that even more than they love to win, they really, really hate to lose. I can totally believe that for LeMond, winning the Tour was not the defining achievement we all assume it would be. It's a bit like lottery-winners: a year later, they're basically about as happy as they were before the win, and oftentimes not really that different financially, either. LeMond put his whole life towards winning the Tour, but think about it: he basically finishes his professional peak at age 30, and is "retired" at age 32 or 33. There's a lot of fatty masters here, so you understand what I'm about to say: I don't even know what I want to do when I grow up, and I'm past 30. What would it be like to be defined by your achievements at age 25? How weird would it be to be in your forties, and have everyone you know want to hear about that summer job you had in your 20s? And that's not even counting the sexual abuse revelations, which seem to have been a defining experience for this poor kid. And no wonder. But it's all in how you look at it. Greg, either by nature or by upbringing, might not be a naturally optimistic person (it probably improves one's racing: if you fear that something might go wrong, the only way to work against that is to train more, train better, prepare more, plan better; it's like an OCD fever-dream). The "virtual tour" tale points to a guy more haunted by his misfortune and failures than reveling in his success. -- Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/ "I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos |
#5
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
In article
, Ryan Cousineau wrote: In article , bob sullivan wrote: Jason Spaceman wrote: From the article: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - The American won the Tour de France three times, twice with shotgun pellets lodged in his heart after a shooting accident. But his triumphs felt hollow as he struggled with the secret of his abuse as a child The Big Interview: Greg LeMond ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Read it at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...ce/article2010 066.ece Yes, I'm sure he didn't enjoy being the first American to win the Tour. At all. That totally explains the 'virtual victories'. ~bob s. At the risk of engaging in the shallowest sort of pop-psychoanalysis, a lot of incredibly driven, very successful people have a hard time enjoying their success. There's a lot of reasons for this (psychologically, we tend to overestimate both the amount of joy we would feel at a good outcome, and the amount of sorrow we would feel at a bad turn), but one aspect for the sort of Type-As who win big bike races is that even more than they love to win, they really, really hate to lose. I can totally believe that for LeMond, winning the Tour was not the defining achievement we all assume it would be. It's a bit like lottery-winners: a year later, they're basically about as happy as they were before the win, and oftentimes not really that different financially, either. LeMond put his whole life towards winning the Tour, but think about it: he basically finishes his professional peak at age 30, and is "retired" at age 32 or 33. There's a lot of fatty masters here, so you understand what I'm about to say: I don't even know what I want to do when I grow up, and I'm past 30. What would it be like to be defined by your achievements at age 25? How weird would it be to be in your forties, and have everyone you know want to hear about that summer job you had in your 20s? And that's not even counting the sexual abuse revelations, which seem to have been a defining experience for this poor kid. And no wonder. But it's all in how you look at it. Greg, either by nature or by upbringing, might not be a naturally optimistic person (it probably improves one's racing: if you fear that something might go wrong, the only way to work against that is to train more, train better, prepare more, plan better; it's like an OCD fever-dream). The "virtual tour" tale points to a guy more haunted by his misfortune and failures than reveling in his success. I am not here to understand him. I am here to accuse him. Greg, get over it. -- Michael Press |
#6
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote in message
oups.com... On Jul 2, 9:50 am, bob sullivan wrote: Jason Spaceman wrote: From the article: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------*-- The American won the Tour de France three times, twice with shotgun pellets lodged in his heart after a shooting accident. But his triumphs felt hollow as he struggled with the secret of his abuse as a child The Big Interview: Greg LeMond Read it at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...de_france/arti... Yes, I'm sure he didn't enjoy being the first American to win the Tour. At all. That totally explains the 'virtual victories'. I wonder if he has any idea at all of how narcissitic he is. So what does that matter? No matter what his personal strengths and weaknesses he's still the first American to win the Tour de France. He's still the guy that rode Bernard Hinault, maybe the most gifted bicycle racer since Eddy Merckx, to a standstill. He still came back after a near fatal accident and won twice more. Greg LeMond is still a great athlete of his time and nothing he can say now will ever change that. I don't have to like his personality to recognize his talents. |
#7
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
Tom Kunich wrote:
