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#111
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 4:17:43 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 15:00:41 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich wrote: On Friday, January 15, 2021 at 8:06:06 PM UTC-8, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 20:34:41 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 18:58:23 -0500, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 1/14/2021 6:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: I suspect that the next translation of the bible will be into text message abbreviations and acronyms, which is the common language of todays youth: https://www.webopedia.com/reference/text-message-abbreviations/ Long ago I read a science fiction novel (probably by Heinlein) that featured some sort of secret society. As I recall, to be inducted one needed a high degree of intelligence; but once inducted, trainees learned a new language, one that was heavily abbreviated. The claim was that we think by internal use of language, so learning a language whose information was very dense (in terms of ideas per syllable) allowed much faster processing of data - i.e. faster and more efficient thinking. I read the same story, but can't recall the name or author. I did some random Googling for clues, but can't recall enough of the story to construct a working key word search. As I vaguely recall, my first thoughts were that high speed thinking was of marginal value because it also accelerates one's rate of making mistakes and reduces the available time to consider side effects and "what can go wrong" thoughts after the high speed decisions are reached. While one can probably learn to communicate at high speeds, there's no guarantee that they will also think at high speeds. Found it! It's _Gulf_ by Robert A. Heinlein. Wikipedia says that the story was written after the table of contents for the magazine was composed, which explains why it fits its title very loosely. I was never able to understand why do many writers visualized a race superior to humans when the ultimate thing made by the hand of God himself with all of his foibles is the human being. No Tommy God did not make humans he made Adam and Eve who in turn made the rest of humanity. And, quite obviously the blight set in very early in the game. After all, One of their sons murdered the other one. Perhaps you you should spend a little time reading Genesis before shooting your mouth off. |
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#112
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 4:39:44 PM UTC-8, Ralph Barone wrote:
John B. wrote: On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 15:00:41 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich wrote: On Friday, January 15, 2021 at 8:06:06 PM UTC-8, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 20:34:41 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 18:58:23 -0500, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 1/14/2021 6:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: I suspect that the next translation of the bible will be into text message abbreviations and acronyms, which is the common language of todays youth: https://www.webopedia.com/reference/text-message-abbreviations/ Long ago I read a science fiction novel (probably by Heinlein) that featured some sort of secret society. As I recall, to be inducted one needed a high degree of intelligence; but once inducted, trainees learned a new language, one that was heavily abbreviated. The claim was that we think by internal use of language, so learning a language whose information was very dense (in terms of ideas per syllable) allowed much faster processing of data - i.e. faster and more efficient thinking.. I read the same story, but can't recall the name or author. I did some random Googling for clues, but can't recall enough of the story to construct a working key word search. As I vaguely recall, my first thoughts were that high speed thinking was of marginal value because it also accelerates one's rate of making mistakes and reduces the available time to consider side effects and "what can go wrong" thoughts after the high speed decisions are reached. While one can probably learn to communicate at high speeds, there's no guarantee that they will also think at high speeds. Found it! It's _Gulf_ by Robert A. Heinlein. Wikipedia says that the story was written after the table of contents for the magazine was composed, which explains why it fits its title very loosely. I was never able to understand why do many writers visualized a race superior to humans when the ultimate thing made by the hand of God himself with all of his foibles is the human being. No Tommy God did not make humans he made Adam and Eve who in turn made the rest of humanity. And, quite obviously the blight set in very early in the game. After all, One of their sons murdered the other one. If humanity is the pinnacle of all of God’s creations, it casts serious doubt on the concept of a perfect, infallible God. Did you think that God made man only to worship him? Or to be a fallible lot attempting to reach the level of a civilized God? |
#113
