Follow the Science?

One of the odd things is to discover that MD's don't necessarily understand what science is and they are following rumor and myth. They ran a rather silly test in which they had adjoining cages of hamsters with one group infected with SARS-Cov-2 and the others not. They measured the percentage of non-infected hamsters that became infected. Then they place the material that masks are made of between another set of cages and measured the numbers of hamsters that subsequently became infected. Since a smaller number of hamsters because infected in the second case they presented this as "science" proving that masks work.

Well, this was a rather ridiculous idea to begin with so why didn't they actually think about what they were doing? This experiment worked for the simple reason that the material reduced the flow of air between the cages or forces a more indirect route. This is absolutely nothing like the case of a person wearing a mask who has pressurized transfer of air both in and out.

So exactly where was this science they were following?

I have talked about how doctors in general are brighter than most of these so-called scientists designing and running tests like this, but they too can become propagandized into believing that a mask can have some sort of effect. We have that fool Fauci standing before a camera and saying that it would be advisable to wear two masks in tandem.

A corona virus is small, on the order of between 50 to 200 nanometers depending on the specific type. This would be extremely difficult to mechanically filter from the air under the best possible conditions and a cloth mask is not a good condition.

While the mask proponents cry otherwise the facts are that the growth of covid-19 across the globe between those that wear masks and those who haven't are virtually identical with population density being more informative than any other measures. So let's not cry about "following the science" as a man told me yesterday.

On 1/31/2021 11:52 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
One of the odd things is to discover that MD's don't necessarily understand what science is and they are following rumor and myth. They ran a rather silly test in which they had adjoining cages of hamsters with one group infected with SARS-Cov-2 and the others not. They measured the percentage of non-infected hamsters that became infected. Then they place the material that masks are made of between another set of cages and measured the numbers of hamsters that subsequently became infected. Since a smaller number of hamsters because infected in the second case they presented this as "science" proving that masks work.

Well, this was a rather ridiculous idea to begin with so why didn't they actually think about what they were doing? This experiment worked for the simple reason that the material reduced the flow of air between the cages or forces a more indirect route. This is absolutely nothing like the case of a person wearing a mask who has pressurized transfer of air both in and out.

So exactly where was this science they were following?

I have talked about how doctors in general are brighter than most of these so-called scientists designing and running tests like this, but they too can become propagandized into believing that a mask can have some sort of effect. We have that fool Fauci standing before a camera and saying that it would be advisable to wear two masks in tandem.

A corona virus is small, on the order of between 50 to 200 nanometers depending on the specific type. This would be extremely difficult to mechanically filter from the air under the best possible conditions and a cloth mask is not a good condition.

While the mask proponents cry otherwise the facts are that the growth of covid-19 across the globe between those that wear masks and those who haven't are virtually identical with population density being more informative than any other measures. So let's not cry about "following the science" as a man told me yesterday.



MDs are merely human, no more no less:

https://zukus.net/2021/01/31/st-pete...ews-headlines/

You might say MDs ought to know better. Good luck with that.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Sunday, January 31, 2021 at 1:00:22 p.m. UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
On 1/31/2021 11:52 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
One of the odd things is to discover that MD's don't necessarily understand what science is and they are following rumor and myth. They ran a rather silly test in which they had adjoining cages of hamsters with one group infected with SARS-Cov-2 and the others not. They measured the percentage of non-infected hamsters that became infected. Then they place the material that masks are made of between another set of cages and measured the numbers of hamsters that subsequently became infected. Since a smaller number of hamsters because infected in the second case they presented this as "science" proving that masks work.

Well, this was a rather ridiculous idea to begin with so why didn't they actually think about what they were doing? This experiment worked for the simple reason that the material reduced the flow of air between the cages or forces a more indirect route. This is absolutely nothing like the case of a person wearing a mask who has pressurized transfer of air both in and out.

So exactly where was this science they were following?

