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Electric Bikes



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 19th 19, 10:21 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
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Default Electric Bikes

I received an email from a local bike shop. They were advertising e-bikes. Three of them were shown. $2400 Raleigh. $4050 Specialized. $5050 Specialized. I had no idea electric bikes were that F---ing expensive. That is almost Half the price of one of those $10,000+ Specialized Venge Tour de France bikes. I have not looked recently, but I am positive that you can buy a new or used motorcycle, scooter, moped for much less than those prices.. I suppose riding e-bikes can get you some exercise which is good for you, but if you have to pay that much for it, wow. It almost makes those monthly gym membership fees seem reasonable.
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  #2  
Old April 19th 19, 11:52 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
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Default Electric Bikes

On Fri, 19 Apr 2019 14:21:17 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

I received an email from a local bike shop. They were advertising e-bikes. Three of them were shown. $2400 Raleigh. $4050 Specialized. $5050 Specialized. I had no idea electric bikes were that F---ing expensive. That is almost Half the price of one of those $10,000+ Specialized Venge Tour de France bikes. I have not looked recently, but I am positive that you can buy a new or used motorcycle, scooter, moped for much less than those prices. I suppose riding e-bikes can get you some exercise which is good for you, but if you have to pay that much for it, wow. It almost makes those monthly gym membership fees seem reasonable.



Here, in Thailand, a Honda Wave 110, drum brakes, sells (new) for
34,000 baht or US$1,069 :-)
--

Cheers,

John B.
  #3  
Old April 20th 19, 12:10 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Default Electric Bikes

On 4/19/2019 3:52 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Fri, 19 Apr 2019 14:21:17 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

I received an email from a local bike shop. They were advertising e-bikes. Three of them were shown. $2400 Raleigh. $4050 Specialized. $5050 Specialized. I had no idea electric bikes were that F---ing expensive. That is almost Half the price of one of those $10,000+ Specialized Venge Tour de France bikes. I have not looked recently, but I am positive that you can buy a new or used motorcycle, scooter, moped for much less than those prices. I suppose riding e-bikes can get you some exercise which is good for you, but if you have to pay that much for it, wow. It almost makes those monthly gym membership fees seem reasonable.


Those are name-brand e-Bikes, mid-drive. A decent rear-hub drive e-bike
costs $1200-1500.

You can do a mid-drive e-Bike conversion for about $1000 with the motor,
battery, and controller, plus about $500 for a suitable bicycle for
conversion (a mid-range mountain bike with hydraulic disc brakes, i.e.
https://www.rei.com/product/106331/co-op-cycles-drt-11-bike). You need
a bicycle with a strong frame and disc brakes.


  #4  
Old April 20th 19, 05:20 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
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Default Electric Bikes

On Friday, April 19, 2019 at 10:21:19 PM UTC+1, wrote:
I suppose riding e-bikes can get you some exercise which is good for you, but if you have to pay that much for it, wow. It almost makes those monthly gym membership fees seem reasonable.


Forget it, Russell. Successful ebikers, who extend their cycling life with the ebike but don't expect the motor to do all the work, are longtime cyclists. My observation is that the buyers of ebikes who weren't cyclists before they bought an ebike are virtually 100% likely to park the thing in the garage and never ride it again within at most a month. They also whine about how the battery won't carry them as far as they hoped, which gives away the fact that they don't pedal but just run the battery down. Also, all those who stop me on the street or in the supermarket car park to ask if they can buy my obviously successful ebike instead, prove on questioning to have abused the battery by repeatedly running it quite flat, which cuts its life to at most months rather than years. In short, whatever their intentions, they didn't get any exercise by buying an ebike, they didn't enjoy it, they feel they wasted their money, and they certainly haven't become cyclists in any recognizable sense of the word. They're the same people with subscriptions to half a dozen expensive, exclusive gyms, who never go there.

This entire idea, apparently held by some of the more starry-eyed bicycle apostles, that ebikes will expand cycling is a crock. All it will expand is (maybe) electric motorcycling.

The best those who hope for the cycle-Utopia can expect is that maybe a few commuters will stick it out and thus take one car off the road in the rush hour. Note the "maybe".

Andre Jute
Ebiker for about ten years now

  #5  
Old April 20th 19, 05:45 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
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Default Electric Bikes

On Saturday, April 20, 2019 at 12:10:53 AM UTC+1, sms wrote:
On 4/19/2019 3:52 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Fri, 19 Apr 2019 14:21:17 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

I received an email from a local bike shop. They were advertising e-bikes. Three of them were shown. $2400 Raleigh. $4050 Specialized. $5050 Specialized. I had no idea electric bikes were that F---ing expensive. That is almost Half the price of one of those $10,000+ Specialized Venge Tour de France bikes. I have not looked recently, but I am positive that you can buy a new or used motorcycle, scooter, moped for much less than those prices. I suppose riding e-bikes can get you some exercise which is good for you, but if you have to pay that much for it, wow. It almost makes those monthly gym membership fees seem reasonable.


Those are name-brand e-Bikes, mid-drive. A decent rear-hub drive e-bike
costs $1200-1500.


You can build your own for much less. At http://coolmainpress.com/BICYCLINGbuildingpedelec1.html
I describe fitting a front motor for around $500 including even a new tyre (! it came with the kit) to an existing bike. Of course my bike, a Utopia Kranich, wasn't in any sense basic, but, as you say, any cheap but strong mountain bike will do the business. After I gained experience with this installation, I went over to mid-motors.