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 15:19:00 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote: On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 2:59:14 PM UTC-8, jbeattie wrote: On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 2:29:19 PM UTC-8, wrote: On Friday, January 15, 2021 at 3:11:11 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote: On Fri, 15 Jan 2021 10:20:43 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich wrote: On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 5:43:43 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote: On 1/14/2021 7:20 PM, Tom Kunich wrote: On Thursday, January 14, 2021 at 4:15:02 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 10:01:56 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Wed, 13 Jan 2021 11:49:04 +0700, John B. wrote: Well, certainly there are various "versions" of the Bible and some of the instructions are a bit different. "Thou shall not kill" in some versions and "Thou shall not commit murder" in others for instance New versions appear constantly. The latest is the MEV (Modern English Version) which takes the KJV bible and translates the 17th century idioms and terminology, into modern English. It was finished in 2013. https://modernenglishversion.com https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_English_Version It's the idioms that drive readers nuts. One famous example is from WWII, when a misunderstanding of the phrase "table the motion" brought an important military meeting to a grinding halt: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_(parliamentary_procedure) That's just one example, and the bible is crammed full of idioms. "Thou shalt no kill" is not sufficient in a court of law. Question arise as to exceptions and killing what? Is it acceptable to slaughter animals for food? Some attempts have been made to clarify such details, usually resulting in a bible that reads like a legal document or history book: https://gnt.bible https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_News_Bible Incidentally, here's a vocabulary list extracted from the KJV bible: https://cdn.ymaws.com/www.tbsbibles.org/resource/collection/D1B0BDBE-CD9E-4D12-BBDD-138677F98835/Bible-Word-List-and-Reading-Plan.pdf Most of the words and phrases on the list are in dire need of translation to modern terms. Another thing, regarding the Bible is that of translation. As I have lived in a number of non-English speaking countries I have been made aware that literal translations are frequently meaningless, if even possible, and even worse people often use nicknames and phrases that when literally translated are far different in meaning then what is meant by those using them. For example, it is very common, particularly in Bangkok, to hear a man reference "fan phom" which literally translated is "friend me" but actually means "my wife", a somewhat different meaning than the translation. Given that the Jewish holy books weren't originally written in English, or Latin, but were likely translated first into Greek, and then into Latin and then into English the chances of misinterpreting a word or phrase, or even a loyal advocate of one group or another simply inserting a totally new word into his copy seems more than likely. The Torah or "law" handed down to Moses was in Aramaic. Only scholars could read it for centuries. This was eventually translated from several languages into Latin and then the Bible was only available to priests and monks and the like and again, only scholar could read it. During the reformation the Anglo-Saxons wanted a bible that everyone could read and have and at THAT point it was translated into what passed for Saxon under Martin Luther and finally English as England became the colonial power they passed their Protestant Bible to every corner of the globe where native believers then translated it into local languages. The word "engraver" had the origin in reproducing religious texts. Moses' Jehovah couldn't manage writing in Hebrew? Aramaic was a written language and Hebrew was not for many centuries. There were all sorts of "gospels" since like today, people loved to speak of Jesus never having known him. So the Catholic Church had to sort through these gospels and decide which had authority and which did not. And they were all translated into Latin. https://patternsofevidence.com/2019/...irst-alphabet/ "the first Hebrew writing is called “Old Hebrew” or “Paleo-Hebrew.” This is known from inscriptions found from about 900 BC in the kingdoms of Israel and Judah until the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem and the exile of many of Judah’s inhabitants to Babylon around 586 BC." Since you're the expert in a religion you know nothing about perhaps you'd like to explain to us why the Torah is written in Aramaic and is read by scholars that way to the present day? Uh, Tom, it was written in Hebrew. Google it. I know this from going to friend sons' Bar Mitzvahs and seen those stressed out boys struggle through their Hebrew Torah reading. Originally old Hebrew was not a written language which is why the Torah that Moses brought down from the mountain from the burning bush was in the language that Moses was fluent in. Question: Since there was no such thing as paper at that time and papyrus could only be found near the River Nile, where did Moses get the papyrus upon which to write down the words of God