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Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag



 
 
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  #1  
Old July 1st 20, 04:44 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

On 7/1/2020 11:36 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/1/2020 12:18 AM, Joy Beeson wrote:

I'd made a couple of short rides in my grubbies, in case I had to
undress into the washing machine, and thought that I could wear
calf-length house pants on the bike all the time.Â* They aren't
reinforced in the seat, but hey, they are cheap (never mind that each
pair represents a few hundred trips to the store; non-plastic clothing
is *really* hard to find)


You know MUCH more than I do about clothes, so I hesitate to post a tip.
But I'll do it anyway.

About hard-to-find clothes: Last year I needed to replace a couple of
cotton seersucker casual shirts. I like that fabric for summer's heat
and humidity.

I seldom even consider buying clothes online, but then I thought about
Kohl's online. Turned out they had a large inventory including my
acceptable shirts, I could order and pay online, then pick up at the
store which is not far away.

Best of all, in my book, I figured I could try the shirts on in the
store before I even walked out the door; so if they didn't fit, the
return would be postage free and instantaneous.

When I picked them up, I asked if I could try them on. The clerk said
"Honey, they're yours! You can do anything you want!"

And they did fit. Heck, I'd be tempted to buy shoes that way!


Speaking of shoes: I recently took delivery of a new pair of cycling
shoes. It involved quite a search, since I don't use clipless pedals
(that a person clips into). I like toe clips and straps. I needed to
find shoes that came with a proper cleat cover, and it seems those are
becoming rare. Plus, I'm not into psychedelic shoe colors.

I used the new shoes for the first time on a tandem ride Sunday. They'll
require a little work. First, I'll have to adjust the strap length, as I
think these are thicker than my previous shoes. Also I'll try to
re-shape the toe clips because the toe box is higher.

But the scariest thing occurred two times we started from a dead stop -
always a bit trickier with the tandem. My wife held the left pedal in my
power position, I stood on it to pedal forward as I rose into the seat,
and my foot almost slipped off!

When I got home, I found the reason. The sole of the shoe is made of
normal rubber with high traction. But they searched far and wide to find
the hardest, lowest friction material available for the cleat cover. I
think it's made of black Teflon.

I hope EPDM rubber can be glued to it.


--
- Frank Krygowski
Ads
  #2  
Old July 1st 20, 07:33 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.tech
Jeff Liebermann
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Posts: 4,018
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

On Wed, 1 Jul 2020 11:44:16 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

When I got home, I found the reason. The sole of the shoe is made of
normal rubber with high traction. But they searched far and wide to find
the hardest, lowest friction material available for the cleat cover. I
think it's made of black Teflon.

I hope EPDM rubber can be glued to it.


EPDM is very difficult to glue:
https://www.permabond.com/resource-center/bonding-epdm-industrial-adhesive/
The article suggests cyanoacrylate adhesives, which might work if you
don't flex the sole very much while riding. If the sole is as stiff
as you suggest, that might work. I don't have any experience using
structural adhesives (acrylic) and rubber.

One lesson I learned working with rubber is that the glue joint has to
be super clean before applying the glue. 91% alcohol was my favored
solvent, but if the materials were compatible, I used acetone. Also,
wear gloves as any skin oil transferred to the glue joint will ruin
it.

Instead of EPDM, maybe something lower tech, such as rubber gasket
material:
https://www.acehardware.com/departments/plumbing/faucet-and-faucet-repair/faucet-and-valve-packing/4218095
or neoprene sheets:
https://www.mcmaster.com/neoprene-rubber-sheet-gaskets/

However, neoprene adhesive is kinda expensive:
https://www.amazon.com/3M-Scotch-Weld-Neoprene-Performance-Adhesive/dp/B00QVILOQO
https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/3M-Neoprene-High-Performance-Rubber-and-Gasket-Adhesive-1300/?N=5002385+3293241328&rt=rud
https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/3M-Scotch-Weld-Neoprene-High-Performance-Contact-Adhesive-EC-1357/?N=5002385+3292667546&preselect=3293786499&rt=rud
I think it's basically contact cement, so it might be worth trying
something cheaper such as Weldwood.

Also, you could try wire brushing or cutting grooves into the existing
soles to improve traction. That might need to be done anyway to
increase the surface area for gluing.


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
  #3  
Old July 1st 20, 08:34 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Lou Holtman[_5_]
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Posts: 826
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 5:44:21 PM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/1/2020 11:36 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/1/2020 12:18 AM, Joy Beeson wrote:

I'd made a couple of short rides in my grubbies, in case I had to
undress into the washing machine, and thought that I could wear
calf-length house pants on the bike all the time.Â* They aren't
reinforced in the seat, but hey, they are cheap (never mind that each
pair represents a few hundred trips to the store; non-plastic clothing
is *really* hard to find)


You know MUCH more than I do about clothes, so I hesitate to post a tip..
But I'll do it anyway.

