Front derailer compatibility issue?

Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.
The rear is fine, the front is not.

This is a bottom pull FD setup (it’s really a “city bike”, not a
mountain bike). Also, it’s Bio-Pace, which I really don’t like, but,
it’s my wife’s bike, she likes it, and I don’t want to spend too much
to overhaul it.

Anyway, when I attached the FD cable and tried to shift, it took a lot
of pressure on the shift lever to even move the FD. When the FD does
move, it seems to swing out too much with the amount of shift lever
movement. For example, moving from low (1) to middle (2) causes the
FD to move all the way to the big ring.

I added slack to the cable, thinking maybe I had it too tight - that
helped a little, but even with a lot of slack in there, it still moved
too much and still takes what seems to be way to pressure to cause the
movement.

Chainline seems to be okay:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

The above indicates 47.5 to 50mm and I’m at about 49mm.

Do I need a new FD that is compatible with this indexed front shifter?
--
Marty

On Mar 22, 12:15*pm, Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. *It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.
The rear is fine, the front is not.

This is a bottom pull FD setup (it’s really a “city bike”, not a
mountain bike). *Also, it’s Bio-Pace, which I really don’t like, but,
it’s my wife’s bike, she likes it, and I don’t want to spend too much
to overhaul it.

Anyway, when I attached the FD cable and tried to shift, it took a lot
of pressure on the shift lever to even move the FD. *When the FD does
move, it seems to swing out too much with the amount of shift lever
movement. *For example, moving from low (1) to middle (2) causes the
FD to move all the way to the big ring.

I added slack to the cable, thinking maybe I had it too tight - that
helped a little, but even with a lot of slack in there, it still moved
too much and still takes what seems to be way to pressure to cause the
movement.

Chainline seems to be okay:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

The above indicates 47.5 to 50mm and I’m at about 49mm.

Do I need a new FD that is compatible with this indexed front shifter?
--
Marty

Depends on the shifter and FD you have, but almost certainly, yes.
What shifter? and what size chainrings?

Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.
The rear is fine, the front is not.

This is a bottom pull FD setup (it’s really a “city bike”, not a
mountain bike). Also, it’s Bio-Pace, which I really don’t like, but,
it’s my wife’s bike, she likes it, and I don’t want to spend too much
to overhaul it.

Anyway, when I attached the FD cable and tried to shift, it took a lot
of pressure on the shift lever to even move the FD. When the FD does
move, it seems to swing out too much with the amount of shift lever
movement. For example, moving from low (1) to middle (2) causes the
FD to move all the way to the big ring.

I added slack to the cable, thinking maybe I had it too tight - that
helped a little, but even with a lot of slack in there, it still moved
too much and still takes what seems to be way to pressure to cause the
movement.

Chainline seems to be okay:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

The above indicates 47.5 to 50mm and I’m at about 49mm.

Do I need a new FD that is compatible with this indexed front shifter?

Maybe. First, ensure the gear wire is attached above, not
below, the anchor bolt. If that's right, get a newer model
changer.
AFAIK anything Shimano from 1988-up (BioPace era) is
front-click compatible.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Mar 22, 1:46*pm, AMuzi wrote:
Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. *It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.
The rear is fine, the front is not.

This is a bottom pull FD setup (it’s really a “city bike”, not a
mountain bike). *Also, it’s Bio-Pace, which I really don’t like, but,
it’s my wife’s bike, she likes it, and I don’t want to spend too much
to overhaul it.

Anyway, when I attached the FD cable and tried to shift, it took a lot
of pressure on the shift lever to even move the FD. *When the FD does
move, it seems to swing out too much with the amount of shift lever
movement. *For example, moving from low (1) to middle (2) causes the
FD to move all the way to the big ring.

I added slack to the cable, thinking maybe I had it too tight - that
helped a little, but even with a lot of slack in there, it still moved
too much and still takes what seems to be way to pressure to cause the
movement.

Chainline seems to be okay:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

The above indicates 47.5 to 50mm and I’m at about 49mm.

Do I need a new FD that is compatible with this indexed front shifter?

Maybe. First, ensure the gear wire is attached above, not
below, the anchor bolt. If that's right, get a newer model
changer.
AFAIK anything Shimano from 1988-up (BioPace era) is
front-click compatible.

--
Andrew Muzi
* www.yellowjersey.org/
* Open every day since 1 April, 1971- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hi Andrew and Hank,

The original FD and crank/chainrings are Shimano Exage 300 LX (bio-
pace), chainrings are 48/38/28.

The original shifters are Exage Country SLR (friction).

