Are the Dutch are getting lazy?

On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 22:17:41 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Saturday, 29 February 2020 00:03:30 UTC-5, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 18:16:07 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Friday, 28 February 2020 21:08:33 UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 5:09:07 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 15:07:36 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Friday, 28 February 2020 17:48:20 UTC-5, wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 10:52:02 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 2:28:52 AM UTC-6, wrote:
From a popular Dutch news site:

'Vorig jaar werd een recordaantal e-bikes verkocht, melden RAI Vereniging, BOVAG en onderzoeksbureau GfK vrijdag. Fietsverkopers wisten 420.000 e-bikes aan de man te brengen, een stijging van 2,6 procent ten opzichte van 2018.

De totale omzet uit de fietsverkoop steeg voor het zevende jaar op rij. In totaal verkochten fietswinkels vorig jaar voor 1,252 miljard euro aan fietsen. Zo'n 70 procent van deze omzet werd behaald met de verkoop van elektrische fietsen.

E-bikes zijn hiermee in de afgelopen jaren de standaard geworden. In 2014 kwam nog 414 miljoen euro van de omzet van fietswinkels uit de verkoop van e-bikes.

Met een marktaandeel van 41,7 procent is de e-bike voor het tweede jaar op rij het meest verkochte type fiets in Nederland. Gemiddeld betaalt een consument 2.067 euro voor een e-bike.'

Summary:
420000 E bikes sold last year
Total sales volume 2019: 1.252 billion euro (2.6% up) of which 70% from E bikes
Market share E bikes 41.7 procent.
Average amount spent on a E bike 2067 euro

For long you were some kind of piteous riding an assisted bike being disabled or something now it is the otherway round. You are a loser buying a 'normal' bike. Everybody older than 45 years I encounter during my rides riding a normal bike gets a thumbs up from me. I have to do that not very often. We now have Ebike peletons...

Lou

I'm not an eBike person myself. But I can see the appeal of them. Especially in a society like the Netherlands where the bicycle is considered a normal mode of transportation. Unlike in the USA, where the bicycle is only a recreational object. In the Netherlands you use the bike to go to work, school, store, etc. So using an eBike to make these required transportation tasks easier makes a lot of sense. But in the USA the bicycle is for recreation. Almost no one uses it for basic transportation. So getting an eBike to make your recreational riding easier makes no sense. It makes as much sense as people driving to the gym in the morning to get their workout. Instead of jogging or cycling to the gym in the morning. But people do stupid things all the time.

The thing is that leisure rides also increased a lot. So there were a lot of people that would like to ride for fun but not want to get (too) tired or sweaty. An E bike solved that.

Lou

I see more and more E-bikes being used around here when the weather is warm. I wonder if the popularity of E-bikes will lead to many if any of the unpaved trails and rail-trails getting paved over? Time will tell.

Cheers

Googling "how to soup-up your e-bike" gets almost 60,000,000 hits. I
think that you may soon be seeing powerful e-bikes all over the place
:-)

They even make foldable e-bikes for Frank to take on his travels. and
strong too, a load capacity 125 kg (275 lbs). At $1,275 they are very
competitive in price with push-bikes too :-)

Prepare for sticker-shock, John B. https://tinyurl.com/tptmp84

My son talks non-stop about eBikes. They're now Specialized's bread-and-butter product. He wants me to get one -- probably so he doesn't have to wait for me when we're riding in Utah. He also wants one for commuting.

The problem is that even at employee/family prices, the top end eBikes are really expensive. But if the discount or scratch and dent stars align, my next bike may be a Specialized eBike.

-- Jay Beattie.

I wonder. How do you go about replacing an internal battery on one of those Specialized E-bikes?

Cheers

From watching
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fy4M9hlf2YQ
it appears that the battery just clips in place. And
I think that like a laptop battery it is generally considered as non
repairable although it may well be for someone with the necessary
tools and experience.

--
cheers,

John B.

Ah, but the Specialized bikes use an internal battery. Does that mean it's sealed inside the frame and that it's non-removable by the user? The battery dies, do you have to buy a new bike?

