Pedal axle extenders in Europe

Phil W Lee wrote:



OK, for the pedantic:
Pedal reflectors complying with Schedule 20 Part 1 of the Road Vehicle
Lighting Regulations 1989 are mandatory on pedal cycles used during
the hours of darkness on the public highway in the UK, unless the
pedal cycle was manufactured before 1st October 1985.

Thanks Phil, I never realised that - I thought the legislation was
retrospective. As nearly all my cycles are pre-1985 it's useful to know.

If (optionally) fitted to pedal cycles manufactured before that date
(s20), they must still comply with the requirements laid down in the
schedule.

To get even more obscure, what about pre-1985 bikes fitted with pedal
reflectors as original equipment? If I remember correctly, some pedal
reflectors were made pre-war when strictly speaking, they were illegal.
The law was later changed to /permit/ their use without making them
compulsory, later still they were made compulsory. So, there are
probably a number about with reflectors that don't conform to any standard.

--
Andrew

On 1 July, 19:39, Naqerj wrote:
Phil W Lee wrote:

OK, for the pedantic:
Pedal reflectors complying with Schedule 20 Part 1 of the Road Vehicle
Lighting Regulations 1989 are mandatory on pedal cycles used during
the hours of darkness on the public highway in the UK, unless the
pedal cycle was manufactured before 1st October 1985.

Thanks Phil, I never realised that - I thought the legislation was
retrospective. *As nearly all my cycles are pre-1985 it's useful to know.

For bikes first constructed between 1985 and 1989, the legislation
does appear tpo be retrospective. From 1985 custom racing bikes were
excluded from the pedal reflector legislation, yet from Feb 1989,
supposedly all bikes from 1985 have to have pedal reflectors. It does
not tally up!


If (optionally) fitted to pedal cycles manufactured before that date
(s20), they must still comply with the requirements laid down in the
schedule.

To get even more obscure, what about pre-1985 bikes fitted with pedal
reflectors as original equipment? *If I remember correctly, some pedal
reflectors were made pre-war when strictly speaking, they were illegal.
* The law was later changed to /permit/ their use without making them
compulsory, later still they were made compulsory. *So, there are
probably a number about with reflectors that don't conform to any standard.

--
Andrew

Naqerj wrote:
Phil W Lee wrote:



OK, for the pedantic:
Pedal reflectors complying with Schedule 20 Part 1 of the Road Vehicle
Lighting Regulations 1989 are mandatory on pedal cycles used during
the hours of darkness on the public highway in the UK, unless the
pedal cycle was manufactured before 1st October 1985.

Thanks Phil, I never realised that - I thought the legislation was
retrospective. As nearly all my cycles are pre-1985 it's useful to know.

If (optionally) fitted to pedal cycles manufactured before that date
(s20), they must still comply with the requirements laid down in the
schedule.

To get even more obscure, what about pre-1985 bikes fitted with pedal
reflectors as original equipment? If I remember correctly, some pedal
reflectors were made pre-war when strictly speaking, they were illegal.
The law was later changed to /permit/ their use without making them
compulsory, later still they were made compulsory. So, there are
probably a number about with reflectors that don't conform to any standard.


By "pre-war" do you mean "Before Falklands"?
The inception of pedal reflectors IIRC was the CPSC
regulation of 1974.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Jul 1, 12:37*pm, thirty-six wrote:
On 1 July, 03:33, Nate Nagel wrote:





On 06/30/2010 09:56 PM, Clive George wrote:

On 01/07/2010 02:54, Nate Nagel wrote:
On 06/30/2010 09:32 PM, Barry wrote:
How does one address the situation of, say, using road-type clipless
pedals (e.g. Time, Look, SPD-SL, etc.) after dark? AFAIK the only
clipless pedals able to be fitted with reflectors are the kind that we
were discussing, that is, single-sided SPDs. Do shoes with reflective
material meet the spec? I'm guessing no...

You can get platforms to clip into double-sided spds, and indeed they
seem
to come with them.

I think some single-sided road pedals can be fitted with legal
reflectors,
but they're rare. I think they mount under the axle.

Shimano offers reflectors for its SPD-SL pedals:

http://tinyurl.com/sm-pd58

Learn something new, etc.

I don't think it needs to be said (but I will anyway) that those appear
that they would be positively embarassing to any self-respecting roadie,
not to mention that they look like they'd dramatically increase the
possibility of a pedal strike to one used to the same pedals without the
reflectors...

I'ma go out on a limb and guess that they're not particularly popular?

Can you see them for sale anywhere? Question is, is it the lack of
supply causing the lack of demand, or the other way round? I'm tempted
to agree with you and say the latter.

Well, since my state of residence I do not believe even requires pedal
reflectors (going off memory, I think the only requirements are
headlight and rear reflector) the answer is obviously "no."

Obviously there are far better alternatives for those wishing to have
pedal-area reflectivity, ankle bands and reflective tape being the two
that come immediately to mind.

And when I remember, I do carry, and use, reflective bands. *My lights
are good and I have backups.

