Economics not bicycle tech

On Wed, 08 Apr 2020 12:03:23 +0200, Sepp Ruf wrote:

AMuzi wrote:

- snip -

You could embrace the new religion, face Mosinee Wisconsin and give
thanks for the sacred toilet paper we send out to redeem the world.
It's suddenly the only sacred artifact in the nation.

(I don't understand this phenomenon either. It's mystical.)

Sorry buddhists, sorry Mosinee, but with Doosan and Alfa-Laval probably
being way more adept than GM in building functioning respirators,
Wisconsin needs to get rid of the invasive Holsteins, instead let the
bisons roam! Exporting toilet paper is a logical complementary industry
to the dairy industry which feeds lactose intolance that causes (up to
85%, or more, of) excessively high-tp consumption in the first place.

OTOH, that woud mean that if Alfa-Laval game up with a process to turn
the other product of the dairy and feed lot industies, atm it woud make a
killing.

i'm just wondering how much bleaching it would need to make it customer
acceptance.

On 4/7/2020 10:35 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 8 Apr 2020 02:35:18 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 9:03:19 PM UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 07 Apr 2020 19:03:33 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

You could embrace the new religion, face Mosinee Wisconsin
and give thanks for the sacred toilet paper we send out to
redeem the world. It's suddenly the only sacred artifact in
the nation.

(I don't understand this phenomenon either. It's mystical.)

Did y'all "send out" toilet paper? I thought that it was hoarded by
the multitudes and was no longer available in the "the land of the
free and the home of the brave (with dirty bums)"?

Oh, they're sending it out. My long haul trucker friend posted a
photo of a line of tractor trailers maybe a quarter mile long. They
were lined up to pick up shipments of toilet paper.

We went to the grocery today. On the twenty foot long double shelves
that are usually filled with packs of toilet paper, we saw two packs
of Charmin (6 rolls each) and maybe 20 individual discount rolls.
We snagged one Charmin pack. Woo hoo!

One interesting aspect: If this scare suddenly ends, the toilet paper
factories will have to shut down for a month or more. Nobody will
need to buy any for a long time.

- Frank Krygowski


I think it will actually work out well for them. The toilet paper factories
are running flat out now. Once everybody has too much and the virus
situation continues to worsen, they can let their staff run off of their
banked overtime and stay home with pay.

Perhaps the problem is that while the U.S. exports some $188 million
worth of toilet paper it imports some $375 million worth. A short fall
of some 187 million dollars worth of toilet paper. Perhaps there
really is a shortage.


I know nothing about it but it way well be that, like
bicycles and crude oil, the export product and the import
product are very different, hence 'volume' in both
directions for different markets.

In steel for example we import raw slab and export
stainless, maraging and other alloys, finished roll and so
on. To an outside observer the numbers look like 'steel in,
steel out'.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 4/8/2020 9:45 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 4/7/2020 10:35 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 8 Apr 2020 02:35:18 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 9:03:19 PM UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 07 Apr 2020 19:03:33 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

You could embrace the new religion, face Mosinee Wisconsin
and give thanks for the sacred toilet paper we send out to
redeem the world. It's suddenly the only sacred artifact in
the nation.

(I don't understand this phenomenon either. It's mystical.)

Did y'all "send out" toilet paper? I thought that it was hoarded by
the multitudes and was no longer available in the "the land of the
free and the home of the brave (with dirty bums)"?

Oh, they're sending it out. My long haul trucker friend posted a
photo of a line of tractor trailers maybe a quarter mile long. They
were lined up to pick up shipments of toilet paper.

We went to the grocery today. On the twenty foot long double shelves
that are usually filled with packs of toilet paper, we saw two packs
of Charmin (6 rolls each) and maybe 20 individual discount rolls.
We snagged one Charmin pack. Woo hoo!

One interesting aspect: If this scare suddenly ends, the toilet paper
factories will have to shut down for a month or more. Nobody will
need to buy any for a long time.

- Frank Krygowski


I think it will actually work out well for them. The toilet paper
factories
are running flat out now. Once everybody has too much and the virus
situation continues to worsen, they can let their staff run off of their
banked overtime and stay home with pay.

Perhaps the problem is that while the U.S. exports some $188 million
worth of toilet paper it imports some $375 million worth. A short fall
of some 187 million dollars worth of toilet paper. Perhaps there
really is a shortage.


I know nothing about it but it way well be that, like bicycles and crude
oil, the export product and the import product are very different, hence
'volume' in both directions for different markets.

In steel for example we import raw slab and export stainless, maraging
and other alloys, finished roll and so on. To an outside observer the
numbers look like 'steel in, steel out'.


