Redline Conquest

On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 5:33:01 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 3:45:07 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 8:52:56 AM UTC-7, Zen Cycle wrote:
On Monday, October 21, 2019 at 1:36:21 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:

Again, skippy, The link you posted directly contradicts your claim. So, who is it that doesn't know what they're talking about?

On the smartest day of your life you couldn't out-think a tin pan could
you?

That's a question you should be asking yourself.

Someone that claims to be the world's expert in anything and
everything

I've never claimed that. Not even close. In fact, I'm smart enough to know that the more I learn, the more I find out I don't know. You don't seem to understand the complexity of life in general.

cannot even understand the English Language.

You me the english language in your link that lists specific riders bikes that are equipped with discs?

You really are beyond pathetic. Rather than actually address the issue, the entire content of your argument is 'you're stupid'. You really aren't with the trouble.

You mean the list that shows more riders ride with rim brakes than disks? And despite saying that they use disks on TT bikes the vast majority don't? Or that Guess Who didn't even ride his sponsor's bike because it had disks on the TT bike?

Your initial post was wrong. Mavic neutral support does carry disc wheels https://tinyurl.com/yyc25cmv; pros riding flat-inducing courses like the Paris Roubaix are riding discs, including this year's winner. https://www.cyclingnews.com/features...at-debut-race/ Some pro teams use disc wheels and some do not. When the spring classics start, we'll have a better idea of who is riding what. BTW, Alaphilippe won the TdF TT on a disc-equipped Specialized Shiv: https://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-fr...n-alaphilippe/

Most people do not fear discs. I was riding rim brakes today, and in the wet leaves and muck, the pads sounded like a lathe on my tender aluminum brake tracks on the Dura-Ace wheels. I wish I had discs. In fact, I wish I had a gravel bike rather than a race bike on the leaf covered dirt road climb.

-- Jay Beattie.

Jay, that is not "neutral support" since they only carry Mavic disk wheels which only mount on Mavic wheel specific frames - or at least they did unless they have made a universal standard since the last time I looked. They make a point of that during the last Tour. They talked about how the Mavic wheels didn't fit and the team car was way back and the mechanic was running up with the proper disk wheel. Whoever it was, was changing bikes with a teammate and halted since it wasn't the correct size and the mechanic had arrived.

On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 9:51:28 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 5:33:01 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 3:45:07 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 8:52:56 AM UTC-7, Zen Cycle wrote:
On Monday, October 21, 2019 at 1:36:21 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:

Again, skippy, The link you posted directly contradicts your claim. So, who is it that doesn't know what they're talking about?

On the smartest day of your life you couldn't out-think a tin pan could
you?

That's a question you should be asking yourself.

Someone that claims to be the world's expert in anything and
everything

I've never claimed that. Not even close. In fact, I'm smart enough to know that the more I learn, the more I find out I don't know. You don't seem to understand the complexity of life in general.

cannot even understand the English Language.

You me the english language in your link that lists specific riders bikes that are equipped with discs?

You really are beyond pathetic. Rather than actually address the issue, the entire content of your argument is 'you're stupid'. You really aren't with the trouble.

You mean the list that shows more riders ride with rim brakes than disks? And despite saying that they use disks on TT bikes the vast majority don't? Or that Guess Who didn't even ride his sponsor's bike because it had disks on the TT bike?

Your initial post was wrong. Mavic neutral support does carry disc wheels https://tinyurl.com/yyc25cmv; pros riding flat-inducing courses like the Paris Roubaix are riding discs, including this year's winner. https://www..cyclingnews.com/feature...at-debut-race/ Some pro teams use disc wheels and some do not. When the spring classics start, we'll have a better idea of who is riding what. BTW, Alaphilippe won the TdF TT on a disc-equipped Specialized Shiv: https://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-fr...n-alaphilippe/

Most people do not fear discs. I was riding rim brakes today, and in the wet leaves and muck, the pads sounded like a lathe on my tender aluminum brake tracks on the Dura-Ace wheels. I wish I had discs. In fact, I wish I had a gravel bike rather than a race bike on the leaf covered dirt road climb.

-- Jay Beattie.