Cheers
See
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRx_hsdBmUc
The battery slides up into the down tube from the bottom
--
cheers,

John B.

On Saturday, February 29, 2020 at 3:08:33 AM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 5:09:07 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 15:07:36 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Friday, 28 February 2020 17:48:20 UTC-5, wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 10:52:02 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 2:28:52 AM UTC-6, wrote:
From a popular Dutch news site:

'Vorig jaar werd een recordaantal e-bikes verkocht, melden RAI Vereniging, BOVAG en onderzoeksbureau GfK vrijdag. Fietsverkopers wisten 420..000 e-bikes aan de man te brengen, een stijging van 2,6 procent ten opzichte van 2018.

De totale omzet uit de fietsverkoop steeg voor het zevende jaar op rij. In totaal verkochten fietswinkels vorig jaar voor 1,252 miljard euro aan fietsen. Zo'n 70 procent van deze omzet werd behaald met de verkoop van elektrische fietsen.

E-bikes zijn hiermee in de afgelopen jaren de standaard geworden.. In 2014 kwam nog 414 miljoen euro van de omzet van fietswinkels uit de verkoop van e-bikes.

Met een marktaandeel van 41,7 procent is de e-bike voor het tweede jaar op rij het meest verkochte type fiets in Nederland. Gemiddeld betaalt een consument 2.067 euro voor een e-bike.'

Summary:
420000 E bikes sold last year
Total sales volume 2019: 1.252 billion euro (2.6% up) of which 70% from E bikes
Market share E bikes 41.7 procent.
Average amount spent on a E bike 2067 euro

For long you were some kind of piteous riding an assisted bike being disabled or something now it is the otherway round. You are a loser buying a 'normal' bike. Everybody older than 45 years I encounter during my rides riding a normal bike gets a thumbs up from me. I have to do that not very often. We now have Ebike peletons...

Lou

I'm not an eBike person myself. But I can see the appeal of them. Especially in a society like the Netherlands where the bicycle is considered a normal mode of transportation. Unlike in the USA, where the bicycle is only a recreational object. In the Netherlands you use the bike to go to work, school, store, etc. So using an eBike to make these required transportation tasks easier makes a lot of sense. But in the USA the bicycle is for recreation. Almost no one uses it for basic transportation. So getting an eBike to make your recreational riding easier makes no sense. It makes as much sense as people driving to the gym in the morning to get their workout. Instead of jogging or cycling to the gym in the morning. But people do stupid things all the time.

The thing is that leisure rides also increased a lot. So there were a lot of people that would like to ride for fun but not want to get (too) tired or sweaty. An E bike solved that.

Lou

I see more and more E-bikes being used around here when the weather is warm. I wonder if the popularity of E-bikes will lead to many if any of the unpaved trails and rail-trails getting paved over? Time will tell.

Cheers

Googling "how to soup-up your e-bike" gets almost 60,000,000 hits. I
think that you may soon be seeing powerful e-bikes all over the place
:-)

They even make foldable e-bikes for Frank to take on his travels. and
strong too, a load capacity 125 kg (275 lbs). At $1,275 they are very
competitive in price with push-bikes too :-)

Prepare for sticker-shock, John B. https://tinyurl.com/tptmp84

My son talks non-stop about eBikes. They're now Specialized's bread-and-butter product. He wants me to get one -- probably so he doesn't have to wait for me when we're riding in Utah. He also wants one for commuting.

The problem is that even at employee/family prices, the top end eBikes are really expensive. But if the discount or scratch and dent stars align, my next bike may be a Specialized eBike.

-- Jay Beattie.

A S-work E bake, that is funny...

Lou

On Saturday, February 29, 2020 at 12:04:57 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Saturday, February 29, 2020 at 3:08:33 AM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 5:09:07 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 15:07:36 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Friday, 28 February 2020 17:48:20 UTC-5, wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 10:52:02 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 2:28:52 AM UTC-6, wrote:
From a popular Dutch news site:

'Vorig jaar werd een recordaantal e-bikes verkocht, melden RAI Vereniging, BOVAG en onderzoeksbureau GfK vrijdag. Fietsverkopers wisten 420.000 e-bikes aan de man te brengen, een stijging van 2,6 procent ten opzichte van 2018.

