Clip or not to clip - that was the question

In alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent on 6 Feb 2007 16:36:18 -0800
wrote:
Joel wrote:

I think it's just a random comment by a chiropractor and nothing more. He's
just thinking out loud & on the fly. He's likely wrong. Big whoop!

If there were a problem with the clipless system there would have been
many law suites by now, especially how law suit crazy the USA is.

I agree with the big whoop (!), I can assume a twisted ankle might
have been the cause for concern.

Only if you don't unclip in time.....

Only incidents I have had riding clipless have involved gravel rash,
and the pedals weren't the problem - kerbs were. That and a metal plate
in the wet.

hazard of high BB recumbents - chainwheel punctures on your shin!

Zebee

Joel wrote:
:: Roger Zoul wrote:
::: Peter Clinch wrote:
::::: wrote:
:::::
:::::: On the other hand, my chiropractor, who also has a great
:::::: interest in sports medicine, examined my recumbent and said that
:::::: he felt the twisting motion needed to get out of clipless pedals
:::::: would be harmful if used from a recumbent, rather than the
:::::: normal upright, position.
:::::
::::: I'd be interested to know why it malkes any difference at all.
::::: The body parts are more or less at similar angles to one another,
::::: just rotated back the way.
:::
::: I think it's just a random comment by a chiropractor and nothing
::: more. He's just thinking out loud & on the fly. He's likely wrong.
::: Big whoop!
:::
:::::
::::: Furthermore, I've been using Time ATACs on both uprights and
::::: 'bents for years now and don't notice any difference in use
::::: between one and the other. And since clipless are remarkanly
::::: common on 'bents, you'd have thought that a lot of problems would
::::: be showing up by now if this was true, but it's the first I've
::::: heard of it.
:::::
::::: Pete.
::::: --
::::: Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
::::: Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells
::::: Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland
::::: UK
::::: net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
:::
:::
:: If there were a problem with the clipless system there would have
:: been many law suites by now, especially how law suit crazy the USA
:: is. And as far as your chiropractor making a remark like that still
:: is a no, no as far as I am concerned. People expect proper and
:: factual remarks from a medical practitioner.

On all topics? What does a chiropractor know about bicycles and pedals? Do
they get trained on this?

People have no right to have these expectations.

My uncle was a
:: chiropractor for many years and I felt he was good at what he did,
:: but I also feel that many practice a little under the guidelines. I
:: had such a chiropractor and he caused me nothing but pain, if I knew
:: then what I know now I would be in a lot better shape.

Robert Stevahn Wrote:
On 6 Feb 2007 10:51:43 -0800, wrote:

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I'm sorry, but this post is complete nonsense. My Speedplay X-type
cleats and pedals work perfectly well on my SWB (or any other, I'd
wager) bicycle. Many other people use many other systems with no
problem at all.

-- Robert
You don't have to say you're sorry for calling a spade a spade. The
entire forum here seems to be about nothing but complete nonsense. Pure
pabulum for weak and insecure.


--
nget

wrote in message
ps.com...
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I know that toe clips aren't popular these days. On the recumbent,
however, they are a little more problamatic. They are a lot slower to
get in to because one has to come from ``underneath'' the clip; the
traditional method of catching the rear point of the pedal on the sole
of the shoe doesn't work well when you are behind the pedals rather
than above them.

I don't recommend clips-and-straps for recumbent use .

On the other hand, my chiropractor, who also has a great interest in
sports medicine, examined my recumbent and said that he felt the
twisting motion needed to get out of clipless pedals would be harmful
if used from a recumbent, rather than the normal upright, position.

It's possible. I've experienced pretty nasty pain in my knees from jerking
my foot out of SPD's that were set too tight. (I'm not a fan of SPD's, and
ride them as infrequently as possible.)

When you are using toeclips, the type of shoes you wear is quite
important. My first test rides on my recumbent were in street shoes,
and I couldn't keep my feet in the clips for any length of time. (If I
didn't actively push my feet up when in the clips, they would just
fall right out.)

Yep. That's why PowerGrips are (or were) popular for commuters (around here
anyway).

snippage
I can relax my legs completely and my feet will still `hang' in the
toeclips.

THAT is what you want. To avoid dropping a foot while riding, you want to
be able to hang your feet freely from the pedals. This is especially
important when riding extremely laid-back bikes like low racers, where
dropping a foot by accident can severely wrench your knee.

