Habanero shows up curved stays

On 4/2/2017 3:10 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, April 2, 2017 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/2/2017 10:54 AM, Joerg wrote:
The reason why I'd likely opt for a Ti-frame
if my current road bike ever fails beyond repair is that you can hardly
get steel frames anymore except at collector's prices.

There are thousands of them sold every day. Most are not brand new, but
that makes very little difference. In America, almost all used bikes
are very low mileage.

New ones are available too. Just last year, a good friend of mine
bought a new one that Andrew recommended. It cost roughly $1000. She
loves it.

The response will be "those are all collector's prices. A bike should cost no more than $99. I bought a new Schwinn Varsity in 1972 for $99, and it's still running today [yada, yada, yada . . . ]" To the extent reality matters, there are plenty of new steel frames on the market. Steel is seeing an LP-like resurgence in some sectors. One sector being a few miles from my office, over at Universal. Here's a simple $399 road frame: https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...1&category=119

-- Jay Beattie


You got ripped off. My new Varsity was $66.95
http://schwinncruisers.com/catalogs/1965.html

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 4/2/2017 4:10 PM, jbeattie wrote:

To the extent reality matters, there are plenty of new steel frames on the market. Steel is seeing an LP-like resurgence in some sectors.

Well, my favorite bike is aluminum, not steel; but it is analog. None
of those modern digital frames for me. You get a much warmer sound when
an analog aluminum bike hits a pothole.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Sun, 02 Apr 2017 07:54:32 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-04-01 20:49, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Apr 2017 07:59:34 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-03-31 17:45, John B. wrote:


[...]

I had a look at your Bikes Direct site and nowhere could I find a
reference to the specific Titanium alloy that their bikes are made
from. I would comment that after striping off the somewhat hysterical
sales pitch the bikes look surprisingly like those offered on Alibaba
at a noticeably cheaper price.


His Ti hardtail definitely is high class stuff. I have ridden it myself.
It almost feels like it ain't there yet it is very tough. I have also
see my buddy crash it in front of me where I thought "Now this is going
to bend it". It didn't.

What I think is that most of those frames end up coming from the same
huge factory somewhere in Taiwan or China and are largely assembled by
robots. Then some of them go to upscale companies where a huge profit
margin is tacked on, some to mass producers and some to places like
BikesDirect.

He's also got two fat bikes from them though those are aluminum frame.
We have ridden them together and they are also very sturdy. When
comparing the welds they looks identical on both bikes. I don't think
that is possible if done by hand.

But your cast iron (and very cheap) Thai made tires are far heavier
than other tires and you brag about them. Now you are telling us that
"weight is important"?


To most others, not to me. The reason why I'd likely opt for a Ti-frame
if my current road bike ever fails beyond repair is that you can hardly
get steel frames anymore except at collector's prices.

Where do you live? On the Moon? There are more than 30 custom bike
builders in the S.F. Bay area of California alone. Or you could buy a
steel frame from any of the places importing them from china and build
your own and even TREK is still selling the 520 model that is steel,

Or, you can but the Ti frame and bask in the sunlight of owning a real
treasure.

By the way, I just had a look at a site which says "The seven best
Titanium Bikes" and their average price is in the $2,500 (frame set
only) range.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 4/2/2017 7:06 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 02 Apr 2017 07:54:32 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-04-01 20:49, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Apr 2017 07:59:34 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-03-31 17:45, John B. wrote:


[...]

I had a look at your Bikes Direct site and nowhere could I find a
reference to the specific Titanium alloy that their bikes are made
from. I would comment that after striping off the somewhat hysterical
sales pitch the bikes look surprisingly like those offered on Alibaba
at a noticeably cheaper price.


His Ti hardtail definitely is high class stuff. I have ridden it myself.
It almost feels like it ain't there yet it is very tough. I have also
see my buddy crash it in front of me where I thought "Now this is going
to bend it". It didn't.

What I think is that most of those frames end up coming from the same
huge factory somewhere in Taiwan or China and are largely assembled by
robots. Then some of them go to upscale companies where a huge profit
margin is tacked on, some to mass producers and some to places like
BikesDirect.

He's also got two fat bikes from them though those are aluminum frame.
We have ridden them together and they are also very sturdy. When
comparing the welds they looks identical on both bikes. I don't think
that is possible if done by hand.

But your cast iron (and very cheap) Thai made tires are far heavier
than other tires and you brag about them. Now you are telling us that
"weight is important"?


To most others, not to me. The reason why I'd likely opt for a Ti-frame
if my current road bike ever fails beyond repair is that you can hardly
get steel frames anymore except at collector's prices.

Where do you live? On the Moon? There are more than 30 custom bike
builders in the S.F. Bay area of California alone. Or you could buy a
steel frame from any of the places importing them from china and build
your own and even TREK is still selling the 520 model that is steel,

Or, you can but the Ti frame and bask in the sunlight of owning a real
treasure.

By the way, I just had a look at a site which says "The seven best
Titanium Bikes" and their average price is in the $2,500 (frame set
only) range.
--
Cheers,

John B.


meh. Someone's subjective set of "best" is roughly
upper-middle of the range for Ti frames, not least expensive.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 03/04/17 09:07, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/2/2017 4:10 PM, jbeattie wrote:

To the extent reality matters, there are plenty of new steel frames
on the market. Steel is seeing an LP-like resurgence in some sectors.