De totale omzet uit de fietsverkoop steeg voor het zevende jaar op rij. In totaal verkochten fietswinkels vorig jaar voor 1,252 miljard euro aan fietsen. Zo'n 70 procent van deze omzet werd behaald met de verkoop van elektrische fietsen.

E-bikes zijn hiermee in de afgelopen jaren de standaard geworden. In 2014 kwam nog 414 miljoen euro van de omzet van fietswinkels uit de verkoop van e-bikes.

Met een marktaandeel van 41,7 procent is de e-bike voor het tweede jaar op rij het meest verkochte type fiets in Nederland. Gemiddeld betaalt een consument 2.067 euro voor een e-bike.'

Summary:
420000 E bikes sold last year
Total sales volume 2019: 1.252 billion euro (2.6% up) of which 70% from E bikes
Market share E bikes 41.7 procent.
Average amount spent on a E bike 2067 euro

For long you were some kind of piteous riding an assisted bike being disabled or something now it is the otherway round. You are a loser buying a 'normal' bike. Everybody older than 45 years I encounter during my rides riding a normal bike gets a thumbs up from me. I have to do that not very often. We now have Ebike peletons...

Lou

I'm not an eBike person myself. But I can see the appeal of them. Especially in a society like the Netherlands where the bicycle is considered a normal mode of transportation. Unlike in the USA, where the bicycle is only a recreational object. In the Netherlands you use the bike to go to work, school, store, etc. So using an eBike to make these required transportation tasks easier makes a lot of sense. But in the USA the bicycle is for recreation. Almost no one uses it for basic transportation. So getting an eBike to make your recreational riding easier makes no sense. It makes as much sense as people driving to the gym in the morning to get their workout. Instead of jogging or cycling to the gym in the morning. But people do stupid things all the time.

The thing is that leisure rides also increased a lot. So there were a lot of people that would like to ride for fun but not want to get (too) tired or sweaty. An E bike solved that.

Lou

I see more and more E-bikes being used around here when the weather is warm. I wonder if the popularity of E-bikes will lead to many if any of the unpaved trails and rail-trails getting paved over? Time will tell.

Cheers

Googling "how to soup-up your e-bike" gets almost 60,000,000 hits. I
think that you may soon be seeing powerful e-bikes all over the place
:-)

They even make foldable e-bikes for Frank to take on his travels. and
strong too, a load capacity 125 kg (275 lbs). At $1,275 they are very
competitive in price with push-bikes too :-)

Prepare for sticker-shock, John B. https://tinyurl.com/tptmp84

My son talks non-stop about eBikes. They're now Specialized's bread-and-butter product. He wants me to get one -- probably so he doesn't have to wait for me when we're riding in Utah. He also wants one for commuting.

The problem is that even at employee/family prices, the top end eBikes are really expensive. But if the discount or scratch and dent stars align, my next bike may be a Specialized eBike.

-- Jay Beattie.

A S-work E bake, that is funny...

They're apparently shipping a lot of them. I got an advertising e-mail from a local shop yesterday announcing a sale on Orbea Gains. https://www.orbea..com/us-en/ebikes/road/gain-all-road Another stealth eBike. When some guy drops me like a rock, I now look at the BB and/or hub to determine whether I should be laughing or crying. I will vanquish them all when I get my super-stealth eBike with the zillion watt motor!

-- Jay Beattie.

jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, February 29, 2020, wrote:
On Saturday, February 29, 2020 at 3:08:33 AM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 5:09:07 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 15:07:36 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, 28 February 2020, wrote:
wrote:
wrote:
From a popular Dutch news site:

Summary: 420000 E bikes sold last year Total sales volume
2019: 1.252 billion euro (2.6% up) of which 70% from E
bikes Market share E bikes 41.7 procent. Average amount
spent on a E bike 2067 euro

For long you were some kind of piteous riding an assisted
bike being disabled or something now it is the otherway
round. You are a loser buying a 'normal' bike. Everybody
older than 45 years I encounter during my rides riding a
normal bike gets a thumbs up from me. I have to do that not
very often. We now have Ebike peletons...

