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  #111  
Old March 31st 20, 10:44 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Eric Pozharski
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 41
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

with AMuzi wrote:
On 3/30/2020 7:56 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 30 Mar 2020 11:31:50 -0400, Radey Shouman
wrote:
John B. writes:
On Sun, 29 Mar 2020 21:34:36 -0500, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/29/2020 9:24 PM, Radey Shouman wrote:
Sir Ridesalot writes:
On Sunday, 29 March 2020 21:02:23 UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 29 Mar 2020 10:37:44 -0000 (UTC), news18
wrote:
On Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:12:34 +0700, John B. wrote:


*SKIP*
Now there's a great question! And 'technical' too ! I had no idea
but it turns out to be amazingly universal:
https://sciencenotes.org/wp-content/...aElementov.png

*SKIP*
I suppose that this is how rumors start. (someone who doesn't
understand what he/she/it is talking about explaining something :-)

*SKIP*
Thank you. I found it in an image search for 'foreign language
periodic table' in response to a query about Russia.


You better be careful here. There's that dude who is/was so interrested
in Russia he'd been sacked and is now held for ransom.

--
Torvalds' goal for Linux is very simple: World Domination
Stallman's goal for GNU is even simpler: Freedom
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  #112  
Old March 31st 20, 02:00 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 13,447
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

On 3/30/2020 9:45 PM, Radey Shouman wrote:
John B. writes:

On Mon, 30 Mar 2020 11:31:50 -0400, Radey Shouman
wrote:

John B. writes:

On Sun, 29 Mar 2020 21:34:36 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 3/29/2020 9:24 PM, Radey Shouman wrote:
Sir Ridesalot writes:

On Sunday, 29 March 2020 21:02:23 UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 29 Mar 2020 10:37:44 -0000 (UTC), news18
wrote:

On Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:12:34 +0700, John B. wrote:


It depends on the surface. For sars-Cov2, Cu about 4 hours to plastic
for weeks.
also depends on the mu-flora and wheather if gets consumed '

Ok, on a plastic surface it is viable for weeks. But what is Cu? and I
did look... and came across 82 definitions, starting with Credit Union
and ending with Coefficient of Utilization.
--
cheers,

John B.

Cu (from Latin: cuprum)is the symbol for copper.

Cheers

Or Christian Union, or Coming Unglued, or Celeron Unit, or Cardiac Unit,
or... :-)

Yes, any of those might have it too, but you wouldn't normally define
them as a surface

I was attempting to point out how ludicrous this constant use of
abbreviations is. I mean, well... if you can't spell than, what the
hell, just look it up.

But apparently I was being too subtle :-(
--
cheers,

John B.

A LOT of people use their cell phone to access this newsgroup and thus
rely on abbreviations to keep their texts shorter.

Chemists use them because they are understood regardless of language,
although I'm not sure what they do in non-Latin scripts.


Now there's a great question! And 'technical' too !
I had no idea but it turns out to be amazingly universal:

https://sciencenotes.org/wp-content/...aElementov.png

https://sciencenotes.org/wp-content/...huuki-hyou.png

Hey Mr Slocumb:
http://canov.jergym.cz/vyhledav/varianty/th.gif

Yup, seems to be a chart of how letters of the English alphabet are
pronounced. For Thai children, I'd guess.

I can't read Thai, but it's plainly a periodic table of the elements,
for Thai children learning chemistry, I'd guess. you can see the
pictures illustrating a use of each element, for example Mn (manganese)
is an i-beam, S (sulfur) is a vulcanized rubber tire, Co (cobalt) is a
magnet, H (hydrogen) is a zeppelin.

Sc (scandium) is a bicycle, I had no idea what that was about, but it
seems that scandium alluminum alloys are a thing:

http://www.konabikeworld.com/08_tech_scandium.htm

Nice find.


I suppose that this is how rumors start.
(someone who doesn't understand what he/she/it is talking about
explaining something :-)

The chart that Andrew posted the reference to is a Thai language chart
to teach children the pronunciation of English language letters and is
clearly labeled as such. I described the"K" in the left column for
somebody. It is pronounced like the first part of the Thai word
"Kloo-ah" (common English translation) which in English would be
called a banana.


Grade school children in Thailand learn how to pronounce the English
"Nb"? How do they say it?


Trick question. 'Columbium'

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #113  
Old March 31st 20, 03:18 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sepp Ruf
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Posts: 454
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

Radey Shouman wrote:
Frank Krygowski writes:
On 3/30/2020 12:12 PM, Sepp Ruf wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/30/2020 5:58 AM, Rolf Mantel wrote:
Am 29.03.2020 um 03:40 schrieb John B.:
how long does a
virus, or perhaps more accurately a virion, remain viable and able to
infect another creature if it is outside a living body. Or in simple
terms if a virion falls on the floor how long can it lay there and
still be capable of causing a disease?

