Stripping paint off steel

I recently purchased a used Italian steel frame on eBay -- a circa 1991
Guerciotti. It's not particularly fancy -- chrome fork and chain stays, but
the rest is blue. The paint is almost perfect and...

....I'd like to fix that -- by removing it. (I don't like the color, and I'm
curious to see what a frame looks like naked). My plan is to strip it myself,
and then clearcoat it. Any sort of clear finish that protects the frame will
suit me fine. I'm not particularly gentle with my bikes, but I don't leave 'em
in the rain either.

1. Should I have this professionally done -- and if so, any suggestions about
dipping, sandblasting, etc. (I live in NYC)?

2. In researching this important issue I ran across the old newsgroup post
(excerpted below) which warns:
"Don't use OLD stripper, a chemical reaction can cause hydrogen embritlement in
certain grades of steel."

So... what is "OLD" stripper?

3. Do I need "Metalprep(DX-579)" if I'm going to clearcoat? And clearcoat
with what (ordinary furniture grade acrylic?).

thanks in advance

- Charles

========== FROM AN OLD NEWSGROUP POST =============
2: Apply a good quality aircraft grade stripper such as Klean Strip (PPG)
don't worry about the stickers, they'll start to peel at the edges and
will scrape right off. ( USE CAREFULLY - VERY STRONG STUFF ) You might
have to do this twice. Don't use OLD stripper, a chemical reaction can
cause hydrogen embritlement in certain grades of steel. Rinse well with
water to remove strippr. Lightly brush away any remaining paint flakes
around lugs or fittings with a brass bristle brush. OR GLASS bead blast
away the remaining paint. ( there won't be much. ) Sand blasting is
pretty harsh for road grade lightweight tubing. (IMHO!!)

3: Now is the time to get that alignment or new braze-ons!!

4: This step is VERY IMPORTANT so pay attention. If it isa steel frame
use Metalprep(DX-579) to chemically prepare the surface for primer.
If it is aluminum then use Alumiprep(DX-533) or Alodine to prep the
bare metal. If you skip this step on steel, well, you will get a
mediocre adhesion ( will chip easily ) if you skip this step on
aluminum watch out!! Paint will chip and flake away in weeks. (
No, I didn't try it, But we saw samples in Paint and Final
Finish School in the Navy )

===================
My other bike is a Masi Prestige dooded up by CycleArt & I will happily sell
it. Another bike that is too pretty for my taste.
My other other bike is a 1976 Viscount. Not for sale.
)

In article ,
abbit (Tilyou1) writes:

1. Should I have this professionally done -- and if so, any suggestions
about
dipping, sandblasting, etc. (I live in NYC)?

2. In researching this important issue I ran across the old newsgroup post
(excerpted below) which warns:
"Don't use OLD stripper, a chemical reaction can cause hydrogen embritlement
in
certain grades of steel."

So... what is "OLD" stripper?


I spent many hours trying to remove all the paint from an old Raleigh. If you
are faced with anything like that English stove enamel and your time is worth
anything at all consider having it media (aka: Sand) blasted. Or at least let
the media blaster do the detailing. Find a local powder coating outfit that
does bicycles and ask them who they use to prep a bicycle frame. When I had
one done the standard was to use walnut shell as the "media," not sand.

Tom Gibb

I don't know of any metal crystallization issues with any
chemical strippers. We've used Dupont 5662S to good effect.
A product called "Aircraft paint stripper" , which is
methyl based, from an auto parts store is phenomenally quick
even with the British Stove Enamel that resists anything else.

If you must abrade the finish, heed the admonition to avoid
sand or metal grit blasting. Use glass bead if you use
anything.

And after your metal prep a primer is best. We like regular
automotive grey primer-surfacers wetsanded then sprayed a
second time before the color .

If you want to show the brass work through a clear coat,
you'll find all those finishes mildly hydroscopic. The
steel will rust right through the clear. Just polishing and
oiling a steel frame looks pretty sharp too, for a couple
of days or even a week but without a well-bonded primer
under color you'll just watch it rust.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Tilyou1 wrote:

I recently purchased a used Italian steel frame on eBay -- a circa 1991
Guerciotti. It's not particularly fancy -- chrome fork and chain stays, but
the rest is blue. The paint is almost perfect and...

