Commuting Alternative?

I'm curious if anyone has come across a suitable bent for a reasonably
long commute that doesn't cost a fortune? I live just under 40 miles
from my work, and sometimes ride my singlespeed upright home. I've
lately been considering a fully geared road bike for this ride, leaving
my SS for a local bad-weather commuter. That was until I started
researching HPV's, where I saw some things that interest me. I've read
of people who are not overly athletic covering 40 miles in an hour or
just over on some of these sleek HPV's. I average about 15mph on my
way home with my SS, and don't see gears bringing me to or past 20.

Can I get a 30-40mph aerodynamic 'bent that will be reliable for daily
riding without spending 10K? I'd like to pedal my commute when I can,
but am not willing to sell my car to make it happen. The Hammacher
Schlemmer seems to be the cream of the crop. is there a heavier,
slower version for a fraction of the $14K price tag? Any other cheaper
bents you'd suggest I check out?


TIA,

Dan

Wrote:
I'm curious if anyone has come across a suitable bent for a reasonably
long commute that doesn't cost a fortune? I live just under 40 miles
from my work, and sometimes ride my singlespeed upright home. I've
lately been considering a fully geared road bike for this ride,
leaving
my SS for a local bad-weather commuter. That was until I started
researching HPV's, where I saw some things that interest me. I've
read
of people who are not overly athletic covering 40 miles in an hour or
just over on some of these sleek HPV's. I average about 15mph on my
way home with my SS, and don't see gears bringing me to or past 20.

Can I get a 30-40mph aerodynamic 'bent that will be reliable for daily
riding without spending 10K? I'd like to pedal my commute when I can,
but am not willing to sell my car to make it happen. The Hammacher
Schlemmer seems to be the cream of the crop. is there a heavier,
slower version for a fraction of the $14K price tag? Any other
cheaper
bents you'd suggest I check out?


TIA,

Dan

Just to get things started here, have you looked into the F-40? It is
a p-38 with a fairing set up. I do think 25-30 mph is more realistic
but I am no expert on streamliners.
Mark the biker


--
nget

wrote:
I'm curious if anyone has come across a suitable bent for a reasonably
long commute that doesn't cost a fortune? .....
Sure there are--I have a LWB that cost me about $1100, not counting the
accessories I've put on it. I cannot sustain anywhere near 40 MPH on it
however.

The aero advantage is true but is not really huge: an aero recumbent
(like a highracer) with fairing, sock and tailbox should be expected at
best to get you about 6 mph faster than you're pedaling now.

The record streamliners that an average person might be able to hold 40
mph on aren't real practical for regular street use. Most full-fairings
you find are for trikes due to their greater stability in crosswinds,
but they also have greater frontal area (all the fastest HPVs now are
bicycles).
-------
A recumbent wouldn't be much faster than an upright bike, but it would
be a lot more comfortable.

If any type of bicycle engines are legal where you live, you could get a
motor kit. Most of the electrics it seems aren't much good beyond 25
miles but the gasoline ones could certainly hold 25-30 mph
easily--although if the engine is limited in capacity by a small
built-in tank, you may have to stop to refuel halfway (either at a gas
station, or by carrying a bottle of fuel with you).
~

wrote:

Can I get a 30-40mph aerodynamic 'bent that will be reliable for daily
riding without spending 10K? I'd like to pedal my commute when I can,
but am not willing to sell my car to make it happen. The Hammacher
Schlemmer seems to be the cream of the crop. is there a heavier,
slower version for a fraction of the $14K price tag? Any other cheaper
bents you'd suggest I check out?

Probably the most popular fast velomoble of the moment is the Quest,
which you can find out about at http://www.velomobiel.nl/ and it comes
in at 40766 Euros without tax.
30783 Euros without tax will get you their "budget" model, the Mango,
which seems to have been well received but certainly isn't as fast.

Problems... there is, AIUI, a bit of a waiting list.

