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Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle



 
 
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  #11  
Old August 14th 07, 08:31 PM posted to or.politics,pdx.general,rec.autos.driving,rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.racing
Don Homuth
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Posts: 73
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 18:59:22 GMT, Lobby Dosser
wrote:

Don Homuth dhomuthoneatcomcast.net wrote:

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 09:54:07 -0700, "Gattman"
wrote:


"steve" wrote in message
.. .

What is the point of these mass rides, anyway? It cant be good
riding, and
it obviously screws up traffic.

It's a fund-raiser. I have a friend who trains for it and then flies
out from Virginia every year just for the ride.


Careful there, Chris. If you mention that you "have a friend" folks
like the Three Monkeys will determine that you do not.

Notice that his friend was not a Transportation Expert who knew how to
clean up the traffic jam? Didja?


I did notice that.

But then, neither was mine.
Ads
  #12  
Old August 14th 07, 08:43 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing,rec.bicycles.misc,pdx.general,or.politics,rec.autos.driving
Rocky
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Posts: 17
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle


"John S." wrote in message
ups.com...
On Aug 14, 10:57 am, (Paul Berg) wrote:
~

News article from The (Portland) Oregonian - August 14, 2007

Officially, it's called the Providence Bridge Pedal. But the annual bike
ride over Portland's bridges earned a new name Sunday -- Providence
Bridge Ped-debacle.



Portland should to take lessons in ride management from the 5 Borough
bike ride in NYC. Roadways and bridges traversed in early sections of
the NYC ride are closed off to automobile traffic. It's only later in
the ride when the line stretches out that bikes and cars share the
same road. The only significant delay was getting that very long
snake of 30,000 riders going. One steep bridge did have a slowdown as
out of shape riders walked over. Done properly it can be fun riding
with 30,000 of my closest cycling buddies.

The NYC event is well organized throughout, with several well spaced
break areas and sag wagons.


For those unfamiliar with this venue Portland is a city built at the
confluence of 2 rivers. To get anywhere you have to cross a bridge, usually
one over the Willamette river which runs N-S.

These bridges are always closed (at least partially) for this ride as it is
not possible any other way.

IMHO it is the greed of the organizers to maximize the funds raised that
results in this chaos. It is clear to anyone who can think clearly that
you must limit the number of riders especially as there are several choke
points as the story described. At at least one you have to wait without
moving for at an hour or more to get through.

When I do this ride I will only start in the first group which leaves at
6:30 (or maybe it's 7 am - didn't do it this year) thus avoiding all of the
problems. The 20K riders lined up behind me are nuts to even try. It's a
walk, not a ride if you're in the back.

If you avoid the rush this way it is a very fun ride with parties and
fabulous views of Portland from the freeway bridges. That is why people do
it - you can't stop on the freeway bridges and hang out during rush hour.


  #13  
Old August 14th 07, 08:44 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing,rec.bicycles.misc,pdx.general,or.politics,rec.autos.driving
dgk
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Posts: 827
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 09:09:35 -0700, "John S." wrote:

On Aug 14, 10:57 am, (Paul Berg) wrote:
~

News article from The (Portland) Oregonian - August 14, 2007

Officially, it's called the Providence Bridge Pedal. But the annual bike
ride over Portland's bridges earned a new name Sunday -- Providence
Bridge Ped-debacle.



Portland should to take lessons in ride management from the 5 Borough
bike ride in NYC. Roadways and bridges traversed in early sections of
the NYC ride are closed off to automobile traffic. It's only later in
the ride when the line stretches out that bikes and cars share the
same road. The only significant delay was getting that very long
snake of 30,000 riders going. One steep bridge did have a slowdown as
out of shape riders walked over. Done properly it can be fun riding
with 30,000 of my closest cycling buddies.

The NYC event is well organized throughout, with several well spaced
break areas and sag wagons.


True, the 5bbr is very well run. NYC is nowhere near as bike friendly
as Portland, but this ride is usually a pleasure. I've been doing it
for the last 7 or 8 years and have a friend who has done it every year
since it started.

Getting the line moving is a problem, but it's almost automatic after
that. We usually get to Astoria Park pretty early and there you have
to wait 20 minutes or so until the second part begins, but everyone
sits around and eats the free stuff and gets ready to move out, and
then we move right along.