+1

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 2:26:16 PM UTC-7, Ralph Barone wrote:
wrote:
On Monday, April 6, 2020 at 7:17:32 PM UTC-7, Ralph Barone wrote:
John B. wrote:
On Mon, 6 Apr 2020 13:52:02 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Sunday, April 5, 2020 at 11:11:35 AM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:

'For every room in heaven, there's one just like it in hell
for someone else.'

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Not sure how to interpret this. Does it mean the rooms in heaven are
really, really bad? Or the rooms in hell are really, really good? And
your statement implies an exact 50/50 split between heaven and hell. 1
out of 2 are going to burn in hell. And the other half are going to be
happy in heaven. Based on my observations over the years, I can believe
the amount going to hell. But 50% gong to heaven seems too optimistic.

I was once told by an individual that had attended a Catholic collage
that all of those who did not worship the Christian God were bound for
Hell, that is currently 68% of the world's population who will be
taking the "down" elevator.
--
cheers,

John B.

It’s gonna be a hell of a shock when those people get to the Pearly Gates
and find Buddha there.

So among your other talents you haven't any idea of what Buddhism is?


Whatever... The point of this atheist’s post was that with the
multiplicity of religions out there all praising their “One True God�, if
there is an afterlife, there’s gonna be a lot of people disappointed that
they bet on the wrong horse.

Buddhism doesn't offer an afterlife. It is a way of life that also happens to pretty much align with Christianity. This is why so many Indians and Chinese converted to Christianity

On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 3:32:04 PM UTC-7, news18 wrote:
On Tue, 07 Apr 2020 13:08:54 -0700, Tom Kunich wrote:


Jay, you can't let a chance go by to show you're crazy can you? Just the
PROPERTY that Trump owns makes him a billionaire.

Does he own them or are they owned by banks?

So among your other talents or lack of such, you cannot look it up?

On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 5:03:41 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 4/7/2020 5:19 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/7/2020 5:26 PM, Ralph Barone wrote:
wrote:
On Monday, April 6, 2020 at 7:17:32 PM UTC-7, Ralph
Barone wrote:

It’s gonna be a hell of a shock when those people get
to the Pearly Gates
and find Buddha there.

So among your other talents you haven't any idea of what
Buddhism is?


Whatever... The point of this atheist’s post was that
with the
multiplicity of religions out there all praising their
“One True God†, if
there is an afterlife, there’s gonna be a lot of people
disappointed that
they bet on the wrong horse.

This non-atheist believes that all religions and even
non-religions are, at best, tremendous simplifications. And
only the most simplistic of minds hold perfectly literal
belief in every bit of their chosen dogma.

I think there is a reality beyond our personal
electro-chemical consciousness factories. But I think our
chance of thoroughly understanding that reality is about as
great as a pet goldfish's chance of understanding its
owner's reality.


You could embrace the new religion, face Mosinee Wisconsin
and give thanks for the sacred toilet paper we send out to
redeem the world. It's suddenly the only sacred artifact in
the nation.

(I don't understand this phenomenon either. It's mystical.)

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Not as mystical as you might think. People are normally gone for at least half the day. Not that they are home most of the time they are using toilet paper a lot more than usual instead of the cheaply made commercial stuff used in businesses. There is little actual hording but the increased demand for the far higher quality home stuff that is causing a shortage which the idiots are blaming on hording. I actually used to have a higher storage of toilet paper than I presently do and should I discover a source for Charmin or Great Northern or Cottonelle would grab a package and pass the lower quality off to my step daughters with children. I approached the supermarket the other day and there was this long line waiting to enter the store when it opened. I was only there to see if they had a shipment of the higher quality toilet paper and some paper towels. They had good paper towels but it was in a giant 8 roll so that was all I got. When I entered the store this crowd was shouting "wait your turn" - TO ENTER A STORE??? This is how whacked out these people have become. They then enter the store and handle every can or bottle on the shelf and think that they couldn't catch the covid-19 because they stand 6 feet or more away from people.

When the Democrats are saying that it has just started and that it will reoccur next fall you can bet that they are attempting to elicit fear among the population and that makes me full-on against the Democrats.

On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 7:35:32 PM UTC-7, Ralph Barone wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 9:03:19 PM UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 07 Apr 2020 19:03:33 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

You could embrace the new religion, face Mosinee Wisconsin
and give thanks for the sacred toilet paper we send out to
redeem the world. It's suddenly the only sacred artifact in
the nation.

(I don't understand this phenomenon either. It's mystical.)

Did y'all "send out" toilet paper? I thought that it was hoarded by
the multitudes and was no longer available in the "the land of the
free and the home of the brave (with dirty bums)"?

Oh, they're sending it out. My long haul trucker friend posted a
photo of a line of tractor trailers maybe a quarter mile long. They
were lined up to pick up shipments of toilet paper.

We went to the grocery today. On the twenty foot long double shelves
that are usually filled with packs of toilet paper, we saw two packs
of Charmin (6 rolls each) and maybe 20 individual discount rolls.
We snagged one Charmin pack. Woo hoo!

