London "Danger! Danger!"

"Mark J." writes:

On 12/10/2013 11:19 AM, Jay Beattie wrote:

TECHNICAL TOPIC CHANGE: Anyone have a great technique for beading difficult tires. My studs love to hang up and not bead, so they are like riding on square tires. Running up the pressure doesn't do the trick. I could soap them up before mounting, but short of that, anyone have tried and true technique?

-- Jay Beattie.

Pump to about 10 or 15 psi, then muscle them into place by gripping,
pushing "up" on sidewall with thumbs. Likewise, where the bead is
riding high, push "down". Works /sometimes/.


Yes - I've had some tires that will seat, but not "perfectly"
evenly, and manual manipulation with just enough pressure to
hold it (but not enough to prevent the manual manipulation)
was SOP with those.

In the motorcycle shop, we used soap and water slurry as lube
for mounting, which also helps pop them right up on the bead.

Or just build a set of wheels dedicated to your studs. I did. Makes
the last-minute morning decision to "stud up" easier to make, when
conditions are iffy and black ice is a possibility.



....AREAS OF FREEZING RAIN POSSIBLE THURSDAY IN THE INLAND AREAS
OF SOUTHWEST WASHINGTON AND NORTHWEST OREGON...

A PACIFIC FRONT WILL MOVE INTO THE AREA ON THURSDAY AND BRING SOME
PRECIPITATION TO THE AREA. SINCE THIS SYSTEM IS COMING OFF THE
PACIFIC...MOST OF THE PRECIPITATION WILL FALL AS RAIN.
HOWEVER...THERE IS POTENTIAL FOR A SHORT PERIOD OF FREEZING RAIN
IN INLAND VALLEYS THAT REMAIN ENTRENCHED IN A COLD AIR MASS.


.... and if that's not bad enough:


URGENT - WEATHER MESSAGE

....

....DENSE FOG ADVISORY IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 AM PST THURSDAY FOR THE
SOUTH AND CENTRAL VALLEY...

THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN PORTLAND HAS ISSUED A DENSE FOG
ADVISORY...WHICH IS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 AM PST THURSDAY.

* VISIBILITY: AT OR BELOW 1/4 OF A MILES AT TIMES.

* TIMING: TONIGHT THROUGH EARLY THURSDAY MORNING.

* LOCATIONS INCLUDE: EUGENE...CORVALLIS...ALBANY...SALEM...
MCMINNVILLE

* IMPACTS: FREEZING FOG MAY LEAD TO ICY SPOTS ON ROADWAYS AND
SIDEWALKS.

Frank Krygowski writes:

On Wednesday, December 11, 2013 8:30:57 AM UTC-5, SMS wrote:
On 12/10/2013 6:15 PM, Jay Beattie wrote:

P.S., sad to see the trend toward e-Bikes in Holland. My riding buddy goes to China a lot a tells some great stories about sharing bicycle facilities with scooter drivers -- who are displacing bicyclists in China.

I've been to China many times and the drop in the number of cyclists is
amazingly large. But a large part of the drop has been due to new subway
lines.

It will be interesting to watch Northern European and Chinese trends for the next several years. I've read some rumblings about user dissatisfaction with bike infrastructure, safety complaints, and some official frustration that the glorious dream of ever-increasing cycling seems to be failing.


There are big changes ahead. Bicycles are a wonderful part of
it, but won't be *the* transportation solution.

Bicycles are a great *part* of that future for all the reasons
we know: Healthy "active" transportation (much needed), efficient,
low impact, low cost, the rider experiences life immersed in it
instead of looking out at it, and (above all,) great fun.

Then as us rbt'ers know, there's the learning of mechanics,
physics, engineering that we began as kids. The Wright
Brothers spirit lives forever!

The interesting part will be whether it dawns on people like Peter Furth, John Pucher, Mia Birk and others that high cycling volumes depend on dozens of economic and societal factors, NOT just on the presence of cycle tracks.


