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Training for Power



 
 
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  #21  
Old January 1st 20, 12:50 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
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Posts: 10,422
Default Training for Power

Happy New Year, everyone, and many Prosperous Returns.

Slainte!

Ande Jute
There goes my alarm. Time to open more champagne.
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  #22  
Old January 1st 20, 12:52 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_7_]
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Posts: 173
Default Training for Power

Andre Jute wrote:
Happy New Year, everyone, and many Prosperous Returns.

Slainte!

Ande Jute
There goes my alarm. Time to open more champagne.


+1

  #23  
Old January 1st 20, 01:12 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
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Posts: 1,231
Default Training for Power

On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 8:51:25 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/31/2019 6:13 AM, wrote:
Tom should ask himself what 'training for power' means to him as a 75 year old. If he means training with varying power blocks he needs a goal, a trainings plan and a power meter to know what he is doing. Him mentioning that he already sees an effect after 1 or 2 rides based on average speed make me suspicious. I hope that when I am at that age I'm satisfied by just riding the best I can without worrying that it gets downhill with age. I think Tom has a hard time to accept that.


I agree with all that, especially the part about riding the best I can.

To expand on that a bit: Not only is aging inevitable, but for many
people, life complications seem to be increasingly inevitable as one
ages. For any number of reasons it can become much harder to do long
rides, intense rides, or even to ride as regularly as you once did.

I think it's important to find a way to both keep moving, and to be
reasonably content with moving not as briskly as before.

Happy new year to you all.


And to you, Lou.

--
- Frank Krygowski


OK, ready to ride, the Colnago carbon fiber Taiwanese bike weighs in at 20 lbs. I rapidly completed the Basso last night and rode it today. Ready to ride, it is 4 1/2 lbs heavier. I did a familiar ride and the total time on a 3,700 ft 37 mile ride was zero difference. Since my 185 lbs and the Colnago's 20 lbs makes an increase of 4 lbs only a little more than 2% I wouldn't expect to see any difference.

I might even have been a bit faster since I had a slightly loose rear wheel which turned and locked against the left chain stay on a steep part leaving me to sort that out and try to get moving again. And I passed what was quite clearly a stolen SUV and reported it to the Park Police. Then on the return trip the Sheriff was there so I stopped and gave him the information that just around the next turn from that car had been a pickup stopped and as I passed I had a funny feeling and looking in there were two people with hoodies on with their faces totally obscured. The motor was running and there wasn't any steam coming out the exhaust so they most obviously had a heater (the windshield wasn't frosted over either) and were covering their faces for a reason. I considered calling the cops after I saw the stolen SUV but thought it better to get out of gun range first. Down the hill is a Golf course so they have a camera recording their front gate which covers passing traffic.

Now although I did the ride in the same time, I am pretty tired but I write that off to doing nothing but short flat rides for the last three weeks.

The test ride also showed that the mechanic overpacked the bearings so they settled as the extra grease squished out. The front derailleur was a standard and threw the chain twice but Amazon delivered a Compact so I installed that.

I must be getting very good at eye-balling the rear derailleur adjustment since it too, like the LeMond I just set up, worked absolutely perfectly including the shift from the lower half of the cassette to the upper loose cogs.
  #24  
Old January 1st 20, 01:15 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
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Posts: 1,231
Default Training for Power

On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 3:50:03 PM UTC-8, Andre Jute wrote:
Happy New Year, everyone, and many Prosperous Returns.

Slainte!

Ande Jute
There goes my alarm. Time to open more champagne.


And great luck in the land of good beer. Yee Gods, I bought a 12 pack of what was supposed to be a good small brewery lager. This stuff is almost clear and stinks of hops.
  #25  
Old January 3rd 20, 10:03 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 884
Default Training for Power

On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 3:13:21 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 4:02:15 AM UTC+1, AMuzi wrote:
On 12/30/2019 8:05 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 3:06:44 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 7:00:24 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 1:31:56 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 1:30:19 AM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 1:23:31 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 7:32:31 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 9:53:48 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 6:25:29 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, December 28, 2019 at 11:50:06 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Saturday, December 28, 2019 at 1:23:54 AM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:


-much snip-

I was wondering why there are many many power meters for sale on Craigslist.


