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#1
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
XTR M960 Cranks: $450
XTR M960 Brifters: $275 XTR M960 Rear Derailleur: $123 XTR M960 9sp Cassette: $142 XTR M960 Rear Disc Hub: $192 HA HA HA HA! Nobody is gonna buy this stuff, are they? The weight weenies with more money than sense are gonna line up to drop $2k+ on the new XTR line. Does the phrase "diminishing returns" mean anything to them? I'm betting it doesn't. Shimano is trying to see how much they can get the logo whores to pay for ugly, trendy bike parts. It's not jewelry, but it's priced like gold. The new XTR is partially based on 11-year-old technology. Several companies offered similar crank and BB designs in 1992, most notably Magic Motorcycle; but also Bullseye, Sweet Wings and Syncros a few years later. Shimano has been borrowing 1993 Magic Motorcycle crank technology for a while now (square-splined BB, outboard bearings, hollow crankarms). The only thing marginally new are the M960 shifters, and they're just a rehash of Dura Ace. Meanwhile, all of Shimano's other component lines are going up in price. Last season, I bought the new DuraAce mid-cage rear derailleur for $53 from JensonUSA. Right now, JensonUSA lists DuraAce 7800 rear derailleurs for $146!! LX cranks that sold for $59 are now $83. M753 XT cranks were $119. The new XT cranks are $249!! That, folks, is a HUGE increase. Your next bike will cost a *lot* more than your last bike did. Low-priced Shimano sources are drying up quickly. If you're thinking of stocking up, do it very soon. Is Shimano begging us to switch to SRAM, or what? Rocketman -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
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#2
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
what about large people who want something strong? SOmeone I know has
snapped 5 crank sets just from the sheer power of his pedalling, he has had to spend over 7 times the amount of money buying his bike than i have buying mine cause he needs something really strong On Mon, 1 Dec 2003 14:37:31 CST, "Rocketman" wrote: XTR M960 Cranks: $450 XTR M960 Brifters: $275 XTR M960 Rear Derailleur: $123 XTR M960 9sp Cassette: $142 XTR M960 Rear Disc Hub: $192 HA HA HA HA! Nobody is gonna buy this stuff, are they? The weight weenies with more money than sense are gonna line up to drop $2k+ on the new XTR line. Does the phrase "diminishing returns" mean anything to them? I'm betting it doesn't. Shimano is trying to see how much they can get the logo whores to pay for ugly, trendy bike parts. It's not jewelry, but it's priced like gold. The new XTR is partially based on 11-year-old technology. Several companies offered similar crank and BB designs in 1992, most notably Magic Motorcycle; but also Bullseye, Sweet Wings and Syncros a few years later. Shimano has been borrowing 1993 Magic Motorcycle crank technology for a while now (square-splined BB, outboard bearings, hollow crankarms). The only thing marginally new are the M960 shifters, and they're just a rehash of Dura Ace. Meanwhile, all of Shimano's other component lines are going up in price. Last season, I bought the new DuraAce mid-cage rear derailleur for $53 from JensonUSA. Right now, JensonUSA lists DuraAce 7800 rear derailleurs for $146!! LX cranks that sold for $59 are now $83. M753 XT cranks were $119. The new XT cranks are $249!! That, folks, is a HUGE increase. Your next bike will cost a *lot* more than your last bike did. Low-priced Shimano sources are drying up quickly. If you're thinking of stocking up, do it very soon. Is Shimano begging us to switch to SRAM, or what? Rocketman -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
#3
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
"News Subsystem" wrote in message
... what about large people who want something strong? SOmeone I know has snapped 5 crank sets just from the sheer power of his pedalling, he has had to spend over 7 times the amount of money buying his bike than i have buying mine cause he needs something really strong Which five crank sets has your friend snapped? (brand/model) What makes you think that XTR won't also snap? Why on earth would you think that getting the lightest crank would be the same as getting the strongest crank? It doesn't work like that. XTR cranks will snap under stress. Being XTRa Xpensive doesn't allow them to violate the laws of physics and material engineering. Your XXX large friend needs to try some of the welded tubular CrMo steel cranks out there. They're about 1/3 the price of XTR, and very, very tough. Have a look at the FSA X-Drive or the AC 454 DH cranks. I'd be shocked if he could even bend them, much less break them. He might also be a prime candidate for the new - and breathtakingly expensive - Shimano Saint DH/FR components. This may be the only high-end racing-oriented highly-specialized component group in history that sells *because* it is heavy. Saint seems ready-made for the big mashers and big-air crazies that snap cranks and axles, and ruin rear derailleurs against boulders. It's *very* expensive; but at least it's solving a problem that actually exists, and saving a trip to the hospital with gaping wounds from a razor-sharp crank stub gashing open your calf. Gotta say, if it keeps you out of the hospital once, it's worth the whole price