The new shifters are generic Shimano indexing rapid-fire type shifters
- very nice actually. For the front brifter, the thumb lever shifts
to a highter gear, the finger lever shifts to lower gears. The brake
levers even have a little tab that you can move to change between V-
brakes and cantilever type brakes. They are similar to this, only
mine are brifters:

http://harriscyclery.net/itemdetails.cfm?id=2671

The FD cable was attached to the FD bolt to the left-top (non-drive
side).

I think the new brifters are newer model than the original stuff.
--
Marty

On Mar 22, 2:08*pm, Marty wrote:
On Mar 22, 1:46*pm, AMuzi wrote:





Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. *It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.
The rear is fine, the front is not.

This is a bottom pull FD setup (it’s really a “city bike”, not a
mountain bike). *Also, it’s Bio-Pace, which I really don’t like, but,
it’s my wife’s bike, she likes it, and I don’t want to spend too much
to overhaul it.

Anyway, when I attached the FD cable and tried to shift, it took a lot
of pressure on the shift lever to even move the FD. *When the FD does
move, it seems to swing out too much with the amount of shift lever
movement. *For example, moving from low (1) to middle (2) causes the
FD to move all the way to the big ring.

I added slack to the cable, thinking maybe I had it too tight - that
helped a little, but even with a lot of slack in there, it still moved
too much and still takes what seems to be way to pressure to cause the
movement.

Chainline seems to be okay:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

The above indicates 47.5 to 50mm and I’m at about 49mm.

Do I need a new FD that is compatible with this indexed front shifter?

Maybe. First, ensure the gear wire is attached above, not
below, the anchor bolt. If that's right, get a newer model
changer.
AFAIK anything Shimano from 1988-up (BioPace era) is
front-click compatible.

--
Andrew Muzi
* www.yellowjersey.org/
* Open every day since 1 April, 1971- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hi Andrew and Hank,

The original FD and crank/chainrings are Shimano Exage 300 LX (bio-
pace), chainrings are 48/38/28.

The original shifters are Exage Country SLR (friction).

The new shifters are generic Shimano indexing rapid-fire type shifters
- very nice actually. *For the front brifter, the thumb lever shifts
to a highter gear, the finger lever shifts to lower gears. *The brake
levers even have a little tab that you can move to change between V-
brakes and cantilever type brakes. * They are similar to this, only
mine are brifters:

http://harriscyclery.net/itemdetails.cfm?id=2671

The FD cable was attached to the FD bolt to the left-top (non-drive
side).

I think the new brifters are newer model than the original stuff.
--
Marty- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Anybody? I'm so close to getting this project completed. Would love
to know if anybody has had similar experience with converting FD
friction shift to indexed. I've read some thing on Sheldon's site
that would suggest that I may have to upgrade the FD. Just not sure.
Help!!!

On Mar 23, 10:12*am, Marty wrote:
On Mar 22, 2:08*pm, Marty wrote:





On Mar 22, 1:46*pm, AMuzi wrote:

Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. *It's 7 speed rear and tripple front..
The rear is fine, the front is not.

This is a bottom pull FD setup (it’s really a “city bike”, not a
mountain bike). *Also, it’s Bio-Pace, which I really don’t like, but,
it’s my wife’s bike, she likes it, and I don’t want to spend too much
to overhaul it.

Anyway, when I attached the FD cable and tried to shift, it took a lot
of pressure on the shift lever to even move the FD. *When the FD does
move, it seems to swing out too much with the amount of shift lever
movement. *For example, moving from low (1) to middle (2) causes the
FD to move all the way to the big ring.

I added slack to the cable, thinking maybe I had it too tight - that
helped a little, but even with a lot of slack in there, it still moved
too much and still takes what seems to be way to pressure to cause the
movement.

Chainline seems to be okay:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

The above indicates 47.5 to 50mm and I’m at about 49mm.

Do I need a new FD that is compatible with this indexed front shifter?

Maybe. First, ensure the gear wire is attached above, not
below, the anchor bolt. If that's right, get a newer model
changer.
AFAIK anything Shimano from 1988-up (BioPace era) is
front-click compatible.

--
Andrew Muzi
* www.yellowjersey.org/
* Open every day since 1 April, 1971- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hi Andrew and Hank,

The original FD and crank/chainrings are Shimano Exage 300 LX (bio-
pace), chainrings are 48/38/28.

The original shifters are Exage Country SLR (friction).

The new shifters are generic Shimano indexing rapid-fire type shifters
- very nice actually. *For the front brifter, the thumb lever shifts
to a highter gear, the finger lever shifts to lower gears. *The brake
levers even have a little tab that you can move to change between V-
brakes and cantilever type brakes. * They are similar to this, only
mine are brifters:

http://harriscyclery.net/itemdetails.cfm?id=2671

The FD cable was attached to the FD bolt to the left-top (non-drive
side).

