I'm ashamed to admit I was conned.

Like this? *(prehistoric Look Y-cleats - no longer made)http://home.comcast.net/~mandmlj/ShoeLugs/

Mark J.

That's the saddest page I've ever seen.

On 12/30/2010 10:23 AM, Duane Hebert wrote:

"landotter" wrote in message
...
On Dec 30, 8:07 am, Cicero Venatio wrote:

That said, on a hot day, I got nothing against putting on a lycra
monkeysuit and going for a long haul on my SS roadie bike. It's got
spds--but I'll never ever buy another road shoe.

Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
deal is about road shoes.

I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) I have a pair of
Shimano MTB shoes
that I use with both bikes. My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
side and grips on the other.

I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. I've
used
Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.

They say that Look type pedals are easier to get into and out of but I
don't
see that. They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
notice
that either. Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.

I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes.
The cleats
are recessed into the sole.

Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. I can unclip
and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.

I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until
I get
across the intersection.

The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are $150 bucks.

I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.

What's the argument against this setup on a road bike?


Fabrizio Mazzoleni thinks you are a fred.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.

On 12/30/2010 12:17 PM, Jay Beattie wrote:
I wish I could discover the real joy of riding, but I think I would
have to move to San Diego to do it.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWu6BTm74nM&NR=1
-- Jay Beattie.

You need a Tatra: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwXr774zZKs.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.

On 12/30/2010 12:17 PM, raamman wrote:
On Dec 30, 9:07 am, Cicero wrote:
Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.


it was so obvious THEN even- I couldn't imagine all the fools here who
believed
( and they STILL believe the ****er )

It was a such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.

it sounds like you've discovered a joy of eating; 35 wide tires carry
such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
for "comfort"

Wider tires have lower rolling resistance than narrower tires, all else
being equal.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.

On 12/30/2010 1:43 PM, Zenon wrote:
Okay all you retards need to quit your mamby pamby whining and get
over it. It is what it is. Accept it. Lance Armstrong is a doper
just like the rest of your VHS lovers except he is now a saint because
he cures cancer. He's no different than Bernard Madoff because, just
like Bernie, Lance Dopestrong has built his little one nut wonder
empire on lies. In a few weeks you'll all have erections watching him
leave the scene. So take Lance Armstrong and your fat tire, pedal,
and shoe thread and shove it up your ass. You're used to it. For you
it will be like throwing a hot dog down a hallway.

It's not cheating unless you get caught.

Lance was smart enough to get doctors and biochemists who could beat the
system.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.

Jay Beattie wrote:

Chalo wrote:

A supple 700x35 tire like the Pasela, Rivendell Jack
Brown, or Schwalbe Marathon Racer has _less_ rolling resistance than a
narrow race tire, because it flexes a lot less deeply to establish its
contact patch. *It weighs a little more and has more aerodynamic drag
at speeds over 20mph or so, but neither of those things equal rolling
resistance.

I sell 700x23 Soma Everwear and 700x25mm Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires
at my shop. *Those tires are sluggish, even though they are narrow.
If you want to compare an armored 35mm utility tire to a skinny tire,
compare with those. *But a fast 35mm tire is simply a fast tire by any
measure.

Big fat tires ride like big fat tires. *They are pigs climbing and can
ride like pogo sticks at real low pressure . . . but you get better
traction in crappy conditions and get good pinch flat resistance. *

That's a pretty fair characterization of my big fat tires, which are
700x60 Big Apples and 26x3.0 Kenda Kraze slicks. I'd say "beach
balls" instead of "pogo sticks", but why quibble?

But not one of the three examples I gave, nor any other 700x35 tire,
is a big fat tire. There are some clunky 700x35s (like the Forte
Gothams on my wife's coastie) but then there are also clunky skinny
tires as I already pointed out.

Chalo

On Dec 30, 1:24 pm, Jay Beattie wrote:
On Dec 30, 11:47 am, Chalo wrote:



raamman wrote:

Cicero Venatio wrote:

It was a such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.

it sounds like you've discovered a joy of eating; 35 wide tires carry
such rolling resistance that only massively overweight riders use them
for "comfort"

You are full of gas (and you're a prick, but I guess that's just a
racer thing). A supple 700x35 tire like the Pasela, Rivendell Jack
Brown, or Schwalbe Marathon Racer has _less_ rolling resistance than a
narrow race tire, because it flexes a lot less deeply to establish its
contact patch. It weighs a little more and has more aerodynamic drag
at speeds over 20mph or so, but neither of those things equal rolling
resistance.

I sell 700x23 Soma Everwear and 700x25mm Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires
at my shop. Those tires are sluggish, even though they are narrow.
If you want to compare an armored 35mm utility tire to a skinny tire,
compare with those. But a fast 35mm tire is simply a fast tire by any
measure.

Chalo

Big fat tires ride like big fat tires. They are pigs climbing and can
ride like pogo sticks at real low pressure . . . but you get better
traction in crappy conditions and get good pinch flat resistance. I
switch between tires frequently on my cross-bike. I will throw on the
fatties this weekend because conditions have turned very soupy, and
riding in the dark and the rain is just asking to whack something. But
if it were summer, I would stick with my 25s or 28s because I hate
dragging the fatties uphill.

The walnuts that litter my driveway every year have a rock hard inner
shell about 2 cm diameter, and a green outer coating that is tight at
first, but loosens after a day or so on the ground, and is slimy
inside. So, what you have here is a big rock with a thick slimy
coating.