You can do a mid-drive e-Bike conversion for about $1000 with the motor,
battery, and controller,


I think you might get away for about $800 for a Bafang 8FUN central installation like mine if you shop wisely. If it's pre-installed, the price of the base bike might increase 1200 if you're lucky, more likely 1500 and up.

plus about $500 for a suitable bicycle for
conversion (a mid-range mountain bike with hydraulic disc brakes, i.e.
https://www.rei.com/product/106331/co-op-cycles-drt-11-bike). You need
a bicycle with a strong frame and disc brakes.


If you're going to spend the money for a mid-motor, I think it is worth getting a bike with a hub gearbox, at least an Alfine and better still a CVT automatic box like the NuVinci Harmony or, best of all, a Rohloff Speed Drive 500. My Rohloff is just run in with 10K on it. There's also a Pinion mid-gearbox (requires a frame designed to take it, $$$ all round, not for the innocent) designed by Porsche, so likely to be strong enough for whatever rear motor anyone wants to fit. It would be foolish to fit a torquey mid-motor to a Shimano Nexus hub gearbox -- I trashed two of those just mashing the pedals, before I ever fitted electrical assistance.

While just about anyone can install a front motor already built into a complete wheel, a mid motor is a bit trickier and more likely to defeat or endanger a non-cyclist, though any engineer or mechanic or handy person should be able to do it.

Andre Jute
Been there, done that, left town for greener pastures before the T-shirts were even printed
  #6  
Old April 21st 19, 07:17 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Posts: 9,477
Default Electric Bikes

On 4/19/2019 4:10 PM, sms wrote:
On 4/19/2019 3:52 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Fri, 19 Apr 2019 14:21:17 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

I received an email from a local bike shop.Â* They were advertising
e-bikes.Â* Three of them were shown.Â* $2400 Raleigh.Â* $4050
Specialized.Â* $5050 Specialized.Â* I had no idea electric bikes were
that F---ing expensive.Â* That is almost Half the price of one of
those $10,000+ Specialized Venge Tour de France bikes.Â* I have not
looked recently, but I am positive that you can buy a new or used
motorcycle, scooter, moped for much less than those prices.Â* I
suppose riding e-bikes can get you some exercise which is good for
you, but if you have to pay that much for it, wow.Â* It almost makes
those monthly gym membership fees seem reasonable.


Those are name-brand e-Bikes, mid-drive. A decent rear-hub drive e-bike
costs $1200-1500.

You can do a mid-drive e-Bike conversion for about $1000 with the motor,
battery, and controller, plus about $500 for a suitable bicycle for
conversion (a mid-range mountain bike with hydraulic disc brakes, i.e.
https://www.rei.com/product/106331/co-op-cycles-drt-11-bike). You need
a bicycle with a strong frame and disc brakes.


I would probably opt for a 1x11 setup for a mid-drive electric bicycle.

  #8  
Old April 24th 19, 02:30 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
news18
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Posts: 1,131
Default Electric Bikes

On Sat, 20 Apr 2019 09:45:36 -0700, Andre Jute wrote:

On Saturday, April 20, 2019 at 12:10:53 AM UTC+1, sms wrote:
On 4/19/2019 3:52 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Fri, 19 Apr 2019 14:21:17 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

I received an email from a local bike shop. They were advertising
e-bikes. Three of them were shown. $2400 Raleigh. $4050
Specialized. $5050 Specialized. I had no idea electric bikes were
that F---ing expensive. That is almost Half the price of one of
those $10,000+ Specialized Venge Tour de France bikes. I have not
looked recently, but I am positive that you can buy a new or used
motorcycle, scooter, moped for much less than those prices. I
suppose riding e-bikes can get you some exercise which is good for
you, but if you have to pay that much for it, wow. It almost makes
those monthly gym membership fees seem reasonable.


Those are name-brand e-Bikes, mid-drive. A decent rear-hub drive e-bike
costs $1200-1500.


You can build your own for much less. At
http://coolmainpress.com/BICYCLINGbuildingpedelec1.html I describe
fitting a front motor


Mid frame conversions are better and fit the riding habits of perople who
would benefit from a e-bike; aka more activity and ICE replacement.

Front and rear motors are not designed for the average bicle rider and
would be rapidly destroyed.

  #9  
Old April 24th 19, 11:28 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Posts: 9,477
Default Electric Bikes

On 4/23/2019 6:26 PM, news18 wrote:
On Fri, 19 Apr 2019 14:21:17 -0700, wrote:

I received an email from a local bike shop. They were advertising
e-bikes. Three of them were shown. $2400 Raleigh. $4050 Specialized.
$5050 Specialized. I had no idea electric bikes were that F---ing
expensive. That is almost Half the price of one of those $10,000+
Specialized Venge Tour de France bikes. I have not looked recently, but
I am positive that you can buy a new or used motorcycle, scooter, moped
for much less than those prices. I suppose riding e-bikes can get you
some exercise which is good for you, but if you have to pay that much
for it, wow. It almost makes those monthly gym membership fees seem
reasonable.


Suppossedly it is the cost of the lithium batteries.
Then there is the early adopter markup addded-on,
Then there is the birht and shinny new cost added on.

Wait until wallymat/etc starts offering them.


Xiaomi's (more known for mobile phones) second folding e-bike, the Himo
C20, has a retail price in China of $375, and that’s their more
expensive model
https://electrek.co/2019/04/08/xiaomi-himo-c20-electric-bike/.

It’s not the cost of the underlying components that accounts for the
high cost of name-brand electric bicycles because motors and Li-Ion
batteries are just not that expensive. Prices are set by what the market
will bear.

Right now, the low-cost electric bicycles use rear hub motors, but
there’s no reason that mid-drive electric bicycles are so expensive and
those prices will fall as more Chinese companies enter the market. At
Sea Otter, there was on mid-drive Chinese company displaying their system.
 




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