of admission. Rocketman On Mon, 1 Dec 2003 14:37:31 CST, "Rocketman" wrote: XTR M960 Cranks: $450 XTR M960 Brifters: $275 XTR M960 Rear Derailleur: $123 XTR M960 9sp Cassette: $142 XTR M960 Rear Disc Hub: $192 HA HA HA HA! Nobody is gonna buy this stuff, are they? The weight weenies with more money than sense are gonna line up to drop $2k+ on the new XTR line. Does the phrase "diminishing returns" mean anything to them? I'm betting it doesn't. Shimano is trying to see how much they can get the logo whores to pay for ugly, trendy bike parts. It's not jewelry, but it's priced like gold. The new XTR is partially based on 11-year-old technology. Several companies offered similar crank and BB designs in 1992, most notably Magic Motorcycle; but also Bullseye, Sweet Wings and Syncros a few years later. Shimano has been borrowing 1993 Magic Motorcycle crank technology for a while now (square-splined BB, outboard bearings, hollow crankarms). The only thing marginally new are the M960 shifters, and they're just a rehash of Dura Ace. Meanwhile, all of Shimano's other component lines are going up in price. Last season, I bought the new DuraAce mid-cage rear derailleur for $53 from JensonUSA. Right now, JensonUSA lists DuraAce 7800 rear derailleurs for $146!! LX cranks that sold for $59 are now $83. M753 XT cranks were $119. The new XT cranks are $249!! That, folks, is a HUGE increase. Your next bike will cost a *lot* more than your last bike did. Low-priced Shimano sources are drying up quickly. If you're thinking of stocking up, do it very soon. Is Shimano begging us to switch to SRAM, or what? Rocketman -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
#4
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
what about large people who want something strong? SOmeone I know has snapped 5 crank sets just from the sheer power of his pedalling, he XTR is the lightweight race stuff. LX or XT are better for big guys. But really if he snaps parts like that, get some RaceFace or Truvativ freeride or downhill cranks. BTW: It's obviously not from "the sheer power of his pedalling", but rather some combination of poor riding skills, aggressive drops and his weight. I speak with some experiance. I'm an x football player and the more I ride the less I break parts. As you learn to glide over the trail rather than beat it to submission, not only do the parts last but you go way faster. I used to bend a lot of wheels, break chains, helmets, seatposts, cassettes, chainrings,... but I rarely break stuff anymore. I even crash softer, well usually, I sprained my neck a couple months ago by not paying attention on a new trail. Big guy parts: freeride cranks (splined) custom frame (Ti Seven Sola works for me!) Marzoochi fork (only big guy fork) rims (32 spoke triple cross or DH specific ) 9 speed Chains and cassettes might last a summer if this is too much $$ switch to 8 speed, 8 speeds last me at least 2 years. Thompson Elite seatpost Thompson Elite stem Chris King headset (it's worth the money) Easton's cheapest AL handlebar When you buy the cheaper parts from the big name manufacturers you usually get the heavy duty parts. (not including frames and forks) The most expensive parts are usually the lightest weight, xc race stuff for the 140 lb rider. Ogre -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
#5
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
better yet get him to buy some Race Face NORTH SHORE cranks... guaranteed
for the life of the original owner. "Rocketman" wrote in message news:MzRyb.277206$ao4.951523@attbi_s51... "News Subsystem" wrote in message ... what about large people who want something strong? SOmeone I know has snapped 5 crank sets just from the sheer power of his pedalling, he has had to spend over 7 times the amount of money buying his bike than i have buying mine cause he needs something really strong Which five crank sets has your friend snapped? (brand/model) What makes you think that XTR won't also snap? Why on earth would you think that getting the lightest crank would be the same as getting the strongest crank? It doesn't work like that. XTR cranks will snap under stress. Being XTRa Xpensive doesn't allow them to violate the laws of physics and material engineering. Your XXX large friend needs to try some of the welded tubular CrMo steel cranks out there. They're about 1/3 the price of XTR, and very, very tough. Have a look at the FSA X-Drive or the AC 454 DH cranks. I'd be shocked if he could even bend them, much less break them. He might also be a prime candidate for the new - and breathtakingly expensive - Shimano Saint DH/FR components. This may be the only high-end racing-oriented highly-specialized component group in history that sells *because* it is heavy. Saint seems ready-made for the big mashers and big-air crazies that snap cranks and axles, and ruin rear derailleurs against boulders. It's *very* expensive; but at least it's solving a problem that actually exists, and saving a trip to the hospital with gaping wounds from a razor-sharp crank stub gashing open your calf. Gotta say, if it keeps you out of the hospital once, it's worth the whole price of admission. Rocketman On Mon, 1 Dec 2003 14:37:31 CST, "Rocketman" wrote: XTR M960 Cranks: $450 XTR M960 Brifters: $275 XTR M960 Rear Derailleur: $123 XTR M960 9sp Cassette: $142 XTR M960 Rear Disc Hub: $192 HA HA