I'm not an eBike person myself. But I can see the appeal of
them. Especially in a society like the Netherlands where the
bicycle is considered a normal mode of transportation.
Unlike in the USA, where the bicycle is only a recreational
object. In the Netherlands you use the bike to go to work,
school, store, etc. So using an eBike to make these required
transportation tasks easier makes a lot of sense. But in the
USA the bicycle is for recreation. Almost no one uses it for
basic transportation. So getting an eBike to make your
recreational riding easier makes no sense. It makes as much
sense as people driving to the gym in the morning to get
their workout. Instead of jogging or cycling to the gym in
the morning. But people do stupid things all the time.

The thing is that leisure rides also increased a lot. So there
were a lot of people that would like to ride for fun but not
want to get (too) tired or sweaty. An E bike solved that.

That's the problem. With ebikes as today's antiperspirant of choice for the
sports-simulating middle classes, the attitude toward sweat caused by real
bicycling, even if odorless, seems to become more Puritan.

I see more and more E-bikes being used around here when the
weather is warm. I wonder if the popularity of E-bikes will lead
to many if any of the unpaved trails and rail-trails getting
paved over? Time will tell.

Googling "how to soup-up your e-bike" gets almost 60,000,000 hits.
I think that you may soon be seeing powerful e-bikes all over the
place :-)

They even make foldable e-bikes for Frank to take on his travels.
and strong too, a load capacity 125 kg (275 lbs). At $1,275 they
are very competitive in price with push-bikes too :-)

Prepare for sticker-shock, John B. https://tinyurl.com/tptmp84

My son talks non-stop about eBikes. They're now Specialized's
bread-and-butter product. He wants me to get one -- probably so he
doesn't have to wait for me when we're riding in Utah. He also wants
one for commuting.

The problem is that even at employee/family prices, the top end
eBikes are really expensive. But if the discount or scratch and dent
stars align, my next bike may be a Specialized eBike.

A S-work E bake, that is funny...

They're apparently shipping a lot of them. I got an advertising e-mail
from a local shop yesterday announcing a sale on Orbea Gains.
https://www.orbea..com/us-en/ebikes/road/gain-all-road Another stealth
eBike. When some guy drops me like a rock, I now look at the BB and/or
hub to determine whether I should be laughing or crying. I will vanquish
them all when I get my super-stealth eBike with the zillion watt motor!

What's Oregon's assist speed, or wattage, limit to keep your vanquEsh bike
from being classified as a motorcycle?

You could as well relax, get a Rohloff Speedhub and a Shimano generator hub
to mislead ignorant ebikers into asking what motors these are. Then inform
them that only strenuous exercise could make them nearly as fast and healthy
as you are, and enjoy watching their jaws drop. In case they still aren't
convinced to also drop their e-toy on the spot, tell them that the ebikes'
share of deadly bicycle accidents in Europe is close to 1/3, and rising
(because the ebikers are mostly old or inexperienced).

On 2/29/2020 12:54 PM, Sepp Ruf wrote:
In case they still aren't
convinced to also drop their e-toy on the spot, tell them that the ebikes'
share of deadly bicycle accidents in Europe is close to 1/3, and rising
(because the ebikers are mostly old or inexperienced).

I agree with that. Others have pointed out that up to this time, if a
person was fast on a bike it was usually because he had put thousands of
hours into riding. He probably learned to stop making most mistakes when
he was still slow and the mistakes had lower consequences. Not so today.

But I wonder if another factor relates to design of facilities. A
segregated facility might be OK at 10 kph but dangerous at 20 kph, let
alone 30 kph.