Ah, but those social factors are encouraged and enabled by butts
on bikes. They are substantially dead in the water until the car
culture as we know it is rehabilitated. It's actually working in
places that are implementing the vision (these places all happen
to emphasize bike facilities as a prominent essential - but by no
means the sole - feature). Actually altering the culture.

(I won't rehash my reasons for thinking that bike facilites are an
easily worthwhile, multi-vector array of forces to the post car
culture world, even though there are tradeoffs in everything and
there is always a valid argument against anything - bike facilites
included. And not every facility is worthwhile - even reasonably
well considered, but finding things out is messy. Wisdom and alternate
perspectives like yours are needed to succeed. But (and I'm no expert
on "networking" and collaborating and crap like that), but I don't
think we're getting the best you have to offer with, "Every facility
is a botched facility."

I appreciate your vision. Maybe and hopefully it will be the way
in some places; but it's never going to be the way everywhere or
most places.

Que sera, sera (and I don't mean that in the defeatist sense -
rather the realist).

Remember, as for myself, whatever I find when I wake up each day
is my oyster. No facilities? No problem. I'll ride. So many
facilites (most) people can't figure out which way to go? I don't
have that particular problem, either. Sieze the day and wring your
life from whatever it has to offer. Rock on, brothjer!

After decades of demanding bike lanes, these people now realize that bike lanes won't change Podunk into Copenhagen. But they still don't admit that Europe's greater bicycle use is due to immense differences in city density, history, terrain, climate, auto taxes, fuel prices, licensing difficulty, parking scarcity, living spaces, public transportation, liability laws, suburban growth and other aspects of culture.


I refer to them collectively as "the enlightened societies".

Instead, that crew is now attributing (almost?) all the cycling popularity to one "new" factor: cycle tracks. "Guess what? _Cycle tracks_ will change Podunk into Copenhagen!"


Who are "these people"? Furth, Pucher, Birk? Shall we ask them
if this is their position? (I'll do it if you want me to.)

Of course, it's very hard to get a person to admit they're wrong,

It can be, and usually is. That is very true.

snip

On Wednesday, December 11, 2013 6:21:46 PM UTC-8, Dan wrote:
"Mark J." writes:



On 12/10/2013 11:19 AM, Jay Beattie wrote:



TECHNICAL TOPIC CHANGE: Anyone have a great technique for beading difficult tires. My studs love to hang up and not bead, so they are like riding on square tires. Running up the pressure doesn't do the trick. I could soap them up before mounting, but short of that, anyone have tried and true technique?



-- Jay Beattie.



Pump to about 10 or 15 psi, then muscle them into place by gripping,

pushing "up" on sidewall with thumbs. Likewise, where the bead is

riding high, push "down". Works /sometimes/.





Yes - I've had some tires that will seat, but not "perfectly"

evenly, and manual manipulation with just enough pressure to

hold it (but not enough to prevent the manual manipulation)

was SOP with those.



In the motorcycle shop, we used soap and water slurry as lube

for mounting, which also helps pop them right up on the bead.



Or just build a set of wheels dedicated to your studs. I did. Makes

the last-minute morning decision to "stud up" easier to make, when

conditions are iffy and black ice is a possibility.

I have a bicycle dedicated to studs -- my son's abandoned Kona Dewdrop. He took his 29er and a lighter road bike to college. It weighs a f***** ton! I rode home on dry pavement last night, and the buzzing about drove me crazy - along with the bumping up and down on stuck beads. I was exhausted trying to keep up with some guy on a tourista bike with panniers. He was a total Frank, taking the lane and signalling and all that stuff. With all the racket I was making, he probably thought he was being chased by the angel of death.

When I have difficult-to-bead tires, I also wrestled them on to the bead and/or use soapy water as a lubricant. I like Andrew's idea of furniture polish, so I'll give that a whirl. My studs are super stiff and are pretty resistant to wrestling.

-- Jay Beattie.