directly? And where did he get the coloring with which to write? Ink was only known in China at the time. Tommy, do you make things up deliberately? Or does it come to you in a dream. Moses quite obviously must have spoken the Egyptian of his times, after all he was educated as a part of a member of the Egyptian royalty. And equally obvious he must have spoken the language of God, who spoke to him from the burning bush, probably ancient Hebrew. As for paper, the first known use of paper seems to date from about 225 B.C., in China so obviously Moses couldn't have used that. However, the earliest known fragment of written papyrus, The Ebers Papyrus, dates from approximately 1550 B.C. As Moses was said to have lived from about 1391–1271 BC, some 200 years after papyrus had been used in Egypt there is no reason that he couldn't have written God's Word on that "paper". Now Tommy, the above is not some sort of archaic knowledge known to a few initiates it is rather commonly known, to those interested in the subject. I googled the term "The Ebers Papyrus" and got 440,000 "hits" so you could have looked it up and have spoken from a background of at least minimal knowledge instead of the subject instead of your usual blathering of weird notion that is your usual contribution. -- Cheers, John B. |
#114
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 16:41:15 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
wrote: On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 4:17:43 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote: On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 15:00:41 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich wrote: On Friday, January 15, 2021 at 8:06:06 PM UTC-8, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 20:34:41 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 18:58:23 -0500, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 1/14/2021 6:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: I suspect that the next translation of the bible will be into text message abbreviations and acronyms, which is the common language of todays youth: https://www.webopedia.com/reference/text-message-abbreviations/ Long ago I read a science fiction novel (probably by Heinlein) that featured some sort of secret society. As I recall, to be inducted one needed a high degree of intelligence; but once inducted, trainees learned a new language, one that was heavily abbreviated. The claim was that we think by internal use of language, so learning a language whose information was very dense (in terms of ideas per syllable) allowed much faster processing of data - i.e. faster and more efficient thinking. I read the same story, but can't recall the name or author. I did some random Googling for clues, but can't recall enough of the story to construct a working key word search. As I vaguely recall, my first thoughts were that high speed thinking was of marginal value because it also accelerates one's rate of making mistakes and reduces the available time to consider side effects and "what can go wrong" thoughts after the high speed decisions are reached. While one can probably learn to communicate at high speeds, there's no guarantee that they will also think at high speeds. Found it! It's _Gulf_ by Robert A. Heinlein. Wikipedia says that the story was written after the table of contents for the magazine was composed, which explains why it fits its title very loosely. I was never able to understand why do many writers visualized a race superior to humans when the ultimate thing made by the hand of God himself with all of his foibles is the human being. No Tommy God did not make humans he made Adam and Eve who in turn made the rest of humanity. And, quite obviously the blight set in very early in the game. After all, One of their sons murdered the other one. Perhaps you you should spend a little time reading Genesis before shooting your mouth off. Well, you could excite us with your vast knowledge so please advise us whether The God of Abraham did or did not create Adam and Eve? And whether or not one of their sons did or did not murder the other son. -- Cheers, John B. |
#115
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 16:41:15 -0800, Tom Kunich scribed:
On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 4:17:43 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote: On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 15:00:41 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich wrote: I was never able to understand why do many writers visualized a race superior to humans when the ultimate thing made by the hand of God himself with all of his foibles is the human being. No Tommy God did not make humans he made Adam and Eve who in turn made the rest of humanity. And, quite obviously the blight set in very early in the game. After all, One of their sons murdered the other one. Perhaps you you should spend a little time reading Genesis before shooting your mouth off. Is that the bit with all the begitting and begatting. I got up to that bit and decided I wouldn't begitting anything reading this silly book, unless i was begatting myself out of here into the real world. Never been back since. |
#116
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On Sun, 17 Jan 2021 08:01:39 +0700, John B.
