Why do bicyclist have to try the patience of automobile drivers?

On 23 Feb 2004 05:36:53 GMT, David Reuteler wrote:

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
: But rarely do people "trolling" post with a legit address, as this person
: did. She's been using that same address, and appears to be associated with
: a kite-flying business, for many, many years.

true. but at the very least it's an uncontrolled vent. it's pretty damn
rude. i mean she's doing the equivalent of me strolling over to rec.kites
and complaining about ..

i've having real difficulty coming up with an example of bad things people
flying kits might do. but real bad things with kites, tho.

Tripping over me while I'm having a nap in the park. Tangling their
kites in your trees constantly when the wind dies down. Scaring away
birds. Smashing windows (out of control kites).

and saying that if a kite flyer (or kite business owner) gets in my way i
won't lift a finger to not maim them.

You better look out though. If the OP is any indication, those kite
flyers are a rough bunch. Better keep your frame pump handy.


: I honestly there's a chance this person may simply be over-reacting to a few
: coincidental situations she encountered. I'd treat her (for the moment) as
: neither a troll nor someone deserving (yet) of being flamed. Best to
: attempt reason at first and see where it gets here. It could be totally
: disarming as she becomes aware that we're not all a bunch of
: testosterone-crazed ego-centric self-absorbed spandex-clad psychos.

yea, overreacting indeed. and probably we should listen to her if there is
a second post .. but she's already done something worthy of being flamed.

I'll bet you a post-ride bananna that she doesn't reply.

-Luigi

On 23 Feb 2004 05:42:46 GMT, David Reuteler wrote:

cheg wrote:
:
: We have a bicycle path that was built just for bicyclists here in
: Seattle so
: why do you two wheelers have to travel on roads that are not wide
: enough to
: accommadate you?
:
: If the "bicycle path" you are talking about is the Burke Gilman
: trail, the nearest point is over 3 miles away, near the Fremont
: bridge. Maybe they weren't going that way. We have a freeway built
: just for cars here in Seattle, why weren't you on it?
:
: State law gives bicycles the right to use public roads. Surprise,
: your convenience is not more important than theirs.

what i get a kick out of is the implicit belief in the statement ("travel
on roads that are not wide enough to accomodate you.") hmmmm, obviously
if they're wide enuf for a car they're wide enuf for a cyclist. but
me thinks that's not what she meant.

They're not wide enough for *me* to accomodate *you*.

Those pronouns. they'll get you coming or going.

-Luigi

true. but at the very least it's an uncontrolled vent. it's pretty damn
rude. i mean she's doing the equivalent of me strolling over to rec.kites
and complaining about ..

i've having real difficulty coming up with an example of bad things people
flying kits might do. but real bad things with kites, tho.

I was also having a very difficult time coming up with examples of times
I've been inconvenienced by those darned kite flyers. Maybe that string
that got wrapped up in my cassette was from a rogue kite flyer!!! Or how
many times we've had to subsidize their hospital stays because they were
electrocuted by lightning.

yea, overreacting indeed. and probably we should listen to her if there
is
a second post .. but she's already done something worthy of being flamed.

Agreed. She deserves it, and expects it. You don't write something like
that and not think people are going to come back pretty mad at you. Which
is a compelling reason for doing otherwise. Surprise her with reasoned,
rational replies and it might shake her up a bit and make her rethink her
position. Intense flaming rarely changes anyone's mind.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"David Reuteler" wrote in message
.. .
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
: But rarely do people "trolling" post with a legit address, as this
person
: did. She's been using that same address, and appears to be associated
with
: a kite-flying business, for many, many years.

true. but at the very least it's an uncontrolled vent. it's pretty damn
rude. i mean she's doing the equivalent of me strolling over to rec.kites
and complaining about ..

i've having real difficulty coming up with an example of bad things people
flying kits might do. but real bad things with kites, tho.

and saying that if a kite flyer (or kite business owner) gets in my way i
won't lift a finger to not maim them.

: I honestly there's a chance this person may simply be over-reacting to a
few
: coincidental situations she encountered. I'd treat her (for the moment)
as
: neither a troll nor someone deserving (yet) of being flamed. Best to
: attempt reason at first and see where it gets here. It could be totally
: disarming as she becomes aware that we're not all a bunch of
: testosterone-crazed ego-centric self-absorbed spandex-clad psychos.

yea, overreacting indeed. and probably we should listen to her if there
is
a second post .. but she's already done something worthy of being flamed.
--
david reuteler

Goodwinds wrote:
I really admire people who ride their bikes to and from work. I am
always curteous and give them the advantage. I have arthritis in my
hips so bicycling is out for me.
So why is that I find bicyclists so rude and road hogs? Recently a
bicyclist rode by my car and bashed off the side mirror. It cost me
$200 to repair. I was sitting in my car waiting for a bicyclist to
pass by. It was dusk and the person had nothing on their bike or
person to let people know they were man powered. So why did this
person bang on my car in such a manner as to scare the holy crap
outta me? {snip}

My guess? You did something terribly dangerous and didn't even know it, and
the cyclist (wrongly) lost his temper.

