Bike adjustments

On Sun, 08 Dec 2019 16:17:36 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Sun, 8 Dec 2019 23:32:55 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 8 Dec 2019 04:00:35 -0800, sms
wrote:

Manufacturers got tired of manufacturing ten different frame sizes so
now they'll make four to six different "compact" frame sizes and use
various combinations of seat posts, stems, and spacers to make things
fit?kind of, sort of.

Agreed. That sort of works:
https://www.thegeekycyclist.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/An-Adult-on-A-Kids-Bike-1024x865.jpg

I’m not sure where you would get the seat post, stem and spacers to make
that bike work, but aside from way too much frame flex and steering that
would feel like a tiller, I suppose you could make it work.

Probably not. I recently gave away a Trek 1400 road bike:
http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/pics/bicycles/slides/Trek-1400.html
I really liked the bicycle, but the frame was too small for me. I
forgot the official frame size, but it seemed to be made for someone
smaller and shorter. I could extend the seat post, stem, crank
length, and handlebars. However I could do nothing to prevent my feet
from hitting the trailing end of the front wheel.

Not to argue about your bike size but "toe interference" or "toe
overlap" as it is called is quite common. At least one company,
"Thorn Cycles" used to mention that a bike had "toe overlap" in their
catalog. Generally more common in high performance bikes. Sheldon
mentions it and says, " Many, many people ride bicycles with fairly
severe overlap with no practical problems"

--
cheers,

John B.

On Mon, 09 Dec 2019 07:30:37 +0700, John B.
wrote:

To be honest though, I'm not exactly sure what a "mobile" bike is? Are
there immobile bikes?

Yes, there is such a thing as an immovable bicycle:
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=wrought+iron+bicycle
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=bicycle+sculpture
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=inflatable+advertising+bicycle
etc...

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Monday, December 9, 2019 at 12:58:54 AM UTC, AMuzi wrote:

'Gunar abortion' WTF?

Gunnar _race bikes_ have short chainstays, suitable to race
bike riders/customers.

Of their 16 models, that's four (2 single speed, two
geared). The long wheelbase styles (most of the line) are
longer.

http://gunnarbikes.com


--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

This is the reference, posted by one AMuzi:
http://www.gunnarbikes.com/newslette...29-04_ming.jpg

Andre Jute
Eiditic

On 8/12/19 10:28 am, wrote:
As part of the ordering process of my gravel bike I was measured last
Wednesday to determine the correct frame size. The measuring program
didn't take the handlebar/shifter/shifter position into account in
contrast to saddle make and type. I found that strange because most
of the time you are riding on the hoods. It was a rainy day yesterday
so I took the time to measure all my current bikes which I adjusted
by 'feel' giving the purpose/riding style of that bike. Results:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/1HbWyM6g1gNqoyMx5

So today I went back to the LBS (another 100 km round trip) to
discuss this. In the meantime the manufacturer emailed the shop a
drawing of their proposal. Strangely this drawing did show the
measurements of the position of the shifter on the handlebar and this
came very close what I measured on my bikes especially measurement E,
F and D. With the mechanic we figured out the correct frame size
taking the chosen handlebar, a stem length of 110 mm and the new
Ultegra shifters and the manufacturers proposal/my measurements into
account. My question is what do these measurement programs exactly
do? Are there people that close a bike only based on these
measurements?


The last bike I bought (gravel) was advertised with a chart that was
scaled to leg length. According to my leg length I should have chosen
an XL frame, but I reviewed the frame angles and geometry against my
custom road racing bike, and decided on a L size frame. The XL would
have had my hands too high. Even so, with the L frame I have the head
stem all the way down, and I used a longer stem than the supplied one of
course, and I used a longer seat post too.

I also dislike the sloping top tube "compact" design, for the simple
reasons that;

a) longer frame tubes would probably weigh less than a long seat post,
and a longer seat post likely stresses the frame more.

b) the sloping top tube is very difficult to sit on while you're stopped
somewhere to admire the view and eat a banana.

c) the area in the triangle is reduced which restricts that available to
carry water bottles or frame bags and stuff, if you so desire.

--
JS

On Mon, 09 Dec 2019 08:02:36 +0700, John B.
wrote:

Not to argue about your bike size but "toe interference" or "toe
overlap" as it is called is quite common. At least one company,
"Thorn Cycles" used to mention that a bike had "toe overlap" in their
catalog. Generally more common in high performance bikes.

Yep, anything with a steep head tube angle and a short wheelbase will
have the problem. I managed to make things worse by routinely wearing
steel toe construction boots while riding. It became an issue after
several low speed crashes while cornering. On my Trek 1400, I once
measured the angle on the front wheel where my toe might overlap the
front wheel. Methinks it was a fairly large 30 degrees, with the
forward motion of my heel stopped by the pedal. I just checked my
Gary Fisher Tassajara:
http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/pics/bicycles/slides/Gary-Fisher-Tassajara.html
and found about 5 degrees overlap (again with construction boots). I
previously tried to use toe clips to reduce the toe interference on my
Trek 1400, but couldn't find toe clips that would also work with
platform pedals (so that the waffle pattern soles will slide easily).

I could probably have made something work with custom front fork
extensions and disk brakes, which would increase the wheelbase, but
didn't think it was worth the effort.

Sheldon
mentions it and says, " Many, many people ride bicycles with fairly
severe overlap with no practical problems"

My other bicycles have a longer wheelbase and therefore less of a toe
interference problem.


