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#141
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Islabikes new range
Adam Lea wrote:
"JNugent" wrote: But apart from that, and since I am not (in general) dismissive of rising living standards for the masses for whom you have such obvious disdain - Congratulations, you've just won strawman of the year award. I fear not, especially as the quoted text is no evidence of the creation of a strawman. |
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#142
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Islabikes new range
Adam Lea wrote:
"David Damerell" wrote: Quoting Ace : wrote: Quoting Ace : People found out what a tremendously useful, convenient and fun thing a car can be. Three thousand people a year find out, permanently, that that's not the case - many of those deaths are caused by the dangerous ****wits who think operating heavy machinery in public is a good time to have fun. I'm guessing you're one of them, too. Really? You guess all that from one post? That you think operating lethally dangerous machinery in public is "fun"? Yes. You said so. That that's a stupid thing to think, and anyone who wasn't caught up in this insane car culture would be constantly nervous and careful when in a position where they were likely to kill or main their fellow man? Yes, that too. Are you effectively saying that to enjoy driving is morally wrong? There may be another meaning to it, but if there is, it's very well-disguised. |
#143
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Islabikes new range
Phil W Lee wrote:
Philly considered Fri, 19 Sep 2008 23:14:40 +0100 the perfect time to write: Phil W Lee wrote: JNugent considered Fri, 19 Sep 2008 09:06:39 +0100 the perfect time to write: Peter Clinch wrote: David Damerell wrote: That you think operating lethally dangerous machinery in public is "fun"? I do, reasonably often. I think a lot of other people do too. Just because it's /potentially/ lethally dangerous doesn't mean I'm going to kill someone enjoying the heady mix of scenery and lovely driving on e.g. the A701 down to Moffat. I enjoy working with bill-hooks and axes at times too. Although it's not personal my cup of tea (as a born and bred townie), I also hear that some people derive great pleasure from hunting and shooting, using potentially deadly weapons. But DD presumably thinks that such things are highly immoral and destructive of society. I would argue that both of these are incompatible with crowded areas, making them ideal comparisons to the motor car. So private cars are "incompatible" with the people who wish to use them? Damn, Phil, you've uttered some pretty stupid crap (I'm still laughing at your 'forgery' complaint) but this is a corker even by your standards! Classic strawman. The discussion was about using private cars for FUN. And is there anything wrong with having fun? |
#144
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Islabikes new range
Ace writes:
My 25 min drive to the office isn't exactly what I'd call a 'commute' in any case. Why not? |
#145
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Islabikes new range
Ace writes:
On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 05:47:41 +0100, Paul Rudin wrote: Ace writes: My 25 min drive to the office isn't exactly what I'd call a 'commute' in any case. Why not? Two reasons. One, it's a pleasant drive (or ride, but that takes an hour or more) mostly through very attractive countryside. Two, having worked in and around London for many years, sometimes commuting via rail/tube/bus for up to two hours each way, it just doesn't seem to be worthy of using the same name to describe it. Shrug, that still fits within any reasonable definition of "commute". Your enjoyment or otherwise, and the fact that there are longer commutes, are irrelevant. We can all make up our own definitions of words ... but it doesn't help communication :/ |
#146
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Islabikes new range
David Damerell wrote:
I've never met a cager who thought they _personally_ weren't dangerous, Well, you haven't ever met me thus far. I'm well aware I'm dangerous in a car, after all, I've written one off from inattention in the past. Pete. -- Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/ |
#147
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Islabikes new range
On Sep 22, 8:31*am, Ace wrote:
On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 08:14:44 +0100, Paul Rudin wrote: Ace writes: On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 05:47:41 +0100, Paul Rudin wrote: Ace writes: My 25 min drive to the office isn't exactly what I'd call a 'commute' in any case. Why not? Two reasons. One, it's a pleasant drive (or ride, but that takes an hour or more) mostly through very attractive countryside. Two, having worked in and around London for many years, sometimes commuting via rail/tube/bus for up to two hours each way, it just doesn't seem to be worthy of using the same name to describe it. Shrug, that still fits within any reasonable definition of "commute". Your enjoyment or otherwise, and the fact that there are longer commutes, are irrelevant. By that definition anyone who doesn't actually live at their place of work commutes. "Reasonable" definitions may vary, depending on personal experience. The term originally arose from those who would buy a season ticket rather than individual journey tickets as they could then commute their travel. Such people became known as commuters, and that term has spread to all who travel regularly to the same place of work. ...d |