Also, I imagine speeds are a lot less consistent these days. People on
"acoustic" bikes are still tootling along at, oh, 15 kph, mixing with
E-bikers that are probably much faster, passing unexpectedly, messing
with distance judgment, etc.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 4:40:07 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 17:17:25 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 2/28/2020 4:52 PM, wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 2:28:52 AM UTC-6, wrote:
From a popular Dutch news site:

'Vorig jaar werd een recordaantal e-bikes verkocht, melden RAI Vereniging, BOVAG en onderzoeksbureau GfK vrijdag. Fietsverkopers wisten 420.000 e-bikes aan de man te brengen, een stijging van 2,6 procent ten opzichte van 2018.

De totale omzet uit de fietsverkoop steeg voor het zevende jaar op rij. In totaal verkochten fietswinkels vorig jaar voor 1,252 miljard euro aan fietsen. Zo'n 70 procent van deze omzet werd behaald met de verkoop van elektrische fietsen.

E-bikes zijn hiermee in de afgelopen jaren de standaard geworden. In 2014 kwam nog 414 miljoen euro van de omzet van fietswinkels uit de verkoop van e-bikes.

Met een marktaandeel van 41,7 procent is de e-bike voor het tweede jaar op rij het meest verkochte type fiets in Nederland. Gemiddeld betaalt een consument 2.067 euro voor een e-bike.'

Summary:
420000 E bikes sold last year
Total sales volume 2019: 1.252 billion euro (2.6% up) of which 70% from E bikes
Market share E bikes 41.7 procent.
Average amount spent on a E bike 2067 euro

For long you were some kind of piteous riding an assisted bike being disabled or something now it is the otherway round. You are a loser buying a 'normal' bike. Everybody older than 45 years I encounter during my rides riding a normal bike gets a thumbs up from me. I have to do that not very often. We now have Ebike peletons...

Lou

I'm not an eBike person myself. But I can see the appeal of them. Especially in a society like the Netherlands where the bicycle is considered a normal mode of transportation. Unlike in the USA, where the bicycle is only a recreational object. In the Netherlands you use the bike to go to work, school, store, etc. So using an eBike to make these required transportation tasks easier makes a lot of sense. But in the USA the bicycle is for recreation. Almost no one uses it for basic transportation. So getting an eBike to make your recreational riding easier makes no sense.

I know a few people who have bought e-bikes, or are about to. All are
doing it for recreation.

One person has led leisurely, very social club rides for decades, but is
now old enough that she's very slow. (I stopped doing her rides for that
reason.) She wants an e-bike so she can continue her group riding, which
is her favorite socializing. I don't have any problem with that.

A couple other guys bought e-bikes so they could finally stay up with
the A group on training rides. To me, that seems a bit weird. I mean, is
it OK if I show up on my motorcycle?

Well, the trade term for thing powering your e-bike is a "motor", so
"motor-cycle" could well be the correct term :-)

In Singapore e-bikes are the preferred vehicle by the "delivery-boys",
you call for a pizza and it arrives on an e-bike. In fact it is so
prevalent that they have just passed some new laws there to control
e-bike traffic.
--
cheers,

John B.

What's the dominant variant there, John, mid-drives or hub motors?

pH in Aptos

On Saturday, February 29, 2020 at 9:54:03 AM UTC-8, Sepp Ruf wrote:
jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, February 29, 2020, wrote:
On Saturday, February 29, 2020 at 3:08:33 AM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 5:09:07 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 15:07:36 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, 28 February 2020, wrote:
wrote:
wrote:
From a popular Dutch news site:

Summary: 420000 E bikes sold last year Total sales volume
2019: 1.252 billion euro (2.6% up) of which 70% from E
bikes Market share E bikes 41.7 procent. Average amount
spent on a E bike 2067 euro

For long you were some kind of piteous riding an assisted
bike being disabled or something now it is the otherway
round. You are a loser buying a 'normal' bike. Everybody
older than 45 years I encounter during my rides riding a
normal bike gets a thumbs up from me. I have to do that not
very often. We now have Ebike peletons...