I have talked about how doctors in general are brighter than most of these so-called scientists designing and running tests like this, but they too can become propagandized into believing that a mask can have some sort of effect. We have that fool Fauci standing before a camera and saying that it would be advisable to wear two masks in tandem.

A corona virus is small, on the order of between 50 to 200 nanometers depending on the specific type. This would be extremely difficult to mechanically filter from the air under the best possible conditions and a cloth mask is not a good condition.

While the mask proponents cry otherwise the facts are that the growth of covid-19 across the globe between those that wear masks and those who haven't are virtually identical with population density being more informative than any other measures. So let's not cry about "following the science" as a man told me yesterday.

MDs are merely human, no more no less:

https://zukus.net/2021/01/31/st-pete...ews-headlines/

You might say MDs ought to know better. Good luck with that.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Lawsuit pending?

Cheers

On 1/31/2021 12:59 PM, AMuzi wrote:

MDs are merely human, no more no less:

https://zukus.net/2021/01/31/st-pete...ews-headlines/

It's bad to overgeneralize. MDs are highly educated and trained in
medicine, much more so than typical humans. Do they make mistakes? Yes,
occasionally - but I still wouldn't want to pick a random human off the
street to diagnose and treat my heart attack.

One might say "Bike mechanics are human, no more no less." But despite
the mistakes I've seen them make, I'd say they are on average more
competent at bike repair than most people - even most MDs.

Division of labor makes sense. It's a fundamental component of
civilization.

(And I'm far too conservative to pretend we are all equal in
intelligence, training and skill.)

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Sunday, January 31, 2021 at 10:00:22 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 1/31/2021 11:52 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
One of the odd things is to discover that MD's don't necessarily understand what science is and they are following rumor and myth. They ran a rather silly test in which they had adjoining cages of hamsters with one group infected with SARS-Cov-2 and the others not. They measured the percentage of non-infected hamsters that became infected. Then they place the material that masks are made of between another set of cages and measured the numbers of hamsters that subsequently became infected. Since a smaller number of hamsters because infected in the second case they presented this as "science" proving that masks work.

Well, this was a rather ridiculous idea to begin with so why didn't they actually think about what they were doing? This experiment worked for the simple reason that the material reduced the flow of air between the cages or forces a more indirect route. This is absolutely nothing like the case of a person wearing a mask who has pressurized transfer of air both in and out.

So exactly where was this science they were following?

I have talked about how doctors in general are brighter than most of these so-called scientists designing and running tests like this, but they too can become propagandized into believing that a mask can have some sort of effect. We have that fool Fauci standing before a camera and saying that it would be advisable to wear two masks in tandem.

A corona virus is small, on the order of between 50 to 200 nanometers depending on the specific type. This would be extremely difficult to mechanically filter from the air under the best possible conditions and a cloth mask is not a good condition.

While the mask proponents cry otherwise the facts are that the growth of covid-19 across the globe between those that wear masks and those who haven't are virtually identical with population density being more informative than any other measures. So let's not cry about "following the science" as a man told me yesterday.

MDs are merely human, no more no less:

https://zukus.net/2021/01/31/st-pete...ews-headlines/

You might say MDs ought to know better. Good luck with that.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
I took my wife down to the ER for a possible broken bone in her leg. It turned out to be harmless but didn't seem so at first. Getting her in there was a REAL chore because you had to have a mask on and she could not be accompanied. So she had to work her way in barely able to walk and go the counter and fill out a form standing up and then go and sit in a section of the waiting room that was exposed to heavy air conditioning on a cold night. I finally had enough and went and talked to the ARMED GUARD on the entrance to the ER and got him to call the doctor out. I told her that the last time I brought my brother in that they missed a major problem that would have killed him shortly. She took that as she should have as a legal threat and they went out of their way to X-rays, cat scans and MRI to find that it was a slight fracture that would heal in a couple of days. An MRI for a possible broken bone was overkill but at least I knew that they had taken me seriously.