This is completely unknown.* What we do know are some numbers how long
the virus DNA is detectable on various surfaces.* We do not know how
much virus load is needed to trigger an infection (with measles it's
very few, with COVID, it's probably a lot), and we don't know how long
the virus stays in an active form outside the body.

The only thing that we can safely say is that smear contagion is a very
minor source of infection compared to droplet contagion.

So how much are you willing to bet on it?

I had been wondering about required viral load with this virus, with the
understanding that it is probably an unknown.

Regarding "smear contagion": I've seen a photograph of a certain very
intelligent guy - an online colleague whom I've met - spraying down his
groceries in his driveway. According to this article, that's probably
gross overkill:
https://vitals.lifehacker.com/you-do...ies-1842528397

Your online colleague might be both overdoing it and not using effective
means to destroy the virus before whirling it at his direction, but he
probably is more intelligent than some journo who warns her rather clueless
readership about ingesting soap.


Yes, the soap remark was strange. But getting back to the matter of
groceries, there's this:

"... currently there is no evidence of food or food packaging being
associated with transmission of COVID-19." That's from
https://www.fda.gov/food/food-safety...-2019-covid-19


The medical profession seems to have trouble with admitting that absence
of evidence is not evidence of absence.


In any warlike situation, never look for individually sound advice from
bureaucrats in government agencies.

I was struck by this sentence:

If you are concerned about contamination of food and food packaging you
have purchased from the grocery store, wash your hands after handling
food and food packages when you return from the grocery store and after
removing packaging from food.

Because we typically did not remove packaging from food until we're
ready to use it, keeping it in the original bags or boxes. Now we
either remove it from packaging in a "dirty" area, or wipe down the
packaging. But you will do as you see fit. Ohio actually seems to be
in pretty good shape.



Evil doctor, can't the FDA dronestrike him?
https://www.foxla.com/news/sanitize-groceries-discard-takeout-containers-immediately-doctor-demonstrates-sterile-technique

Another evil doctor, seems to cure elderly Covid-19 sufferers in early
stages with $20 worth of drugs, shouldn't something be done about the guy's
cruise control?
https://matzav.com/wp-content/upload...9-01-22-37.mp3
https://www.globalresearch.ca/report-successful-treatment-coronavirus/5708056
  #114  
Old March 31st 20, 03:31 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Rolf Mantel[_2_]
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Posts: 267
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

Am 31.03.2020 um 16:18 schrieb Sepp Ruf:
Another evil doctor, seems to cure elderly Covid-19 sufferers in early
stages with $20 worth of drugs, shouldn't something be done about the guy's
cruise control?
https://matzav.com/wp-content/upload...9-01-22-37.mp3
https://www.globalresearch.ca/report-successful-treatment-coronavirus/5708056


Hydroxychloroquine with the well-known risk 'permanent loss of eyesight'
does not feel perfect for "the early stages of COVID". German
University hospitals use it in intensive care when already a pneumonia
has developed.
Throwing your patients down a bridge also ensures that they don't die of
COVID ;-(
  #115  
Old March 31st 20, 06:05 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sepp Ruf
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 454
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

Rolf Mantel wrote:
Am 31.03.2020 um 16:18 schrieb Sepp Ruf:
Another evil doctor, seems to cure elderly Covid-19 sufferers in early
stages with $20 worth of drugs, shouldn't something be done about the guy's
cruise control?
https://matzav.com/wp-content/upload...9-01-22-37.mp3
https://www.globalresearch.ca/report-successful-treatment-coronavirus/5708056


Hydroxychloroquine with the well-known risk 'permanent loss of eyesight'


OK, this is rbt, but quantify risk by severity only?
"This medication may rarely cause serious (sometimes permanent) eye problems
or muscle/nerve damage, especially if you take it for a long time." (webmd)

does not feel perfect for "the early stages of COVID".


Thyme tea sounds perfectly safe, I shall buy another boatload of it today
before shelves are empty.

I'm fully aware that the elderly ex-mayor's podcast with Zelenko is only
slightly more joy to listen to than a Trump press conferences, but you made
it through in less than 13 minutes? We'll eventually find out if Zelenko's
patients got through this better than comparable groups.

Better old and blind in a closely knit community than young and drowned at
the ICU:
http://www.leparisien.fr/essonne-91/morsang-sur-orge-91390/julie-16-ans-decedee-du-coronavirus-personne-n-est-invincible-se-desole-sa-soeur-27-03-2020-8288850.php

German University hospitals use it in intensive care when already a pneumonia
has developed.