Jay, that is not "neutral support" since they only carry Mavic disk wheels which only mount on Mavic wheel specific frames - or at least they did unless they have made a universal standard since the last time I looked. They make a point of that during the last Tour. They talked about how the Mavic wheels didn't fit and the team car was way back and the mechanic was running up with the proper disk wheel. Whoever it was, was changing bikes with a teammate and halted since it wasn't the correct size and the mechanic had arrived.

They carry neutral support bicycles primarily, and there is no Mavic wheel specific frame -- there are just through axle/hub standards, but yes, if you're running some odd-ball Specialized SCS standard, the Mavic wheels either won't fit or won't shift right. I suspect the neutral support disc wheels they have are 12/100 and 12/142, and I believe the article said 160mm rotors. This is not a universal standard but probably the most common. If you have the narrower Specialized rear or a 15mm front or a 140mm rotor, you're SOL and get a yellow bike to ride. I'm sure there are similar problems with Campy/Shimano incompatibility and maybe even 11/12 speed, etc. There are so many variations even without discs that neutral support must be a nightmare. The year one team was running one-by was probably the worst, but that looks to be a thing of the past. The riders hated it. I think the Mavic bike with a dropper post is probably the best choice these days.

-- Jay Beattie.

On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 10:42:31 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 9:51:28 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 5:33:01 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 3:45:07 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 8:52:56 AM UTC-7, Zen Cycle wrote:
On Monday, October 21, 2019 at 1:36:21 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:

Again, skippy, The link you posted directly contradicts your claim. So, who is it that doesn't know what they're talking about?

On the smartest day of your life you couldn't out-think a tin pan could
you?

That's a question you should be asking yourself.

Someone that claims to be the world's expert in anything and
everything

I've never claimed that. Not even close. In fact, I'm smart enough to know that the more I learn, the more I find out I don't know. You don't seem to understand the complexity of life in general.

cannot even understand the English Language.

You me the english language in your link that lists specific riders bikes that are equipped with discs?

You really are beyond pathetic. Rather than actually address the issue, the entire content of your argument is 'you're stupid'. You really aren't with the trouble.

You mean the list that shows more riders ride with rim brakes than disks? And despite saying that they use disks on TT bikes the vast majority don't? Or that Guess Who didn't even ride his sponsor's bike because it had disks on the TT bike?

Your initial post was wrong. Mavic neutral support does carry disc wheels https://tinyurl.com/yyc25cmv; pros riding flat-inducing courses like the Paris Roubaix are riding discs, including this year's winner. https://www.cyclingnews.com/features...at-debut-race/ Some pro teams use disc wheels and some do not. When the spring classics start, we'll have a better idea of who is riding what. BTW, Alaphilippe won the TdF TT on a disc-equipped Specialized Shiv: https://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-fr...n-alaphilippe/

Most people do not fear discs. I was riding rim brakes today, and in the wet leaves and muck, the pads sounded like a lathe on my tender aluminum brake tracks on the Dura-Ace wheels. I wish I had discs. In fact, I wish I had a gravel bike rather than a race bike on the leaf covered dirt road climb.

-- Jay Beattie.

Jay, that is not "neutral support" since they only carry Mavic disk wheels which only mount on Mavic wheel specific frames - or at least they did unless they have made a universal standard since the last time I looked. They make a point of that during the last Tour. They talked about how the Mavic wheels didn't fit and the team car was way back and the mechanic was running up with the proper disk wheel. Whoever it was, was changing bikes with a teammate and halted since it wasn't the correct size and the mechanic had arrived.

They carry neutral support bicycles primarily, and there is no Mavic wheel specific frame -- there are just through axle/hub standards, but yes, if you're running some odd-ball Specialized SCS standard, the Mavic wheels either won't fit or won't shift right. I suspect the neutral support disc wheels they have are 12/100 and 12/142, and I believe the article said 160mm rotors. This is not a universal standard but probably the most common. If you have the narrower Specialized rear or a 15mm front or a 140mm rotor, you're SOL and get a yellow bike to ride. I'm sure there are similar problems with Campy/Shimano incompatibility and maybe even 11/12 speed, etc. There are so many variations even without discs that neutral support must be a nightmare. The year one team was running one-by was probably the worst, but that looks to be a thing of the past. The riders hated it. I think the Mavic bike with a dropper post is probably the best choice these days.

-- Jay Beattie.

