Growth of voting

On Sat, 23 Jan 2021 17:28:27 -0800, sms
wrote:

On 1/23/2021 1:11 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

snip

Why select math as the criteria for comparison? I would think that
reading would be more appropriate for voting, except that there's very
no test data available for reading in most states.

I think that critical thinking skills should be the criteria. But then
the whole country would be blue and we'd have a one-party system of only
Democrats. That might not be the best thing, but at least we'd be rid of
Josh Hawley, Ted Cruz, Lindsay Graham, and Louie Gohmert.

If you realy want a valid voter literacy comparison by state, the
statistical population should exclude those who cannot legally vote.
That would be children under 18, non-citizens, convicted felons, and
lizard people. I couldn't find such a voter literacy survey.

Well if you're going to exclude lizard people then the Republicans will
win every election.

On the other hand is literacy necessary in these modern times? After
all the information in the whole world is available on YouTube.
Isn't it?

Ever read 1984?
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Sun, 24 Jan 2021 08:39:47 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On the other hand is literacy necessary in these modern
times?

Nope. We are in the process of substituting icons, hieroglyphics,
abbreviations and symbology for reading comprehension. These have the
advantage of working in almost any language, and being easy to learn
in the form of graffiti. In time, communications will be reduced to
SMS/TEXT msging shrt hnd and iconography. It's much like the
transition between cave paintings, glyphs and alphabets. Each was an
effort to make the previous writing technology more accessible to the
GUM (great unwashed masses). One possible reason for the invention of
an alphabet was because the inventor found it too difficult and time
consuming to teach his slaves hieroglyphics and found it easier to
substitute sound-symbols, also known as letters.

After
all the information in the whole world is available on YouTube.
Isn't it?

Absolutely. My new neighbor was having problems with her chain saw
today. I found it necessary to assure her that I knew how to deal
with them. So, I announced "I've been watching chainsaw videos on
YouTube. That makes me an expert". After that, she wouldn't let me
anywhere near her chainsaw, but previously, it always worked.

Ever read 1984?

Of course. It was required reading at some point in my
indoctrination, errr education. I haven't seen the movie:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52wis_sLT1I

I thought you might prefer "Starship Troopers" by Robert Heinlein,
where voting and holding public office is limited to those who have
served in the "Federal Service".
https://www.nitrosyncretic.com/rah/ftp/fedrlsvc.pdf
It seems like a better idea than compulsory voting, where you have the
choice of voting or going to jail.



--
Jeff Liebermann
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sat, 23 Jan 2021 18:30:35 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jan 2021 08:39:47 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On the other hand is literacy necessary in these modern
times?

Nope. We are in the process of substituting icons, hieroglyphics,
abbreviations and symbology for reading comprehension. These have the
advantage of working in almost any language, and being easy to learn
in the form of graffiti. In time, communications will be reduced to
SMS/TEXT msging shrt hnd and iconography. It's much like the
transition between cave paintings, glyphs and alphabets. Each was an
effort to make the previous writing technology more accessible to the
GUM (great unwashed masses). One possible reason for the invention of
an alphabet was because the inventor found it too difficult and time
consuming to teach his slaves hieroglyphics and found it easier to
substitute sound-symbols, also known as letters.

After
all the information in the whole world is available on YouTube.
Isn't it?

Absolutely. My new neighbor was having problems with her chain saw
today. I found it necessary to assure her that I knew how to deal
with them. So, I announced "I've been watching chainsaw videos on
YouTube. That makes me an expert". After that, she wouldn't let me
anywhere near her chainsaw, but previously, it always worked.

Ever read 1984?

Of course. It was required reading at some point in my
indoctrination, errr education. I haven't seen the movie:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52wis_sLT1I

I thought you might prefer "Starship Troopers" by Robert Heinlein,
where voting and holding public office is limited to those who have
served in the "Federal Service".
https://www.nitrosyncretic.com/rah/ftp/fedrlsvc.pdf
It seems like a better idea than compulsory voting, where you have the
choice of voting or going to jail.

Yup, I just read it again and it is just a good story as it was years
ago when I first read it.

But, I'm not sure about the theory that in order to vote one must
first have undertaken some sort of "federal service" as at one time in
my military career I was assigned to The USAF Test Center at Edwards
AFB out in the desert in a unit tasked with testing the F-111B, which
demonstrated that neither "federal service" not "federal procurement"
resulted in the best equipment or the best personnel. :-)

By the way, I believe that Singapore still has mandatory government
service for all male citizens. At the age of 18, I believe a two year
stint in government service, in the military, police or "civil de
fence" which covers fireman, emergency medical service, etc.