On 1/31/2021 1:30 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/31/2021 12:59 PM, AMuzi wrote:

MDs are merely human, no more no less:

https://zukus.net/2021/01/31/st-pete...ews-headlines/


It's bad to overgeneralize. MDs are highly educated and
trained in medicine, much more so than typical humans. Do
they make mistakes? Yes, occasionally - but I still wouldn't
want to pick a random human off the street to diagnose and
treat my heart attack.

One might say "Bike mechanics are human, no more no less."
But despite the mistakes I've seen them make, I'd say they
are on average more competent at bike repair than most
people - even most MDs.

Division of labor makes sense. It's a fundamental component
of civilization.

(And I'm far too conservative to pretend we are all equal in
intelligence, training and skill.)


I agree with you.

Ditto for licensed professional engineers:

https://www.mercurynews.com/2019/01/...sbay-terminal/

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Sunday, January 31, 2021 at 11:30:48 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/31/2021 12:59 PM, AMuzi wrote:

MDs are merely human, no more no less:

https://zukus.net/2021/01/31/st-pete...ews-headlines/
It's bad to overgeneralize. MDs are highly educated and trained in
medicine, much more so than typical humans. Do they make mistakes? Yes,
occasionally - but I still wouldn't want to pick a random human off the
street to diagnose and treat my heart attack.

One might say "Bike mechanics are human, no more no less." But despite
the mistakes I've seen them make, I'd say they are on average more
competent at bike repair than most people - even most MDs.

Division of labor makes sense. It's a fundamental component of
civilization.

(And I'm far too conservative to pretend we are all equal in
intelligence, training and skill.)

We are living in an age of Fake News and too much Fake Science. As Andrew said, Doctors are only human and they are just as likely to fall for a load of crap as the next guy if it is repeated enough. A good friend of mine said that he was going to "follow the science" because that is the commonly used phrase now. I didn't know what I was talking about because I wasn't going with the flow. His wife has a liver and heart transplant and what he didn't know is that she would be dead if I hadn't designed the instruments to make those transplants possible. I designed the first real heart/lung machine and the respiratory gas analyzer so that the surgeons could keep her alive during and after the transplants. You and I are being absolutely inundated by propaganda lies that can destroy your life but you don't even realized it because they follow the tenants of Joseph Goebbels "If you repeat a big enough lie often enough people grow to believe it".

Remember when I said that people were wearing masks on their bikes while riding? That can cause very serious lung damage. And now we have that moron Fauci saying that we should wear two or even three masks all of the time. Do you think that you're immune to this? Time after time here you have turned away from actual science because I stated it only to follow your false God's of leftism. I really couldn't care less whether you believe me or not but I don't say these things to hurt you but to inform you, you may do what you wish with that. While I rag you for being a failure, I hope you realize that being a college professor isn't a failure of any caliber. I don't expect ME jobs to be all that common in Springfield and from what little I know of the place I certainly wouldn't blame you for wanting to stay there and using any job to enable that.

I was lucky that Silicon Valley and Berkeley were hotbeds of high tech development or I might have ended up working for the Rapid Transit repair for my whole life.

On 1/31/2021 4:04 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, January 31, 2021 at 11:30:48 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/31/2021 12:59 PM, AMuzi wrote:

MDs are merely human, no more no less:

https://zukus.net/2021/01/31/st-pete...ews-headlines/
It's bad to overgeneralize. MDs are highly educated and trained in
medicine, much more so than typical humans. Do they make mistakes? Yes,
occasionally - but I still wouldn't want to pick a random human off the
street to diagnose and treat my heart attack.

One might say "Bike mechanics are human, no more no less." But despite
the mistakes I've seen them make, I'd say they are on average more
competent at bike repair than most people - even most MDs.

Division of labor makes sense. It's a fundamental component of
civilization.

(And I'm far too conservative to pretend we are all equal in
intelligence, training and skill.)