About hard-to-find clothes: Last year I needed to replace a couple of
cotton seersucker casual shirts. I like that fabric for summer's heat
and humidity.

I seldom even consider buying clothes online, but then I thought about
Kohl's online. Turned out they had a large inventory including my
acceptable shirts, I could order and pay online, then pick up at the
store which is not far away.

Best of all, in my book, I figured I could try the shirts on in the
store before I even walked out the door; so if they didn't fit, the
return would be postage free and instantaneous.

When I picked them up, I asked if I could try them on. The clerk said
"Honey, they're yours! You can do anything you want!"

And they did fit. Heck, I'd be tempted to buy shoes that way!


Speaking of shoes: I recently took delivery of a new pair of cycling
shoes. It involved quite a search, since I don't use clipless pedals
(that a person clips into). I like toe clips and straps. I needed to
find shoes that came with a proper cleat cover, and it seems those are
becoming rare. Plus, I'm not into psychedelic shoe colors.


I confused. Why do you need cleat covers if you don't need cleats.

Lou
  #4  
Old July 1st 20, 09:39 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,870
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 8:44:21 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/1/2020 11:36 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/1/2020 12:18 AM, Joy Beeson wrote:

I'd made a couple of short rides in my grubbies, in case I had to
undress into the washing machine, and thought that I could wear
calf-length house pants on the bike all the time.Â* They aren't
reinforced in the seat, but hey, they are cheap (never mind that each
pair represents a few hundred trips to the store; non-plastic clothing
is *really* hard to find)


You know MUCH more than I do about clothes, so I hesitate to post a tip..
But I'll do it anyway.

About hard-to-find clothes: Last year I needed to replace a couple of
cotton seersucker casual shirts. I like that fabric for summer's heat
and humidity.

I seldom even consider buying clothes online, but then I thought about
Kohl's online. Turned out they had a large inventory including my
acceptable shirts, I could order and pay online, then pick up at the
store which is not far away.

Best of all, in my book, I figured I could try the shirts on in the
store before I even walked out the door; so if they didn't fit, the
return would be postage free and instantaneous.

When I picked them up, I asked if I could try them on. The clerk said
"Honey, they're yours! You can do anything you want!"

And they did fit. Heck, I'd be tempted to buy shoes that way!


Speaking of shoes: I recently took delivery of a new pair of cycling
shoes. It involved quite a search, since I don't use clipless pedals
(that a person clips into). I like toe clips and straps. I needed to
find shoes that came with a proper cleat cover, and it seems those are
becoming rare. Plus, I'm not into psychedelic shoe colors.

I used the new shoes for the first time on a tandem ride Sunday. They'll
require a little work. First, I'll have to adjust the strap length, as I
think these are thicker than my previous shoes. Also I'll try to
re-shape the toe clips because the toe box is higher.

But the scariest thing occurred two times we started from a dead stop -
always a bit trickier with the tandem. My wife held the left pedal in my
power position, I stood on it to pedal forward as I rose into the seat,
and my foot almost slipped off!

When I got home, I found the reason. The sole of the shoe is made of
normal rubber with high traction. But they searched far and wide to find
the hardest, lowest friction material available for the cleat cover. I
think it's made of black Teflon.


With double-sided SPD platform pedals and endless SPD stealth-shoe styles, I can't imagine why anyone would want to use toe clips, particularly on a tandem. I dumped toe clips a millenia ago and haven't used them since -- except after breaking my legs and having to ride in ortho boots. I can see wanting to avoid special shoes, but you're buying special shoes. Now just go out and buy some sale-table M520s and call it good.

-- Jay Beattie.

  #5  
Old July 1st 20, 10:15 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

On 7/1/2020 3:34 PM, Lou Holtman wrote:
On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 5:44:21 PM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Speaking of shoes: I recently took delivery of a new pair of cycling
shoes. It involved quite a search, since I don't use clipless pedals
(that a person clips into). I like toe clips and straps. I needed to
find shoes that came with a proper cleat cover, and it seems those are
becoming rare. Plus, I'm not into psychedelic shoe colors.


I confused. Why do you need cleat covers if you don't need cleats.


The shoes will certainly be used for walking, including on dirt, perhaps
mud, etc. when I have to dismount and walk the bike. I figure the cavity
inside will fill up with mud and need to be cleaned out.