Maybe after having damaged patients by throwing everything from antibiotics,
Aids-medication, colchicine, etc. at them?
https://dasgelbeforum.net/index.php?id=519857

Throwing your patients down a bridge also ensures that they don't die of
COVID ;-(


I guess it depends on the statistician -- and MHL. Italy does not have a
cyclist MHL, so under Italian bridges, the bodies would be Wuhan tested
post-mortem and recorded as Covid victims.
  #116  
Old March 31st 20, 06:15 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,318
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

On Monday, March 30, 2020 at 9:23:37 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/30/2020 9:23 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, March 29, 2020 at 6:09:50 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/29/2020 7:57 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 29 Mar 2020 19:01:53 +0300, Eric Pozharski
wrote:

with John B wrote:
On Sat, 28 Mar 2020 09:45:07 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:
On Saturday, 28 March 2020 12:01:47 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:

As usual, discussions here have devolved into childish name calling
by some, demeaning published facts and data, quick political jabs,
defensive changes of subjet, and "I know better than anyone"
allusions. Things get obscured.
*SKIP*
Thailand has imposed some pretty draconian regulations to fight the
virus and while I'm not sure whether it is a viable calculation their
new cases number is 8% of total cases. The U.S. with apparently fewer
restrictions has a new case total of about 14% of the total cases. At
this rate the U.S. will exceed 200,000 cases in about 4 more days :-(

For kernel's sake, can we start to think in ratios, plz? Let me reframe
this.

X -- grand total cases (not mentioned in the post by "John B"; I'm
not going to figure out at how many it is/was (at time of
posting by "John B"))
x_t -- cases in Thailand (0.08X)
x_u -- cases in USA (0.14X)
p_t -- population in Thailland (694 of 100K people, estimate 2018)
p_u -- population in USA (3087 of 100K people, estimate 2019)

Now, r_t would be ( x_t X / p_t ) or ( 1.15e-4 X ), and r_u would be
( x_u X / p_u ) or ( 4.54e-5 X ).

Now, it looks like USA is going 2.54 better then Thailand. But
important question is -- at what timespan?

plz fill in blanks and/or correct me if I'm wrong.

You don't have to do all that fancy figuring. Just look at
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries
The U.S. has 426 cases per 1,000,000 population and Thailand has 20
cases per 1,000,000 population. The U.S. has had 7 deaths/1 million
and Thailand 0.1/1 million.
Oh Yes, "time span" The U.S. reported their first virus case on 10
January and Thailand on 12 January. The U.S. reported 7,412 new cases
as of March 29, 2020, 22:34 GMT and Thailand reported 143 ( that is
22.47/1 million and 2.0). If daily the difference is so great than 2
days is negligible :-)
--
cheers,

John B.


As yet there's no way to know how many people are/ were
infected, asymptomatic carriers, recovered without result or
report, and so on. These are preliminary figures and as is
often said, in war the first three reports are wrong.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


They have again ceased testing people that are not showing serious symptoms. So again that means is that those testing positive are only the 20% of people that aren't asymptomatic or with mild to very moderate symptoms. I is very serious that they are not even attempting to get an accurate baseline to judge mortality rates with.


Tom, you keep harping on your theory that this virus isn't very bad, and
your theory that the mortality rate is grossly overstated.

You've harped on the fact that the flu can kill tens of thousands, so
this virus is no worse than the flu.

Weirdly, your orange hero seems to have stopped listening to you. He's
now saying that IF we can hold U.S. deaths to 100,000 that will be a
"very good job."

You need to give him another phone call. Set the man straight!

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-very-good-job


--
- Frank Krygowski


Exactly how can you stand to live with yourself? The President is in a position in where he has to get the population prepared for the worst case and not a for-joy for-joy scenario.

As it turns out 4 out of 5 people appear to be naturally immune to the disease to begin with. That means to the very uninformed people like you that the target population is only 64 million. Large but not unmanageable since the people most at risk are in focused groups in large cities like New York.

80% of this group have silent or mild symptoms. That reduces the target group to 12.8 million. Of this group without any forms of treatment that would make the 1.3% fatality rate only 33,280 which while massive is still less than the yearly influenza death toll in the AVERAGE year.

However, we now have 3 forms of treatment that have proven to be very effective and all you have to do is determine which of these treatments are best for your patient.