I'm not an eBike person myself. But I can see the appeal of
them. Especially in a society like the Netherlands where the
bicycle is considered a normal mode of transportation.
Unlike in the USA, where the bicycle is only a recreational
object. In the Netherlands you use the bike to go to work,
school, store, etc. So using an eBike to make these required
transportation tasks easier makes a lot of sense. But in the
USA the bicycle is for recreation. Almost no one uses it for
basic transportation. So getting an eBike to make your
recreational riding easier makes no sense. It makes as much
sense as people driving to the gym in the morning to get
their workout. Instead of jogging or cycling to the gym in
the morning. But people do stupid things all the time.

The thing is that leisure rides also increased a lot. So there
were a lot of people that would like to ride for fun but not
want to get (too) tired or sweaty. An E bike solved that.

That's the problem. With ebikes as today's antiperspirant of choice for the
sports-simulating middle classes, the attitude toward sweat caused by real
bicycling, even if odorless, seems to become more Puritan.

I see more and more E-bikes being used around here when the
weather is warm. I wonder if the popularity of E-bikes will lead
to many if any of the unpaved trails and rail-trails getting
paved over? Time will tell.

Googling "how to soup-up your e-bike" gets almost 60,000,000 hits.
I think that you may soon be seeing powerful e-bikes all over the
place :-)

They even make foldable e-bikes for Frank to take on his travels.
and strong too, a load capacity 125 kg (275 lbs). At $1,275 they
are very competitive in price with push-bikes too :-)

Prepare for sticker-shock, John B. https://tinyurl.com/tptmp84

My son talks non-stop about eBikes. They're now Specialized's
bread-and-butter product. He wants me to get one -- probably so he
doesn't have to wait for me when we're riding in Utah. He also wants
one for commuting.

The problem is that even at employee/family prices, the top end
eBikes are really expensive. But if the discount or scratch and dent
stars align, my next bike may be a Specialized eBike.

A S-work E bake, that is funny...

They're apparently shipping a lot of them. I got an advertising e-mail
from a local shop yesterday announcing a sale on Orbea Gains.
https://www.orbea..com/us-en/ebikes/road/gain-all-road Another stealth
eBike. When some guy drops me like a rock, I now look at the BB and/or
hub to determine whether I should be laughing or crying. I will vanquish
them all when I get my super-stealth eBike with the zillion watt motor!

What's Oregon's assist speed, or wattage, limit to keep your vanquEsh bike
from being classified as a motorcycle?

Here is the Oregon eBike manifesto. https://tinyurl.com/v7uvdff The motor must be 1,000 watts or under and incapable of propelling the bike over 20mph.. As Ray notes, the statute is not clear on whether the "not over 20mph" provision requires motor cut-off at 20mph or would allow pedal assist up to any speed so long as the motor alone would not propel the bike over 20mph.


You could as well relax, get a Rohloff Speedhub and a Shimano generator hub
to mislead ignorant ebikers into asking what motors these are. Then inform
them that only strenuous exercise could make them nearly as fast and healthy
as you are, and enjoy watching their jaws drop. In case they still aren't
convinced to also drop their e-toy on the spot, tell them that the ebikes'
share of deadly bicycle accidents in Europe is close to 1/3, and rising
(because the ebikers are mostly old or inexperienced).

I don't have many words with eBikers because they're typically dropping me on the urban climbs. "Get back here, I want to tell you about my energy sucking dyno! I have excuses!" The ones I really dislike are the mom cargo eBikes with the kid-hauling buckets: https://www.clevercycles.com/urban-a...10amp-nuv.html They're like the triple-trailers of the MUP world.

I'm sure there are a lot of novice dopes on eBikes, but apart from being startled by a fast pass or getting blocked by a mom bike, I'm not feeling imperiled. EScooters are far worse. The world will be a better place when Lime and Bird go bankrupt.

-- Jay Beattie.