With covers, I should be able to get them adequately clean by just
wiping my feet on a mat.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #6  
Old July 1st 20, 10:27 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

On 7/1/2020 4:39 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 8:44:21 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Speaking of shoes: I recently took delivery of a new pair of cycling
shoes. It involved quite a search, since I don't use clipless pedals
(that a person clips into). I like toe clips and straps. I needed to
find shoes that came with a proper cleat cover, and it seems those are
becoming rare. Plus, I'm not into psychedelic shoe colors.


With double-sided SPD platform pedals and endless SPD stealth-shoe styles, I can't imagine why anyone would want to use toe clips, particularly on a tandem.


Hmm. Is that yet more intolerance for others' choices?

I know quite a few people who prefer toe clips. Of the two (fast) people
we rode with Sunday, one of them used toe clips. You might work harder
to train your imaginative powers.

Personally, I frequently ride without "suiting up." In the last couple
of weeks, I've ridden that tandem twice with a little kid on the back
(using a kid-back attachment I fabricated myself, years ago). Should I
really have donned special shoes to ride 7 miles on neighborhood
streets, or two miles to a store and back?

The double-sided SPD pedals would work after a fashion, but if I were
not in SPD shoes I'd be on flat pedals without toe clips. For me, that's
less desirable.

In general, I use "special shoes" as I do special bike shorts - for
longer recreational rides. For quick utility rides, rides with kids,
slow rides with neighbors etc. I just jump on and ride.

(Will we someday have "special shorts" that only interface with a
particular design of saddle? Will each saddle manufacturer have their
own standard for shorts? It's an entirely new opportunity for bike
industry churning!)

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #7  
Old July 1st 20, 11:11 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,447
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

On 7/1/2020 4:27 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/1/2020 4:39 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 8:44:21 AM UTC-7, Frank
Krygowski wrote:

Speaking of shoes: I recently took delivery of a new pair
of cycling
shoes. It involved quite a search, since I don't use
clipless pedals
(that a person clips into). I like toe clips and straps.
I needed to
find shoes that came with a proper cleat cover, and it
seems those are
becoming rare. Plus, I'm not into psychedelic shoe colors.


With double-sided SPD platform pedals and endless SPD
stealth-shoe styles, I can't imagine why anyone would want
to use toe clips, particularly on a tandem.


Hmm. Is that yet more intolerance for others' choices?

I know quite a few people who prefer toe clips. Of the two
(fast) people we rode with Sunday, one of them used toe
clips. You might work harder to train your imaginative powers.

Personally, I frequently ride without "suiting up." In the
last couple of weeks, I've ridden that tandem twice with a
little kid on the back (using a kid-back attachment I
fabricated myself, years ago). Should I really have donned
special shoes to ride 7 miles on neighborhood streets, or
two miles to a store and back?

The double-sided SPD pedals would work after a fashion, but
if I were not in SPD shoes I'd be on flat pedals without toe
clips. For me, that's less desirable.

In general, I use "special shoes" as I do special bike
shorts - for longer recreational rides. For quick utility
rides, rides with kids, slow rides with neighbors etc. I
just jump on and ride.

(Will we someday have "special shorts" that only interface
with a particular design of saddle? Will each saddle
manufacturer have their own standard for shorts? It's an
entirely new opportunity for bike industry churning!)


The last thing made which did that very well was the SiDi
Touring, a walkable sorta stiff smooth rubber sole shoe.
There just wasn't sufficient volume for it. Grant Peterson
cajoled SiDi into making one last run for Rivendell, but
that was twenty years ago.

I ride toeclips with regular leather soled dress shoes
because I find them comfortable and they're dirt cheap used
(as my generation drops dead). Retail $400, thrift store
$10. I tried Capezio 440s (made in USA!) which are very
comfortable but the soles are too thin for riding.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #8  
Old July 2nd 20, 07:23 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Rolf Mantel[_2_]
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Posts: 267
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

Am 01.07.2020 um 23:27 schrieb Frank Krygowski:
On 7/1/2020 4:39 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 8:44:21 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Speaking of shoes: I recently took delivery of a new pair of cycling
shoes. It involved quite a search, since I don't use clipless pedals
(that a person clips into). I like toe clips and straps. I needed to
find shoes that came with a proper cleat cover, and it seems those are
becoming rare. Plus, I'm not into psychedelic shoe colors.


With double-sided SPD platform pedals and endless SPD stealth-shoe
styles, I can't imagine why anyone would want to use toe clips,
particularly on a tandem.


Personally, I frequently ride without "suiting up." In the last couple
of weeks, I've ridden that tandem twice with a little kid on the back
(using a kid-back attachment I fabricated myself, years ago). Should I
really have donned special shoes to ride 7 miles on neighborhood
streets, or two miles to a store and back?