By any chance did you drive past this bike rider and THEN "sit and wait for
{him} to pass by"? I'll bet you cut him off and/or nearly ran him off the
road.

Bill "only thing worse than mean jerks are oblivious ones" S.

"Mike Jacoubowsky" wrote

Agreed. She deserves it, and expects it. You don't write something like
that and not think people are going to come back pretty mad at you. Which
is a compelling reason for doing otherwise. Surprise her with reasoned,
rational replies and it might shake her up a bit and make her rethink her
position. Intense flaming rarely changes anyone's mind.


Can we at least tell her to "go fly a kite"?

On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:03:29 GMT, "Alfred Ryder"
wrote:

"Mike Jacoubowsky" wrote

Agreed. She deserves it, and expects it. You don't write something like
that and not think people are going to come back pretty mad at you. Which
is a compelling reason for doing otherwise. Surprise her with reasoned,
rational replies and it might shake her up a bit and make her rethink her
position. Intense flaming rarely changes anyone's mind.


Can we at least tell her to "go fly a kite"?

She'll tell you to go play in traffic!

-Luigi

Luigi de Guzman wrote:
: She'll tell you to go play in traffic!

i'm be pretty surprised to hear her say that .. that we're playing in traffic
seems to be her primary complaint.
--
david reuteler

23 Feb 2004 03:16:50 GMT,
,
(Goodwinds) wrote:

So why did this person bang on my car in such a manner as to scare
the holy crap outta me?

Your holiness looked constipated?

thpppft!
--
zk

Goodwinds wrote:

So why is that I find bicyclists so rude and road hogs? Recently a bicyclist
rode by my car and bashed off the side mirror. It cost me $200 to repair. I
was sitting in my car waiting for a bicyclist to pass by. It was dusk and the
person had nothing on their bike or person to let people know they were man
powered. So why did this person bang on my car in such a manner as to scare
the holy crap outta me?

Sounds like an encounter with a jerk, who happened to be riding
a bicycle. Jerks are also known to drive cars, run ATVs and
boats, ride motorcycles and more.

Just recognize them for what they are and move on. No need to
trash humanity in general for individual people being selfish
fools.

We have a bicycle path that was built just for bicyclists here in Seattle so
why do you two wheelers have to travel on roads that are not wide enough to
accommadate you?

Although some communities have laws that require bicycle use on
bike paths instead of roads *if one is available*, in general
a bicycle is considered a *road vehicle*, and bike path or not,
entitled to travel on the road.

Today I had my fill. On a long narrow barely two lane road to a local beach,
several macho bikers were holding up a long line of traffic so they could prove
their manliness. We all have to share the roads but I pay my highway taxes and
you guys don't pay a damn thing! After seeing the rudness and crudness of the
display of macho egos and selfish attitudes you all have lost my respect!!!

I'd say the behavior you observed is generally not accepted by
most bicyclists as proper. Some bad apples.

That isn't to say "taking the lane", in other words, not moving
as far off the road to avoid "inconveniencing" motorists is
improper technique.

Just the opposite in general. Safety can demand a road bicyclist
ride farther out in the lane, *forcing* a motorist to slow and
wait for a safe time to pass the bicyclist.

It sounds as if you suffer from the "I pay taxes for this road;
you bicyclists don't belong here" syndrome. We can get into a
very long discourse over the correctness of this belief, bringing
into play real versus hidden, and short versus long term costs
of motor and human powered vehicles. I'll spare you that, but
this idea shouldn't really be the issue. It's one of *safe*
riding practice versus road courtesy.

Overall, you sound like the maligned party.

Just watch out because if I am ever on that road with you guys I am not moving
over! You can ride in the ditch for all I care. I was not even one of the car
being held up! I was going the other way and could see the concern on the
other drivers faces while these Yahoos on two wheels smugly pedeled UP the
dangerous road from Golden Gardens. You deserve what you get in my opinion!

Well just keep it all in context. Running down a bicyclist because
he "deserves what he gets" might end you up in jail, with serious
financial penalties in civil court for a long period of time.

Keep cool. Don't let a jerk who happens to ride a bike turn you
into a jerk who happens to be driving a car!


SMH

On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:36:30 -0500, Stephen Harding
wrote:

Well just keep it all in context. Running down a bicyclist because
he "deserves what he gets" might end you up in jail, with serious
financial penalties in civil court for a long period of time.


She'll take the risk. You can more easily fill a jury with motorists
who hate cyclists than you can with cyclists of any stripe.

-Luigi