#148
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Islabikes new range
On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:15:57 -0700 (PDT)
David Martin wrote: The term originally arose from those who would buy a season ticket rather than individual journey tickets as they could then commute their travel. Such people became known as commuters, and that term has spread to all who travel regularly to the same place of work. I'm doubtful of that explanation - the Latin commutare means to switch or exchange (and is the root of English words such as commutator and commutative) so it seems more likely to me that it simply refers to the habitual switching between the locations of home and work. |
#149
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Islabikes new range
On Mon, 22 Sep 2008, Rob Morley wrote:
On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:15:57 -0700 (PDT) David Martin wrote: The term originally arose from those who would buy a season ticket rather than individual journey tickets as they could then commute their travel. Such people became known as commuters, and that term has spread to all who travel regularly to the same place of work. I'm doubtful of that explanation - the Latin commutare means to switch or exchange (and is the root of English words such as commutator and commutative) so it seems more likely to me that it simply refers to the habitual switching between the locations of home and work. OED sayeth: commute, v. b. absol. spec. To purchase and use a commutation-ticket. Also, more generally, to travel daily or regularly to and from one's place of work in a city (by any means of conveyance); also transf. and fig. orig. U.S. 1889 Cent. Dict., Commuter, one who commutes. 1906 Daily Chron. 25 Feb. 4 There are many business men who practically divide their time between New York and Chicago, and commute (the American term for taking season tickets). commutation 9. attrib. and Comb., [...] commutation ticket (U.S.), a ticket issued by a railway company, etc., at a reduced rate, entitling the holder to travel over a given route a certain number of times or during a certain period; a season-ticket. 1848 Amer. Railroad Jrnl. 29 July 481/3 Commutation tickets.., costing $5, are issued at Trenton, signed by B. Fish, which entitles the receiver to eight passages between Trenton and New Brunswick, by any line on the route. 1885 Good Words July 450/1 A single Commutation ticket is given, numbered and dated on the day on which it was issued. Webster's dictionary of 1913 has to say: Commutation ticket. A ticket for transportation at a reduced rate in consideration of some special circumstance, as increase of travel; specif., a ticket for a certain number of, or for daily, trips between neighboring places at a reduced rate, such as are commonly used by those doing business in a city and living in a suburb. Commutation tickets are excepted from the prohibition against special rates contained in the Interstate Commerce Act of Feb. 4, 1887 (24 Stat. 379), and in 145 U. S. 263 it was held that party tickets were also excepted as being "obviously within the commuting principle." And WordNet: * S: (n) commutation ticket, season ticket (a ticket good for several trips or to attend a season of entertainments; sold at a reduced rate) So it seems that the term 'commuter' definitely does come from a kind of ticket. Why those tickets are called that is not entirely clear to me, but it does look more likely that it's to do with their being at a reduced rate than associated with going back and forth between two places. It's 'commute' in the sense of 'his sentence was commuted to life in prison', rather than 'what's purple and commutes?' [1]. tom [1] An Abelian grape. -- Also, a 'dark future where there is only war!' ... have you seen the news lately? -- applez |
#150
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Islabikes new range
Ace wrote:
On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:15:57 -0700 (PDT), David Martin wrote: On Sep 22, 8:31 am, Ace wrote: On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 08:14:44 +0100, Paul Rudin wrote: Ace writes: On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 05:47:41 +0100, Paul Rudin wrote: Ace writes: My 25 min drive to the office isn't exactly what I'd call a 'commute' in any case. Shrug, that still fits within any reasonable definition of "commute". Your enjoyment or otherwise, and the fact that there are longer commutes, are irrelevant. By that definition anyone who doesn't actually live at their place of work commutes. "Reasonable" definitions may vary, depending on personal experience. The term originally arose from those who would buy a season ticket rather than individual journey tickets as they could then commute their travel. Such people became known as commuters, and that term has spread to all who travel regularly to the same place of work. Ahh. Thanks for that. But there's a bit more to it than that; the term has an overtone of working in one municipality (usually a city) and working in another. The commuter commutes from one place to the other. Tunbridge Wells to London Bridge is a commuter journey. Tufnell Park to Leicester Square doesn't conjure up the same mental image. |
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