The Leitra (http://www.leitra.dk/) is ~4,500 Euros, won't be as quick as
the Dutch ones mentioned above but should move along at a tidy clip all
the same.

These are all machines that have been in production for some time and
have a track record of being usable, practical vehicles that work in
windy conditions.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Peter Clinch writes:

Probably the most popular fast velomoble of the moment is the Quest,
which you can find out about at http://www.velomobiel.nl/ and it comes
in at 40766 Euros without tax.
30783 Euros without tax will get you their "budget" model, the Mango,
which seems to have been well received but certainly isn't as fast.

You seem to have some additional zeros here!
The website says 4766 euro and 3782 euro respectively.
Still not budget though.

Roos

Roos Eisma wrote:
Peter Clinch writes:

Probably the most popular fast velomoble of the moment is the Quest,
which you can find out about at http://www.velomobiel.nl/ and it comes
in at 40766 Euros without tax.
30783 Euros without tax will get you their "budget" model, the Mango,
which seems to have been well received but certainly isn't as fast.

You seem to have some additional zeros here!
The website says 4766 euro and 3782 euro respectively.
Still not budget though.

Oooops, they were commas in the original, wonder what happened there...

When it comes to velomobiles, of course, "budget" is a relative term,
but these are some way short of the $14K on the one the OP had found.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

On Jan 23, 4:54 pm, " wrote:

Can I get a 30-40mph aerodynamic 'bent that will be reliable for daily
riding without spending 10K?

No such bike or hpv exists at any price when you are talking about a
real world commute by a real world pilot. There are 50+ mile in hour
records held by exceptional pilots on a closed track (no hills, no
traffic lights ect.) but not in a real wolrd setting.

Jim Reilly

Thanks to all for the feedback. I'm left with a few questions, no
surprise. First, why would the Leitra be slower than the Quest or
Mango? Secondly, would someone really be any faster on the Mango than
on a high-end upright? It looks extremely cool if rather heavy. I can
envision myself spending a few thousand dollars & discovering that
it's actually significantly harder to ride to work than my regular
bicycle, perhaps due to the weight on the hills.

The F40 looks like an interesting solution as well. I have the same
reservations I have about the Mango, however. Also, the F40 is a
'bent with a fairing added. I wonder if a purpose-built velomobile
would be more efficient?

I've considered power-assisted vehicles, but don't think that's
the solution for me. A battery system would be too heavy when under my
own power to justify it's assistance, and would not have the juice
for my commute. It would also be very expensive with Lithium
batteries, and far too heavy to justify its weight with anything else.

A gas system would be add a few issues:
a) Smell. Parked inside & when running.
b) Legality. Suddenly it's a "motorized vehicle" and subject to
many laws & regs.
c) Personal satisfaction. At that point, why not take the car or
motorcycle? I could live with a little electric assist, but a gas
motor is too much.

It seems I set my expectations too high with my 30-40mph statement. I
would be OK with an average speed (including starts, stops & hills) of
20-25mph over my 37.92 mile ride home. My average last ride home was
15.58mph, giving me a 2:25hr ride on my steel singlespeed upright
bicycle. I'd need a 19mph average to get me under 2 hours. I
don't know if a lightweight geared road bike or a velomobile would
accomplish this or not. I also expect I'll be a little faster month
to month, at least until I get into peak shape.

I'd really like to speak with an upright rider who has logged some
miles in a velomobile to see how it compared. I'd hate to spend all
that money on one to find that I should have bought a road bike.

wrote:
First, why would the Leitra be slower than the Quest or
Mango?

Not as aerodynamic.

Secondly, would someone really be any faster on the Mango than
on a high-end upright?

Yes, because of the aerodynamics.

It looks extremely cool if rather heavy.

Quite so, but as high speeds weight is less important than air
resistance. With "normal" race bikes the UCI specifically ban
aerodynamic aids, but using fairings the IHPVA speed records are about
30% better than the UCI "official" ones.