Coming into the driveway one night on my 28 mm tires, I hit a single
walnut, which immediately put me on the ground (where my knee hit
another walnut). OTOH I can ride the 1.95" slicks on my wheelie bike
right through myriad walnuts no problem.

On Dec 30, 6:07 am, Cicero Venatio wrote:
Doing some house cleaning in the cold weather, and I found a stash of
old cycling race mags, and a stack of vhs tapes on tour de france and
those other races they have in Europe. I kind of thumbed through some
of the mags, put a couple of the vhs tapes in, and I thought of how
stupid I was back then. All of it went into the dumpster. The only
thing remotely interesting was some of the hype on that old equipment,
bikes, and shoes, clothes. It was all an elaborate illusion, and they
actually fooled me in those days. But now I know the magic behind the
tricks, and I kept one tape, that I recorded myself, to remind me of how
fake it all was. That is the stage that Landis won, after he covered
himself with t-patches the night before. He looked like a crazed crack
head fleeing the police in that stage, it is so obvious now.


http://bikeportland.org/2010/12/29/f...e-racing-35117

It was all such a waste of time. Still have a couple of CF wonder
racing bikes that I hardly even use because they are so impractical to
ride. Most of riding is now on a Surly LHT, with 35 wide tires, spd
pedals and shoes, and have discovered the real joy of riding.

I put the most miles on my LHT, too (ATM 32 mm front, ~35 mm rear
tires). It has SPD pedals, too - sweet M747's ($5 for the pair on
CL!) My shoes are Shimano MT40's ($55 on closeout) and sandals. I'd
like to have a nice pair of winter boots, but booties over the shoes
aren't too bad unless it rains a lot. The sandals are even good in
the rain if it isn't too cold, and they're great in the heat.

I put plastic MKS pedals on my wheelie bike - so I can ride it
barefoot.

On Dec 30, 5:11*pm, Chalo wrote:
Jay Beattie wrote:

Chalo wrote:

A supple 700x35 tire like the Pasela, Rivendell Jack
Brown, or Schwalbe Marathon Racer has _less_ rolling resistance than a
narrow race tire, because it flexes a lot less deeply to establish its
contact patch. *It weighs a little more and has more aerodynamic drag
at speeds over 20mph or so, but neither of those things equal rolling
resistance.

I sell 700x23 Soma Everwear and 700x25mm Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires
at my shop. *Those tires are sluggish, even though they are narrow.
If you want to compare an armored 35mm utility tire to a skinny tire,
compare with those. *But a fast 35mm tire is simply a fast tire by any
measure.

Big fat tires ride like big fat tires. *They are pigs climbing and can
ride like pogo sticks at real low pressure . . . but you get better
traction in crappy conditions and get good pinch flat resistance. *

That's a pretty fair characterization of my big fat tires, which are
700x60 Big Apples and 26x3.0 Kenda Kraze slicks. *I'd say "beach
balls" instead of "pogo sticks", but why quibble?

But not one of the three examples I gave, nor any other 700x35 tire,
is a big fat tire. *There are some clunky 700x35s (like the Forte
Gothams on my wife's coastie) but then there are also clunky skinny
tires as I already pointed out.

Any opinion on Panaracer Urban Max tires?:
http://www.performancebike.com/bikes...3#ReviewHeader

Price is right. It's a 32mm tire with some tread pattern, which comes
in handy this time of year. It looks like it would meet my commuting
needs. I had durability problems with the Paselas and have not tried
the other two you mention, the Rivendell and the Schwalbe, although it
looks like I could find at least the Schwalbe locally, but the
Marathon Plus in plus size is not cheap!
http://www.biketiresdirect.com/searc...-touring-tires --
Jay Beattie.

On Dec 30, 4:23*pm, "Duane Hebert" wrote:
"landotter" wrote in message

...
On Dec 30, 8:07 am, Cicero Venatio wrote:

That said, on a hot day, I got nothing against putting on a lycra
monkeysuit and going for a long haul on my SS roadie bike. It's got
spds--but I'll never ever buy another road shoe.

Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm wondering what the big
deal is about road shoes.

I have spds on both my bikes (sport tour and road.) *I have a pair of
Shimano MTB shoes
that I use with both bikes. *My pedals are full pedals with the spd on one
side and grips on the other.

I get grief from roadie buddies but I'm not sure I understand why. *I've
used
Look pedals before and I don't see a big difference.

They say that Look type pedals are easier to get into and out of but I don't
see that. *They also talk about hot spots on the spd cleats but I don't
notice
that either. *Maybe it's because of the full size pedals that I have.

I can actually park my bike and walk into the office with these shoes. *The
cleats
are recessed into the sole.

Part of my commute is through a park with gravelly trails. *I can unclip
and use the pedal side for when I'm sliding through the gravel.

I can take off from the red light without fumbling with the cleat until I
get
across the intersection.

The cleats seem to last longer and the shoes are $150 bucks.

I can use the same shoes in the spinning classes in the off season.

What's the argument against this setup on a road bike?

They don't like that you've not paid your full dues into the
effeminate wannabe racer club. Next time tell them your a tourist to
confuse them. Road shoes are 'better' for climbing steep hills in big
gears and for sprinting in. If you always stick to appropriate small
and medium gears, keeping down pedal pressure, then road shoes show no
advantage. Just use the big gears when following some roadie fool(s)
who will do the work for you, because you're a lowly tourist. ;-)