On Sat, 29 Feb 2020 14:24:22 -0800, jbeattie wrote:

On Saturday, February 29, 2020 at 9:54:03 AM UTC-8, Sepp Ruf wrote:
jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, February 29, 2020, wrote:
On Saturday, February 29, 2020 at 3:08:33 AM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 5:09:07 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 15:07:36 -0800 (PST), Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, 28 February 2020, wrote:
wrote:
wrote:
From a popular Dutch news site:

Summary: 420000 E bikes sold last year Total sales volume
2019: 1.252 billion euro (2.6% up) of which 70% from E bikes
Market share E bikes 41.7 procent. Average amount spent on a E
bike 2067 euro

For long you were some kind of piteous riding an assisted bike
being disabled or something now it is the otherway round. You
are a loser buying a 'normal' bike. Everybody older than 45
years I encounter during my rides riding a normal bike gets a
thumbs up from me. I have to do that not very often. We now
have Ebike peletons...

I'm not an eBike person myself. But I can see the appeal of
them. Especially in a society like the Netherlands where the
bicycle is considered a normal mode of transportation. Unlike
in the USA, where the bicycle is only a recreational object.
In the Netherlands you use the bike to go to work, school,
store, etc. So using an eBike to make these required
transportation tasks easier makes a lot of sense. But in the
USA the bicycle is for recreation. Almost no one uses it for
basic transportation. So getting an eBike to make your
recreational riding easier makes no sense. It makes as much
sense as people driving to the gym in the morning to get their
workout. Instead of jogging or cycling to the gym in the
morning. But people do stupid things all the time.

The thing is that leisure rides also increased a lot. So there
were a lot of people that would like to ride for fun but not
want to get (too) tired or sweaty. An E bike solved that.

That's the problem. With ebikes as today's antiperspirant of choice
for the sports-simulating middle classes, the attitude toward sweat
caused by real bicycling, even if odorless, seems to become more
Puritan.

I see more and more E-bikes being used around here when the
weather is warm. I wonder if the popularity of E-bikes will lead
to many if any of the unpaved trails and rail-trails getting
paved over? Time will tell.

Googling "how to soup-up your e-bike" gets almost 60,000,000 hits.
I think that you may soon be seeing powerful e-bikes all over the
place :-)

They even make foldable e-bikes for Frank to take on his travels.
and strong too, a load capacity 125 kg (275 lbs). At $1,275 they
are very competitive in price with push-bikes too :-)

Prepare for sticker-shock, John B. https://tinyurl.com/tptmp84

My son talks non-stop about eBikes. They're now Specialized's
bread-and-butter product. He wants me to get one -- probably so he
doesn't have to wait for me when we're riding in Utah. He also
wants one for commuting.

The problem is that even at employee/family prices, the top end
eBikes are really expensive. But if the discount or scratch and
dent stars align, my next bike may be a Specialized eBike.

A S-work E bake, that is funny...

They're apparently shipping a lot of them. I got an advertising
e-mail from a local shop yesterday announcing a sale on Orbea Gains.
https://www.orbea..com/us-en/ebikes/road/gain-all-road Another
stealth eBike. When some guy drops me like a rock, I now look at the
BB and/or hub to determine whether I should be laughing or crying. I
will vanquish them all when I get my super-stealth eBike with the
zillion watt motor!

What's Oregon's assist speed, or wattage, limit to keep your vanquEsh
bike from being classified as a motorcycle?

Here is the Oregon eBike manifesto. https://tinyurl.com/v7uvdff The
motor must be 1,000 watts or under and incapable of propelling the bike
over 20mph. As Ray notes, the statute is not clear on whether the "not
over 20mph" provision requires motor cut-off at 20mph or would allow
pedal assist up to any speed so long as the motor alone would not propel
the bike over 20mph.

Wow, does your locality suffer gross obesity?
Aust only allows 200W unassisted(not pedalling) and 250 Watts assisted
(pedalling).

20mph is very generous considering all that weight flying along.

I'm sure there are a lot of novice dopes on eBikes, but apart from being
startled by a fast pass or getting blocked by a mom bike, I'm not
feeling imperiled. EScooters are far worse. The world will be a better
place when Lime and Bird go bankrupt.