...I'd like to fix that -- by removing it. (I don't like the color, and I'm
curious to see what a frame looks like naked). My plan is to strip it myself,
and then clearcoat it. Any sort of clear finish that protects the frame will
suit me fine. I'm not particularly gentle with my bikes, but I don't leave 'em
in the rain either.

1. Should I have this professionally done -- and if so, any suggestions about
dipping, sandblasting, etc. (I live in NYC)?

2. In researching this important issue I ran across the old newsgroup post
(excerpted below) which warns:
"Don't use OLD stripper, a chemical reaction can cause hydrogen embritlement in
certain grades of steel."

So... what is "OLD" stripper?

3. Do I need "Metalprep(DX-579)" if I'm going to clearcoat? And clearcoat
with what (ordinary furniture grade acrylic?).

thanks in advance

- Charles

========== FROM AN OLD NEWSGROUP POST =============
2: Apply a good quality aircraft grade stripper such as Klean Strip (PPG)
don't worry about the stickers, they'll start to peel at the edges and
will scrape right off. ( USE CAREFULLY - VERY STRONG STUFF ) You might
have to do this twice. Don't use OLD stripper, a chemical reaction can
cause hydrogen embritlement in certain grades of steel. Rinse well with
water to remove strippr. Lightly brush away any remaining paint flakes
around lugs or fittings with a brass bristle brush. OR GLASS bead blast
away the remaining paint. ( there won't be much. ) Sand blasting is
pretty harsh for road grade lightweight tubing. (IMHO!!)

3: Now is the time to get that alignment or new braze-ons!!

4: This step is VERY IMPORTANT so pay attention. If it isa steel frame
use Metalprep(DX-579) to chemically prepare the surface for primer.
If it is aluminum then use Alumiprep(DX-533) or Alodine to prep the
bare metal. If you skip this step on steel, well, you will get a
mediocre adhesion ( will chip easily ) if you skip this step on
aluminum watch out!! Paint will chip and flake away in weeks. (
No, I didn't try it, But we saw samples in Paint and Final
Finish School in the Navy )

===================
My other bike is a Masi Prestige dooded up by CycleArt & I will happily sell
it. Another bike that is too pretty for my taste.
My other other bike is a 1976 Viscount. Not for sale.
)

A product called "Aircraft paint stripper" , which is
methyl based, from an auto parts store is phenomenally quick
even with the British Stove Enamel that resists anything else.


http://plaza.ufl.edu/phillee/crap/aircraft.jpg

--
Phil, Squid-in-Training

On 08 Feb 2004 07:27:07 GMT, abbit (Tilyou1) may have
said:

I recently purchased a used Italian steel frame on eBay -- a circa 1991
Guerciotti. It's not particularly fancy -- chrome fork and chain stays, but
the rest is blue. The paint is almost perfect and...

And if the chainstays are chrome, it may be chrome under the blue as
well. Given that, I would not recommend any type of abrasive or
blasting procedure for removal of the paint.

...I'd like to fix that -- by removing it. (I don't like the color, and I'm
curious to see what a frame looks like naked). My plan is to strip it myself,
and then clearcoat it. Any sort of clear finish that protects the frame will
suit me fine. I'm not particularly gentle with my bikes, but I don't leave 'em
in the rain either.

Automotive clearcoat, which is used as a topcoat over both solid and
metallic finishes, is perfect for what you propose. It adheres to
bare metal just fine. The good stuff is not sold in aerosol spray
cans, though, so you'll have to buy it from a professional automotive
paint supplier and use a spray gun to apply it...or you could yank
your headset cups, mask the inside of the head tube and BB, and get it
sprayed with the good stuff at any auto paint shop. If you aren't in
a hurry, and can wait for them to spray it at the same time that
they're spraying a car that needs it, you might even get it done
fairly cheap.

1. Should I have this professionally done -- and if so, any suggestions about
dipping, sandblasting, etc. (I live in NYC)?

From any Autozone store, and many other sources, you can get a
brush-on pain stripper called "Aircraft Remover" that will curdle the
paint and lift it from the surface. The stuff's nasty on skin,
though, so buy several pairs of latex gloves to use (and throw away)
as you work.

2. In researching this important issue I ran across the old newsgroup post
(excerpted below) which warns:
"Don't use OLD stripper, a chemical reaction can cause hydrogen embritlement in
certain grades of steel."