Some recumbent riders here on ARBR prefer the "lollipop" style pedals made
by Speedplay and BeBop, because they are foolproof to get in and out of, and
easy on the knees. Here's an archived thread comparing these pedals:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.r...edc71195680aa5

What Me Worry? wrote:

It's possible. I've experienced pretty nasty pain in my knees from jerking
my foot out of SPD's that were set too tight. (I'm not a fan of SPD's, and
ride them as infrequently as possible.)

Have you tried Time ATACs/Aliums? No fiddling about with tension
like SPuDs, the mechanisms handle all that for you and they're
always (IME) pretty easy in and out but won't let go unless you
want them to, even with badly worn cleats. I've got pretty dodgy
knees but never any trouble from my ATACs.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

On 2007-02-07 16:59:57 +0000, Peter Clinch said:

What Me Worry? wrote:

It's possible. I've experienced pretty nasty pain in my knees from
jerking my foot out of SPD's that were set too tight. (I'm not a fan
of SPD's, and ride them as infrequently as possible.)

Have you tried Time ATACs/Aliums? No fiddling about with tension like
SPuDs, the mechanisms handle all that for you and they're always (IME)
pretty easy in and out but won't let go unless you want them to, even
with badly worn cleats. I've got pretty dodgy knees but never any
trouble from my ATACs.

Pete.

I have no anteria or posteria cruciate ligaments in my left knee and a
re-profiled, re constructed tibial plateau and I use ATACs to great
effect, I cannot walk to well but I can cycle for hundreds of km.
--
Three wheels good, two wheels ok

www.catrike.co.uk

SPD clipless pedals work great on a bent.( better that an upright) I would
not be without them . The last thing you want is for your foot to slip off
while coasting. Ouch

1
wrote in message
ps.com...
R E C U M B E N T P E D A L N O T E S
------------------------------------------------------------------------

I know that toe clips aren't popular these days. On the recumbent,
however, they are a little more problamatic. They are a lot slower to
get in to because one has to come from ``underneath'' the clip; the
traditional method of catching the rear point of the pedal on the sole
of the shoe doesn't work well when you are behind the pedals rather
than above them.

On the other hand, my chiropractor, who also has a great interest in
sports medicine, examined my recumbent and said that he felt the
twisting motion needed to get out of clipless pedals would be harmful
if used from a recumbent, rather than the normal upright, position.
When you are using toeclips, the type of shoes you wear is quite
important. My first test rides on my recumbent were in street shoes,
and I couldn't keep my feet in the clips for any length of time. (If I
didn't actively push my feet up when in the clips, they would just
fall right out.)

In my touring shoes, which are designed for toeclips, I don't have
this problem. I've got a pair of old Sidi touring shoes, which have
about 3 mm deep left-right grooves in the sole under the ball of the
foot. On an upright bike these help to catch the hook on the back of
the pedal to help one clip in. (They work very well: on my upright I
can get back into clips faster than most people I know can cleat in. I
sometimes find myself looking down to find out why I'm having so much
trouble getting into the clip to find that my foot went in so smoothly
and quickly that I never noticed it.)

On my recumbent (and presumably on my upright, though I didn't notice
it as much) these grooves act like small cleats, and help to keep my
foot locked into the pedal. I keep my toe straps quite tight. I
thought this would make the clips more difficult to get in to, but it
doesn't, and it takes a good solid tug to get my feet out of the
clips. (But I've got no problem doing it; I do it at every stoplight.)
I can relax my legs completely and my feet will still `hang' in the
toeclips.

I have also tried a pair of old racing shoes (designed for toe clips
and straps) with cleats on them. They really lock your foot in nicely,
but it wasn't as easy to get the foot out (though it could still be
done without any inordinant amount of difficulty). The biggest problem
with these was the very smooth, hard sole, which made walking and even
standing very difficult. I actually fell over on my recumbent at one
point after I had put my foot down on the ground because the shoe just
slid out from under me. The touring shoes never have this problem.

Sad to say, proper shoes designed for clip systems are awfully
difficult to find these days. Modern cycling shoes can be bought with
a little rubber plate in place of the cleat (one would normally remove
this to install the cleat) but I've not seen any shoes recently that
have the grooves my Sidi shoes have.