Or their riders end up too crippled, after repeated crashes, to ride them

On Sat, 29 Feb 2020 12:03:21 +0700, John B. wrote:


I wonder. How do you go about replacing an internal battery on one of
those Specialized E-bikes?

Cheers

From watching https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fy4M9hlf2YQ it appears
that the battery just clips in place. And I think that like a laptop
battery it is generally considered as non repairable although it may
well be for someone with the necessary tools and experience.

depending on yor definition of "laptop", they are generall easily
replaced as there are a number of suppliers of replacement laptop
batteries assemblies.

it is the cracking the "battery" cases to gt acess to the internal cells
to test and replace them that is the trick part.

On Sat, 29 Feb 2020 11:50:27 -0800 (PST), pH wrote:

On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 4:40:07 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 17:17:25 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 2/28/2020 4:52 PM, wrote:
On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 2:28:52 AM UTC-6, wrote:
From a popular Dutch news site:

'Vorig jaar werd een recordaantal e-bikes verkocht, melden RAI Vereniging, BOVAG en onderzoeksbureau GfK vrijdag. Fietsverkopers wisten 420.000 e-bikes aan de man te brengen, een stijging van 2,6 procent ten opzichte van 2018.

De totale omzet uit de fietsverkoop steeg voor het zevende jaar op rij. In totaal verkochten fietswinkels vorig jaar voor 1,252 miljard euro aan fietsen. Zo'n 70 procent van deze omzet werd behaald met de verkoop van elektrische fietsen.

E-bikes zijn hiermee in de afgelopen jaren de standaard geworden. In 2014 kwam nog 414 miljoen euro van de omzet van fietswinkels uit de verkoop van e-bikes.

Met een marktaandeel van 41,7 procent is de e-bike voor het tweede jaar op rij het meest verkochte type fiets in Nederland. Gemiddeld betaalt een consument 2.067 euro voor een e-bike.'

Summary:
420000 E bikes sold last year
Total sales volume 2019: 1.252 billion euro (2.6% up) of which 70% from E bikes
Market share E bikes 41.7 procent.
Average amount spent on a E bike 2067 euro

For long you were some kind of piteous riding an assisted bike being disabled or something now it is the otherway round. You are a loser buying a 'normal' bike. Everybody older than 45 years I encounter during my rides riding a normal bike gets a thumbs up from me. I have to do that not very often. We now have Ebike peletons...

Lou

I'm not an eBike person myself. But I can see the appeal of them. Especially in a society like the Netherlands where the bicycle is considered a normal mode of transportation. Unlike in the USA, where the bicycle is only a recreational object. In the Netherlands you use the bike to go to work, school, store, etc. So using an eBike to make these required transportation tasks easier makes a lot of sense. But in the USA the bicycle is for recreation. Almost no one uses it for basic transportation. So getting an eBike to make your recreational riding easier makes no sense.

I know a few people who have bought e-bikes, or are about to. All are
doing it for recreation.

One person has led leisurely, very social club rides for decades, but is
now old enough that she's very slow. (I stopped doing her rides for that
reason.) She wants an e-bike so she can continue her group riding, which
is her favorite socializing. I don't have any problem with that.

A couple other guys bought e-bikes so they could finally stay up with
the A group on training rides. To me, that seems a bit weird. I mean, is
it OK if I show up on my motorcycle?

Well, the trade term for thing powering your e-bike is a "motor", so
"motor-cycle" could well be the correct term :-)

In Singapore e-bikes are the preferred vehicle by the "delivery-boys",
you call for a pizza and it arrives on an e-bike. In fact it is so
prevalent that they have just passed some new laws there to control
e-bike traffic.
--
cheers,

John B.

What's the dominant variant there, John, mid-drives or hub motors?

pH in Aptos

Probably hub motors. At least Tornado e-bikes, the only brand that is
actually built in Singapore are hub motor bikes. There are also
e-scooters.
Ebikes seem to be in the $800 to $1400 range and Escooters range
from $300 to $1000. Note, these are Singapore dollars. S$1.00 =
US$0.71
--
cheers,

John B.