I always feel really bad for the folks who are trapped in their cars
on the Brooklyn Queens Expressway (BQE). Once they close that off,
they just sit there for a few hours it seems. There really should be
better signage warning folks not to get on.
  #14  
Old August 14th 07, 08:44 PM posted to or.politics,pdx.general,rec.autos.driving,rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.racing
Royal Dalton
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 18:57:05 GMT, Lobby Dosser
wrote:

Don Homuth dhomuthoneatcomcast.net wrote:

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:48:42 GMT, "steve" wrote:

On 14-Aug-2007, smacked up and reeling, (Paul Berg)
blindly formulated
the following incoherence:

Bottlenecks not only forced cyclists to walk their bikes along parts
of the course, but also meant as many as 1,500 of the estimated
record 19,000 cyclists in the event were unable to complete the
ride. Organizers barred them from crossing the Fremont Bridge and
other spans as authorities sought to reopen them to vehicle traffic.
Other cyclists, frustrated, left the course on their own.
What is the point of these mass rides, anyway? It cant be good
riding, and it obviously screws up traffic.
Just for the sheer fun of doing it, apparently.

My Datsun club does the same thing when it does a cruise or a tour.

They disrupt regular traffic?


Sometimes they have done exactly that, so I hear. A long column of a
couple dozen Datsuns of various vintages can be pretty noticeable.

Mine has been in the restoration shop long enough that I haven't gone
on one of those, since I only actually Joined the club several months
back.

But if you check, you can even see pictures of the car
pre-restoration.


http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/s...page=4&t=17399
  #15  
Old August 14th 07, 08:50 PM posted to or.politics,pdx.general,rec.autos.driving,rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.racing
Don Homuth
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 73
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 19:44:21 GMT, Royal Dalton
wrote:

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 18:57:05 GMT, Lobby Dosser
wrote:

Don Homuth dhomuthoneatcomcast.net wrote:

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:48:42 GMT, "steve" wrote:

On 14-Aug-2007, smacked up and reeling, (Paul Berg)
blindly formulated
the following incoherence:

Bottlenecks not only forced cyclists to walk their bikes along parts
of the course, but also meant as many as 1,500 of the estimated
record 19,000 cyclists in the event were unable to complete the
ride. Organizers barred them from crossing the Fremont Bridge and
other spans as authorities sought to reopen them to vehicle traffic.
Other cyclists, frustrated, left the course on their own.
What is the point of these mass rides, anyway? It cant be good
riding, and it obviously screws up traffic.
Just for the sheer fun of doing it, apparently.

My Datsun club does the same thing when it does a cruise or a tour.

They disrupt regular traffic?


Sometimes they have done exactly that, so I hear. A long column of a
couple dozen Datsuns of various vintages can be pretty noticeable.

Mine has been in the restoration shop long enough that I haven't gone
on one of those, since I only actually Joined the club several months
back.

But if you check, you can even see pictures of the car
pre-restoration.


http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/s...page=4&t=17399


Nope.

http://www.northwestz.org/members/ha...AB17E14285BEF6
  #16  
Old August 14th 07, 09:04 PM posted to or.politics,pdx.general,rec.autos.driving,rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.racing
Royal Dalton
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 19:44:21 GMT, Royal Dalton
wrote:

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 18:57:05 GMT, Lobby Dosser
wrote:

Don Homuth dhomuthoneatcomcast.net wrote:

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:48:42 GMT, "steve" wrote:

On 14-Aug-2007, smacked up and reeling, (Paul Berg)
blindly formulated
the following incoherence:

Bottlenecks not only forced cyclists to walk their bikes along parts
of the course, but also meant as many as 1,500 of the estimated
record 19,000 cyclists in the event were unable to complete the
ride. Organizers barred them from crossing the Fremont Bridge and
other spans as authorities sought to reopen them to vehicle traffic.
Other cyclists, frustrated, left the course on their own.
What is the point of these mass rides, anyway? It cant be good
riding, and it obviously screws up traffic.
Just for the sheer fun of doing it, apparently.

My Datsun club does the same thing when it does a cruise or a tour.

They disrupt regular traffic?
Sometimes they have done exactly that, so I hear. A long column of a
couple dozen Datsuns of various vintages can be pretty noticeable.

Mine has been in the restoration shop long enough that I haven't gone
on one of those, since I only actually Joined the club several months
back.

But if you check, you can even see pictures of the car
pre-restoration.

http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/s...page=4&t=17399


Nope.


I like the blue one better.

http://www.northwestz.org/members/ha...AB17E14285BEF6

  #17  
Old August 14th 07, 09:10 PM posted to or.politics,pdx.general,rec.autos.driving,rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.racing
Don Homuth
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 73
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 20:04:39 GMT, Royal Dalton
wrote:

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 19:44:21 GMT, Royal Dalton
wrote:

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 18:57:05 GMT, Lobby Dosser
wrote:

Don Homuth dhomuthoneatcomcast.net wrote:

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:48:42 GMT, "steve" wrote:

What is the point of these mass rides, anyway? It cant be good
riding, and it obviously screws up traffic.
Just for the sheer fun of doing it, apparently.

My Datsun club does the same thing when it does a cruise or a tour.

They disrupt regular traffic?
Sometimes they have done exactly that, so I hear. A long column of a
couple dozen Datsuns of various vintages can be pretty noticeable.