wrote: On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 15:19:00 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich wrote: On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 2:59:14 PM UTC-8, jbeattie wrote: Uh, Tom, it was written in Hebrew. Google it. I know this from going to friend sons' Bar Mitzvahs and seen those stressed out boys struggle through their Hebrew Torah reading. I still recall going through the Bar Mitzvah ordeal process. Stressed out boys was a chronic problem for the rabbis, who had an excellent solution. Part of the ceremony was the Bar Mitzvah brat would drink from a cup of wine. That should calm him down a little. I had no idea what was going to be in the cup and it hit me unexpectedly. Instead of wine, they had substituted some kind of non-alcoholic energy drink, probably to avoid prosecution for contributing to the delinquency of a minor. It was mostly of grapefruit juice and I hated grapefruit juice. I made a rather sour face, which the audience decided was humorous and which brought the proceedings to a temporary standstill. Originally old Hebrew was not a written language which is why the Torah that Moses brought down from the mountain from the burning bush was in the language that Moses was fluent in. Moses received a royal primary education which was in Egyptian. As a hot headed adolescent, he got into a fight, killed a local, and had to leave town in a hurry. He ended up in the Land of Midian, which was probably somewhere in the Arabian peninsula for 40 years in exile. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midian https://ancientexodus.com/where-was-ancient-midian-2/ Midian was founded by one of descendents of Abraham. In Midian, Moses's knowledge of Egyptian was useless, so he switched to the local tongue, which was probably spoken Aramaic. As a sheep herder, Moses would have no need to do any reading or writing. Incidentally, Moses and the suffix "mose" mean "born of" in Egyptian. Since nobody knew the name of Moses' father, they just left off the name. Question: Since there was no such thing as paper at that time and papyrus could only be found near the River Nile, where did Moses get the papyrus upon which to write down the words of God directly? He used parchment or vellum. Parchment is made from untanned animal hides and could only be written on one side. Vellum is made from much finer calves skin and can be written on both sides. For "ink", they used a concoction of soot, plant sap or gum, and water. Same as the Greeks. Contrary to the CB DeMille version of the Ten Commandments, God did not inscribe his commandments on two slabs of stone. If he did, it would have been inscribed in Egyptian hieroglyphic. God might have been clever and used clay tablets which favored the cuneiform stick writing. More likely, he suspected that Moses was not going to survive the trip down the mountain carrying 50 lbs of stone tablets and opted for something lighter and more familiar such as parchment. However, there's a problem. Moses was illiterate. He might have been able to read Egyptian if he could remember any of it from his youth. If is recall was anything like my ability to recall German, French, Russian, Hebrew, Yiddish, and Polish from my youth, forget that idea. So what to do? Well, God probably dictated his commandments and Moses took notes. For writing material, Moses had the sacrificial lamb that was caught in the thicket on the mountain. For ink, he had charcoal and gum from the burning bush. So Moses took notes as fast as he could scribble, probably in a very crude version of a Aramaic or maybe pictograms. After the burning calf idolatry incident, Moses had to do it all again. However, this time he was prepared. He probably brought some writing materials with him up the mountain, or simply hired a scribe to follow behind. In any case, what he brought back was probably not readable to the Jewish scribes who left Egypt who were expected to read the word of God to masses. As recent refugees, these scribes spoke Egyptian and not Aramaic. Moses probably couldn't remember Egyptian and certainly couldn't write it. So, he had his brother Aaron translate Moses's parchment scribbling into Egyptian. After wandering around the desert again for another 40 years, someone probably translated it again into Aramaic. Incidentally, Moses tended to stutter, so he had his brother Aaron do most of the talking. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron Incidentally, I'm not sure if the translators edited the 613 commandments down to 10, or whether the bureaucracy expanded the initial 10 to 613 commandments. https://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm And where did he get the coloring with which to write? Ink was only known in China at the time. The Mechanics of Scriptu Materials Used to Write the Bible https://owlcation.com/humanities/The-Mechanics-of-Scripture Tommy, do you make things up deliberately? Or does it come to you in a dream. I'll not speculate on his motivation or methodology. However, I will note that whatever he's doing, it's not working. Moses quite obviously must have spoken the Egyptian of his times, after all he was educated as a part of a member of the Egyptian royalty. Nope. Receiving the 10 commandments on Mt Sinai was 40 years after he fled from Egypt. Also, his education in Egypt probably did NOT include writing as that was the job of a scribe and the scribes union might object. I had much the same problem in the early days of computers. Upper corporate management did not want to learn how to operate their personal computer and left the job to their secretaries. I had a few managers have me send every incoming email directly to the printer. And equally obvious he must have spoken the language of God, who spoke to him from the burning bush, probably ancient Hebrew. Aramaic would be my guess. Among the tribes and caravan organizers of the time, it was the main spoken language. As for paper, the first known use of paper seems to date from about 225 B.C., in China so obviously Moses couldn't have used that. However, the earliest known fragment of written papyrus, The Ebers Papyrus, dates from approximately 1550 B.C. As I previously mumbled, spoken language and written symbols are fairly independent. Similarly, the writing media varies with the available resources. Egypt had the Nile river, so writing on reeds was a economical solution. The nomadic goat herders of the deserts had animal skins, so that's what they used for writing. In Mesopotamia, they had river mud, which was quite suitable for cuneiform stick writing: https://bibleinterp.arizona.edu/articles/Adkins_Cuneiform If there had been more water and plants, vegetable paper would have been suitable writing as well as cooking: https://www.ahlstrom-munksjo.com/campaigns/GVP/ Writing on stone worked for the cave man, but carving in stone really sucks but has only one advantage. It's fairly permanent. As Moses was said to have lived from about 1391–1271 BC, some 200 years after papyrus had been used in Egypt there is no reason that he couldn't have written God's Word on that "paper". He wasn't anywhere near Egypt when he received the ten commandments. I suppose the local Midian stationary store only carried the local parchment and vellum. Now Tommy, the above is not some sort of archaic knowledge known to a few initiates it is rather commonly known, to those interested in the subject. I googled the term "The Ebers Papyrus" and got 440,000 "hits" so you could have looked it up and have spoken from a background of at least minimal knowledge instead of the subject instead of your usual blathering of weird notion that is your usual contribution. Whatever. What I see here is a very common problem. People like to believe what they read. Worse, they adjust what they read to conform to their biases. That's human nature and can't be fixed. Tom did the right thing by asking the right questions. How did God and Moses communicate? On what was the original 10 commandments inscribed. However, he didn't go far enough because that would be trampling on hallowed ground. Had he dealt with even a few of the problems I've mentioned, I would have been very impressed. There are still a few major unanswered questions in the Exodus, such as on what were perhaps 60,000 Jews doing to stay alive wandering around the desert for 40 years? The answer is easy, if you think of it in terms of what would you and your family do to survive in a desert for 40 years. -- Jeff Liebermann PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272 Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#117
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On 16/01/2021 23:54, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, January 15, 2021 at 5:21:00 PM UTC-8, wrote: On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 06:11:04 +0700, John B. wrote: https://patternsofevidence.com/2019/...irst-alphabet/ "the first Hebrew writing is called “Old Hebrew” or “Paleo-Hebrew.” This is known from inscriptions found from about 900 BC in the kingdoms of Israel and Judah until the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem and the exile of many of Judah’s inhabitants to Babylon around 586 BC." More on Old Hebrew: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleo-Hebrew_alphabet Compare the Old Hebrew characters with the Hebrew characters in the right hand column. A few a close, but most are very different. Aramaic is the base alphabet for most of the middle eastern languages. Notice on the chart that the Imperial Aramaic and Hebrew characters are fairly similar: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aramaic_alphabet#Letters So, why are some characters radically different while others seem to copied from older character sets? What happened is that the spoken languages are not necessarily written in the written language of the same name. Sometimes, the spoken language