Riis just killed pro-cycling.....

On Sun, 27 May 2007 15:58:57 GMT, "B. Lafferty"
wrote:


"RicodJour" wrote in message
oups.com...
On May 27, 10:38 am, "B. Lafferty"
wrote:
"RicodJour" wrote in message

I get the fact that you have a bug up your ass about Armstrong, and
your view/opinions are seriously skewed due to said bug. You cherry
pick facts, create virtual facts, whatever it takes to support your
viewpoint.

When Lance finally croaks you'll be blubbering more than anyone else -
your personal windmill will be getting buried along with him.
Probably time to invest in a "Plan B" so you're not caught short.


So you still believe the Lance return from the dead, lose weight, hard
training/efficiency myth. ROTFL!

Doesn't this feel good? I'm so happy for you. Just like old times!
You can take any opportunity to twist things into being about Lance
doping. Cycling is bigger than Lance. Cycling is bigger than
doping. Well...maybe not in your world.

I'm serious. Plan B time. Don't be the grasshopper, grasshopper.

R

This is funny. You DO still believe.

And what in hell is it that you believe?

That Lance has some magic pill he won't pass on to his team or friends?

What?

You can't just say that he doped. THe rest of them doped, so why's he beating
them?

Did he dope better? Perhaps, then why are there no successors showing up. Is it
your theory that Lance is a super genius endocrinologist who knows things about
doping nobody else does and he'll take it to his grave?

He didn't dope more because he would've been busted.

Whether or not he doped, he beat the other guys for the same reasons he would
have beaten them if nobody ever doped. Most of those reasons are pretty well
known and are significant.

Ron


Ron

Effect pedal demo's up at http://www.soundclick.com/ronsonicpedalry

On Sun, 27 May 2007 16:40:12 GMT, "B. Lafferty"
wrote:


"RicodJour" wrote in message
ups.com...
On May 27, 11:58 am, "B. Lafferty"
wrote:

This is funny. You DO still believe.

I believe in "I believe in the soul, the cock, the pussy, the small of
a woman's back, the hanging curve ball, high fiber, good scotch, that
the novels of Susan Sontag are self-indulgent, overrated crap. I
believe Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone. I believe there ought to be a
constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated
hitter. I believe in the sweet spot, soft-core pornography, opening
your presents Christmas morning rather than Christmas Eve and I
believe in long, slow, deep, soft, wet kisses that last three days."
I believe baseball is a stupid sport, but fun to watch in person (had
to straighten out Kevin Costner's errors).

I also believe that you'll have a big empty hole in your life when
Lance goes away. That would be normal for a ten year old boy, it's
just sad for a fifty year old man (I'm being charitable).

Ever consider not mentioning Lance for a week or two to see what
positive things fill in? If not, do.

Now, on your way...

Oh, your sarcasm is devastating. How will I ever go on?! I'll wager that
you still believe in Lance, Tyler, Floyd, Ullrich and Basso. You are such a
******. LOL

Whatever is there to believe in or not? I believe those guys are brilliant bike
racers who regularly produced marvels of athletic performance with which to
amaze and entertain. My own opinion is that some reasonable and undetectible
quantity of any of the currently available PEDs is far more natural and
appealing than what Lance did to his life in order to win.

Pretty much every race I've ever been in has involved a critical gut check at
some point. Whether it's a bunch of fat yahoos like me slogging around a muddy
park or Floyd trying to fight back 15 minutes, it's a gut check. Dope doesn't
change that.

Ron

"B. Lafferty" wrote in message
news:Mvi6i.160$2v5.57@trndny06...

"RicodJour" wrote in message
ps.com...
On May 27, 11:58 am, "B. Lafferty"
wrote:

This is funny. You DO still believe.

I believe in "I believe in the soul, the cock, the pussy, the small of
a woman's back, the hanging curve ball, high fiber, good scotch, that
the novels of Susan Sontag are self-indulgent, overrated crap. I
believe Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone. I believe there ought to be a
constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated
hitter. I believe in the sweet spot, soft-core pornography, opening
your presents Christmas morning rather than Christmas Eve and I
believe in long, slow, deep, soft, wet kisses that last three days."
I believe baseball is a stupid sport, but fun to watch in person (had
to straighten out Kevin Costner's errors).

I also believe that you'll have a big empty hole in your life when
Lance goes away. That would be normal for a ten year old boy, it's
just sad for a fifty year old man (I'm being charitable).