I think the new brifters are newer model than the original stuff.
--
Marty- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Anybody? *I'm so close to getting this project completed. *Would love
to know if anybody has had similar experience with converting FD
friction shift to indexed. *I've read some thing on Sheldon's site
that would suggest that I may have to upgrade the FD. *Just not sure.
Help!!!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Your Exage 300LX is from after the introduction of Front SIS, so the
pull ratio should be OK.

Getting a new one will be dicey, too, because of the chainring sizes.
Most FDs compatible with your shifters will be 44T max.

Like Andy said, I'd mostly suspect that the cable's on the wrong side
of the anchor bolt.

On Mar 23, 11:57*am, Hank Wirtz wrote:
On Mar 23, 10:12*am, Marty wrote:





On Mar 22, 2:08*pm, Marty wrote:

On Mar 22, 1:46*pm, AMuzi wrote:

Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. *It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.

On Mar 23, 11:57*am, Hank Wirtz wrote:
On Mar 23, 10:12*am, Marty wrote:





On Mar 22, 2:08*pm, Marty wrote:

On Mar 22, 1:46*pm, AMuzi wrote:

Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. *It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.

On Mar 23, 11:46*am, Marty wrote:
On Mar 23, 11:57*am, Hank Wirtz wrote:





On Mar 23, 10:12*am, Marty wrote:

On Mar 22, 2:08*pm, Marty wrote:

On Mar 22, 1:46*pm, AMuzi wrote:

Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. *It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.
The rear is fine, the front is not.

This is a bottom pull FD setup (it’s really a “city bike”, not a
mountain bike). *Also, it’s Bio-Pace, which I really don’t like, but,
it’s my wife’s bike, she likes it, and I don’t want to spend too much
to overhaul it.

Anyway, when I attached the FD cable and tried to shift, it took a lot
of pressure on the shift lever to even move the FD. *When the FD does
move, it seems to swing out too much with the amount of shift lever
movement. *For example, moving from low (1) to middle (2) causes the
FD to move all the way to the big ring.

I added slack to the cable, thinking maybe I had it too tight - that
helped a little, but even with a lot of slack in there, it still moved
too much and still takes what seems to be way to pressure to cause the
movement.

Chainline seems to be okay:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

The above indicates 47.5 to 50mm and I’m at about 49mm.

Do I need a new FD that is compatible with this indexed front shifter?

Maybe. First, ensure the gear wire is attached above, not
below, the anchor bolt. If that's right, get a newer model
changer.
AFAIK anything Shimano from 1988-up (BioPace era) is
front-click compatible.

--
Andrew Muzi
* www.yellowjersey.org/
* Open every day since 1 April, 1971- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hi Andrew and Hank,

The original FD and crank/chainrings are Shimano Exage 300 LX (bio-
pace), chainrings are 48/38/28.

The original shifters are Exage Country SLR (friction).

The new shifters are generic Shimano indexing rapid-fire type shifters
- very nice actually. *For the front brifter, the thumb lever shifts
to a highter gear, the finger lever shifts to lower gears. *The brake
levers even have a little tab that you can move to change between V-
brakes and cantilever type brakes. * They are similar to this, only
mine are brifters:

http://harriscyclery.net/itemdetails.cfm?id=2671

The FD cable was attached to the FD bolt to the left-top (non-drive
side).

I think the new brifters are newer model than the original stuff.
--
Marty- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Anybody? *I'm so close to getting this project completed. *Would love
to know if anybody has had similar experience with converting FD
friction shift to indexed. *I've read some thing on Sheldon's site
that would suggest that I may have to upgrade the FD. *Just not sure.
Help!!!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Your Exage 300LX is from after the introduction of Front SIS, so the
pull ratio should be OK.

Getting a new one will be dicey, too, because of the chainring sizes.
Most FDs compatible with your shifters will be 44T max.

Like Andy said, I'd mostly suspect that the cable's on the wrong side
of the anchor bolt.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

From Sheldon's web pages on FD:

"The ratio of cable movement to derailer movement differs with
Shimano's "road " vs. "MTB " front derailers. This can cause indexing
problems if you use a "road" front derailer with upright handlebars or
a "MTB" front derailer with drop handlebars. This is a concern if you
are running an indexed front shifter, such as Shimano STI or RapidFire
shifters."

Is this Exage 300LX a true MTB FD? *Because, what is stated above is
exactly what is happening in my case. *There is WAY too much FD
movement with the amount of cable movement with this new index
shifter. *Now, this would not be an issue with the old friction based
shifter. *As stated by Sheldon he

"It is not a problem if you are using a friction system, such as bar-
end shifters or downtube shifters. It is also not a problem with
ratcheting systems such as Campagnolo Ergo."

Hmmmm???- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

The Exage 300LX was definitely a mountain group, .