for a region is a common language, such as Aramaic was in biblical times. Everyone spoke Aramaic, but wrote it in a variety of character sets. Sometimes, either or both the language and character set is specific to the region, trade, politics, status, etc. For example, the Emperor of Japan during WWII had a very different spoke language than what was spoken by the common people. That was to isolate the Emperor from the common people. That worked well until the Emperor Hirohito had to give his famous "Bear the Unbearable" speech near the end of WWII. It went out over loudspeakers and radio to all over Japan. Nobody could understand what he was saying, so it had to be repeated by someone else in the language of the common people. This kind to stratification was very common in biblical times. The priesthood had their own language and character set. The various merchants all spoke Aramaic, but used the written language familiar to those with whom they were trading. Something similar happened with the decoding of the Rosetta Stone. It was the same proclamation written in Egyptian hieroglyphs, Coptic, and Greek. Greek and Coptic could be read, but not the hieroglyphics. What Champollion determined was that hieroglyphs could be read just like Latin characters, where each symbol represents a sound in spoken Egyptian. By substituting the similar Coptic equivalents for the hieroglyphs, Egyptian could be read. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosetta_Stone#Reading_the_Rosetta_Stone If you go to Hawaii, they say Hawaiian place names in the native Hawaiian spoken language, but since there wasn't a written language, they just borrowed the Latin characters and pronunciation. Same thing in biblical times. Language and characters were fairly independent. Modern Hebrew is also quite different from biblical Hebrew. When the Zionist movement setup the framework for what was eventually to become Israel, they had a problem with the language. Hebrew was the language of the bible and was not easily converted to something that could be used for everyday commerce. For example, it has very few technical terms. In an effort to find a quick fix, Theodor Hertzl wanted to use Yiddish, which is mediaeval German, as the official language of Israel. Yiddish uses the written Hebrew alphabet, but is spoken in German. It's much like Polish and Russian are fairly similar spoken languages, but Polish is written using Latin characters, while Russian uses Cyrillic (Greek) characters. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UB5MtF70xe8 Anyway, I hope this helps disconnect spoken and written languages. My mother's name was Herz which is nothing more than one of the many spelling variations of Hertz, Hertzl , Herzle etc. which was the Austrian Royal Family. What isn't a matter of discussion is that Moses spoke Aramaic even if he could understand Hebrew. He also spoke and understood middle Egyptian and Median. Moses received not just the Ten Commandments but the Torah or "law" We have that until today. The Talmud is a scholarly interpretation of the Torah and the prophesies of Moses. Yesyes, but did he vote for Trump? |
#118
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On 17/01/2021 01:39, Ralph Barone wrote:
John B. wrote: On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 15:00:41 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich wrote: On Friday, January 15, 2021 at 8:06:06 PM UTC-8, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 20:34:41 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 18:58:23 -0500, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 1/14/2021 6:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: I suspect that the next translation of the bible will be into text message abbreviations and acronyms, which is the common language of todays youth: https://www.webopedia.com/reference/text-message-abbreviations/ Long ago I read a science fiction novel (probably by Heinlein) that featured some sort of secret society. As I recall, to be inducted one needed a high degree of intelligence; but once inducted, trainees learned a new language, one that was heavily abbreviated. The claim was that we think by internal use of language, so learning a language whose information was very dense (in terms of ideas per syllable) allowed much faster processing of data - i.e. faster and more efficient thinking. I read the same story, but can't recall the name or author. I did some random Googling for clues, but can't recall enough of the story to construct a working key word search. As I vaguely recall, my first thoughts were that high speed thinking was of marginal value because it also accelerates one's rate of making mistakes and reduces the available time to consider side effects and "what can go wrong" thoughts after the high speed decisions are reached. While one can probably learn to communicate at high speeds, there's no guarantee that they will also think at high speeds. Found