Papp pleads guilty

In article ,
Fred Fredburger wrote:

Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In article ,
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote:

"Ryan Cousineau" wrote in message
]...
The dissent dismissed both LeMond's testimony as irrelevant, and Papp's
("Pap") as tainted
snip


Dumbass -

Too bad LemonD can't figure that out.

Whatever. He just testified. Of Papp, Landis, and LeMond, I'll take
LeMond.


How about: a kick in the nuts, minor road rash, or being stuck in an
elevator with Mr. Vidmar?

Being stuck with Brian wouldn't bother me, but being in Elevator Jail
for more than an hour would be tedious. At that point, minor road rash
would look ok.

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

On Fri, 19 Feb 2010 21:47:09 GMT, Ryan Cousineau
wrote:

In article ,
Fred Fredburger wrote:

Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In article ,
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote:

"Ryan Cousineau" wrote in message
]...
The dissent dismissed both LeMond's testimony as irrelevant, and Papp's
("Pap") as tainted
snip


Dumbass -

Too bad LemonD can't figure that out.

Whatever. He just testified. Of Papp, Landis, and LeMond, I'll take
LeMond.


How about: a kick in the nuts, minor road rash, or being stuck in an
elevator with Mr. Vidmar?

Being stuck with Brian wouldn't bother me, but being in Elevator Jail
for more than an hour would be tedious. At that point, minor road rash
would look ok.

Yeah, of the six, describe the road rash in more detail please.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

In article
],
Ryan Cousineau wrote:

In article ,
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote:

"Ryan Cousineau" wrote in message
]...

The dissent dismissed both LeMond's testimony as irrelevant, and Papp's
("Pap") as tainted

snip


Dumbass -

Too bad LemonD can't figure that out.

Whatever. He just testified. Of Papp, Landis, and LeMond, I'll take
LeMond.

Why? Why take any? Lemond lost touch, and is not helping.

--
Michael Press

"Michael Press" wrote in message
...

Why? Why take any? Lemond lost touch, and is not helping.

Nevertheless Greg IS worried about real bicycle racing. Good on him even
though he occasionally sticks his foot in it.

"Tom Kunich" wrote in message
m...
"Michael Press" wrote in message
...

Why? Why take any? Lemond lost touch, and is not helping.

Nevertheless Greg IS worried about real bicycle racing.



Dumbass -

No he isn't.

It's all about him.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

In article ,
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote:

"Tom Kunich" wrote in message
m...
"Michael Press" wrote in message
...

Why? Why take any? Lemond lost touch, and is not helping.

Nevertheless Greg IS worried about real bicycle racing.



Dumbass -

No he isn't.

It's all about him.

Well, this discussion started when I threw out a line about preferring
LeMond to Joe Papp or Floyd Landis.

Maybe it is all about LeMond, but it's also possible (with similar
amounts of evidence) that he's genuinely concerned about the present
state of doping in the sport. His behavior is consistent with either
theory, and at best you have an argument that his methods are
unproductive (and that he should damn well rehearse his speeches a lot
better).

Returning to Papp versus Landis versus LeMond. Yes, I'll take the weird
crusading champion over the verging-on-insane drug dealer** and Landis,
he of the poor choices in managers, doping products, and Fairness*.

*Here's the thing: even if you accept the common rbr trope that doping
is part of the sport, getting caught is also part of the sport.
Appealing is fine, too. But soliciting donations for your futile defense
of your sporting violation is unseemly and pathetic. I guess this is me
announcing that I'm virtually certain Floyd was totally guilty, but I'm
ok with that.

Floyd Fairness Fund TV, just as a reminder:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRIbmhqSiME

If you're wondering what I think a guilty Landis should have done, I
think he should have taken his punishment, no appeals, and that's that.
Maybe it's merely an aesthetic judgment, but the David Millar approach
seems a lot more palatable.

**Papp is so weird in so many ways, I barely know where to start. I'm
still trying to figure out the story of the failed defection of Yuliet
RodrÃ*guez Jiménez (his wife). To be blunt: if you're fleeing from Cuba,
on what planet does going to Venezuela seem like a good idea? That said,
The counterpoise is Joe (or at least his life) is so weird he might
actually be fun to hang around with. Having read a bit of his blog, he
is interesting and articulate. But still weird.

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

"Ryan Cousineau" wrote in message
]...

:
: Well, this discussion started when I threw out a line about preferring
: LeMond to Joe Papp or Floyd Landis.
:
: Maybe it is all about LeMond, but it's also possible (with similar
: amounts of evidence) that he's genuinely concerned about the present
: state of doping in the sport. His behavior is consistent with either
: theory,

snip



Dumbass -

That is incorrect.