However, if you decide to get something new, be sure to go cheap and
cheerful - something like a Shimano Nexave FD-T301. Shouldn't be more
than $15, probably closer to $12. Be sure that it's not the T300,
which is for the smaller chainrings, and if anybody tries to steer you
to something you're not sure about, get them to agree to take it back
if it's not right.

On Mar 23, 2:23*pm, Hank Wirtz wrote:
On Mar 23, 11:46*am, Marty wrote:





On Mar 23, 11:57*am, Hank Wirtz wrote:

On Mar 23, 10:12*am, Marty wrote:

On Mar 22, 2:08*pm, Marty wrote:

On Mar 22, 1:46*pm, AMuzi wrote:

Marty wrote:
Front derailer compatibility issue?

I'm trying to upgrade an old (early 90's) Shimano friction shift
system to an indexed system. *It's 7 speed rear and tripple front.
The rear is fine, the front is not.

This is a bottom pull FD setup (it’s really a “city bike”, not a
mountain bike). *Also, it’s Bio-Pace, which I really don’t like, but,
it’s my wife’s bike, she likes it, and I don’t want to spend too much
to overhaul it.

Anyway, when I attached the FD cable and tried to shift, it took a lot
of pressure on the shift lever to even move the FD. *When the FD does
move, it seems to swing out too much with the amount of shift lever
movement. *For example, moving from low (1) to middle (2) causes the
FD to move all the way to the big ring.

I added slack to the cable, thinking maybe I had it too tight - that
helped a little, but even with a lot of slack in there, it still moved
too much and still takes what seems to be way to pressure to cause the
movement.

Chainline seems to be okay:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

The above indicates 47.5 to 50mm and I’m at about 49mm.

Do I need a new FD that is compatible with this indexed front shifter?

Maybe. First, ensure the gear wire is attached above, not
below, the anchor bolt. If that's right, get a newer model
changer.
AFAIK anything Shimano from 1988-up (BioPace era) is
front-click compatible.

--
Andrew Muzi
* www.yellowjersey.org/
* Open every day since 1 April, 1971- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hi Andrew and Hank,

The original FD and crank/chainrings are Shimano Exage 300 LX (bio-
pace), chainrings are 48/38/28.

The original shifters are Exage Country SLR (friction).

The new shifters are generic Shimano indexing rapid-fire type shifters
- very nice actually. *For the front brifter, the thumb lever shifts
to a highter gear, the finger lever shifts to lower gears. *The brake
levers even have a little tab that you can move to change between V-
brakes and cantilever type brakes. * They are similar to this, only
mine are brifters:

http://harriscyclery.net/itemdetails.cfm?id=2671

The FD cable was attached to the FD bolt to the left-top (non-drive
side).

I think the new brifters are newer model than the original stuff.
--
Marty- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Anybody? *I'm so close to getting this project completed. *Would love
to know if anybody has had similar experience with converting FD
friction shift to indexed. *I've read some thing on Sheldon's site
that would suggest that I may have to upgrade the FD. *Just not sure.
Help!!!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Your Exage 300LX is from after the introduction of Front SIS, so the
pull ratio should be OK.

Getting a new one will be dicey, too, because of the chainring sizes.
Most FDs compatible with your shifters will be 44T max.

Like Andy said, I'd mostly suspect that the cable's on the wrong side
of the anchor bolt.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

From Sheldon's web pages on FD:

"The ratio of cable movement to derailer movement differs with
Shimano's "road " vs. "MTB " front derailers. This can cause indexing
problems if you use a "road" front derailer with upright handlebars or
a "MTB" front derailer with drop handlebars. This is a concern if you
are running an indexed front shifter, such as Shimano STI or RapidFire
shifters."

Is this Exage 300LX a true MTB FD? *Because, what is stated above is
exactly what is happening in my case. *There is WAY too much FD
movement with the amount of cable movement with this new index
shifter. *Now, this would not be an issue with the old friction based
shifter. *As stated by Sheldon he

"It is not a problem if you are using a friction system, such as bar-
end shifters or downtube shifters. It is also not a problem with
ratcheting systems such as Campagnolo Ergo."

Hmmmm???- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

The Exage 300LX was definitely a mountain group, .

However, if you decide to get something new, be sure to go cheap and
cheerful - something like a Shimano Nexave FD-T301. Shouldn't be more
than $15, probably closer to $12. Be sure that it's not the T300,
which is for the smaller chainrings, and if anybody tries to steer you
to something you're not sure about, get them to agree to take it back
if it's not right.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thanks again Hank!

For sure it will be "cheap and cheerful" and I'll ask for a return
agreement. Thanks for the model suggestion.

Also, I will try mounting the cable on the other side of the bolt to
see if that makes a difference.
--
Marty