Both people who bought (or were given) one, yet found
structured cycling activity unattractive plus riders who
continue to upgrade to improved (or maybe just more
feature-laden) models.

To some smaller extent, people who bought one cheap at a PX
or overseas outlet and also those who pilfered one or some
at work. Not to mention the ever-present shoplifters.

In short, just like everything else in the secondary
markets; nothing to see here.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


I think you are right about that. There will be people that are disappointed in the fact that is a little more complicated. You have the numbers and now what? Same applies for heart rate monitors, GPS devices, cadence sensors or even cycling computers. Tom should ask himself what 'training for power' means to him as a 75 year old. If he means training with varying power blocks he needs a goal, a trainings plan and a power meter to know what he is doing. Him mentioning that he already sees an effect after 1 or 2 rides based on average speed make me suspicious. I hope that when I am at that age I'm satisfied by just riding the best I can without worrying that it gets downhill with age. I think Tom has a hard time to accept that.
Happy new year to you all.

Lou


What do you think is complicated about reading instantaneous power and average power since the reset?
  #26  
Old January 3rd 20, 11:54 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 824
Default Training for Power

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 10:03:03 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 3:13:21 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 4:02:15 AM UTC+1, AMuzi wrote:
On 12/30/2019 8:05 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 3:06:44 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 7:00:24 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 1:31:56 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 1:30:19 AM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 1:23:31 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 7:32:31 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 9:53:48 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 6:25:29 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, December 28, 2019 at 11:50:06 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Saturday, December 28, 2019 at 1:23:54 AM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:

-much snip-

I was wondering why there are many many power meters for sale on Craigslist.


Both people who bought (or were given) one, yet found
structured cycling activity unattractive plus riders who
continue to upgrade to improved (or maybe just more
feature-laden) models.

To some smaller extent, people who bought one cheap at a PX
or overseas outlet and also those who pilfered one or some
at work. Not to mention the ever-present shoplifters.

In short, just like everything else in the secondary
markets; nothing to see here.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


I think you are right about that. There will be people that are disappointed in the fact that is a little more complicated. You have the numbers and now what? Same applies for heart rate monitors, GPS devices, cadence sensors or even cycling computers. Tom should ask himself what 'training for power' means to him as a 75 year old. If he means training with varying power blocks he needs a goal, a trainings plan and a power meter to know what he is doing. Him mentioning that he already sees an effect after 1 or 2 rides based on average speed make me suspicious. I hope that when I am at that age I'm satisfied by just riding the best I can without worrying that it gets downhill with age. I think Tom has a hard time to accept that.
Happy new year to you all.

Lou


What do you think is complicated about reading instantaneous power and average power since the reset?


Try it Tom. Reading is easy it interpreting the numbers. Try to measure your FTP. The definition is simple: maximum power you can sustain for an hour.

Lou



  #27  
Old January 4th 20, 07:17 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 884
Default Training for Power

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 2:54:32 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 10:03:03 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 3:13:21 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 4:02:15 AM UTC+1, AMuzi wrote:
On 12/30/2019 8:05 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 3:06:44 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 7:00:24 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 1:31:56 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 1:30:19 AM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 1:23:31 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 7:32:31 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 9:53:48 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 6:25:29 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, December 28, 2019 at 11:50:06 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Saturday, December 28, 2019 at 1:23:54 AM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:

-much snip-

I was wondering why there are many many power meters for sale on Craigslist.


Both people who bought (or were given) one, yet found
structured cycling activity unattractive plus riders who
continue to upgrade to improved (or maybe just more
feature-laden) models.

To some smaller extent, people who bought one cheap at a PX
or overseas outlet and also those who pilfered one or some
at work. Not to mention the ever-present shoplifters.

In short, just like everything else in the secondary
markets; nothing to see here.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

I think you are right about that. There will be people that are disappointed in the fact that is a little more complicated. You have the numbers and now what? Same applies for heart rate monitors, GPS devices, cadence sensors or even cycling computers. Tom should ask himself what 'training for power' means to him as a 75 year old. If he means training with varying power blocks he needs a goal, a trainings plan and a power meter to know what he is doing. Him mentioning that he already sees an effect after 1 or 2 rides based on average speed make me suspicious. I hope that when I am at that age I'm satisfied by just riding the best I can without worrying that it gets downhill with age. I think Tom has a hard time to accept that.
Happy new year to you all.