I leave mine strapped around my rack, that way when I need them,
they're right there.

nate

N8N wrote:
On Jul 1, 12:37 pm, thirty-six wrote:
On 1 July, 03:33, Nate Nagel wrote:





On 06/30/2010 09:56 PM, Clive George wrote:
On 01/07/2010 02:54, Nate Nagel wrote:
On 06/30/2010 09:32 PM, Barry wrote:
How does one address the situation of, say, using road-type clipless
pedals (e.g. Time, Look, SPD-SL, etc.) after dark? AFAIK the only
clipless pedals able to be fitted with reflectors are the kind that we
were discussing, that is, single-sided SPDs. Do shoes with reflective
material meet the spec? I'm guessing no...
You can get platforms to clip into double-sided spds, and indeed they
seem
to come with them.
I think some single-sided road pedals can be fitted with legal
reflectors,
but they're rare. I think they mount under the axle.
Shimano offers reflectors for its SPD-SL pedals:
http://tinyurl.com/sm-pd58
Learn something new, etc.
I don't think it needs to be said (but I will anyway) that those appear
that they would be positively embarassing to any self-respecting roadie,
not to mention that they look like they'd dramatically increase the
possibility of a pedal strike to one used to the same pedals without the
reflectors...
I'ma go out on a limb and guess that they're not particularly popular?
Can you see them for sale anywhere? Question is, is it the lack of
supply causing the lack of demand, or the other way round? I'm tempted
to agree with you and say the latter.
Well, since my state of residence I do not believe even requires pedal
reflectors (going off memory, I think the only requirements are
headlight and rear reflector) the answer is obviously "no."
Obviously there are far better alternatives for those wishing to have
pedal-area reflectivity, ankle bands and reflective tape being the two
that come immediately to mind.
And when I remember, I do carry, and use, reflective bands. My lights
are good and I have backups.

I leave mine strapped around my rack, that way when I need them,
they're right there.

nate

These days the reflective tape is so good and so cheap I think it makes
sense to simply use it generously in places where solid reflectors might
have been used before as well as others where they couldn't. I've used
and seen it used on rear fenders and spokes (traditional spots), but
also on shoes, helmets, cranks, rims and frames. Why not? It weighs and
costs virtually nothing. I bought a big roll from an industrial supply
house & slap it everywhere.

On 1 July, 21:29, Peter Cole wrote:
N8N wrote:
On Jul 1, 12:37 pm, thirty-six wrote:
On 1 July, 03:33, Nate Nagel wrote:

On 06/30/2010 09:56 PM, Clive George wrote:
On 01/07/2010 02:54, Nate Nagel wrote:
On 06/30/2010 09:32 PM, Barry wrote:
How does one address the situation of, say, using road-type clipless
pedals (e.g. Time, Look, SPD-SL, etc.) after dark? AFAIK the only
clipless pedals able to be fitted with reflectors are the kind that we
were discussing, that is, single-sided SPDs. Do shoes with reflective
material meet the spec? I'm guessing no...
You can get platforms to clip into double-sided spds, and indeed they
seem
to come with them.
I think some single-sided road pedals can be fitted with legal
reflectors,
but they're rare. I think they mount under the axle.
Shimano offers reflectors for its SPD-SL pedals:
http://tinyurl.com/sm-pd58
Learn something new, etc.
I don't think it needs to be said (but I will anyway) that those appear
that they would be positively embarassing to any self-respecting roadie,
not to mention that they look like they'd dramatically increase the
possibility of a pedal strike to one used to the same pedals without the
reflectors...
I'ma go out on a limb and guess that they're not particularly popular?
Can you see them for sale anywhere? Question is, is it the lack of
supply causing the lack of demand, or the other way round? I'm tempted
to agree with you and say the latter.
Well, since my state of residence I do not believe even requires pedal
reflectors (going off memory, I think the only requirements are
headlight and rear reflector) the answer is obviously "no."
Obviously there are far better alternatives for those wishing to have
pedal-area reflectivity, ankle bands and reflective tape being the two
that come immediately to mind.
And when I remember, I do carry, and use, reflective bands. *My lights
are good and I have backups.

I leave mine strapped around my rack, that way when I need them,
they're right there.

nate

These days the reflective tape is so good and so cheap

Still, there are different amounts of relectivity, some of the highest
are too bright for large areas on vehicles.

I think it makes
sense to simply use it generously in places where solid reflectors might
have been used before as well as others where they couldn't. I've used
and seen it used on rear fenders and spokes (traditional spots), but
also on shoes, helmets, cranks, rims and frames. Why not?

Because any colour other than red will cause some deficiency in the
night vision of a following road user. Vast amounts of red in
themselves can cause a sort of blindness.

It weighs and
costs virtually nothing. I bought a big roll from an industrial supply
house & slap it everywhere.

What colour?

On 01 Jul 2010 21:46:26 GMT, Jobst Brandt wrote:

Tell it to Shimano, who year for year have reduced the area of white
"Scotchlite" heel cup on their shoes, as though it were a hazard.