On 12/11/2013 8:09 PM, Jay Beattie wrote:
On Wednesday, December 11, 2013 6:21:46 PM UTC-8, Dan wrote:
"Mark J." writes:
Or just build a set of wheels dedicated to your studs. I did. Makes

the last-minute morning decision to "stud up" easier to make, when

conditions are iffy and black ice is a possibility.

I have a bicycle dedicated to studs -- my son's abandoned Kona Dewdrop. He took his 29er and a lighter road bike to college. It weighs a f***** ton! I rode home on dry pavement last night, and the buzzing about drove me crazy - along with the bumping up and down on stuck beads. I was exhausted trying to keep up with some guy on a tourista bike with panniers. He was a total Frank, taking the lane and signalling and all that stuff. With all the racket I was making, he probably thought he was being chased by the angel of death.

When I have difficult-to-bead tires, I also wrestled them on to the bead and/or use soapy water as a lubricant. I like Andrew's idea of furniture polish, so I'll give that a whirl. My studs are super stiff and are pretty resistant to wrestling.

-- Jay Beattie.


So which brand/model of studs are you using, again? I've got the Nokian
Hakkapeliitta 700c, I think in 35mm. They don't buzz that bad on dry
pavement, but I agree I don't like it. I'm not quite ready to believe
the internet post I read years ago about someone using them as winter
training tires - and riding on them with his road club, saying something
like "turns a mellow ride into a good workout."

In marginal conditions, I only run the front wheel studded - 90% of the
control with less than 50% of the drag. I haven't fishtailed yet, but
I'm pretty cautious.

Think I'm gonna leave the front one on for the freezing rain forecast
this morning.

Mark J.

On Wednesday, December 11, 2013 11:09:03 PM UTC-5, Jay Beattie wrote:

I have a bicycle dedicated to studs -- my son's abandoned Kona Dewdrop. He took his 29er and a lighter road bike to college. It weighs a f***** ton! I rode home on dry pavement last night, and the buzzing about drove me crazy - along with the bumping up and down on stuck beads. I was exhausted trying to keep up with some guy on a tourista bike with panniers. He was a total Frank, taking the lane and signalling and all that stuff.

Sad to say, if he was able to stay ahead of you, he probably wasn't a _total_ Frank. :-( At least, not any more.

I ride my former (pre-retirement) commute route only occasionally these days. It's shocking how much steeper the hills have become!

- Frank Krygowski

On Thursday, December 12, 2013 9:04:23 AM UTC-8, Mark J. wrote:
On 12/11/2013 8:09 PM, Jay Beattie wrote:

On Wednesday, December 11, 2013 6:21:46 PM UTC-8, Dan wrote:

"Mark J." writes:

Or just build a set of wheels dedicated to your studs. I did. Makes



the last-minute morning decision to "stud up" easier to make, when



conditions are iffy and black ice is a possibility.



I have a bicycle dedicated to studs -- my son's abandoned Kona Dewdrop. He took his 29er and a lighter road bike to college. It weighs a f***** ton! I rode home on dry pavement last night, and the buzzing about drove me crazy - along with the bumping up and down on stuck beads. I was exhausted trying to keep up with some guy on a tourista bike with panniers. He was a total Frank, taking the lane and signalling and all that stuff. With all the racket I was making, he probably thought he was being chased by the angel of death.



When I have difficult-to-bead tires, I also wrestled them on to the bead and/or use soapy water as a lubricant. I like Andrew's idea of furniture polish, so I'll give that a whirl. My studs are super stiff and are pretty resistant to wrestling.



-- Jay Beattie.





So which brand/model of studs are you using, again? I've got the Nokian

Hakkapeliitta 700c, I think in 35mm. They don't buzz that bad on dry

pavement, but I agree I don't like it. I'm not quite ready to believe

the internet post I read years ago about someone using them as winter

training tires - and riding on them with his road club, saying something

like "turns a mellow ride into a good workout."