Lou


What do you think is complicated about reading instantaneous power and average power since the reset?


Try it Tom. Reading is easy it interpreting the numbers. Try to measure your FTP. The definition is simple: maximum power you can sustain for an hour.

  #28  
Old January 5th 20, 11:32 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 884
Default Training for Power

On Saturday, January 4, 2020 at 10:17:53 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 2:54:32 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 10:03:03 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 3:13:21 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 4:02:15 AM UTC+1, AMuzi wrote:
On 12/30/2019 8:05 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 3:06:44 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 7:00:24 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 1:31:56 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Monday, December 30, 2019 at 1:30:19 AM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 1:23:31 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 7:32:31 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 9:53:48 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 6:25:29 PM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, December 28, 2019 at 11:50:06 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Saturday, December 28, 2019 at 1:23:54 AM UTC+1, Tom Kunich wrote:

-much snip-

I was wondering why there are many many power meters for sale on Craigslist.


Both people who bought (or were given) one, yet found
structured cycling activity unattractive plus riders who
continue to upgrade to improved (or maybe just more
feature-laden) models.

To some smaller extent, people who bought one cheap at a PX
or overseas outlet and also those who pilfered one or some
at work. Not to mention the ever-present shoplifters.

In short, just like everything else in the secondary
markets; nothing to see here.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

I think you are right about that. There will be people that are disappointed in the fact that is a little more complicated. You have the numbers and now what? Same applies for heart rate monitors, GPS devices, cadence sensors or even cycling computers. Tom should ask himself what 'training for power' means to him as a 75 year old. If he means training with varying power blocks he needs a goal, a trainings plan and a power meter to know what he is doing. Him mentioning that he already sees an effect after 1 or 2 rides based on average speed make me suspicious. I hope that when I am at that age I'm satisfied by just riding the best I can without worrying that it gets downhill with age. I think Tom has a hard time to accept that.
Happy new year to you all.

Lou

What do you think is complicated about reading instantaneous power and average power since the reset?


Try it Tom. Reading is easy it interpreting the numbers. Try to measure your FTP. The definition is simple: maximum power you can sustain for an hour.

Lou


That was one of he readings the power meter supplied. After using it once or twice I stopped paying any attention to the readings.


Now, if you are racing long distances I can understand that some riders who do not have a good feeling for their outputs might want to have a power meter in order to monitor their total output.

But for you and me, the time between points is much more to the point.

As I noted before, I have been power training. Today I did the same course again and there was one hell of a headwind all of the way out there. 12 and 13 mph in the first part was pretty difficult until I warmed up and could hold 15 mph for about 6 miles. Had a cup of coffee and came back. I didn't feel like I was riding very fast but I wasn't slowing down to keep from passing people either.

Got home and the average speed was 14.96 mph. So power training is working and doing so much faster than I thought that I'm quite surprised. In about a month I've had a 30% increase on flat ground. This probably doesn't translate all that well to climbing but that remains to be seen.

How this effects endurance still has to be seen as well. I will have to make endurance rides in the spring for the spring centuries. What I have found is that the first one or two endurance rides are real killers and then they don't bother me. So increasing the speed of my endurance rides for the spring centuries is the object.

I intend to be able to keep up with my brother when he's fresh. Since he is 15 years younger than me that is a pretty steep order. So let's see how it goes.
  #29  
Old January 8th 20, 12:03 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 884
Default Training for Power

On Friday, December 27, 2019 at 4:23:54 PM UTC-8, Tom Kunich wrote:
As I probably misplaced in Andre's string, I have decided to train in the winter for power. I can't remember doing this before but I must have done so.

I had a couple of toutes that are between 20 and 30 miles and I do a fast first half. Stop for coffee and donut and then a fast return. 24 miles ends up being about 2 hours with the stop.

When I started a couple of weeks ago I was averaging between 11 and 11.5 mph. Yesterday I was a git sore from Tuesday so I tried to take it a little easier. Tuesday's average was 14 mph and Thursday's was 14,75. There are a couple of rises that I was slowing down on and I'm not slowing down nearly as much now.