As far as I know there are 8, 9 and 10 mm axles and quick releases on the 8 mm and quick releases or screw-in on the 9 mm and two different sorts of screw-in on the 10 mm.

Unless they have settled on a standard since the Tour it remains the same with quick release wheels mostly being the age old rim brakes. The Neutral support car simply doesn't have room to carry all the different types and why should they?

The UCI has even passed a rule that you cannot have a rim brake mounted behind the fork head since it is an unfair aero advantage (???)

On 10/27/2019 1:38 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 10:42:31 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 9:51:28 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 5:33:01 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 3:45:07 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 8:52:56 AM UTC-7, Zen Cycle wrote:
On Monday, October 21, 2019 at 1:36:21 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:

Again, skippy, The link you posted directly contradicts your claim. So, who is it that doesn't know what they're talking about?

On the smartest day of your life you couldn't out-think a tin pan could
you?

That's a question you should be asking yourself.

Someone that claims to be the world's expert in anything and
everything

I've never claimed that. Not even close. In fact, I'm smart enough to know that the more I learn, the more I find out I don't know. You don't seem to understand the complexity of life in general.

cannot even understand the English Language.

You me the english language in your link that lists specific riders bikes that are equipped with discs?

You really are beyond pathetic. Rather than actually address the issue, the entire content of your argument is 'you're stupid'. You really aren't with the trouble.

You mean the list that shows more riders ride with rim brakes than disks? And despite saying that they use disks on TT bikes the vast majority don't? Or that Guess Who didn't even ride his sponsor's bike because it had disks on the TT bike?

Your initial post was wrong. Mavic neutral support does carry disc wheels https://tinyurl.com/yyc25cmv; pros riding flat-inducing courses like the Paris Roubaix are riding discs, including this year's winner. https://www.cyclingnews.com/features...at-debut-race/ Some pro teams use disc wheels and some do not. When the spring classics start, we'll have a better idea of who is riding what. BTW, Alaphilippe won the TdF TT on a disc-equipped Specialized Shiv: https://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-fr...n-alaphilippe/

Most people do not fear discs. I was riding rim brakes today, and in the wet leaves and muck, the pads sounded like a lathe on my tender aluminum brake tracks on the Dura-Ace wheels. I wish I had discs. In fact, I wish I had a gravel bike rather than a race bike on the leaf covered dirt road climb.

-- Jay Beattie.

Jay, that is not "neutral support" since they only carry Mavic disk wheels which only mount on Mavic wheel specific frames - or at least they did unless they have made a universal standard since the last time I looked. They make a point of that during the last Tour. They talked about how the Mavic wheels didn't fit and the team car was way back and the mechanic was running up with the proper disk wheel. Whoever it was, was changing bikes with a teammate and halted since it wasn't the correct size and the mechanic had arrived.

They carry neutral support bicycles primarily, and there is no Mavic wheel specific frame -- there are just through axle/hub standards, but yes, if you're running some odd-ball Specialized SCS standard, the Mavic wheels either won't fit or won't shift right. I suspect the neutral support disc wheels they have are 12/100 and 12/142, and I believe the article said 160mm rotors. This is not a universal standard but probably the most common. If you have the narrower Specialized rear or a 15mm front or a 140mm rotor, you're SOL and get a yellow bike to ride. I'm sure there are similar problems with Campy/Shimano incompatibility and maybe even 11/12 speed, etc. There are so many variations even without discs that neutral support must be a nightmare. The year one team was running one-by was probably the worst, but that looks to be a thing of the past. The riders hated it. I think the Mavic bike with a dropper post is probably the best choice these days.

-- Jay Beattie.

As far as I know there are 8, 9 and 10 mm axles and quick releases on the 8 mm and quick releases or screw-in on the 9 mm and two different sorts of screw-in on the 10 mm.

Unless they have settled on a standard since the Tour it remains the same with quick release wheels mostly being the age old rim brakes. The Neutral support car simply doesn't have room to carry all the different types and why should they?

The UCI has even passed a rule that you cannot have a rim brake mounted behind the fork head since it is an unfair aero advantage (???)


Standards are great - and so we have an endless supply of them:
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/p...ard-yet-308139
(note that was a year and a half ago. There are more now)

What self-respecting brand manager would ever use the same
format as THOSE PEOPLE at the other vendor?