Well, my favorite bike is aluminum, not steel; but it is analog. None
of those modern digital frames for me. You get a much warmer sound when
an analog aluminum bike hits a pothole.


Analog is too modern. I'd like to try a log frame. Apparently timber
frames have the most natural resonance of all, rims too.

--
JS

On Mon, 3 Apr 2017 10:20:39 +1000, James
wrote:

On 03/04/17 09:07, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/2/2017 4:10 PM, jbeattie wrote:

To the extent reality matters, there are plenty of new steel frames
on the market. Steel is seeing an LP-like resurgence in some sectors.

Well, my favorite bike is aluminum, not steel; but it is analog. None
of those modern digital frames for me. You get a much warmer sound when
an analog aluminum bike hits a pothole.


Analog is too modern. I'd like to try a log frame. Apparently timber
frames have the most natural resonance of all, rims too.

I believe that in American one can buy a custom made Bamboo frame :-)

Strange though, in a land where bamboo grows wild I don't believe I've
ever seen a frame made from the stuff :-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Sun, 02 Apr 2017 19:14:48 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 4/2/2017 7:06 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 02 Apr 2017 07:54:32 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-04-01 20:49, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Apr 2017 07:59:34 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-03-31 17:45, John B. wrote:


[...]

I had a look at your Bikes Direct site and nowhere could I find a
reference to the specific Titanium alloy that their bikes are made
from. I would comment that after striping off the somewhat hysterical
sales pitch the bikes look surprisingly like those offered on Alibaba
at a noticeably cheaper price.


His Ti hardtail definitely is high class stuff. I have ridden it myself.
It almost feels like it ain't there yet it is very tough. I have also
see my buddy crash it in front of me where I thought "Now this is going
to bend it". It didn't.

What I think is that most of those frames end up coming from the same
huge factory somewhere in Taiwan or China and are largely assembled by
robots. Then some of them go to upscale companies where a huge profit
margin is tacked on, some to mass producers and some to places like
BikesDirect.

He's also got two fat bikes from them though those are aluminum frame.
We have ridden them together and they are also very sturdy. When
comparing the welds they looks identical on both bikes. I don't think
that is possible if done by hand.

But your cast iron (and very cheap) Thai made tires are far heavier
than other tires and you brag about them. Now you are telling us that
"weight is important"?


To most others, not to me. The reason why I'd likely opt for a Ti-frame
if my current road bike ever fails beyond repair is that you can hardly
get steel frames anymore except at collector's prices.

Where do you live? On the Moon? There are more than 30 custom bike
builders in the S.F. Bay area of California alone. Or you could buy a
steel frame from any of the places importing them from china and build
your own and even TREK is still selling the 520 model that is steel,

Or, you can but the Ti frame and bask in the sunlight of owning a real
treasure.

By the way, I just had a look at a site which says "The seven best
Titanium Bikes" and their average price is in the $2,500 (frame set
only) range.
--
Cheers,

John B.


meh. Someone's subjective set of "best" is roughly
upper-middle of the range for Ti frames, not least expensive.

Well, yes, Subjective as in "Mine", or for a reporter it can even mean
"he gave me the most" :-(
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Mon, 03 Apr 2017 09:28:50 +0700, John B.
wrote:

I believe that in American one can buy a custom made Bamboo frame :-)

Yep. Made in Santa Cruz:
https://calfeedesign.com/products/bamboo/
Very organic:
"Hemp fiber lugs with plant based high performance eco resin"
Frame prices seem somewhat higher than titanium:
http://calfeedesign.com/product/single-frames-pricing/

Strange though, in a land where bamboo grows wild I don't believe I've
ever seen a frame made from the stuff :-)

It must be tough being forced to ride on titanium.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sun, 02 Apr 2017 16:37:26 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

You got ripped off. My new Varsity was $66.95
http://schwinncruisers.com/catalogs/1965.html

Using the CPI as the basis for an inflation calculator:
https://www.bls.gov/data/inflation_calculator.htm
that $67 bicycle would cost $518 today. Ouch.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sat, 1 Apr 2017 18:53:24 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:
Took the bike out today first ride 47 miles 2 hours 45 minutes never
unclipped felt rock solid. No noise in the frame, quietest bike I ever
ride. In the only real small down hill I got up to 34 mph and would
fell confident it descends well. Nothing in these parts that allow
going over 45 in a descent.

The only real one I do at the ski resort in Cadillac Michigan I get
chicken at about 42 mph and start feather brakes. Maybe on this Habby
I could let it go all out.

Great bike for sure weights about 18.4 with pedals in 58.How do those
pros have the guts to tuck and ride above 50?

Ah, go to YouTube and watch Sean Kelly chase Moreno Argentin downthe
Poggio in Milan-San Remo in 1992. There is some descending. Probably
nowhere near 50 mph at ny point due to the twistiness of the road.
Skill and guts.

Back in 2002 I did a tour in the Alps, the TV commentators overstate the
speeds down those roads- most of them are far too narrow and twisty to
hit 60 mph as claimed. Adn the consequences for missing a turn are
sometimes worth taking into consideration! There are a few stretches,
though, that are straight down the fall line without interruption and
the speed you can get up to quite quickly catches one's attention. I am
thinking of the sunny side of Col d'Izoard from about Brunissard to
(IIRC) Le Coin (on our map, anyway, which means "the corner" but I don't
think it was actually the name of anything; I can't recall the name of
the little town there ). Not a long stretch but steep and straight.
Fun!