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote in message oups.com... On Jul 2, 9:50 am, bob sullivan wrote: Jason Spaceman wrote: From the article: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------*-- The American won the Tour de France three times, twice with shotgun pellets lodged in his heart after a shooting accident. But his triumphs felt hollow as he struggled with the secret of his abuse as a child The Big Interview: Greg LeMond Read it at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...de_france/arti... Yes, I'm sure he didn't enjoy being the first American to win the Tour. At all. That totally explains the 'virtual victories'. I wonder if he has any idea at all of how narcissitic he is. So what does that matter? No matter what his personal strengths and weaknesses he's still the first American to win the Tour de France. He's still the guy that rode Bernard Hinault, maybe the most gifted bicycle racer since Eddy Merckx, to a standstill. He still came back after a near fatal accident and won twice more. Greg LeMond is still a great athlete of his time and nothing he can say now will ever change that. I don't have to like his personality to recognize his talents. Of course, I respect his three wins, and I respect the trailblazing he did to pave the way for other Americans in the European peloton. I'm just disappointed at his post-retirement whining about how he could have won so many more "if only..." It's like those people who die whining about how they could have written the most important novel of the century, if only they hadn't had to work, raise kids, [insert excuse here]. It should be good enough that Lemond won one, two, three Tours. It should be good enough that he was the first American to win, and it should be good enough that he was the first American to wear the yellow jersey. But for some reason, those things aren't enough for him. He's bad-mouthed Armstrong, and he's bad-mouthed Landis, and it wasn't necessary for his legacy to do either. ~bob s. |
#8
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
On Jul 3, 5:23 pm, bob sullivan wrote:
Tom Kunich wrote: "Kurgan Gringioni" wrote in message roups.com... On Jul 2, 9:50 am, bob sullivan wrote: Jason Spaceman wrote: From the article: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-- The American won the Tour de France three times, twice with shotgun pellets lodged in his heart after a shooting accident. But his triumphs felt hollow as he struggled with the secret of his abuse as a child The Big Interview: Greg LeMond Read it at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...de_france/arti.... Yes, I'm sure he didn't enjoy being the first American to win the Tour. At all. That totally explains the 'virtual victories'. I wonder if he has any idea at all of how narcissitic he is. So what does that matter? No matter what his personal strengths and weaknesses he's still the first American to win the Tour de France. He's still the guy that rode Bernard Hinault, maybe the most gifted bicycle racer since Eddy Merckx, to a standstill. He still came back after a near fatal accident and won twice more. Greg LeMond is still a great athlete of his time and nothing he can say now will ever change that. I don't have to like his personality to recognize his talents. Of course, I respect his three wins, and I respect the trailblazing he did to pave the way for other Americans in the European peloton. I'm just disappointed at his post-retirement whining about how he could have won so many more "if only..." It's like those people who die whining about how they could have written the most important novel of the century, if only they hadn't had to work, raise kids, [insert excuse here]. It should be good enough that Lemond won one, two, three Tours. It should be good enough that he was the first American to win, and it should be good enough that he was the first American to wear the yellow jersey. But for some reason, those things aren't enough for him. He's bad-mouthed Armstrong, and he's bad-mouthed Landis, and it wasn't necessary for his legacy to do either. Dumbass - Nail on the head. I was so impressed with what he did while he was racing. So disappointing to see what he's done since. thanks, K. Gringioni. |
#9
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
Ryan Cousineau wrote:
snip But it's all in how you look at it. Greg, either by nature or by upbringing, might not be a naturally optimistic person (it probably improves one's racing: if you fear that something might go wrong, the only way to work against that is to train more, train better, prepare more, plan better; it's like an OCD fever-dream). This is why I believe the current concern over our children's self-esteem to be poorly thought through. Let them grow up to be neurotic, obsessively driven (but successful!) drones like the rest of us. |
#10
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Lemond interview: Cycle of abuse
On Jul 4, 12:46 am, Fred Fredburger
wrote: Ryan Cousineau wrote: But it's all in how you look at it. Greg, either by nature or by upbringing, might not be a naturally optimistic person (it probably improves one's racing: if you fear that something might go wrong, the only way to work against that is to train more, train better, prepare more, plan better; it's like an OCD fever-dream). This is why I believe the current concern over our children's self-esteem to be poorly thought through. Let them grow up to be neurotic, obsessively driven (but successful!) drones like the rest of us. Exactly! Or almost exactly. I've never seen anything of value created by a well adjusted person. If you think you've seen something of value created by a well adjusted person, they're more likely just adept at concealing their maladjustment. And I'm not talking about Kveck's cross-dressing, so don't get your knickers in a knot. R |
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