Ever consider not mentioning Lance for a week or two to see what
positive things fill in? If not, do.

Now, on your way...

Oh, your sarcasm is devastating. How will I ever go on?! I'll wager that
you still believe in Lance, Tyler, Floyd, Ullrich and Basso. You are such
a ******. LOL


I DO believe in Lance, Tyler, Floyd, Ullrich and Basso. Great riders. And
I'm serious.

Benjo

On May 27, 12:40 pm, "B. Lafferty"
wrote:

Oh, your sarcasm is devastating. How will I ever go on?!

Much like a broken record.

I'll wager that
you still believe in Lance, Tyler, Floyd, Ullrich and Basso. You are such a
******. LOL

What exactly am I not supposed to believe in? Which ones weren't
supremely gifted athletes whether they, or anyone else in the peloton,
doped? In the first place, I never believed that random people with a
gift for cycling are somehow paragons of moral erectness. They ride
fookin' bicycles, you maroon. Surprisingly enough, I also don't care
what Rosie O'Donnell or Charlie Sheen have to say about 9/11.

Society periodically goes through such expansion and contraction of
social mores. Popping pills for whatever ailed you was typical in the
50's and 60's. Your mom did it. Your mom, if she had any common
sense, smacked your ass when you were just a little complainer that
got out of hand. If she did those same things nowadays, your mom
would be in rehab, up on child endangerment charges and Child
Protection would have put you in a foster home. I'm not saying that
would have necessarily been a bad thing in your case, merely pointing
out that being a sanctimonious a-hole who can't, or won't,
differentiate between entertainment and vital matters, and is obsessed
with a retired rider, is detrimental to your mental health.

Now the question becomes, do you call the cops on your own mom because
she spanked you, or do you realize that even a mom is human and can
make mistakes, and move past it? You could always tell yourself that
you were helping her and it was for her own good if it would make it
easier to make the call.

We're in a similar transition period in cycling.

Plan B. Seriously. You'll thank me.

R

"RonSonic" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 27 May 2007 15:58:57 GMT, "B. Lafferty"

wrote:


"RicodJour" wrote in message
roups.com...
On May 27, 10:38 am, "B. Lafferty"
wrote:
"RicodJour" wrote in message

I get the fact that you have a bug up your ass about Armstrong, and
your view/opinions are seriously skewed due to said bug. You cherry
pick facts, create virtual facts, whatever it takes to support your
viewpoint.

When Lance finally croaks you'll be blubbering more than anyone
else -
your personal windmill will be getting buried along with him.
Probably time to invest in a "Plan B" so you're not caught short.


So you still believe the Lance return from the dead, lose weight, hard
training/efficiency myth. ROTFL!

Doesn't this feel good? I'm so happy for you. Just like old times!
You can take any opportunity to twist things into being about Lance
doping. Cycling is bigger than Lance. Cycling is bigger than
doping. Well...maybe not in your world.

I'm serious. Plan B time. Don't be the grasshopper, grasshopper.

R

This is funny. You DO still believe.

And what in hell is it that you believe?

That Lance has some magic pill he won't pass on to his team or friends?

Hardly. I believe he followed the training preparation of Dr. Ferrari to
the letter.


What?

You can't just say that he doped. THe rest of them doped, so why's he
beating
them?

Because his dope and doctor (Ferrari) combined with his work ethic made him
just slightly better than guys like Ullrich?

Did he dope better? Perhaps, then why are there no successors showing up.
Is it
your theory that Lance is a super genius endocrinologist who knows things
about
doping nobody else does and he'll take it to his grave?

No successors yet. But please do consider that Lance looks very much like
Indurain's successor. Do you believe Indurain was clean, coming from a team
that came out of the old Reynolds team that had a history of drug use dating
back to Delgado and the use of a former team doctor from the old Peugeot
team--the one who pumped Thevenet up with corticoids to the point where he
pretty much fell off his bike during the 1978 Giro?

The on the record statements and findings of a WADA lab, the statements,
under oath, of the former heart and soul of Postal (Emma per mark Gorski),
statements of former teammates about drug discussions, the backdating of a
steroid prescription (for a different drug than the one found in his
system), the moto riders delivering blue ice chests to the Postal hotel in
the middle of the night, the statement of a former Postal soigneur
(Dutch--not Belgian mafia) that Spanish doctors followed Postal staying in
the same hotels but on different floors-----there's more but you may recall
it----all tends to make me rather skeptical of your super genius
endocrinologist theory. He may take it to his grave unless people who no
longer owe their jobs to him, continue to come forward to tell what they
know.

