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Shimano chains - rivet reuse?



 
 
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  #21  
Old August 22nd 05, 05:30 PM
Leo Lichtman
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?


"Alex Rodriguez" wrote: (clip) There is a reason Shimano insists you use
those expensive pins.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
There is more than one reason. One of them is it costs pennies to make, and
sells for dollars.


Ads
  #22  
Old August 22nd 05, 05:44 PM
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?


Martin wrote:
The other day the mechanic at my local bike shop rejoined my Shimano 10
speed Ultegra chain reusing two rivets. Looking at the link under a
jeweler's magnifying glass I can clearly see that the peening on the
rivets is missing and I can see the countersinking in the plates around
the rivets.

The mechanic is very experienced, very well respected and services many
bikes in a busy shop. It looks like the rivets have been inserted to the
correct depth. Nevertheless the contact area between rivets and plate is
substantially less than it should be and the peeening that would prevent
the rivet moving is absent.

I am interested in readers' opinions and experience regarding the safety
and durability of this repair job. Do many people reuse rivets? Any
experiences of reused rivets working well? or failing?

Many thanks

Martin

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Removed z before replying by email.


Back in early 2000 I bought a mountain bike with Shimano 9 speed parts.
I separated the chain and put it back together using the original
Shimano rivets. No separate special Shimano rivet for me. On a night
ride, on roads, the chain came apart and ripped itself up pretty good.
And ripped the front derailleur cage apart. So $50 later I was back in
business. I've used either the official Shimano rivets or a SRAM
Powerlink on 9 speed chains ever since. I was reusing the Campagnolo 9
speed rivets for a couple years but converted to SRAM Powerlinks on
that bike too.

For 7 speed chains, I reuse rivets. But they are wide chains and
easier to get right.

  #23  
Old August 23rd 05, 01:10 AM
Jasper Janssen
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?

On Mon, 22 Aug 2005 15:40:50 GMT, John Everett
wrote:

As the service rep at my Mercedes-Benz dealer said to me when I told
him I change my oil every 3,000 miles, "Well, it's your money."


3-5000 miles is about the right oil change interval if you want the engine
to last as long as possible. If you just want it to last 100-200k, longer
is okay as well.

Jasper
  #24  
Old August 26th 05, 02:02 AM
Martin
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?

Thanks very much to all responders. Quite clear that rivet reuse in
Shimano 9 & 10 speed chains is not advisable, although it may work for a
while if you are lucky.

Martin

Martin wrote:
The other day the mechanic at my local bike shop rejoined my Shimano 10
speed Ultegra chain reusing two rivets. Looking at the link under a
jeweler's magnifying glass I can clearly see that the peening on the
rivets is missing and I can see the countersinking in the plates around
the rivets.

The mechanic is very experienced, very well respected and services many
bikes in a busy shop. It looks like the rivets have been inserted to the
correct depth. Nevertheless the contact area between rivets and plate is
substantially less than it should be and the peeening that would prevent
the rivet moving is absent.

I am interested in readers' opinions and experience regarding the safety
and durability of this repair job. Do many people reuse rivets? Any
experiences of reused rivets working well? or failing?

Many thanks

Martin



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Removed z before replying by email.
  #25  
Old August 26th 05, 07:14 PM
Rick
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?


Jasper Janssen wrote:
On Mon, 22 Aug 2005 15:40:50 GMT, John Everett
wrote:

As the service rep at my Mercedes-Benz dealer said to me when I told
him I change my oil every 3,000 miles, "Well, it's your money."


3-5000 miles is about the right oil change interval if you want the engine
to last as long as possible. If you just want it to last 100-200k, longer
is okay as well.


If the chain is worn, then it is more costly to keep riding on it than
to replace. I do not have 10sp (no need), but on my bikes riding hard
in hilly terrain 1000-1500 mi is about where the chain *needs* to be
replaced; very rarely I can get up to 2000 mi. I measure regularly,
replace when needed. And due to that my chainrings and cassette cogs
last a very long time.

- rick

  #26  
Old August 26th 05, 07:53 PM
bfd
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?

Ah, but what you're leaving out is what type of oil are you using? Are
you using regular old dino oil or synthetic oil? If its regular old
dino, then an oil and filter change every 3,000 miles may be prudent.
If you're using synthetic, than anything less than say 7500 miles is
probably too soon.

But getting back to bikes, the key with chains is to measure them for
"stretch". If its more than 12" long, replace it!

  #27  
Old August 26th 05, 07:58 PM
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?

the less materail the greater the failure rate?
in this case?
i once received special pins with the MO chains. no more.
but i order replaceable links so i guess the elves sneak in at coffe
break and steal the spec pins?
the spec pins are ok but once per link only.
what the wrecnh is doing using standard pins two sides? he has extra
standard end pins.
is normal. i save the extra end links from new chains at 116 to 112 and
keep a bag of spec pins on the shelf. sometimes a good chain will chew
up three-four links in the middle-usually from cross chaining on a
grimme chain while homeward bound grooving on the sunset
so you get to splice new links in and save the chain and the cluster
and your general good mood over the next 1500 miles

  #28  
Old August 26th 05, 10:43 PM
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?

compute the cost of oil and filter for 100k miles, 150k miles-whatever
your mill is known for and exceed for good luck
rule used hear is-when the fingerprint ridges are felt thru the oil
rubbed tween fingers
then its lost acceptable lubricity
motor oils mileage/print/dirt/other fluids and abilities to absorb this
crap and keep on lubing-vary wildly

  #29  
Old August 27th 05, 12:22 AM
Jasper Janssen
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?

On 26 Aug 2005 11:14:36 -0700, "Rick" wrote:

If the chain is worn, then it is more costly to keep riding on it than
to replace.


Only if it's not yet too worn. If the cogs are already badly enough worn,
you just have to suck that up and you can start planning for the wholesale
replacement while you beat the **** out of it for the remaining miles
until it starts skipping.

Jasper
  #30  
Old August 27th 05, 07:54 AM
Sniper Anon
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Default Shimano chains - rivet reuse?


On 22-Aug-2005, Jasper Janssen wrote:

3-5000 miles is about the right oil change interval if you want the engine
to last as long as possible. If you just want it to last 100-200k, longer
is okay as well.


Since I live in the suburbs of an urban area with about 10 million people, I
expect that my car will be rear-ended by an oversize SUV that can not stop
as fast as I can within that 150-200 K mileage period. With the price of
bodywork. my car will be "totaled out" by the insurance company.

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