it! It's _Gulf_ by Robert A. Heinlein. Wikipedia says that the story was written after the table of contents for the magazine was composed, which explains why it fits its title very loosely. I was never able to understand why do many writers visualized a race superior to humans when the ultimate thing made by the hand of God himself with all of his foibles is the human being. No Tommy God did not make humans he made Adam and Eve who in turn made the rest of humanity. And, quite obviously the blight set in very early in the game. After all, One of their sons murdered the other one. If humanity is the pinnacle of all of God’s creations, it casts serious doubt on the concept of a perfect, infallible God. Octopuses, anyone that can come up with octopuses gets my vote for Supreme Being. Anyone that came up with spoonbills needs serious help, and jellyfish inventors can suffer the nth circle of Tommie's Fantasies. |
#119
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On Sun, 17 Jan 2021 09:04:23 +0100, Tosspot wrote:
On 17/01/2021 01:39, Ralph Barone wrote: John B. wrote: On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 15:00:41 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich wrote: On Friday, January 15, 2021 at 8:06:06 PM UTC-8, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 20:34:41 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Thu, 14 Jan 2021 18:58:23 -0500, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 1/14/2021 6:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: I suspect that the next translation of the bible will be into text message abbreviations and acronyms, which is the common language of todays youth: https://www.webopedia.com/reference/text-message-abbreviations/ Long ago I read a science fiction novel (probably by Heinlein) that featured some sort of secret society. As I recall, to be inducted one needed a high degree of intelligence; but once inducted, trainees learned a new language, one that was heavily abbreviated. The claim was that we think by internal use of language, so learning a language whose information was very dense (in terms of ideas per syllable) allowed much faster processing of data - i.e. faster and more efficient thinking. I read the same story, but can't recall the name or author. I did some random Googling for clues, but can't recall enough of the story to construct a working key word search. As I vaguely recall, my first thoughts were that high speed thinking was of marginal value because it also accelerates one's rate of making mistakes and reduces the available time to consider side effects and "what can go wrong" thoughts after the high speed decisions are reached. While one can probably learn to communicate at high speeds, there's no guarantee that they will also think at high speeds. Found it! It's _Gulf_ by Robert A. Heinlein. Wikipedia says that the story was written after the table of contents for the magazine was composed, which explains why it fits its title very loosely. I was never able to understand why do many writers visualized a race superior to humans when the ultimate thing made by the hand of God himself with all of his foibles is the human being. No Tommy God did not make humans he made Adam and Eve who in turn made the rest of humanity. And, quite obviously the blight set in very early in the game. After all, One of their sons murdered the other one. If humanity is the pinnacle of all of God’s creations, it casts serious doubt on the concept of a perfect, infallible God. Octopuses, anyone that can come up with octopuses gets my vote for Supreme Being. Anyone that came up with spoonbills needs serious help, and jellyfish inventors can suffer the nth circle of Tommie's Fantasies. Well, I read that spoon billed birds exist on every continent, except for Antarctica so they must be considered as at least marginally efficient :-) -- Cheers, John B. |
#120
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Does Slow Johnny still pull the wings off flies
On 17/01/2021 09:57, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 17 Jan 2021 09:04:23 +0100, Tosspot wrote: On 17/01/2021 01:39, Ralph Barone wrote: snip If humanity is the pinnacle of all of God’s creations, it casts serious doubt on the concept of a perfect, infallible God. Octopuses, anyone that can come up with octopuses gets my vote for Supreme Being. Anyone that came up with spoonbills needs serious help, and jellyfish inventors can suffer the nth circle of Tommie's Fantasies. Well, I read that spoon billed birds exist on every continent, except for Antarctica so they must be considered as at least marginally efficient :-) Have you seen the courtship ritual?! You get a stick, wander up to the nearest female, and give it a bit of; "Oeer Missus! Nice stick see! Fancy a bit of how's your father?" https://c8.alamy.com/comp/R3CWDA/usa...est-R3CWDA.jpg It's a miracle they aren't extinct! |
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