[OT] Speed of Light

On Nov 20, 11:06*am, Davey Crockett wrote:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/s.../Speed-of-ligh...

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Davey Crockett
Flying the Flag of the English
The Flag of Hengest and Horsahttp://azurservers.com:7080/rbr/englishdragon.jpg
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So, what's nu? Answer: c/ë
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On Nov 20, 3:21*pm, Uncle Dave wrote:
On 20/11/2011 20:21, atriage wrote:

If this turns out to be true (we are still far from establishing that
for sure) then some brand new physics is gonna be needed.

Maybe it's because I'm not a scientist, but it has always seemed obvious
to me that there can be no "laws" of physics, nature, whatever, because
we know very little about anything, not even ourselves. *Of course,
mankind being inherently stupid, always think they do despite
generations of change.

You can extrapolate all you like on seemingly irrefutable evidence but
the odds are you'll be proven wrong one day. *The "laws" of physics are
simply more evidence of man's immaturity and lack of understanding.

OTOH, who gives a ****? *None of it's real...

UD

Dumbass,

Yes, I think it's because you're not a scientist.

Laws are descriptions of natural phenomena, not
rules of a game. They''re known to be incomplete.
When some anomaly happens that breaks the previously
known laws, that's when we learn something new.
This is as distinct from, say, the UCI, who find a way
to outlaw the anomaly (example: Graeme Obree).

I think many physicists still suspect this neutrino
result is likely to be a subtle problem with the timing
(like synchronizing the timing at the two locations,
which is non trivial since they're both moving).
This isn't because scientists wish it would go away and
stop distracting us from our lunchtime training rides,
but because extraordinary discoveries require
extraordinarily good evidence.

Fredmaster Ben

On 11/20/2011 6:57 PM, Fredmaster of Brainerd wrote:
On Nov 20, 5:33 pm, wrote:
On Nov 20, 1:10 pm, Michael wrote:

In ,
Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/s.../Speed-of-ligh...

An experiment was performed. What reliable
inferences can be made remains to be seen.

We'll know next Tuesday

You'll know next Tuesday, but I've made arrangements
with CERN to get the message on Monday.

Fredmaster Ben

Dumbass,

I consult with people in pro cycling in
California on stuff like this.

F

On 11/20/2011 4:57 PM, Fredmaster of Brainerd wrote:
On Nov 20, 5:33 pm, wrote:
On Nov 20, 1:10 pm, Michael wrote:

In ,
Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/s.../Speed-of-ligh...

An experiment was performed. What reliable
inferences can be made remains to be seen.

We'll know next Tuesday

You'll know next Tuesday, but I've made arrangements
with CERN to get the message on Monday.

Fredmaster Ben

If it's verified, they could send the message on Wednesday.

On Nov 20, 2:06*pm, Davey Crockett wrote:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/s.../Speed-of-ligh...

--
Davey Crockett
Flying the Flag of the English
The Flag of Hengest and Horsahttp://azurservers.com:7080/rbr/englishdragon.jpg

get obree on it, he'll find a way to make it go faster

On 11/20/2011 7:57 PM, Fredmaster of Brainerd wrote:
On Nov 20, 5:33 pm, wrote:
On Nov 20, 1:10 pm, Michael wrote:

In ,
Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/s.../Speed-of-ligh...

An experiment was performed. What reliable
inferences can be made remains to be seen.

We'll know next Tuesday

You'll know next Tuesday, but I've made arrangements
with CERN to get the message on Monday.

Fredmaster Ben


One hamburger, for which I'll gladly pay you on Tuesday.


Fred Wimpie

On 21/11/2011 00:41, Phil H wrote:
On Nov 20, 2:43 pm, wrote:
On 20/11/2011 21:33, Davey Crockett wrote:





atriage a écrit profondement:

| On 20/11/2011 20:10, Michael Press wrote:
| In ,
| Davey wrote:
|
| http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/s.../Speed-of-ligh...
|
| An experiment was performed. What reliable
| inferences can be made remains to be seen.
| A better expression of the speed of light as an
| upper limit is that information cannot transfer
| in an inertial frame of reference faster than c.
| Building a neutrino radio poses a severe challenge.
|
| Well yeah except that neutrinos have mass so we are not talking about
| just information, we are talking about something with actual mass that
| *appears* to be able to travel c. If this turns out to be true (we
| are still far from establishing that for sure) then some brand new
| physics is gonna be needed.

I want to wait and see what Penrose has to say about it.

But in all probability the community is going to split between the
pro-Einsteinists and the New-Science factions with the arguments going
on for decades.

Physicists *really* don't want this result to stand. Physicists hate tachyons
because the retro-causality found in quantum physics would suddenly get upgraded
to *real* world status. This is not something physicists like.


The physicists I know don't get emotional about these kind of
discoveries. As the late great Richard Feynman said, if you don't like
the way physical reality works (quantum lecture), then go and find
something else to do.

No doubt he was right but emotional isn't quite what that meant, I was referring
to the way that some flavours of 'theories of everything' that give rise to the
existence of tachyons (there are quite a few) are often seen as too
*problematical* to consider because of the retro-causality issue (among others).
Of course quantum guys accept retro-causality in their domain since it has been
seen and confirmed experimentally in quantum behaviour. However there is a
considerable disconnect between the quantum and GR worlds. Even the great Albert
some *emotional* problems with this.

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On 21/11/2011 08:57, atriage wrote:

Even the great Albert some *emotional* problems with this.

I missed out the 'had'. It arrived a day ago further up the thread.

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atriage wrote:
Well yeah except that neutrinos have mass so we are not talking about
just information, we are talking about something with actual mass that
*appears* to be able to travel c.

That can't be possible. Nothing is supposed to have more mass that a
fully kitted out FM.

raamman wrote:
get obree on it, he'll find a way to make it go faster

Must have been a washing machine made of neutrinos.