It does have it's advantages as the local "cop on the beat" may well
be your kid, or the neighbor's. It also does give one a certain sense
of responsibility, albeit a small one, and (I suspect) it also gives
the government the chance to orient (brain wash) future voters to
understand that the reigning political party is the best party. Note
here that the People's Action Party has been in power in Singapore
since 1959 although occasionally one, or sometimes two, opposition
members do get elected to the legislature :-)

Additionally it also should be mentioned that under the PAP Singapore
went from a burned out wreck to a modern developed country in, I
believe, the shortest period of any country in the world.

--
Cheers,

John B.

On 23/01/2021 23:00, News 2021 wrote:
On Sat, 23 Jan 2021 16:20:58 +0100, Tosspot scribed:

Ermmm. wasn't it just accepted? Face it, in the U.S. election fraud is
the norm.

AFAIK, technically there is fraud* in every election and impossible to
eliminate, but the critical question is it of significance. The usual
answer is NO.

In Trump, et al's case, they have failed to demonstrate any significant
fraud. AFAIK, all their attempts to provide even a single example has
failed.

That just shows how *good* they are at fraud. I mean it would be
pointless if it was detectable wouldn't it?

Personally, I had a chuckle over "The King of Gondor" case.

Ok, the Tolkien bit I get, but not the rest.

On Sun, 24 Jan 2021 11:51:13 +0100, Tosspot scribed:

On 23/01/2021 23:00, News 2021 wrote:
On Sat, 23 Jan 2021 16:20:58 +0100, Tosspot scribed:

Ermmm. wasn't it just accepted? Face it, in the U.S. election fraud
is the norm.

AFAIK, technically there is fraud* in every election and impossible to
eliminate, but the critical question is it of significance. The usual
answer is NO.

In Trump, et al's case, they have failed to demonstrate any significant
fraud. AFAIK, all their attempts to provide even a single example has
failed.

That just shows how *good* they are at fraud. I mean it would be
pointless if it was detectable wouldn't it?

Personally, I had a chuckle over "The King of Gondor" case.

Ok, the Tolkien bit I get, but not the rest.

Happy to oblige with a url

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-lawsuit-lord-
of-the-rings-gondor-election

On 24/01/2021 12:43, News 2021 wrote:
On Sun, 24 Jan 2021 11:51:13 +0100, Tosspot scribed:

On 23/01/2021 23:00, News 2021 wrote:
On Sat, 23 Jan 2021 16:20:58 +0100, Tosspot scribed:

Ermmm. wasn't it just accepted? Face it, in the U.S. election fraud
is the norm.

AFAIK, technically there is fraud* in every election and impossible to
eliminate, but the critical question is it of significance. The usual
answer is NO.

In Trump, et al's case, they have failed to demonstrate any significant
fraud. AFAIK, all their attempts to provide even a single example has
failed.

That just shows how *good* they are at fraud. I mean it would be
pointless if it was detectable wouldn't it?

Personally, I had a chuckle over "The King of Gondor" case.

Ok, the Tolkien bit I get, but not the rest.

Happy to oblige with a url

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-lawsuit-lord-
of-the-rings-gondor-election

My flabber is well and truly ghasted. The consistency of porcine
excrement springs to mind.

On Saturday, January 23, 2021 at 5:28:33 PM UTC-8, sms wrote:
On 1/23/2021 1:11 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

snip
Why select math as the criteria for comparison? I would think that
reading would be more appropriate for voting, except that there's very
no test data available for reading in most states.
I think that critical thinking skills should be the criteria. But then
the whole country would be blue and we'd have a one-party system of only
Democrats. That might not be the best thing, but at least we'd be rid of
Josh Hawley, Ted Cruz, Lindsay Graham, and Louie Gohmert.
If you realy want a valid voter literacy comparison by state, the
statistical population should exclude those who cannot legally vote.
That would be children under 18, non-citizens, convicted felons, and
lizard people. I couldn't find such a voter literacy survey.
Well if you're going to exclude lizard people then the Republicans will
win every election.
So what you're saying is that the reason you weren't re-elected was because no one in your town had critical thinking skills? You do realize that is why you weren't re-elected don't you?

On 1/23/2021 9:06 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 23 Jan 2021 18:30:35 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jan 2021 08:39:47 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On the other hand is literacy necessary in these modern
times?

Nope. We are in the process of substituting icons, hieroglyphics,
abbreviations and symbology for reading comprehension. These have the
advantage of working in almost any language, and being easy to learn
in the form of graffiti. In time, communications will be reduced to
SMS/TEXT msging shrt hnd and iconography. It's much like the
transition between cave paintings, glyphs and alphabets. Each was an
effort to make the previous writing technology more accessible to the
GUM (great unwashed masses). One possible reason for the invention of
an alphabet was because the inventor found it too difficult and time
consuming to teach his slaves hieroglyphics and found it easier to
substitute sound-symbols, also known as letters.