News to me; I've never run across that, and hydrogen embrittlement is
something I've seen in industrial plant equipment a few times...but it
shouldn't be a factor as far as I know in this situation.

So... what is "OLD" stripper?

Beats me, without a chemical composition spec to look at.

3. Do I need "Metalprep(DX-579)" if I'm going to clearcoat? And clearcoat
with what (ordinary furniture grade acrylic?).

Wood finishes are for wood. See above for my recommendation for a
finish.

The "Metalprep (DX579)" product is not familiar to me. It's a product
made by PPG; they supply a very good line of professional automotive
paints and finishes which are widely used in the auto body shop
industry. If your frame is indeed chomed throughout, then merely
getting the surface properly stripped and degreased should be all the
prep that's needed before clearcoat is applied...and while it might
not seem like clearcoating a chrome surface is really needed, it's
also quite possible that the chroming is fairly thin and porous, and
may develop rust pitting without the clearcoat. With it, you'll
likely have a very attractive result....but if the chroming is only
partial, then the "bare metal" look won't be consistent throughout.
This may or may not still produce an esthetically pleasing result, and
the only way to find out is to try. If the frame is not plated
throughout, bear in mind that it may begin to develop surface
corrosion to some extent almost immediately upon removal of the paint.
Your working window from paint stripping to clearcoat application may
be short, and if surface corrosion happens, you may have to do some
buffing to get shiny tubes. A plating shop would charge the value of
several appendages to chrome the whole thing, and might foul the BB
threads in the process. All of these are just considerations to keep
in mind. Good luck.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

Werehatrack wrote:

...
From any Autozone store, and many other sources, you can get a
brush-on pain stripper called "Aircraft Remover" that will curdle the
paint and lift it from the surface. The stuff's nasty on skin,
though, so buy several pairs of latex gloves to use (and throw away)
as you work.

I would use nitrile rubber instead or latex gloves when working with any
petroleum based solvent. These are readily available at any safety
supply outlet.

...and while it might
not seem like clearcoating a chrome surface is really needed, it's
also quite possible that the chroming is fairly thin and porous, and
may develop rust pitting without the clearcoat...

I used to own a nickel plated bicycle [1] that developed several rust
spots at pinholes in the plating and along some of the welds.

[1] http://www.liegeradinfo.de/wisbone2.jpg .

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities

On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 21:39:21 -0600, Tom Sherman
may have said:

Werehatrack wrote:

...
From any Autozone store, and many other sources, you can get a
brush-on pain stripper called "Aircraft Remover" that will curdle the
paint and lift it from the surface. The stuff's nasty on skin,
though, so buy several pairs of latex gloves to use (and throw away)
as you work.

I would use nitrile rubber instead or latex gloves when working with any
petroleum based solvent. These are readily available at any safety
supply outlet.

Good point, though they can be hard to find in some locales if you
don't know who's selling safety equipment as a sideline. Some paint
stores probably have them, though.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

Werehatrack wrote:

On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 21:39:21 -0600, Tom Sherman
may have said:


Werehatrack wrote:


...
From any Autozone store, and many other sources, you can get a
brush-on pain stripper called "Aircraft Remover" that will curdle the
paint and lift it from the surface. The stuff's nasty on skin,
though, so buy several pairs of latex gloves to use (and throw away)
as you work.

I would use nitrile rubber instead or latex gloves when working with any
petroleum based solvent. These are readily available at any safety
supply outlet.


Good point, though they can be hard to find in some locales if you
don't know who's selling safety equipment as a sideline. Some paint
stores probably have them, though.

There are also nitrile rubber medical gloves available. These are
typically blue (latex gloves are usually green or white) - no idea why
these colors are used.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities

Originally posted by Zeeexsixar
http://plaza.ufl.edu/phillee/crap/aircraft.jp

Right, but what do you use if your aircraft really, really smells

Sorry, I can resist posting to the "when do I replace my balls" threa
but this was just too much

JL


-

On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 06:08:55 -0600, Tom Sherman
wrote:
There are also nitrile rubber medical gloves available. These are
typically blue (latex gloves are usually green or white) - no idea why
these colors are used.

I'm pretty sure that medical nitrile gloves are purple.

I think the colors are so we can have discussions like this...
--
Rick Onanian