Scotchlite is this: expensive. Never assume malice when influence of
accountants might explain the observed facts...

Guy
--
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/
The usenet price promise: all opinions offered in newsgroups are guaranteed
to be worth the price paid.

On 07/01/2010 04:29 PM, Peter Cole wrote:
N8N wrote:
On Jul 1, 12:37 pm, thirty-six wrote:
On 1 July, 03:33, Nate Nagel wrote:





On 06/30/2010 09:56 PM, Clive George wrote:
On 01/07/2010 02:54, Nate Nagel wrote:
On 06/30/2010 09:32 PM, Barry wrote:
How does one address the situation of, say, using road-type
clipless
pedals (e.g. Time, Look, SPD-SL, etc.) after dark? AFAIK the only
clipless pedals able to be fitted with reflectors are the kind
that we
were discussing, that is, single-sided SPDs. Do shoes with
reflective
material meet the spec? I'm guessing no...
You can get platforms to clip into double-sided spds, and indeed
they
seem
to come with them.
I think some single-sided road pedals can be fitted with legal
reflectors,
but they're rare. I think they mount under the axle.
Shimano offers reflectors for its SPD-SL pedals:
http://tinyurl.com/sm-pd58
Learn something new, etc.
I don't think it needs to be said (but I will anyway) that those
appear
that they would be positively embarassing to any self-respecting
roadie,
not to mention that they look like they'd dramatically increase the
possibility of a pedal strike to one used to the same pedals
without the
reflectors...
I'ma go out on a limb and guess that they're not particularly
popular?
Can you see them for sale anywhere? Question is, is it the lack of
supply causing the lack of demand, or the other way round? I'm tempted
to agree with you and say the latter.
Well, since my state of residence I do not believe even requires pedal
reflectors (going off memory, I think the only requirements are
headlight and rear reflector) the answer is obviously "no."
Obviously there are far better alternatives for those wishing to have
pedal-area reflectivity, ankle bands and reflective tape being the two
that come immediately to mind.
And when I remember, I do carry, and use, reflective bands. My lights
are good and I have backups.

I leave mine strapped around my rack, that way when I need them,
they're right there.

nate

These days the reflective tape is so good and so cheap I think it makes
sense to simply use it generously in places where solid reflectors might
have been used before as well as others where they couldn't. I've used
and seen it used on rear fenders and spokes (traditional spots), but
also on shoes, helmets, cranks, rims and frames. Why not? It weighs and
costs virtually nothing. I bought a big roll from an industrial supply
house & slap it everywhere.

I've done the same, but the ankle straps are handy if, say, I just want
to ride up to the library to get some books (~1 mile or so) and I'm
wearing long pants. It's as much as a convenience thing for keeping my
pants clean as it is for the reflective.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Jobst Brandt wrote:
Tell it to Shimano, who year for year have reduced the area of white
"Scotchlite" heel cup on their shoes, as though it were a hazard.

Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
Scotchlite is this: expensive. Never assume malice when influence of
accountants might explain the observed facts...

Relatively, yes. Specifically, maybe not so much.

A legband with USA-made 3M brand Reflexite 12mm x 240mm with
sewn-in-USA Velcro brand USA-made fastener material, as a
finished consumer product, retails at $2.95. (Reflexite is
more expensive, and more effective, than Scotchlite). The
reflective area of one legband is greater than that of any
pair of cycling shoes I can recall.

How significant is another cm or two of reflective trim to a
cycling shoe's price? I assume Shimano's vendor would source
Asian reflective material at some rate lower than USA retail
and the sewing step is already priced in.

I don't see the cost as compelling. I could be wrong.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 07/01/2010 09:57 PM, Phil W Lee wrote:
considered Thu, 1 Jul 2010 12:26:39
-0700 (PDT) the perfect time to write:

On 1 July, 19:39, wrote:
Phil W Lee wrote:

OK, for the pedantic:
Pedal reflectors complying with Schedule 20 Part 1 of the Road Vehicle
Lighting Regulations 1989 are mandatory on pedal cycles used during
the hours of darkness on the public highway in the UK, unless the
pedal cycle was manufactured before 1st October 1985.

Thanks Phil, I never realised that - I thought the legislation was
retrospective. As nearly all my cycles are pre-1985 it's useful to know.

For bikes first constructed between 1985 and 1989, the legislation
does appear tpo be retrospective. From 1985 custom racing bikes were
excluded from the pedal reflector legislation, yet from Feb 1989,
supposedly all bikes from 1985 have to have pedal reflectors. It does
not tally up!

It does when you realise that those custom racing bikes were only
legal (on public roads) for daytime use - and I don't see that as
inconsistent. I'd hardly expect the track bikes used on a velodrome,
or on semi-closed roads in the Tour of Britain to be fitted with pedal
reflectors - or to be road legal in many other respects, so it hardly
makes sense to insist on their being sold with pedal reflectors when
they don't necessarily even have brakes.

Apparently the "hipster" "track bike" "scene" has come to DC, I have
seen people tooling around on brakeless fixies even here.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel