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Carbon frame intregrity after accident



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 28th 03, 02:14 AM
Jürgen Hartwig
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident

I had an accident in which a car pulled across my path. I struck the
passenger rear quarter panel and flew over the car, taking the bike halfway
across the trunk. The fork was slightly bent (can be straightened), and
front wheel was badly warped. The frame is a ~1995 Trek 2300 with carbon
main tubes bonded to aluminum lugs. The carbon tubes look physically fine.
One bike shop states there is the risk of internal damage, and I should
consider replacing the frame. Another shop states the frame is fine,
straighten the fork, and replace the front wheel.

I have been unable to ride the bike due to a healing shoulder, so I cannot
comment on how it feels. Should I be concerned?

Jurgen


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  #2  
Old October 28th 03, 02:20 AM
Mike S.
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident


"Jürgen Hartwig" wrote in message
...
I had an accident in which a car pulled across my path. I struck the
passenger rear quarter panel and flew over the car, taking the bike

halfway
across the trunk. The fork was slightly bent (can be straightened), and
front wheel was badly warped. The frame is a ~1995 Trek 2300 with carbon
main tubes bonded to aluminum lugs. The carbon tubes look physically

fine.
One bike shop states there is the risk of internal damage, and I should
consider replacing the frame. Another shop states the frame is fine,
straighten the fork, and replace the front wheel.

I have been unable to ride the bike due to a healing shoulder, so I cannot
comment on how it feels. Should I be concerned?

Jurgen

There is always going to be a little voice in the back of your head
wondering if the bike is fine, or if its going to break next time you hammer
up a hill.

Have their insurance pay for it! You won't be able to tell if the bike's OK
or not, so replacement is better than the alternative.

I vote for replacement. If for no other reason than the stress it will get
rid of in the long run.

Mike


  #3  
Old October 28th 03, 02:29 AM
Ken
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident

"Mike S." mikeshaw2@coxDOTnet wrote in
news:Wvjnb.83743$vj2.22055@fed1read06:
Have their insurance pay for it! You won't be able to tell if the
bike's OK or not, so replacement is better than the alternative.


I agree. One shop recommending replacement should be enough for the
insurance company.
  #4  
Old October 28th 03, 04:20 AM
jim beam
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident

I had an accident in which a car pulled across my path. I struck the
passenger rear quarter panel and flew over the car, taking the bike halfway
across the trunk. The fork was slightly bent (can be straightened), and
front wheel was badly warped. The frame is a ~1995 Trek 2300 with carbon
main tubes bonded to aluminum lugs. The carbon tubes look physically fine.
One bike shop states there is the risk of internal damage, and I should
consider replacing the frame. Another shop states the frame is fine,
straighten the fork, and replace the front wheel.


composites are hard to judge. aerospace inspection techniques are
prohibitively expensive and even then, not necessarily reliable.

you're therefore stuck with trying to load the frame with some multiple
of the safe working load and seeing if it either fails or deflects more
than a known safe frame. again, that may not be practical. your only
other "safe" option is returning to the manufacturer for inspection and
seeing what they say.

alternatively, if you just want to wing it, you can take comfort from
the fact that many composite frames are substantially stronger than
their metallic counterparts and if you've not already broken it, can
find no evidence of structural damage, and the frame shows no evidence
of increased flex or handling peculiarities, it might well be ok.
composites are similar to wood in that if it looks ok, it often /is/ ok
- if it looks cracked, it's not.

jb

  #5  
Old October 28th 03, 05:21 AM
Jürgen Hartwig
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident

Thanks for the response guys.

My biggest worry is getting on the bike, and having a failure at a later
date. If such a thing happened after I settled with the insurance company,
I'm screwed (especially if I injured myself). On the other hand, my gut
says the frameset is probably fine. I think there is validity to either
side, and it will likely become a personal decision.

Wish this had never happened. My life would be far less complicated.

Jürgen


  #6  
Old October 28th 03, 05:45 AM
Mike Jacoubowsky
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident

On the other hand, my gut
says the frameset is probably fine. I think there is validity to either
side, and it will likely become a personal decision.


Your gut is probably right, but the motorist owes you a bike that you don't
even have to ask such questions about. You didn't before, right? So why
should you be riding something that you'd even question, if it's their
fault?