And in our brave new world where tooling cost is almost nil,
anyone can just make things up. And many do.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 12:04:33 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 10/27/2019 1:38 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 10:42:31 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 9:51:28 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 5:33:01 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 3:45:07 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 8:52:56 AM UTC-7, Zen Cycle wrote:
On Monday, October 21, 2019 at 1:36:21 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:

Again, skippy, The link you posted directly contradicts your claim. So, who is it that doesn't know what they're talking about?

On the smartest day of your life you couldn't out-think a tin pan could
you?

That's a question you should be asking yourself.

Someone that claims to be the world's expert in anything and
everything

I've never claimed that. Not even close. In fact, I'm smart enough to know that the more I learn, the more I find out I don't know. You don't seem to understand the complexity of life in general.

cannot even understand the English Language.

You me the english language in your link that lists specific riders bikes that are equipped with discs?

You really are beyond pathetic. Rather than actually address the issue, the entire content of your argument is 'you're stupid'. You really aren't with the trouble.

You mean the list that shows more riders ride with rim brakes than disks? And despite saying that they use disks on TT bikes the vast majority don't? Or that Guess Who didn't even ride his sponsor's bike because it had disks on the TT bike?

Your initial post was wrong. Mavic neutral support does carry disc wheels https://tinyurl.com/yyc25cmv; pros riding flat-inducing courses like the Paris Roubaix are riding discs, including this year's winner. https://www.cyclingnews.com/features...at-debut-race/ Some pro teams use disc wheels and some do not. When the spring classics start, we'll have a better idea of who is riding what. BTW, Alaphilippe won the TdF TT on a disc-equipped Specialized Shiv: https://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-fr...n-alaphilippe/

Most people do not fear discs. I was riding rim brakes today, and in the wet leaves and muck, the pads sounded like a lathe on my tender aluminum brake tracks on the Dura-Ace wheels. I wish I had discs. In fact, I wish I had a gravel bike rather than a race bike on the leaf covered dirt road climb.

-- Jay Beattie.

Jay, that is not "neutral support" since they only carry Mavic disk wheels which only mount on Mavic wheel specific frames - or at least they did unless they have made a universal standard since the last time I looked. They make a point of that during the last Tour. They talked about how the Mavic wheels didn't fit and the team car was way back and the mechanic was running up with the proper disk wheel. Whoever it was, was changing bikes with a teammate and halted since it wasn't the correct size and the mechanic had arrived.

They carry neutral support bicycles primarily, and there is no Mavic wheel specific frame -- there are just through axle/hub standards, but yes, if you're running some odd-ball Specialized SCS standard, the Mavic wheels either won't fit or won't shift right. I suspect the neutral support disc wheels they have are 12/100 and 12/142, and I believe the article said 160mm rotors. This is not a universal standard but probably the most common. If you have the narrower Specialized rear or a 15mm front or a 140mm rotor, you're SOL and get a yellow bike to ride. I'm sure there are similar problems with Campy/Shimano incompatibility and maybe even 11/12 speed, etc. There are so many variations even without discs that neutral support must be a nightmare. The year one team was running one-by was probably the worst, but that looks to be a thing of the past. The riders hated it. I think the Mavic bike with a dropper post is probably the best choice these days.

-- Jay Beattie.

As far as I know there are 8, 9 and 10 mm axles and quick releases on the 8 mm and quick releases or screw-in on the 9 mm and two different sorts of screw-in on the 10 mm.

Unless they have settled on a standard since the Tour it remains the same with quick release wheels mostly being the age old rim brakes. The Neutral support car simply doesn't have room to carry all the different types and why should they?

The UCI has even passed a rule that you cannot have a rim brake mounted behind the fork head since it is an unfair aero advantage (???)


Standards are great - and so we have an endless supply of them:
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/p...ard-yet-308139
(note that was a year and a half ago. There are more now)

What self-respecting brand manager would ever use the same
format as THOSE PEOPLE at the other vendor?

And in our brave new world where tooling cost is almost nil,
anyone can just make things up. And many do.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Now we have to figure out a way to get Lawyers Lips on them for Jay to not remove.