HA HA! Nobody is gonna buy this stuff, are they? The weight weenies with more money than sense are gonna line up to drop $2k+ on the new XTR line. Does the phrase "diminishing returns" mean anything to them? I'm betting it doesn't. Shimano is trying to see how much they can get the logo whores to pay for ugly, trendy bike parts. It's not jewelry, but it's priced like gold. The new XTR is partially based on 11-year-old technology. Several companies offered similar crank and BB designs in 1992, most notably Magic Motorcycle; but also Bullseye, Sweet Wings and Syncros a few years later. Shimano has been borrowing 1993 Magic Motorcycle crank technology for a while now (square-splined BB, outboard bearings, hollow crankarms). The only thing marginally new are the M960 shifters, and they're just a rehash of Dura Ace. Meanwhile, all of Shimano's other component lines are going up in price. Last season, I bought the new DuraAce mid-cage rear derailleur for $53 from JensonUSA. Right now, JensonUSA lists DuraAce 7800 rear derailleurs for $146!! LX cranks that sold for $59 are now $83. M753 XT cranks were $119. The new XT cranks are $249!! That, folks, is a HUGE increase. Your next bike will cost a *lot* more than your last bike did. Low-priced Shimano sources are drying up quickly. If you're thinking of stocking up, do it very soon. Is Shimano begging us to switch to SRAM, or what? Rocketman -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
#6
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
News Subsystem wrote:
SOmeone I know has snapped 5 crank sets just from the sheer power of his pedalling lets try and cut out the lies, eh? Small Black Dog -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
#7
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
He might also be a prime candidate for the new - and breathtakingly expensive - Shimano Saint DH/FR components. hmm, they're a fair bit cheaper than XTR. and 'breathtakingly' expensive is not a term I'd apply to them. £140 GBP is not a lot to pay for the reputedly mad-strong cranks and BB. Small Black Dog -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
#8
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
A friend of mine, whom weighs a bit less than myself, broke components
constantly, but usually from doing big drops. Simply put, if you're going to ride like that, expect breakage. Sounds like a candidate for the 8" suspension club. Me, I'm mostly cross country on a hardtail ('93 C'dale Delta V600) and the only parts I've broken were due to wear and the odd stick pulling the rear der into the spokes. Thousands of miles without much breakage to report, while trying to keep up with my full suspension friends. Troy Rappe wrote: what about large people who want something strong? SOmeone I know has snapped 5 crank sets just from the sheer power of his pedalling, he XTR is the lightweight race stuff. LX or XT are better for big guys. But really if he snaps parts like that, get some RaceFace or Truvativ freeride or downhill cranks. BTW: It's obviously not from "the sheer power of his pedalling", but rather some combination of poor riding skills, aggressive drops and his weight. I speak with some experiance. I'm an x football player and the more I ride the less I break parts. As you learn to glide over the trail rather than beat it to submission, not only do the parts last but you go way faster. I used to bend a lot of wheels, break chains, helmets, seatposts, cassettes, chainrings,... but I rarely break stuff anymore. I even crash softer, well usually, I sprained my neck a couple months ago by not paying attention on a new trail. Big guy parts: freeride cranks (splined) custom frame (Ti Seven Sola works for me!) Marzoochi fork (only big guy fork) rims (32 spoke triple cross or DH specific ) 9 speed Chains and cassettes might last a summer if this is too much $$ switch to 8 speed, 8 speeds last me at least 2 years. Thompson Elite seatpost Thompson Elite stem Chris King headset (it's worth the money) Easton's cheapest AL handlebar When you buy the cheaper parts from the big name manufacturers you usually get the heavy duty parts. (not including frames and forks) The most expensive parts are usually the lightest weight, xc race stuff for the 140 lb rider. Ogre -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
#9
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
"Small Black Dog" wrote in message ... News Subsystem wrote: SOmeone I know has snapped 5 crank sets just from the sheer power of his pedalling lets try and cut out the lies, eh? Small Black Dog Yeah, tell 'em to stop being such a dick, eh SBD? Shaun aRe -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
#10
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XTR M960: Beyond diminishing returns
"Rocketman" wrote in message news:R%Myb.274457$275.970846@attbi_s53... XTR M960 Cranks: $450 XTR M960 Brifters: $275 XTR M960 Rear Derailleur: $123 XTR M960 9sp Cassette: $142 XTR M960 Rear Disc Hub: $192 Is Shimano begging us to switch to SRAM, or what? Rocketman alllllready did... and haven't looked back. -- rec.bicycles.off-road is moderated by volunteers. To find help solving posting problems, or contact the moderators, please see http://rbor.org/ Please read the charter before posting: http://rbor.org/rbor_charter.txt |
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