I can
envision myself spending a few thousand dollars & discovering that
it's actually significantly harder to ride to work than my regular
bicycle, perhaps due to the weight on the hills.

Once your speed drops under a critical value then weight will matter
more than the aerodynamics, but it's worth noting that the real-roads UK
"End to End" ride (over 800 miles with /lots/ of hills) has the record
held by a faired trike, with the rider taking his own upright racer
based record.
Also, what goes up, must come down, and then your aerodynamics wins out
again.

The F40 looks like an interesting solution as well. I have the same
reservations I have about the Mango, however. Also, the F40 is a
'bent with a fairing added. I wonder if a purpose-built velomobile
would be more efficient?

What /may/ be the case is it's a lot more stable in side winds. Talk to
people with real experience of them for that though.

It seems I set my expectations too high with my 30-40mph statement. I
would be OK with an average speed (including starts, stops & hills) of
20-25mph over my 37.92 mile ride home. My average last ride home was
15.58mph, giving me a 2:25hr ride on my steel singlespeed upright
bicycle. I'd need a 19mph average to get me under 2 hours. I
don't know if a lightweight geared road bike or a velomobile would
accomplish this or not. I also expect I'll be a little faster month
to month, at least until I get into peak shape.

If the roads aren't particularly exceptionally poorly suited, a fully
faired machine should give you a more reliable overall figure (i.e.,
with less difference between still and headwind days). My guess is the
average should be better as long as you're keeping effort high, because
aerodynamics takes up the lion's share of the effort any time you're
above about 15 mph.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Based on my albeit limited experience, unless you commute in an
especially hilly area, you should average a higher speed on a
recumbent, all things being equal (fitness, quality of bike, etc). I
was able to sustain average speeds of well over 25 mph on an Easy Racer
Gold Rush along the Erie Canal trail. In average physical shape at the
time. I could have hit upwards of 30 mph w/ additional effort.
YMMV

On Jan 24, 8:14 am, Peter Clinch wrote:
wrote:
First, why would the Leitra be slower than the Quest or
Mango?Not as aerodynamic.

Secondly, would someone really be any faster on the Mango than
on a high-end upright? Yes, because of the aerodynamics.

It looks extremely cool if rather heavy.Quite so, but as high speeds weight is less important than air
resistance. With "normal" race bikes the UCI specifically ban
aerodynamic aids, but using fairings the IHPVA speed records are about
30% better than the UCI "official" ones.

I can
envision myself spending a few thousand dollars & discovering that
it's actually significantly harder to ride to work than my regular
bicycle, perhaps due to the weight on the hills.Once your speed drops under a critical value then weight will matter
more than the aerodynamics, but it's worth noting that the real-roads UK
"End to End" ride (over 800 miles with /lots/ of hills) has the record
held by a faired trike, with the rider taking his own upright racer
based record.
Also, what goes up, must come down, and then your aerodynamics wins out
again.

The F40 looks like an interesting solution as well. I have the same
reservations I have about the Mango, however. Also, the F40 is a
'bent with a fairing added. I wonder if a purpose-built velomobile
would be more efficient?What /may/ be the case is it's a lot more stable in side winds. Talk to
people with real experience of them for that though.

It seems I set my expectations too high with my 30-40mph statement. I
would be OK with an average speed (including starts, stops & hills) of
20-25mph over my 37.92 mile ride home. My average last ride home was
15.58mph, giving me a 2:25hr ride on my steel singlespeed upright
bicycle. I'd need a 19mph average to get me under 2 hours. I
don't know if a lightweight geared road bike or a velomobile would
accomplish this or not. I also expect I'll be a little faster month
to month, at least until I get into peak shape.If the roads aren't particularly exceptionally poorly suited, a fully
faired machine should give you a more reliable overall figure (i.e.,
with less difference between still and headwind days). My guess is the
average should be better as long as you're keeping effort high, because
aerodynamics takes up the lion's share of the effort any time you're
above about 15 mph.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/