Interesting post on gas prices and bikes

wrote:
You have to change the whole culture. I don't see this ever happening
here in the US. The part that gets me is the total ignorance on part of
the general public. Ands it's jsut not about gas or health. I mean
things like if a woman hears, or guesses, you don't own a car and bike
everywhere you can forget about her and the majority of women. To them
only a loser would just own a bicycle. The truth? Only a loser would
own a car. I'm in minority. Maybe there's some other people like me in
this forum.


Your looking at the wrong kind of woman, do you really want a woman who
is only interested in the size of your car and your wallet. You need to
look at it differently, you voluntarily do not drive, because you like
the excersize of cycling, you like the fact the bicycle is the original
and most efficient zero emission vehicle, you like the fact that your
not wasting the money on a car. You probably have money in the bank, a
lot of car drivers don't.

I am still considering not replacing my old clunker when it finally dies....

W

"Andy Gee" wrote in message
8.78...

So what's the hold up?

I know women who won't ride because they are afraid the bike will have
something go wrong mechanically, and they will be stuck some place where
they will feel vunerable and fear for their physical safety. The automobile
is a big steel box, and they can lock themselves inside if there's a
breakdown.

--
Warm Regards,

Claire Petersky
Personal page: http://www.geocities.com/cpetersky/
See the books I've set free at:
http://bookcrossing.com/referral/Cpetersky

You have to change the whole culture. I don't see this ever happening
here in the US.

I don't know if it *never* happen, but I expect the change will be gradual
over decades (think how general awareness of cycling has improved vs.
several decades ago) or will require a massive cultural shock, like gasoline
going to $10/gallon.


Chris Neary


"Science, freedom, beauty, adventu what more could
you ask of life? Bicycling combined all the elements I
loved" - Adapted from a quotation by Charles Lindbergh

i live downtown denver and bike daily 10 miles to the southeast side.
it's true there are many side streets and bike paths which make for
good commuting, i see many "regulars". it's not exactly flat. not the
mountains, but many small hills and decent grades, especially on south
side and NW side. the weather is usually good and storms move through
fast, but can be unpredictable, especially in the afternoon.

my commute takes about 45 minutes to work, (mostly uphill), and 35
minutes back. my drive time is about 20-25 minutes to work, and about
30-45 back, (traffic worse in afternoon).

i love biking, i get to work alert, refreshed, and get home feeling
energetic as well (no afternoon slump for me).

i think when denver's new train system is in place (years from now),
more people will bike commute, but the first leg will open next year,
and will definetely help cyclists on bad weather days.

"Robert Uhl" wrote in message
...
[...]
It's really very simple: at 12 mph, a 12 mile commute takes one hour.
In a car here in Denver with the highway and rush hour, it takes about
20 minutes. Even at a 16 mph rate, that bike commute takes 45 minutes.
Who would spend more than twice the time to get where he's going?
[...]
But the normal person just wants to get where he's going ASAP.

T'is true in their motivations but flawed in reality.

[It's similar to the way people frequently miss-assess risk. Many people
are more fearful of flying than driving when any rational person would
understand they are incurring a much greater risk of death driving to the
airport than they do on the flight.]

In this case people assume they are saving 25 .minutes by driving their
kar. However they neglect to add in the time they take to drive to the gym
and the timer they spend exercising - often on a stationary bike if one can
comprehend the concept of driving to a pace to ride a stationary bike!!

The other factors - weather, perspiration, are merely social taboos as
quaint as some remote Pacific islanders' when you think about it.

--
'I want to ride my bike
I want to ride my bicycle
I want to ride it where I like' -queen

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 10:17:20 -0400, lowkey wrote:

In this case people assume they are saving 25 .minutes by driving their
kar. However they neglect to add in the time they take to drive to the gym
and the timer they spend exercising - often on a stationary bike if one can
comprehend the concept of driving to a pace to ride a stationary bike!!

I'm not a member of a gym, but I looked into the windows of one and I only
saw three things: treadmills, stationary bicycles, and stepping machines.
All activities that could be done as part of one's daily routine.