Mine has been in the restoration shop long enough that I haven't gone
on one of those, since I only actually Joined the club several months
back.

But if you check, you can even see pictures of the car
pre-restoration.


I like the blue one better.

http://www.northwestz.org/members/ha...AB17E14285BEF6


De gustibus, and all.

Mine is still a work in progress.

When it's done, I will like it. Whether or not someone else does will
be immaterial.
  #18  
Old August 14th 07, 09:13 PM posted to or.politics,pdx.general,rec.autos.driving,rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.racing
Bill C
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,199
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

On Aug 14, 12:08 pm, "Jim Flom" wrote:
"steve" wrote...

What is the point of these mass rides, anyway? It cant be good riding,
and
it obviously screws up traffic.


I did a mass start for a century in Bellingham a week ago and I've never
been around a squirellier bunch of riders.


Yep, when they get some experience they'll be Cat5s. It's why bike
paths are scary too.
Bill C

  #19  
Old August 14th 07, 09:45 PM posted to or.politics,pdx.general,rec.autos.driving,rec.bicycles.misc,rec.bicycles.racing
Royal Dalton
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 20:04:39 GMT, Royal Dalton
wrote:

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 19:44:21 GMT, Royal Dalton
wrote:

Don Homuth wrote:
On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 18:57:05 GMT, Lobby Dosser
wrote:

Don Homuth dhomuthoneatcomcast.net wrote:

On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:48:42 GMT, "steve" wrote:

What is the point of these mass rides, anyway? It cant be good
riding, and it obviously screws up traffic.
Just for the sheer fun of doing it, apparently.

My Datsun club does the same thing when it does a cruise or a tour.

They disrupt regular traffic?
Sometimes they have done exactly that, so I hear. A long column of a
couple dozen Datsuns of various vintages can be pretty noticeable.

Mine has been in the restoration shop long enough that I haven't gone
on one of those, since I only actually Joined the club several months
back.

But if you check, you can even see pictures of the car
pre-restoration.

I like the blue one better.
http://www.northwestz.org/members/ha...AB17E14285BEF6


De gustibus, and all.

Mine is still a work in progress.

When it's done, I will like it. Whether or not someone else does will
be immaterial.


I still like the blue one.
  #20  
Old August 15th 07, 12:00 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing,rec.bicycles.misc,pdx.general,or.politics,rec.autos.driving
John S.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 33
Default Portland's Bridge Pedal Debacle

On Aug 14, 3:43 pm, "Rocky" wrote:
"John S." wrote in message

ups.com...





On Aug 14, 10:57 am, (Paul Berg) wrote:
~


News article from The (Portland) Oregonian - August 14, 2007


Officially, it's called the Providence Bridge Pedal. But the annual bike
ride over Portland's bridges earned a new name Sunday -- Providence
Bridge Ped-debacle.


Portland should to take lessons in ride management from the 5 Borough
bike ride in NYC. Roadways and bridges traversed in early sections of
the NYC ride are closed off to automobile traffic. It's only later in
the ride when the line stretches out that bikes and cars share the
same road. The only significant delay was getting that very long
snake of 30,000 riders going. One steep bridge did have a slowdown as
out of shape riders walked over. Done properly it can be fun riding
with 30,000 of my closest cycling buddies.


The NYC event is well organized throughout, with several well spaced
break areas and sag wagons.


For those unfamiliar with this venue Portland is a city built at the
confluence of 2 rivers. To get anywhere you have to cross a bridge, usually
one over the Willamette river which runs N-S.

These bridges are always closed (at least partially) for this ride as it is
not possible any other way.


I understood that they were partially closed and riders had one lane.
If that is the case then Portland has to decide whether they are going
to manage this race properly or not. Full closure of the needed roads
and bridges on a saturday is really the only way to move that many
riders of widely verying skills. It may take a redesign of the course
to encourage stretching out of the line as is done in NYC. Use of
break points will also help stagger the load.



IMHO it is the greed of the organizers to maximize the funds raised that
results in this chaos. It is clear to anyone who can think clearly that
you must limit the number of riders especially as there are several choke
points as the story described. At at least one you have to wait without
moving for at an hour or more to get through.



Since it is a benefit ride I doubt greed plays much into the
decisions. I suspect that it is more the results of a volunteer
organization taking on a big challenge. It really is not all that
difficult to think through how to control and minimize choke points.
NYC manages to do it very well with 32,000 riders this year.


When I do this ride I will only start in the first group which leaves at
6:30 (or maybe it's 7 am - didn't do it this year) thus avoiding all of the
problems. The 20K riders lined up behind me are nuts to even try. It's a
walk, not a ride if you're in the back.

If you avoid the rush this way it is a very fun ride with parties and
fabulous views of Portland from the freeway bridges. That is why people do
it - you can't stop on the freeway bridges and hang out during rush hour.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -



 




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