Zabel confesses too

On Thu, 24 May 2007 09:06:55 -0500, Bob Schwartz wrote:
Why am I the only one to notice that he hasn't opened up?

Zabel? You mean more than: [summarized translation] "I tried it during
the first week of the Tour 1996. I wanted to try it out but it was
just this once. Jef and I decided I should stop when I noticed I
overheated."

--
E. Dronkert

On 24 May 2007 08:01:42 -0700, "
wrote:

On May 24, 8:13 am, "Sandy" wrote:


J. Spaceman

Thank you. Bravo to those who open up.

dumbasses,

the reaction on rbr to these admissions of guilt is nauseating.

i know for all the fanboys it is gratifying when a rbr man-crush zabel
gives you the truth, but it was only after the whole 90s team was
exposed (or in imminent danger of beng exposed) after this jef d'hont
book and subsequent confessions by the team docs.

Why should they have said anything? Please use all the words you need to present
the argument.

i don't see the same outpouring for the team docs, guys like lemond or
the soigneur who precipitated this series of events.

it goes back to the whole mentality of handling athletes with kid
gloves, not holding them accountable and a willingness to forgive them
no matter how much they **** up. we praise them for being honest, when
there really isn't another choice, but we don't extend the same to ex-
riders, docs or writers who really want a clean sport.

guys like zabel and aldag made millions and enjoyed plenty of glory
and they used drugs occsionally or consistenly to achieve those
things.

is zabel going to give back his millions and sell his apartment which
houses his collection of historic bikes and live like a $40,000/yr
schmoe ? i doubt it.

To whom do you suppose he should give anything back? The guys he raced against
who were using the same dope, or the guys who didn't even have enough talent to
be offered the dope.

it may have been the climate of the sport at the time, but they had a
choice.

feh!

Ron

Ron

Effect pedal demo's up at http://www.soundclick.com/ronsonicpedalry

On May 24, 11:24 am, "Sandy" wrote:

i don't see the same outpouring for the team docs, guys like lemond or
the soigneur who precipitated this series of events.

You must not read very many messages.

the typical sentiment about guys like lemond, manzano, decanio, this
soigneur is theat they are attention seekers and opportunists seeking
to profit.

is zabel going to give back his millions and sell his apartment which
houses his collection of historic bikes and live like a $40,000/yr
schmoe ? i doubt it.

Envy is hard to hide, isn't it ?

i make no bones about it. i'd like to be as rich or as admired as
zabel. we all have possible ways to deceive to achive what we could
not otherwise. but i also don't want to be giving teary eyed
confessions about my past conduct either.

In a larger picture, in canada riders, coaches, the gov. body are
critisized for the lack of international results (jeanson aside). when
the belgian and russian riders were laid to waste the cdn riders, and
we're left questioning, are we really so backward in our methods ?
even though our coaches like landry and barras are being hired away by
other countries. in europe everyone mocks he french riders because
they can't get a result in any of their big races.

Dans le message de
oups.com,
a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :
On May 24, 11:24 am, "Sandy" wrote:

i don't see the same outpouring for the team docs, guys like lemond
or the soigneur who precipitated this series of events.

You must not read very many messages.

the typical sentiment about guys like lemond, manzano, decanio, this
soigneur is theat they are attention seekers and opportunists seeking
to profit.

Some writers enjoy voluminous and repetitive posts. You have never seen
that from me. If you have read my comments, you would have noticed nearly
an opposite trend.

is zabel going to give back his millions and sell his apartment
which houses his collection of historic bikes and live like a
$40,000/yr schmoe ? i doubt it.

Envy is hard to hide, isn't it ?

i make no bones about it. i'd like to be as rich or as admired as
zabel. we all have possible ways to deceive to achive what we could
not otherwise. but i also don't want to be giving teary eyed
confessions about my past conduct either.

So, what have you done ? Bragging requires facts.

In a larger picture, in canada riders, coaches, the gov. body are
critisized for the lack of international results (jeanson aside). when
the belgian and russian riders were laid to waste the cdn riders, and
we're left questioning, are we really so backward in our methods ?
even though our coaches like landry and barras are being hired away by
other countries. in europe everyone mocks he french riders because
they can't get a result in any of their big races.