Presently in the US we have about 10% of those deaths and it is very likely that they are going to taper off quickly like they did in China.

https://www.powerlineblog.com/archiv...n-covid-19.php
  #117  
Old March 31st 20, 06:21 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,318
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

On Tuesday, March 31, 2020 at 7:31:32 AM UTC-7, Rolf Mantel wrote:
Am 31.03.2020 um 16:18 schrieb Sepp Ruf:
Another evil doctor, seems to cure elderly Covid-19 sufferers in early
stages with $20 worth of drugs, shouldn't something be done about the guy's
cruise control?
https://matzav.com/wp-content/upload...-01-22-37..mp3
https://www.globalresearch.ca/report-successful-treatment-coronavirus/5708056


Hydroxychloroquine with the well-known risk 'permanent loss of eyesight'
does not feel perfect for "the early stages of COVID". German
University hospitals use it in intensive care when already a pneumonia
has developed.
Throwing your patients down a bridge also ensures that they don't die of
COVID ;-(


People with Lupus and other rheumatoid conditions use this stuff daily at 10 mg/kg doses. The treatment they are using for covid-19 is 7.8 mg/kg for perhaps a week. You all seem to be working very hard to run about screaming "The Sky is Falling, the Sky is Falling".
  #118  
Old April 30th 20, 08:02 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

On 3/28/2020 12:01 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:


BTW, our bike club now has its first member in intensive care on a
ventilator. I consider him a really good friend, one of the guys who
(almost) always came on my night rides. He's much younger than me and
has been a hell of a rider, a daily commuter, fast and high mileage.


Follow up: My friend is finally off the ventilator, conscious and
eating. He was on the ventilator for a solid month.

Another friend, an long time surgical and emergency nurse, says he's
extremely lucky; that it's very rare for a person to be on a ventilator
that long and survive.

They have detected damage to kidneys, liver, etc. I'm hoping all that
recovers. Again, he had no pre-conditions, is in his early 50s, is slim
and is (or was) a VERY strong rider.

Apparently he caught COVID while on vacation in Florida in mid-February.
That's back when we were told:
Feb 24th - “The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA… Stock
Market starting to look very good to me!”
Feb 25th - “CDC and my Administration are doing a GREAT job of handling
Coronavirus.”
Feb 25h - “I think that's a problem that’s going to go away… They have
studied it. They know very much. In fact, we’re very close to a vaccine.”
Feb 26th - “The 15 (cases in the US) within a couple of days is going to
be down to close to zero.”

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #119  
Old April 30th 20, 09:18 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,447
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

On 4/30/2020 2:02 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/28/2020 12:01 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:


BTW, our bike club now has its first member in intensive
care on a ventilator. I consider him a really good friend,
one of the guys who (almost) always came on my night
rides. He's much younger than me and has been a hell of a
rider, a daily commuter, fast and high mileage.


Follow up: My friend is finally off the ventilator,
conscious and eating. He was on the ventilator for a solid
month.

Another friend, an long time surgical and emergency nurse,
says he's extremely lucky; that it's very rare for a person
to be on a ventilator that long and survive.

They have detected damage to kidneys, liver, etc. I'm hoping
all that recovers. Again, he had no pre-conditions, is in
his early 50s, is slim and is (or was) a VERY strong rider.

Apparently he caught COVID while on vacation in Florida in
mid-February. That's back when we were told:
Feb 24th - “The Coronavirus is very much under control in
the USA… Stock Market starting to look very good to me!”
Feb 25th - “CDC and my Administration are doing a GREAT
job of handling Coronavirus.”
Feb 25h - “I think that's a problem that’s going to go
away… They have studied it. They know very much. In fact,
we’re very close to a vaccine.”
Feb 26th - “The 15 (cases in the US) within a couple of
days is going to be down to close to zero.”


The Fauci quotations are exactly the same over that period.
One often doesn't know what one doesn't know despite prior
achievement or general perspicacity.

I heard Gordon Chang discussing this on 7 January with
follow up telephone interviews through January from Daniel
Yon, an American in HongKong reporting on the insurgency and
well connected in China. It was just another anomaly among
many from China; no one realized its potential, even people
who reported the CCP was covering up the number of deaths.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #120  
Old May 1st 20, 12:28 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 41
Default State your opinion on COVID-19

On Saturday, March 28, 2020 at 11:01:47 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
As usual, discussions here have devolved into childish name calling by
some, demeaning published facts and data, quick political jabs,
defensive changes of subjet, and "I know better than anyone" allusions.
Things get obscured.

So I'd like to get a direct answer, especially from Tom and from Andrew.

Tom: Do you really think COVID-19 is no worse than an ordinary seasonal flu?

Andrew: Do you really think COVID-19 is no worse than an ordinary
seasonal flu?

Of course, this is a discussion group. Others are very welcome to give
their opinion too.

BTW, our bike club now has its first member in intensive care on a
ventilator. I consider him a really good friend, one of the guys who
(almost) always came on my night rides. He's much younger than me and
has been a hell of a rider, a daily commuter, fast and high mileage.

--
- Frank Krygowski


My significant other is a surgeon. All her patients have tested positive. Two died before operations (vascular procedures / dialysis catheter) from C-19. We live in the norm now.

Some have contracted it from nursing homes. Some from going to church. Jerks!

She tested negative. But me, working for the American Dental Association, have seen dental in a different light.

C-19 is real. Stay home. Save lives.
 




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