On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 12:04:33 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 10/27/2019 1:38 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 10:42:31 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, October 27, 2019 at 9:51:28 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 5:33:01 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 3:45:07 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, October 26, 2019 at 8:52:56 AM UTC-7, Zen Cycle wrote:
On Monday, October 21, 2019 at 1:36:21 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:

Again, skippy, The link you posted directly contradicts your claim. So, who is it that doesn't know what they're talking about?

On the smartest day of your life you couldn't out-think a tin pan could
you?

That's a question you should be asking yourself.

Someone that claims to be the world's expert in anything and
everything

I've never claimed that. Not even close. In fact, I'm smart enough to know that the more I learn, the more I find out I don't know. You don't seem to understand the complexity of life in general.

cannot even understand the English Language.

You me the english language in your link that lists specific riders bikes that are equipped with discs?

You really are beyond pathetic. Rather than actually address the issue, the entire content of your argument is 'you're stupid'. You really aren't with the trouble.

You mean the list that shows more riders ride with rim brakes than disks? And despite saying that they use disks on TT bikes the vast majority don't? Or that Guess Who didn't even ride his sponsor's bike because it had disks on the TT bike?

Your initial post was wrong. Mavic neutral support does carry disc wheels https://tinyurl.com/yyc25cmv; pros riding flat-inducing courses like the Paris Roubaix are riding discs, including this year's winner. https://www.cyclingnews.com/features...at-debut-race/ Some pro teams use disc wheels and some do not. When the spring classics start, we'll have a better idea of who is riding what. BTW, Alaphilippe won the TdF TT on a disc-equipped Specialized Shiv: https://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-fr...n-alaphilippe/

Most people do not fear discs. I was riding rim brakes today, and in the wet leaves and muck, the pads sounded like a lathe on my tender aluminum brake tracks on the Dura-Ace wheels. I wish I had discs. In fact, I wish I had a gravel bike rather than a race bike on the leaf covered dirt road climb.

-- Jay Beattie.

Jay, that is not "neutral support" since they only carry Mavic disk wheels which only mount on Mavic wheel specific frames - or at least they did unless they have made a universal standard since the last time I looked. They make a point of that during the last Tour. They talked about how the Mavic wheels didn't fit and the team car was way back and the mechanic was running up with the proper disk wheel. Whoever it was, was changing bikes with a teammate and halted since it wasn't the correct size and the mechanic had arrived.

They carry neutral support bicycles primarily, and there is no Mavic wheel specific frame -- there are just through axle/hub standards, but yes, if you're running some odd-ball Specialized SCS standard, the Mavic wheels either won't fit or won't shift right. I suspect the neutral support disc wheels they have are 12/100 and 12/142, and I believe the article said 160mm rotors. This is not a universal standard but probably the most common. If you have the narrower Specialized rear or a 15mm front or a 140mm rotor, you're SOL and get a yellow bike to ride. I'm sure there are similar problems with Campy/Shimano incompatibility and maybe even 11/12 speed, etc. There are so many variations even without discs that neutral support must be a nightmare. The year one team was running one-by was probably the worst, but that looks to be a thing of the past. The riders hated it. I think the Mavic bike with a dropper post is probably the best choice these days.

-- Jay Beattie.

As far as I know there are 8, 9 and 10 mm axles and quick releases on the 8 mm and quick releases or screw-in on the 9 mm and two different sorts of screw-in on the 10 mm.

Unless they have settled on a standard since the Tour it remains the same with quick release wheels mostly being the age old rim brakes. The Neutral support car simply doesn't have room to carry all the different types and why should they?

The UCI has even passed a rule that you cannot have a rim brake mounted behind the fork head since it is an unfair aero advantage (???)


Standards are great - and so we have an endless supply of them:
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/p...ard-yet-308139
(note that was a year and a half ago. There are more now)

What self-respecting brand manager would ever use the same
format as THOSE PEOPLE at the other vendor?

And in our brave new world where tooling cost is almost nil,
anyone can just make things up. And many do.

And right here in Ory-gun: https://robertaxleproject.com/ Through axles making the economy strong!

The Cycling Weekly article does reinforce the idea that 12/100 12/142 is becoming the standard, if it is not dislodged by Boost, or Boost Plus, or Boost 2.0, 2.1, etc.

-- Jay Beattie.