We are living in an age of Fake News and too much Fake Science. As Andrew said, Doctors are only human and they are just as likely to fall for a load of crap as the next guy if it is repeated enough.

About medical issues? Sorry, Tom, that's absolute bull****.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 1/31/2021 3:39 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, January 31, 2021 at 10:00:22 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 1/31/2021 11:52 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
One of the odd things is to discover that MD's don't necessarily understand what science is and they are following rumor and myth. They ran a rather silly test in which they had adjoining cages of hamsters with one group infected with SARS-Cov-2 and the others not. They measured the percentage of non-infected hamsters that became infected. Then they place the material that masks are made of between another set of cages and measured the numbers of hamsters that subsequently became infected. Since a smaller number of hamsters because infected in the second case they presented this as "science" proving that masks work.

Well, this was a rather ridiculous idea to begin with so why didn't they actually think about what they were doing? This experiment worked for the simple reason that the material reduced the flow of air between the cages or forces a more indirect route. This is absolutely nothing like the case of a person wearing a mask who has pressurized transfer of air both in and out.

So exactly where was this science they were following?

I have talked about how doctors in general are brighter than most of these so-called scientists designing and running tests like this, but they too can become propagandized into believing that a mask can have some sort of effect. We have that fool Fauci standing before a camera and saying that it would be advisable to wear two masks in tandem.

A corona virus is small, on the order of between 50 to 200 nanometers depending on the specific type. This would be extremely difficult to mechanically filter from the air under the best possible conditions and a cloth mask is not a good condition.

While the mask proponents cry otherwise the facts are that the growth of covid-19 across the globe between those that wear masks and those who haven't are virtually identical with population density being more informative than any other measures. So let's not cry about "following the science" as a man told me yesterday.

MDs are merely human, no more no less:

https://zukus.net/2021/01/31/st-pete...ews-headlines/

You might say MDs ought to know better. Good luck with that.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
I took my wife down to the ER for a possible broken bone in her leg.

I'm surprised that you made the trip to ER! After all, you've implied
that doctors know no more about medicine than ordinary people. And
you've long touted your own superior medical knowledge, not to mention
your expertise about everything else in the world.

You're not losing faith in your abilities, are you?

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Sun, 31 Jan 2021 09:52:31 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote:

One of the odd things is to discover that MD's don't necessarily understand what science is and they are following rumor and myth. They ran a rather silly test in which they had adjoining cages of hamsters with one group infected with SARS-Cov-2 and the others not. They measured the percentage of non-infected hamsters that became infected. Then they place the material that masks are made of between another set of cages and measured the numbers of hamsters that subsequently became infected. Since a smaller number of hamsters because infected in the second case they presented this as "science" proving that masks work.

Well, this was a rather ridiculous idea to begin with so why didn't they actually think about what they were doing? This experiment worked for the simple reason that the material reduced the flow of air between the cages or forces a more indirect route. This is absolutely nothing like the case of a person wearing a mask who has pressurized transfer of air both in and out.

So exactly where was this science they were following?

I have talked about how doctors in general are brighter than most of these so-called scientists designing and running tests like this, but they too can become propagandized into believing that a mask can have some sort of effect. We have that fool Fauci standing before a camera and saying that it would be advisable to wear two masks in tandem.

A corona virus is small, on the order of between 50 to 200 nanometers depending on the specific type. This would be extremely difficult to mechanically filter from the air under the best possible conditions and a cloth mask is not a good condition.

While the mask proponents cry otherwise the facts are that the growth of covid-19 across the globe between those that wear masks and those who haven't are virtually identical with population density being more informative than any other measures. So let's not cry about "following the science" as a man told me yesterday.

You do have your head lodged in your fundament don't you.

Compare California with Thailand which has about twice the population
of California.
Thailand - Masks Yes required by law subject to imprisonment
and/or fine for failure to comply
Cases/million - 269
Deaths/million - 1

California Masks ???
Cases/million - 83,736
Deaths/million - 1,035

--
Cheers,

John B.