After
all the information in the whole world is available on YouTube.
Isn't it?

Absolutely. My new neighbor was having problems with her chain saw
today. I found it necessary to assure her that I knew how to deal
with them. So, I announced "I've been watching chainsaw videos on
YouTube. That makes me an expert". After that, she wouldn't let me
anywhere near her chainsaw, but previously, it always worked.

Ever read 1984?

Of course. It was required reading at some point in my
indoctrination, errr education. I haven't seen the movie:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52wis_sLT1I

I thought you might prefer "Starship Troopers" by Robert Heinlein,
where voting and holding public office is limited to those who have
served in the "Federal Service".
https://www.nitrosyncretic.com/rah/ftp/fedrlsvc.pdf
It seems like a better idea than compulsory voting, where you have the
choice of voting or going to jail.

Yup, I just read it again and it is just a good story as it was years
ago when I first read it.

But, I'm not sure about the theory that in order to vote one must
first have undertaken some sort of "federal service" as at one time in
my military career I was assigned to The USAF Test Center at Edwards
AFB out in the desert in a unit tasked with testing the F-111B, which
demonstrated that neither "federal service" not "federal procurement"
resulted in the best equipment or the best personnel. :-)

By the way, I believe that Singapore still has mandatory government
service for all male citizens. At the age of 18, I believe a two year
stint in government service, in the military, police or "civil de
fence" which covers fireman, emergency medical service, etc.

It does have it's advantages as the local "cop on the beat" may well
be your kid, or the neighbor's. It also does give one a certain sense
of responsibility, albeit a small one, and (I suspect) it also gives
the government the chance to orient (brain wash) future voters to
understand that the reigning political party is the best party. Note
here that the People's Action Party has been in power in Singapore
since 1959 although occasionally one, or sometimes two, opposition
members do get elected to the legislature :-)

Additionally it also should be mentioned that under the PAP Singapore
went from a burned out wreck to a modern developed country in, I
believe, the shortest period of any country in the world.



They had Lee Kuan Yew, a big difference from everywhere else.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Op zondag 24 januari 2021 om 17:19:55 UTC+1 schreef :
On Saturday, January 23, 2021 at 5:28:33 PM UTC-8, sms wrote:
On 1/23/2021 1:11 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

snip
Why select math as the criteria for comparison? I would think that
reading would be more appropriate for voting, except that there's very
no test data available for reading in most states.
I think that critical thinking skills should be the criteria. But then
the whole country would be blue and we'd have a one-party system of only
Democrats. That might not be the best thing, but at least we'd be rid of
Josh Hawley, Ted Cruz, Lindsay Graham, and Louie Gohmert.
If you realy want a valid voter literacy comparison by state, the
statistical population should exclude those who cannot legally vote.
That would be children under 18, non-citizens, convicted felons, and
lizard people. I couldn't find such a voter literacy survey.
Well if you're going to exclude lizard people then the Republicans will
win every election.
So what you're saying is that the reason you weren't re-elected was because no one in your town had critical thinking skills? You do realize that is why you weren't re-elected don't you?

Of course. Election fraud or the majority of the voters thought that one of the other candidates was the better choice. Tom, if you take part in an election you can lose.

Lou

On 1/24/2021 5:51 AM, Tosspot wrote:
On 23/01/2021 23:00, News 2021 wrote:

AFAIK, technically there is fraud* in every election and impossible to
eliminate, but the critical question is it of significance. The usual
answer is NO.

In Trump, et al's case, they have failed to demonstrate any significant
fraud. AFAIK, all their attempts to provide even a single example has
failed.

That just shows how *good* they are at fraud.Â* I mean it would be
pointless if it was detectable wouldn't it?

I think there are two possibilities:

!) There was a massive, highly organized nationwide election fraud
scheme that required complicity and coordination from hundreds or
thousands of election boards across dozens of states, and many thousands
of individual poll workers, plus over 60 judges including those
appointed by Trump, plus their staff. This effort was so sophisticated
it defied detection even in normally Republican states that performed
multiple recounts of votes. (And BTW, it somehow rejected Trump while
electing many down-ballot Republicans.)

Or:

2) There was a massive publicity campaign initiated well before the
election, and continued afterward, to fool Trump-worshippers into
thinking that the election would be so corrupt as to overturn the
results of the votes for president (but, um, not the votes for the
down-ballot Republicans). And, given the intellectual capacity of Trumps
biggest fans, this effort worked.

I think scenario #2 is far more likely.

--
- Frank Krygowski