LemonD never said **** about Tyler Hamilton. Just LANCE and Flandis. It's
because Hamilton never won the TdF and therefore was not a threat to the
throne of Greatest Ever American Cyclist.

LemonD is all about LemonD.

thanks,

Kurgan. presented by Gringioni.

In article ],
Ryan Cousineau wrote:

In article ,
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote:

"Tom Kunich" wrote in message
m...
"Michael Press" wrote in message
...

Why? Why take any? Lemond lost touch, and is not helping.

Nevertheless Greg IS worried about real bicycle racing.

No he isn't.

It's all about him.

Well, this discussion started when I threw out a line about preferring
LeMond to Joe Papp or Floyd Landis.

Maybe it is all about LeMond, but it's also possible (with similar
amounts of evidence) that he's genuinely concerned about the present
state of doping in the sport. His behavior is consistent with either
theory, and at best you have an argument that his methods are
unproductive (and that he should damn well rehearse his speeches a lot
better).

I think LemonD *is* genuinely concerned about the state of doping in the peloton.
But that does not preclude him from also being concerned about his legacy. I happen
to think his (genuine) concern about doping plays second (or possibly fifth or sixth)
fiddle to his concerns about other riders like LANCE or Flandis supplanting him as
the "Greatest American Cyclist EVER" in the minds of the public. His attempts to
insert himself into everything seems like serious evidence of that mindset to me.

--
tanx,
Howard

Caught playing safe
It's a bored game

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

In article
],
Ryan Cousineau wrote:

In article ,
"Kurgan Gringioni" wrote:

"Tom Kunich" wrote in message
m...
"Michael Press" wrote in message
...

Why? Why take any? Lemond lost touch, and is not helping.

Nevertheless Greg IS worried about real bicycle racing.



Dumbass -

No he isn't.

It's all about him.

Well, this discussion started when I threw out a line about preferring
LeMond to Joe Papp or Floyd Landis.

Maybe it is all about LeMond, but it's also possible (with similar
amounts of evidence) that he's genuinely concerned about the present
state of doping in the sport. His behavior is consistent with either
theory, and at best you have an argument that his methods are
unproductive (and that he should damn well rehearse his speeches a lot
better).

Returning to Papp versus Landis versus LeMond. Yes, I'll take the weird
crusading champion over the verging-on-insane drug dealer** and Landis,
he of the poor choices in managers, doping products, and Fairness*.

*Here's the thing: even if you accept the common rbr trope that doping
is part of the sport, getting caught is also part of the sport.
Appealing is fine, too. But soliciting donations for your futile defense
of your sporting violation is unseemly and pathetic. I guess this is me
announcing that I'm virtually certain Floyd was totally guilty, but I'm
ok with that.

Floyd Fairness Fund TV, just as a reminder:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRIbmhqSiME

If you're wondering what I think a guilty Landis should have done, I
think he should have taken his punishment, no appeals, and that's that.
Maybe it's merely an aesthetic judgment, but the David Millar approach
seems a lot more palatable.

**Papp is so weird in so many ways, I barely know where to start. I'm
still trying to figure out the story of the failed defection of Yuliet
RodrÖguez Jiménez (his wife). To be blunt: if you're fleeing from Cuba,
on what planet does going to Venezuela seem like a good idea? That said,
The counterpoise is Joe (or at least his life) is so weird he might
actually be fun to hang around with. Having read a bit of his blog, he
is interesting and articulate. But still weird.

So you take Lemond's side because he is not a proven dope taker.

--
Michael Press

In article ,
"KurganGringioni" wrote:

"Ryan Cousineau" wrote in message
]...

:
: Well, this discussion started when I threw out a line about preferring
: LeMond to Joe Papp or Floyd Landis.
:
: Maybe it is all about LeMond, but it's also possible (with similar
: amounts of evidence) that he's genuinely concerned about the present
: state of doping in the sport. His behavior is consistent with either
: theory,

snip



Dumbass -

That is incorrect.

LemonD never said **** about Tyler Hamilton. Just LANCE and Flandis. It's
because Hamilton never won the TdF and therefore was not a threat to the
throne of Greatest Ever American Cyclist.

LemonD is all about LemonD.

Shorter Kurgan: LeMond only comments on the most prominent doping
allegations.

He's right in what he's said about Armstrong*, and he was right in what
he said to Landis. What could he have said to Hamilton?

*I think LIVESTRONG is the most important thing Armstrong has done in
his life**. I think 3 TdFs and a Worlds are the most important thing
LeMond has done in his life. Read that as you might.

**This isn't a rousing endorsement of LIVESTRONG. I'm not pro-cancer,
but I believe it may be The Wrong Problem, in that I'm concerned cancer
is not substantially underfunded when it comes to research and advocacy
processes. My robot-monster instincts do crumble in the face of Fat
Cyclist's first-person account of the support they gave him.

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."