In marginal conditions, I only run the front wheel studded - 90% of the

control with less than 50% of the drag. I haven't fishtailed yet, but

I'm pretty cautious.



Think I'm gonna leave the front one on for the freezing rain forecast

this morning.



Mark J.

I ride cheap Innovas that I got from Bicycle Tires Direct (and which they no longer carry). http://www.jensonusa.com/Bicycle-Tir...9-Studded-Tire

I use them so rarely, that I couldn't see spending serious money.

I've ridden the last couple of days on my regular commuter bike with 28mm tires. It's been frosty, but traction has been acceptable except in some places (which I ride with extreme care). I typically don't take the bike with studded tires unless I wake up to snow or serious ice. If the freezing rain actually comes tonight, I'm screwed.

-- Jay Beattie.

On Friday, December 13, 2013 11:04:42 PM UTC-5, Phil W Lee wrote:
Frank Krygowski considered Tue, 10 Dec 2013

In one major city, one knowledgeable cycling advocate I know is extremely frustrated because the local Bike Advocates In Favor Of Everything group is hounding the city to put in door zone bike lanes everywhere. They're convinced they can't safely ride on even narrow back streets without a paint stripe that tells them to skim the parked cars.

The recent (and ongoing) protest in London was and is almost
completely opposite to that.
The problem is the high proportion of the deaths that have occurred on
poor quality infrastructure, and the need to either scrap it or sort
it.

The worst example (Bow interchange) has been made significantly MORE
dangerous by the cycling infrastructure, and the latest way of
"fixing" it was to make it far more difficult and dangerous to use the
safer alternative.

I've got no problem at all with criticizing or protesting badly done cycling infrastructure. Our local bike club has attempted to do that with one particularly crazy situation, spending serious time in meetings with the offending agency. Unfortunately, we've had only small success in correcting it, partly because there were other cyclists phoning in who said "Oh, I love the new facility!" That's despite guideline-violating collision hazards, written and verbal testimony from nationally known experts, and one cyclist made quadriplegic.

Regarding London protests: I've been watching British press on this for quite a while. The message through the press has not been so much about any specific aspects of the design (Bow or elsewhere), but instead about "Six cyclists killed in two weeks!" and "Cycling in London is too dangerous!" and "We need Amsterdam facilities!" (Well, I supposed cycletracks are a specific request, but I tend to doubt they're realistic in London. I'd like your thoughts on that.)

Perhaps cyclists are proposing workable designs for specific problem situations, and the press doesn't communicate that very well. But from what I've seen, the "Danger! Danger!" gets trumpeted far more than any "Here's a solution."

BTW, this proposal from Edinburgh seems to have potential:
http://www.scotsman.com/news/transpo...sons-1-3231777

.... although I'd also like strong publicity campaigns telling cyclists to stay out of truck blind spots, particularly at curb side. As with doorings, the legal fault may be with the motorist, but a cyclist is not wise if he trusts motorists to avoid him when he's nearly invisible.

- Frank Krygowski

Phil W Lee writes:

Ben Pfaff considered Tue, 10 Dec 2013 08:41:12
-0800 the perfect time to write:

Jay Beattie writes:
It is not because it has gotten that much worse in the last 20
years (although I got passed by a bus this morning by literally
an inch at 45mph), but riders are much less "tough."

Some of the bus drivers around here like to honk as they pass a
cyclist, for no reason that I can see. If I ever get the
opportunity, I will ask one why they do it.

Just take the bus one day, and as you get on, yell in the driver's
face at the top of your voice (or better yet, use one of those
canister airhorns a few inches from his ear) - then point out that
that is exactly the effect that honking a cyclist at short range has.

Hmm. Maybe your bus drivers are more obnoxious than mine, then.
The honks to which I refer are brief and, subjectively, not
nearly as loud as an airhorn. They are startling, but not
painful. Maybe I made too big a deal of it in my previous
article.