If it was your own fault, fine, you could rationalize that it's probably
fine and just keep an eye on things. But why should *you* have to
rationalize anything in this particular case?

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"Jürgen Hartwig" wrote in message
...
Thanks for the response guys.

My biggest worry is getting on the bike, and having a failure at a later
date. If such a thing happened after I settled with the insurance

company,
I'm screwed (especially if I injured myself). On the other hand, my gut
says the frameset is probably fine. I think there is validity to either
side, and it will likely become a personal decision.

Wish this had never happened. My life would be far less complicated.

Jürgen




  #7  
Old October 28th 03, 03:00 PM
Qui si parla Campagnolo
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident

jhartwig- I had an accident in which a car pulled across my path. I struck
the
passenger rear quarter panel and flew over the car, taking the bike halfway
across the trunk. The fork was slightly bent (can be straightened), and
front wheel was badly warped. The frame is a ~1995 Trek 2300 with carbon
main tubes bonded to aluminum lugs. The carbon tubes look physically fine.
One bike shop states there is the risk of internal damage, and I should
consider replacing the frame. Another shop states the frame is fine,
straighten the fork, and replace the front wheel.

I have been unable to ride the bike due to a healing shoulder, so I cannot
comment on how it feels. Should I be concerned?

yes, no way to tell if the carbon tubes are 'bruised' and may crack/fail w/o
noyice. carbon is wonderful but when in an accident like yours, you cannot
really tell if the tubes are compromised.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
  #8  
Old October 28th 03, 04:02 PM
Matt O'Toole
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident


"Qui si parla Campagnolo" wrote in message
...

jhartwig- I had an accident in which a car pulled across my path. I struck
the
passenger rear quarter panel and flew over the car, taking the bike halfway
across the trunk. The fork was slightly bent (can be straightened), and
front wheel was badly warped. The frame is a ~1995 Trek 2300 with carbon
main tubes bonded to aluminum lugs. The carbon tubes look physically fine.
One bike shop states there is the risk of internal damage, and I should
consider replacing the frame. Another shop states the frame is fine,
straighten the fork, and replace the front wheel.

I have been unable to ride the bike due to a healing shoulder, so I cannot
comment on how it feels. Should I be concerned?

yes, no way to tell if the carbon tubes are 'bruised' and may crack/fail w/o
noyice. carbon is wonderful but when in an accident like yours, you cannot
really tell if the tubes are compromised.


Peter is right, there really is no sure way to tell, w/o X-ray equipment (which
is what aerospace and race car folks use).

But you can extrapolate that damage is likely. Look at it this way -- the fork
was bent. Any impact that great on a modern lightweight steel or aluminum frame
will usually damage the frame too -- buckling or cracking the top and down
tubes. Carbon frames are generally designed for the same stresses, and to be as
lightweight as possible. So it's likely they're not that much stronger than a
3.5 LB steel frame or 3 LB aluminum one.

I'd replace the thing. You already have one shop's word, so you shouldn't have
too much trouble getting the guy's insurance to pay for it. You have nothing to
lose. Why even take the risk?

Matt O.


  #10  
Old October 28th 03, 07:39 PM
Carl Fogel
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Default Carbon frame intregrity after accident

"Jürgen Hartwig" wrote in message ...
I had an accident in which a car pulled across my path. I struck the
passenger rear quarter panel and flew over the car, taking the bike halfway
across the trunk. The fork was slightly bent (can be straightened), and
front wheel was badly warped. The frame is a ~1995 Trek 2300 with carbon
main tubes bonded to aluminum lugs. The carbon tubes look physically fine.
One bike shop states there is the risk of internal damage, and I should
consider replacing the frame. Another shop states the frame is fine,
straighten the fork, and replace the front wheel.

I have been unable to ride the bike due to a healing shoulder, so I cannot
comment on how it feels. Should I be concerned?

Jurgen


Dear Jurgen,

Which bike would you buy if you saw two similar bikes
sitting next to each other, one brand new and one 8
years old that had been in a crash and condemned by a
bike shop?

Hell, which bike would you rent for your mother, your
wife, or your daughter to ride?

Think of yourself, not the bike.

Carl Fogel
 




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