One interesting aspect: If this scare suddenly ends, the toilet paper
factories will have to shut down for a month or more. Nobody will
need to buy any for a long time.

- Frank Krygowski


I think it will actually work out well for them. The toilet paper factories
are running flat out now. Once everybody has too much and the virus
situation continues to worsen, they can let their staff run off of their
banked overtime and stay home with pay.

Ralph, It appears that 3 out of 4 people have immune systems that react very rapidly to this virus and they cannot become infected. They are primed by the fact that Covid-19 is very similar to the cold virus so immunity is pretty much built-in.

Of the 25% of the population left, 80% of them had no or very mild symptoms.. The remaining 20% is unclear since they are not properly testing people but it appears that the virus CAN be fatal to about 3% of them however the treatment methods look to be working very well. Perhaps this is the reason that there seems to be a sharp drop in fatalities. Though perhaps it can be more widespread testing which increases the baseline and makes the mortality rate calculations.

What if rather than 80% having little to no symptoms, only 5% do and only 3% of those are in danger? And treatment appears to be working on 80% of those?

I am quite upset at the apparently total fake claims from the CDC. It now appears that we will have fewer than 10% of the predicted fatalities from the CDC and that is not just room for error but totally missing the mark.

On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 8:16:50 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote:
On Tue, 07 Apr 2020 19:03:33 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

(I don't understand this phenomenon either. It's mystical.)

The shortage is quite real.

Lots and lots of people used to spend more time in public places than
at home, but now nobody is going anywhere near a public toilet if he
can help it.

So the big commercial rolls are not being used. People are using
small domestic rolls instead.

The solution would be for stores that are still open to move some of
their commercial rolls from the supply closet to the merchandise
shelves, but there appears to be some overwhelming reason that they
can't do that -- at least nobody has advertised that they sell
commercial rolls.

Sherman & Lyn has a sign out front that says "TP 99c / pack".

Or they did the last time I rode a bike on Winona Avenue. A picture
of the sign has appeared in the newspaper since then.

If anybody could sell commercial rolls retail, Sherman & Lyn could.


--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at comcast dot net
http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

Safeway is doing that and it feels like sandpaper.

On Wednesday, April 8, 2020 at 12:23:47 AM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 7 Apr 2020 08:59:01 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

Listening to people here who actually believe in Darwin, spouting religion is ridiculous.

Did you know that Usenet has its own collection of characters,
apparently modeled after various biblical characters? I wrote this
about 25 years ago. It still applies:
http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/crud/genesis.txt


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

While that is clever it isn't accurate. The internet chat groups used to have quite intellectual discussions because it was mostly limited to technical people. That ended with the more general public who most often ranted anonymously. People like Frank who attempts to take out all of his own life's failures on the rest of the universe. I rather feel sorry for these people but that doesn't mean I won't return their insults with insults.

On Wednesday, April 8, 2020 at 3:03:33 AM UTC-7, Sepp Ruf wrote:
AMuzi wrote:

- snip -

You could embrace the new religion, face Mosinee Wisconsin
and give thanks for the sacred toilet paper we send out to
redeem the world. It's suddenly the only sacred artifact in
the nation.

(I don't understand this phenomenon either. It's mystical.)

Sorry buddhists, sorry Mosinee, but with Doosan and Alfa-Laval probably
being way more adept than GM in building functioning respirators, Wisconsin
needs to get rid of the invasive Holsteins, instead let the bisons roam!
Exporting toilet paper is a logical complementary industry to the dairy
industry which feeds lactose intolance that causes (up to 85%, or more, of)
excessively high-tp consumption in the first place.

TP hoarding is simple to explain, of course:

- counterphobic tendency during uncertainty about escalation of shutdowns,
curfews
- fear for cleanliness; fear of regression, loss of control; refuge in
hyperconsumerism (Freud)
- hunter and gatherer (conservation-of-resources-theory, Hobfoll)
- imitation (compared to other cart items, high visibility of tp packs,
empty tp shelves)
- high size-to-price ratio; zero risk bias; logistics limitations
- per square inch, TP even cheaper than newsprint or Greek bonds (Varoufakis)
- fall within in hierarchy of needs (Maslow; Otsuki)
- prestige; differentiation (Veblen; Bourdieu)
- preparation for natural state (Hobbes)
- egocentric narcissism (Wardetzki)
- displacement activity (Tinbergen)

Sepp, I designed and programmed medical instruments. Ventilators are so simple anyone could build them and chances are that GM or Ford could build a better product since they are FAR more used to interchangeable and replaceable parts. Washing ventilator tubes is a pretty bad idea since it is nearly impossible to clean inside the pores of the material. It is far superior to have replaceable and very cheap disposable parts that come into contact to a patient.