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sun, 08 Dec 2019 17:56:58 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Mon, 09 Dec 2019 08:02:36 +0700, John B.
wrote:

Not to argue about your bike size but "toe interference" or "toe
overlap" as it is called is quite common. At least one company,
"Thorn Cycles" used to mention that a bike had "toe overlap" in their
catalog. Generally more common in high performance bikes.

Yep, anything with a steep head tube angle and a short wheelbase will
have the problem. I managed to make things worse by routinely wearing
steel toe construction boots while riding. It became an issue after
several low speed crashes while cornering. On my Trek 1400, I once
measured the angle on the front wheel where my toe might overlap the
front wheel. Methinks it was a fairly large 30 degrees, with the
forward motion of my heel stopped by the pedal. I just checked my
Gary Fisher Tassajara:
http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/pics/bicycles/slides/Gary-Fisher-Tassajara.html
and found about 5 degrees overlap (again with construction boots). I
previously tried to use toe clips to reduce the toe interference on my
Trek 1400, but couldn't find toe clips that would also work with
platform pedals (so that the waffle pattern soles will slide easily).
?? https://www.amazon.com/bicycle-toe-c...ycle+toe+clips

I could probably have made something work with custom front fork
extensions and disk brakes, which would increase the wheelbase, but
didn't think it was worth the effort.

Sheldon
mentions it and says, " Many, many people ride bicycles with fairly
severe overlap with no practical problems"

My other bicycles have a longer wheelbase and therefore less of a toe
interference problem.

I'm not up on "modern" bicycles as all my bikes are "classic" steel
frame, level top tube, etc., and they all have toe overlap and I have
never found it to be a problem as I can't imagine ever turning the
wheel far enough to hit my toe at even walking speeds,

If I start out up a hill than yes, perhaps for the first revolution or
so of the crank I will be traveling slowly enough to have too turn the
wheel back and forth, far enough to hit my toe, to keep balanced but
other than that I have never had a problem.

But from your posts you seem to be an electronic sort of guy. Do
electronic guys wear hulking great boots?
--
cheers,

John B.

On Mon, 9 Dec 2019 12:48:30 +1100, James
wrote:

On 8/12/19 10:28 am, wrote:
As part of the ordering process of my gravel bike I was measured last
Wednesday to determine the correct frame size. The measuring program
didn't take the handlebar/shifter/shifter position into account in
contrast to saddle make and type. I found that strange because most
of the time you are riding on the hoods. It was a rainy day yesterday
so I took the time to measure all my current bikes which I adjusted
by 'feel' giving the purpose/riding style of that bike. Results:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/1HbWyM6g1gNqoyMx5

So today I went back to the LBS (another 100 km round trip) to
discuss this. In the meantime the manufacturer emailed the shop a
drawing of their proposal. Strangely this drawing did show the
measurements of the position of the shifter on the handlebar and this
came very close what I measured on my bikes especially measurement E,
F and D. With the mechanic we figured out the correct frame size
taking the chosen handlebar, a stem length of 110 mm and the new
Ultegra shifters and the manufacturers proposal/my measurements into
account. My question is what do these measurement programs exactly
do? Are there people that close a bike only based on these
measurements?


The last bike I bought (gravel) was advertised with a chart that was
scaled to leg length. According to my leg length I should have chosen
an XL frame, but I reviewed the frame angles and geometry against my
custom road racing bike, and decided on a L size frame. The XL would
have had my hands too high. Even so, with the L frame I have the head
stem all the way down, and I used a longer stem than the supplied one of
course, and I used a longer seat post too.

I also dislike the sloping top tube "compact" design, for the simple
reasons that;

a) longer frame tubes would probably weigh less than a long seat post,
and a longer seat post likely stresses the frame more.

b) the sloping top tube is very difficult to sit on while you're stopped
somewhere to admire the view and eat a banana.

c) the area in the triangle is reduced which restricts that available to
carry water bottles or frame bags and stuff, if you so desire.

Added to that you can't carry anyone sitting side saddle on the top
tube as we used to do :-)
--
cheers,

John B.

On Sun, 08 Dec 2019 17:31:18 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Mon, 09 Dec 2019 07:30:37 +0700, John B.
wrote:

To be honest though, I'm not exactly sure what a "mobile" bike is? Are
there immobile bikes?

Yes, there is such a thing as an immovable bicycle:
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=wrought+iron+bicycle
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=bicycle+sculpture
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=inflatable+advertising+bicycle
etc...

Ah yes. But does one have to pay good money to be fitted to them :-)
--
cheers,

John B.

On 12/8/2019 7:36 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Monday, December 9, 2019 at 12:58:54 AM UTC, AMuzi wrote:

'Gunar abortion' WTF?

Gunnar _race bikes_ have short chainstays, suitable to race
bike riders/customers.

Of their 16 models, that's four (2 single speed, two
geared). The long wheelbase styles (most of the line) are
longer.

http://gunnarbikes.com



This is the reference, posted by one AMuzi:
http://www.gunnarbikes.com/newslette...29-04_ming.jpg

Andre Jute
Eiditic


Ahem.

Had Mr Ming wanted something different, Gunnar would have
built it differently. Hence the term 'custom'.

http://gunnarbikes.com/site/order/custom-order-form/
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 12/8/2019 12:53 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 8 Dec 2019 04:00:35 -0800, sms
wrote:

Manufacturers got tired of manufacturing ten different frame sizes so
now they'll make four to six different "compact" frame sizes and use
various combinations of seat posts, stems, and spacers to make things
fit?kind of, sort of.

Agreed. That sort of works:
https://www.thegeekycyclist.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/An-Adult-on-A-Kids-Bike-1024x865.jpg

Yes, compact frames are suitable for all size cyclists with appropriate
stems, extenders, and seat posts.