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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 09:28, NY wrote:
"JNugent" wrote in message ... On 02/12/2019 20:25, Bod wrote: On 02/12/2019 20:19, JNugent wrote: On 02/12/2019 20:15, Bod wrote: The most common cause of accidents is to driver error. Over 100,000 (108,479) crashes occured in the UK due to cars suddenly braking, drivers failing to look properly, poor car maneuvering and/or loss of control.2 Jul 2018 How interesting. What does it have to do with cycling? Cyclists cause a fraction of that amount of accidents. You have no idea of the number of accidents in which cyclists are involved (as cyclists). There are far more powered vehicles on the road than bicycles on the road (apart from in large towns, maybe) and they go faster so can cause more damage if things go wrong. So it is hardly surprising that they will be the cause of more accidents. The potential seriousness of the effects of an accident is one thing and you are obviously correct in what you say about that. But accidents befalling motor vehicles on the highway (and which cause injury or damage( have to be reported to the police and so may be accounted for in official statistics, to a nicety. Accidents befalling cyclists do not have to be reported. There is thus no way of knowing how many there are. I doubt that many cyclists who fall off their bikes - or have other accidents short of injuring themselves so badly as to bneed emergeny hospital treatment - report that to the police for official purposes. But cyclists are not *always* blameless. Consider a cyclist who rides through a red traffic light into the path of other traffic, or who pulls out of a side road. Other traffic brakes hard to avoid hitting him; maybe one of them skids and hits other vehicles/pedestrians, or is rear-ended. The cyclist is not hit, and continues unaffected. Is that cyclist blameless? Now consider the same situation where it was a car, not a cyclist, who went through a red light or pulled out of a side road; is that car driver blameless? In my mind, both a blameworthy to the same extent, but there is a philosophy that accidents are always "not the cyclist's fault". Quite so. |
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#12
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 09:59, nightjar wrote:
In terms of casualties per billion miles travelled, at 5,604, they are only second to motorcyclists at 6,043. Other figures are pedestrians 1,801, cars 238, buses 198, vans 62 and LGVs 61. (2017 figures) That would be deaths. In terms of serious injuries they rank a slightly higher mileage than pedestrians. However, the main argument (on u.r.c) is about certain drivers claiming that cyclists are evil pedestrian killers. The main culprit x-posted this. |
#13
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 12:08, TMS320 wrote:
On 03/12/2019 09:59, nightjar wrote: In terms of casualties per billion miles travelled, at 5,604, they are only second to motorcyclists at 6,043. Other figures are pedestrians 1,801, cars 238, buses 198, vans 62 and LGVs 61. (2017 figures) That would be deaths. In terms of serious injuries they rank a slightly higher mileage than pedestrians. It is the other way around. The figures I gave are for all casualties. For deaths per billion passenger miles, it is 30.9 for cyclists and 35.6 for pedestrians. However, the main argument (on u.r.c) is about certain drivers claiming that cyclists are evil pedestrian killers. The main culprit x-posted this. -- Colin Bignell |
#14
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 12:06, JNugent wrote:
But accidents befalling motor vehicles on the highway (and which cause injury or damage( have to be reported to the police and so may be Damage does not have to be reported... accounted for in official statistics, ....so is not counted. |
#15
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
"TMS320" wrote in message
... On 03/12/2019 09:28, NY wrote: The problem we have is of finger pointing at cyclists by drivers that have over inflated ideas about their driving ability. I think the biggest problem is the impunity of cyclists: because they don't have number-plates, they cannot easily be traced and reported for occasions when they do break laws which would see a motorist prosecuted. in other words, resentment rather than concern about safety. I may fume inwardly but I refuse to get riled by bad cyclists when I'm driving; other people regard inconsiderate cyclists as fair game. I cycle - for pleasure rather than as means of getting from A to B - and I try to cycle as if I were a human-powered car, obeying all the same rules as a car driver: I don't go through red traffic lights or occupied zebra crossings, and I don't overtake on the left at junction if I want to go straight on and the car ahead of me is indicating to turn left. As a cyclist and a car driver I have seen an alarmingly high number of cyclists who don't obey the rules - and get away with it. On two occasions I've witnessed pedestrians on a zebra crossing have to jump back to avoid being hit by cyclists. (*). If a car driver did that he would be rightly prosecuted; cyclists seem to get away with it as it is regarded as a venial offence. Being hit by a cyclist at 20-30 mph is nowhere near as bad as being hit by a car, but it