So let's see how this winter progresses and then when the weather improves I'll do some endurance rides since early April is a century. Last August my younger brother dropped me like the layer of dust on his bike. But he ran out of steam 10 miles from the end. But that ain't the way he tells it.

So, lets see how it goes.


It was colder than a well diggers butt this morning. I started worrying about my usual ride since I have done it in conditions like this and hit black ice which was totally invisible. I didn't fall but I would just as soon not now that everything is sore all the time.

So I did my power ride and AGAIN I kicked the time down. Average speed this time was 15.3 mph. I can't believe that I'm learning the spots to pour it on since I've been over this route 1,000 times.

Going from an average of 11.5 to 15.3 in less than a month seems to me to be to be unlikely as hell but I notice on rises and the like where I would slow to near 8 mph before than I am riding over at 13 or 14 mph.

I will continue this sort of thing most of the winter since it's a lot better than riding rollers. Whether this is actually causing improvement or not I'll only be able to tell after I can try it on longer rides or hard climbing rides.

This time there were several spots that slowed me down that usually wouldn't - there is a driveway that is normally the exit for a Oakland International Airport long term parking lot. I have to be careful there since cars can come flying out of it and it is a blind approach. This time there was a bus blocking the entire bike trail. As I slowed to about 12 he pulled out. I proceeded forward and he had his right turn signal on for the next turn so I came almost to a stop and he waited. Finally I kicked it and went across the intersection and it turned out to probably not have slowed me anyway since the next light a block away turned green as I approached.

I would be a terrible track racer since I cannot for the life of me hold a steady speed.
  #30  
Old January 9th 20, 06:27 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 884
Default Training for Power

On Tuesday, January 7, 2020 at 3:03:14 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Friday, December 27, 2019 at 4:23:54 PM UTC-8, Tom Kunich wrote:
As I probably misplaced in Andre's string, I have decided to train in the winter for power. I can't remember doing this before but I must have done so.

I had a couple of toutes that are between 20 and 30 miles and I do a fast first half. Stop for coffee and donut and then a fast return. 24 miles ends up being about 2 hours with the stop.

When I started a couple of weeks ago I was averaging between 11 and 11.5 mph. Yesterday I was a git sore from Tuesday so I tried to take it a little easier. Tuesday's average was 14 mph and Thursday's was 14,75. There are a couple of rises that I was slowing down on and I'm not slowing down nearly as much now.

So let's see how this winter progresses and then when the weather improves I'll do some endurance rides since early April is a century. Last August my younger brother dropped me like the layer of dust on his bike. But he ran out of steam 10 miles from the end. But that ain't the way he tells it..

So, lets see how it goes.


It was colder than a well diggers butt this morning. I started worrying about my usual ride since I have done it in conditions like this and hit black ice which was totally invisible. I didn't fall but I would just as soon not now that everything is sore all the time.

So I did my power ride and AGAIN I kicked the time down. Average speed this time was 15.3 mph. I can't believe that I'm learning the spots to pour it on since I've been over this route 1,000 times.

Going from an average of 11.5 to 15.3 in less than a month seems to me to be to be unlikely as hell but I notice on rises and the like where I would slow to near 8 mph before than I am riding over at 13 or 14 mph.

I will continue this sort of thing most of the winter since it's a lot better than riding rollers. Whether this is actually causing improvement or not I'll only be able to tell after I can try it on longer rides or hard climbing rides.

This time there were several spots that slowed me down that usually wouldn't - there is a driveway that is normally the exit for a Oakland International Airport long term parking lot. I have to be careful there since cars can come flying out of it and it is a blind approach. This time there was a bus blocking the entire bike trail. As I slowed to about 12 he pulled out. I proceeded forward and he had his right turn signal on for the next turn so I came almost to a stop and he waited. Finally I kicked it and went across the intersection and it turned out to probably not have slowed me anyway since the next light a block away turned green as I approached.

I would be a terrible track racer since I cannot for the life of me hold a steady speed.


My leg muscles hurt all night I guess and I had nightmares about riding a Spring Classic in Europe. I suppose the muscles are growing.
 




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