I remember one fellow when I was in Manhattan. He'd go to the gym at lunch,
and then come back and take the escalator up to the lobby. Whereas I'd walk
up the parallel stairs.

Where I work now the building is only fours floors high. But there are
people taking the elevator. Some even take it going down a few floors.

I don't know if commuting by bike will ever get big. But people take
numerous short trips in their car. In The Netherlands most have cars, but
they only use them for long trips. Short ones are by bike.

Then there is the dramatic reduction in bicycling to school. In The
Netherlands and Denmark all the kids bike to school. When I grew up in NJ
we either biked or walked for 10 minutes. Now my parents tell me they have
buses! And the bike shed the school had is now gone and turned into
parking.

Don www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

wrote:
You have to change the whole culture. I don't see this ever happening
here in the US.

It's going to happen and it will happen a lot faster than most people
realize. Crude was $28/barrel in '03. Natural gas price has tripled in
2 years. It's not a question of culture changing. It's a question of
resource change. It's August and no one is thinking about winter heat.
But guess what, it will cost 35% more to stay warm in the U.S. this
fall.

Bikes are coming back...

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Chris Neary wrote:

You have to change the whole culture. I don't see this ever happening
here in the US.

I don't know if it *never* happen, but I expect the change will be gradual
over decades (think how general awareness of cycling has improved vs.
several decades ago) or will require a massive cultural shock, like gasoline
going to $10/gallon.

Higher gas prices certainly would help. One editorialist at the NY Times
was writing taht one of the biggest missed opportunities was Bush not
calling for increased gas taxes on Sept. 12th.

I'd like to see gas taxes raised $0.10/year for the next 25 years. This
will give people a chance to plan.

Don www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

Chris Neary wrote:
You have to change the whole culture. I don't see this ever happening
here in the US.

I don't know if it *never* happen, but I expect the change will be gradual
over decades (think how general awareness of cycling has improved vs.
several decades ago) or will require a massive cultural shock, like gasoline
going to $10/gallon.

Actually a real gasoline hike or shortage would probably have a very
impressive effect. The book _The Bicycle in Wartime_ gives some
interesting descriptions for what effect rationing had on bicycle use.
I suspect if gas prices get really high a lot of rural-suburban housing
is going to drop drastically in price

And come to think of it anyone who can do simple math can see that
autos are expensive. The Canadian Automobile Assoc. figures over CDN
$9,000 a year for a mid-sized car (bought new I think).

John Kane
Kingston ON

(1)Fitzpatrick, Jim (1998). The Bicycle in Wartime: an illustrated
history. Washington DC and London : Brassey

John_Kane wrote:
Chris Neary wrote:

You have to change the whole culture. I don't see this ever happening
here in the US.

I don't know if it *never* happen, but I expect the change will be gradual
over decades (think how general awareness of cycling has improved vs.
several decades ago) or will require a massive cultural shock, like gasoline
going to $10/gallon.


Actually a real gasoline hike or shortage would probably have a very
impressive effect. The book _The Bicycle in Wartime_ gives some
interesting descriptions for what effect rationing had on bicycle use.
I suspect if gas prices get really high a lot of rural-suburban housing
is going to drop drastically in price

I expect that people in those areas would be clamouring for new transit
and bikeways to be installed post-haste.


And come to think of it anyone who can do simple math can see that
autos are expensive. The Canadian Automobile Assoc. figures over CDN
$9,000 a year for a mid-sized car (bought new I think).


That's a medium-small car (Cavalier Z-24), driven 18,000km a year, with
a gas price of 86.9c/L with gas prices currently around $1/L in the
cheaper places like Toronto, it's probably closer to $10,000 a year
right now. A larger vehicle like a Caravan is going to be close to
$11,000 then the quoted $10,227 in the brochure.

The CAA brochure is at:
http://www.caa.ca/e/automotive/pdf/driving-costs-05.pdf

I figure dumping my car, and getting bus passes for my wife and I would
save $3000/year.....

W