can still be fatal. It is the holier-than-thou "I'm a cyclist so the rules of the road are a mere inconvenience - ignore them" cyclists that give the rest a bad name - unfairly. As a driver, I hope I make a better cyclist because I can sympathise with the needs of cars to overtake a much slower vehicle. As a cyclist, I hope I make a better driver - I know to pass them as wide as possible, not to hassle them when they are struggling up a hill that is chickenfeed to a car. I try to keep as far left as is safe (avoiding the kerb and drainholes), and when my wife and I are cycling, we always move into single file when there are cars wanting to get past, even though the law allows two abreast. Incidentally, "two abreast" doesn't allow cyclists to ride one close to the kerb and one almost over the white line, with a gap "that you could drive a double-decker bus through" in between, purposefully making it as hard as possible for anyone to get past. (*) I was out cycling in the centre of Oxford, where tourists are to be expected. As I was approaching a zebra crossing I saw a large group of people, who I imagine were tourists, starting to cross. I slowed down, as did the cars ahead and behind me. Another cyclist, on a racing bike, yelled "out of my ****ing way", overtook and swerved round the traffic and between a car and bollard, and rode full-tilt at the crossing, causing a party of tourists to leap out of the way. He deserved to be punished as severely as a car or lorry driver that did the same - but of course he was untraceable. A rare occasion, but one that sticks in the mind, with a danger that people think "all cyclists" are like that. |
#16
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 12:08, TMS320 wrote:
On 03/12/2019 09:59, nightjar wrote: In terms of casualties per billion miles travelled, at 5,604, they are only second to motorcyclists at 6,043. Other figures are pedestrians 1,801, cars 238, buses 198, vans 62 and LGVs 61. (2017 figures) That would be deaths. In terms of serious injuries they rank a slightly higher mileage than pedestrians. However, the main argument (on u.r.c) is about certain drivers claiming that cyclists are evil pedestrian killers. The main culprit x-posted this. Only *some* cyclists are "evil pedestrian killers". "Evil pedestrian killers" is, of course, *your* phrase and certainly not mine. But it is a very telling one and I am grateful for your coinage of it. |
#17
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 12:28, nightjar wrote:
On 03/12/2019 12:08, TMS320 wrote: On 03/12/2019 09:59, nightjar wrote: In terms of casualties per billion miles travelled, at 5,604, they are only second to motorcyclists at 6,043. Other figures are pedestrians 1,801, cars 238, buses 198, vans 62 and LGVs 61. (2017 figures) That would be deaths. In terms of serious injuries they rank a slightly higher mileage than pedestrians. It is the other way around. The figures I gave are for all casualties. For deaths per billion passenger miles, it is 30.9 for cyclists and 35.6 for pedestrians. Ah yes, you are correct. Injuries similar to motorcyclists, deaths similar to pedestrians. However, if fewer injuries convert to deaths, the typical injury must be less severe. Something difficult to assess when only the fact of an injury gets recorded. |
#18
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 12:38, JNugent wrote:
On 03/12/2019 12:08, TMS320 wrote: However, the main argument (on u.r.c) is about certain drivers claiming that cyclists are evil pedestrian killers. The main culprit x-posted this. Only *some* cyclists are "evil pedestrian killers". It's usually only cyclists (who don't ride fixies) that backpedal. "Evil pedestrian killers" is, of course, *your* phrase and certainly not mine. But it is a very telling one and I am grateful for your coinage of it. I don't claim you said it and will take the credit, if that is what you want. But I will maintain that it is a summary of you stand for. |
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 12:30, TMS320 wrote:
On 03/12/2019 12:06, JNugent wrote: But accidents befalling motor vehicles on the highway (and which cause injury or damage( have to be reported to the police and so may be Damage does not have to be reported... That depends on the circumstances... so you are not correct in what you say. accounted for in official statistics, ...so is not counted. |
#20
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What is the biggest cause of road accidents in the UK?
On 03/12/2019 13:34, TMS320 wrote:
On 03/12/2019 12:38, JNugent wrote: On 03/12/2019 12:08, TMS320 wrote: However, the main argument (on u.r.c) is about certain drivers claiming that cyclists are evil pedestrian killers. The main culprit x-posted this. Only *some* cyclists are "evil pedestrian killers". It's usually only cyclists (who don't ride fixies) that backpedal. "Evil pedestrian killers" is, of course, *your* phrase and certainly not mine. But it is a very telling one and I am grateful for your coinage of it. I don't claim you said it and will take the credit, if that is what you want. But I will maintain that it is a summary of you stand for. I do indeed stand four-square for the rights of pedestrians on footways and in pedestrian-only zones. But you don't, do you? |
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