A lot of fun has been made about the French "theory" of racing at two
speeds. Perhaps recent events will lessen how much ridicule it receives. I
recently remarked about two local riders, friends, who quit, having lost all
motivation due to the persistent suspicion of the public - the French
public.

You can make your points without being an ideologue and without
exaggeration, even if these are de rigueur in RBR. Solid thoughts and their
statement can stand the test of time and attack. Don't be tempted to answer
flames in kind.

On May 24, 11:44 am, RonSonic wrote:

Why should they have said anything? Please use all the words you need to present
the argument.


do you mean zabel and aldag ? when the docs came forward aldag had to
face the question since he's a DS on the team which is supposedly the
clean team after their housecleaning last year.

his bosses don't need a court case and "beyond a reasonable doubt",
they can evaluate the evidence themselves. he can dodge the public,
but he can't dodge his bosses.

zabel wasn't under as much pressure, but just like puerto, eventually
someone would cave and it opens the door for more to come forward.

is zabel going to give back his millions and sell his apartment which
houses his collection of historic bikes and live like a $40,000/yr
schmoe ? i doubt it.

To whom do you suppose he should give anything back?

the concept was meant to be rhetorical.

Ewoud Dronkert wrote:
On Thu, 24 May 2007 09:06:55 -0500, Bob Schwartz wrote:
Why am I the only one to notice that he hasn't opened up?

Zabel? You mean more than: [summarized translation] "I tried it during
the first week of the Tour 1996. I wanted to try it out but it was
just this once. Jef and I decided I should stop when I noticed I
overheated."

Yeah. How about when he was winning Milan-San Remo in March, taking
the Green jersey in July, winning the World Cup, and then riding
six days? I guess that was all mineral water.

Telekom rode the 1995 Tour as a combination team with 5 riders. In
1996 and 1997 they were the top team in the sport. No **** there
was institutionalized doping.

People are comfortable with all sorts of doping. They just don't
want to know about it.

Bob Schwartz

On 24 May 2007 09:36:59 -0700, "
wrote:


In a larger picture, in canada riders, coaches, the gov. body are
critisized for the lack of international results (jeanson aside).

But look at Canadian results in other endurance sports such as World
Cup x-c skiing and speed skating.

I think particularly of Beckie Scott who went from Bronze to Gold in
Salt Lake 2002, when the original 1st and 2nd were dq'd for using
Darbepoetin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beckie_Scott

On Thu, 24 May 2007 13:04:00 -0400, Doug Taylor
wrote:

On 24 May 2007 09:36:59 -0700, "
wrote:


In a larger picture, in canada riders, coaches, the gov. body are
critisized for the lack of international results (jeanson aside).

But look at Canadian results in other endurance sports such as World
Cup x-c skiing and speed skating.

I think particularly of Beckie Scott who went from Bronze to Gold in
Salt Lake 2002, when the original 1st and 2nd were dq'd for using
Darbepoetin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beckie_Scott

Becki Scott rocks. Though I think she was the person who sent Dick
Pound off the deep end in recklessly branding people as dopers. At
the press conference after she won her bronze medal she was asked if,
given her strong anti-doping sentiments, she thought the two athletes
ahead of her were doping. She gave an answer that was noncommittal but
suggested she did. Pound went ballistic after that, claiming she was
irresponsble to suggest such a thing, that the athletes had passed the
tests, etc. And a bit over a year later he looked like a naive fool.

PS -- she set up an altitude room in her bedroom.
--
JT
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Curtis L. Russell wrote:

On Thu, 24 May 2007 13:15:13 -0400, John Forrest Tomlinson
wrote:

PS -- she set up an altitude room in her bedroom.
--
JT

I've heard that one of those amplifies the effect of drinking. Does it
serve any other purpose?

One more layer of defense against a horny boyfriend.

--
Bill Asher

On 24 May 2007 18:48:18 GMT, William Asher wrote:

Curtis L. Russell wrote:

On Thu, 24 May 2007 13:15:13 -0400, John Forrest Tomlinson
wrote:

PS -- she set up an altitude room in her bedroom.
--
JT

I've heard that one of those amplifies the effect of drinking. Does it
serve any other purpose?

One more layer of defense against a horny boyfriend.

Boyfriend was an Olympian too. He was "into it."

--
JT
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