The double-sided SPD pedals would work after a fashion, but if I were
not in SPD shoes I'd be on flat pedals without toe clips. For me, that's
less desirable.


The double-sided SPD pedals are the best compromise between special
shoes for longer distances and "normal shoes" for going into town only.

It it's not worth putting on special cycling shoes, the lack of foot
retention does not matter either. On the 7 miles to work, I forget to
put on the cycling shoes maybe once a year and I'm too lazy to go back
into the house again, the difference is quite noticable.
But I would never want to ride those 7 milse with something as inferior
as toe clips vs. SPD the rest of the year just to get an improvement for
that one day per year.
  #9  
Old July 2nd 20, 08:50 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,870
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 2:27:19 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/1/2020 4:39 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 8:44:21 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Speaking of shoes: I recently took delivery of a new pair of cycling
shoes. It involved quite a search, since I don't use clipless pedals
(that a person clips into). I like toe clips and straps. I needed to
find shoes that came with a proper cleat cover, and it seems those are
becoming rare. Plus, I'm not into psychedelic shoe colors.


With double-sided SPD platform pedals and endless SPD stealth-shoe styles, I can't imagine why anyone would want to use toe clips, particularly on a tandem.


Hmm. Is that yet more intolerance for others' choices?


No, I question your choice when you're already buying special shoes, and particularly when double sided pedals are well suited to tandems. Entry is faster since there is no flip phase, which makes it easier to get into your pedals as you're wobbling off the start. Exit is easier too, depending on the soles of your toe clip shoes and whether you tighten your straps or have multiple straps. I also thought you owned at least one bike with SPD pedals. No?

-- Jay Beattie.




  #10  
Old July 2nd 20, 09:03 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Wolfgang Strobl[_3_]
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Posts: 44
Default Remembering how to tie my shoes, going back for a do-rag

Am Wed, 1 Jul 2020 13:39:41 -0700 (PDT) schrieb jbeattie
:

On Wednesday, July 1, 2020 at 8:44:21 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

....
But the scariest thing occurred two times we started from a dead stop -
always a bit trickier with the tandem. My wife held the left pedal in my
power position, I stood on it to pedal forward as I rose into the seat,
and my foot almost slipped off!

When I got home, I found the reason. The sole of the shoe is made of
normal rubber with high traction. But they searched far and wide to find
the hardest, lowest friction material available for the cleat cover. I
think it's made of black Teflon.


With double-sided SPD platform pedals and endless SPD
stealth-shoe styles, I can't imagine why anyone would want
to use toe clips,


I can and you don't have to. It's primary a personal preference. There
are people who prefer sandals, whether they are walking or cycling.
Probably for a reason.

I myself switched to SPD pedals in 1995 with the newly purchased
Panasonic, my wife changed to SPD in 2010, also on the occasion of a
newly acquired road bike. We live in an old university town, you can
see many students riding around on old racing bikes, few of them use
racing pedals or MTB variant called SPD. A can imagine why they do it
that way, too.

Speaking about sandals, I rarely wear those, because they offer little
protection. Nevertheless, years ago I bought a pair of sandals with SPD
cleats and was quite happy to have them available for some of these
tours
https://www.mystrobl.de/ws/pic/fahrrad/luberon/luberon2008-2018s.jpg
in 2018, on very hot days.


particularly on a tandem. I dumped toe
clips a millenia ago and haven't used them since -- except
after breaking my legs and having to ride in ortho boots.


See? You can imagine reasons, as long as these are your reasons. Now try
to imagine that other people may have reasons you don't know about.


I
can see wanting to avoid special shoes, but you're buying
special shoes. Now just go out and buy some sale-table M520s
and call it good.


I agree with the notion that M520 are good enough. Shortly after I wrote
the following summary about the M323 in 2008, I bought a pair of M520,
replacing the M323, mostly to get rid of the flat side, which I almost
never used, but which gets in the way in curves.

https://www.mystrobl.de/Plone/radfahren/technik/komponenten/m323/shimano-m323-still-going-strong.html

The article is in German, sorry about that. A rought translation of the
first paragraph:

"At the beginning of 1995 I bought a set of M323 pedals, shoe plates and
a pair of shoes together with my road bike. At the end of 1998 I wrote
in a first experience report that I was quite satisfied with the pedals.
Later I dismantled the M323 pedals from the road bike and exchanged them
with PD-M525 which I had received together with a touring bike that I
had had built according to my specifications. The plates ("cleats") are
long worn and replaced, ditto the shoes. The pedals, on the other hand,
are still in use and I am still quite satisfied with them."




--
Thank you for observing all safety precautions
 




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