On Sat, 14 Dec 2013 09:24:36 -0800 (PST), Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On Friday, December 13, 2013 11:04:42 PM UTC-5, Phil W Lee wrote:
Frank Krygowski considered Tue, 10 Dec 2013

In one major city, one knowledgeable cycling advocate I know is extremely frustrated because the local Bike Advocates In Favor Of Everything group is hounding the city to put in door zone bike lanes everywhere. They're convinced they can't safely ride on even narrow back streets without a paint stripe that tells them to skim the parked cars.

The recent (and ongoing) protest in London was and is almost
completely opposite to that.
The problem is the high proportion of the deaths that have occurred on
poor quality infrastructure, and the need to either scrap it or sort
it.

The worst example (Bow interchange) has been made significantly MORE
dangerous by the cycling infrastructure, and the latest way of
"fixing" it was to make it far more difficult and dangerous to use the
safer alternative.

I've got no problem at all with criticizing or protesting badly done cycling infrastructure. Our local bike club has attempted to do that with one particularly crazy situation, spending serious time in meetings with the offending agency. Unfortunately, we've had only small success in correcting it, partly because there were other cyclists phoning in who said "Oh, I love the new facility!" That's despite guideline-violating collision hazards, written and verbal testimony from nationally known experts, and one cyclist made quadriplegic.

Regarding London protests: I've been watching British press on this for quite a while. The message through the press has not been so much about any specific aspects of the design (Bow or elsewhere), but instead about "Six cyclists killed in two weeks!" and "Cycling in London is too dangerous!" and "We need Amsterdam facilities!" (Well, I supposed cycletracks are a specific request, but I tend to doubt they're realistic in London. I'd like your thoughts on that.)

Perhaps cyclists are proposing workable designs for specific problem situations, and the press doesn't communicate that very well. But from what I've seen, the "Danger! Danger!" gets trumpeted far more than any "Here's a solution."

BTW, this proposal from Edinburgh seems to have potential:
http://www.scotsman.com/news/transpo...sons-1-3231777

... although I'd also like strong publicity campaigns telling cyclists to stay out of truck blind spots, particularly at curb side. As with doorings, the legal fault may be with the motorist, but a cyclist is not wise if he trusts motorists to avoid him when he's nearly invisible.

- Frank Krygowski

There is a joke about engineers that seems appropriate here.

A Priest, a Doctor and an Engineer are playing golf and the group
ahead of them is playing slowly and holding them up. they complain to
the Starter and he tells them that the group is some blind fireman who
lost their eyesight fighting a big fire and rescuing some people and
the golf club has allowed them to play because thy are heroes who gave
up their sight in order to save people.

The Priest says, "I'll pray for them".
The doctor says, "I'll get my buddy, an eye doctor to se if something
can't be done about their seeing".
The Engineer says, "Why can't they play at night?"

If there are too many deaths due to cycling in London the problem can
be solved by simply banning bicycles in the metropolitan area.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Sat, 14 Dec 2013 15:57:29 -0800, Ben Pfaff
wrote:

Phil W Lee writes:

Ben Pfaff considered Tue, 10 Dec 2013 08:41:12
-0800 the perfect time to write:

Jay Beattie writes:
It is not because it has gotten that much worse in the last 20
years (although I got passed by a bus this morning by literally
an inch at 45mph), but riders are much less "tough."

Some of the bus drivers around here like to honk as they pass a
cyclist, for no reason that I can see. If I ever get the
opportunity, I will ask one why they do it.

Just take the bus one day, and as you get on, yell in the driver's
face at the top of your voice (or better yet, use one of those
canister airhorns a few inches from his ear) - then point out that
that is exactly the effect that honking a cyclist at short range has.

Hmm. Maybe your bus drivers are more obnoxious than mine, then.
The honks to which I refer are brief and, subjectively, not
nearly as loud as an airhorn. They are startling, but not
painful. Maybe I made too big a deal of it in my previous
article.

Hearing a vehicle horn is startling? On the road? Really?
--
Cheers,

John B.