He didn't dope more because he would've been busted.

Interesting but strange statement. Oh, well.

Whether or not he doped, he beat the other guys for the same reasons he
would
have beaten them if nobody ever doped. Most of those reasons are pretty
well
known and are significant.

You have absolutely no way of knowing that any more than what riders such as
Hampsten and Motet (as examples) might have done without the drug culture in
cycling.

On May 27, 7:14 pm, "benjo maso" wrote:


I DO believe in Lance, Tyler, Floyd, Ullrich and Basso. Great riders. And
I'm serious.

Benjo- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Agreed Benjo. They were all playing by the unwritten rules and all
performed great feats. In another era none of the doping would've
mattered much. The quality of the competition, the event, and the
great performances would've set them apart in any era.
Many of the great artists, composer and writers were NOT great
people, and not above some cheating here and there, but that doesn't
diminish the beauty, importance, and power of their works.
The event, as it unfolds, is unique a unique and seperate entity from
the other concerns which may influence it as do a million other
factors. Those factors also make each event individual despite the
same participants.
If you see cycling, or athletics as nothing more than a cut throat
business then doping and every other nasty trick is par for the
course, as it is in big business. Seems to have worked well for
Microsoft, Barry Bonds, and others.
I see an art, story, and beauty to the sport that really isn't all
that related to the results. Results are what they race for, but doing
it well and beautifully is important to those of us watching.
That's not a Protestant work ethic, North American attitude though.
More French, Italian, and European I'd say.
For the most part they live better than we do, and by choice. I was
thrilled to see Wal-Mart fail miserably in Germany.
Bill C

On 27 May 2007 04:44:19 -0700, Qui si parla Campagnolo
wrote:

is basically true. Just as it is for every other member of the
peleton

PelOton, please, please......

Different sprot.

in message , RonSonic
') wrote:

Not true, Rick. Â*According to Dr. Eddie Coyle (supported by our own Dr.
Coggan), it is possible with years of training to develope the efficiency
needed to climb mountains at 26 kph. Â*Lose weight as Armstrong and George
are alleged to have done, and you can climb even though you're a classics
man. Â*Look at Indurain. Â*All he had to do was lose weight and suddenly
his climbing and time trialing became world class. Â*It's all hard work,
diet and the efficiency created by years of selfless training. Â*You
believe me, don't you? ;-)

So, what makes the difference.

Everyone can train hard and lose weight. Everyone can buy drugs. So why
such inequal results. Do you suppose the guys in the back are skimping on
the drugs or on the miles?

Different people have different genetics, which respond to both miles and
drugs in different ways. But, more important, different people have
different psychology, different self belief, different ability to deceive
and to persuade, and different will to win. People who win bike races -
people who win a lot of bike races - are as much psychologically
exceptional as they are physically exceptional, whether you're talking
about Obree (who is one of the few people in modern cycling one can say
with certainty did not dope) or about Armstrong.

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

Hobbit ringleader gives Sauron One in the Eye.

On May 27, 5:15 pm, RicodJour wrote:

... merely pointing
out that being a sanctimonious a-hole who can't, or won't,
differentiate between entertainment and vital matters,...

Speaking of "the need" to attend to vital matters and not waste time
with trivia and simple entertainment (bike racing), how many "dope
posts" have been made to rbr in the last month?

On May 25, 4:14 pm, "Crescentius Vespasianus"
wrote:
Riis just killed the sport known as pro-cycling. The European police in
Italy and France were in the end correct and the people who criticized them
were wrong. I think David Millar was the first to crack under those warm
interrogation lights. In the end he told them all they needed to know about
this cycling-Mafia. Kudos to all of the European police agencies, in
cracking this Mafia wide open for all to see. All that crap about these
guys going up grades 8% at 26 mph were simply an illusion. Where does
Carmichael go now, when people now know it wasn't his training, but what he
had in the medicine bag. What about Liggett, will he now return to being a
shoe salesman? Trautman can now compare his steroid perfected Yankee team
to the EPO perfected CSC team. It was the perfect illusion,......all of it.
We should all give them a giant round of applause for this magic trick of
the century called pro-cycling.

In 2045 they'll still be racing Milan-San Remo and the Pogio will
still play prominantly into the final results. OP, Riis, Birillo et
al. will fade much faster then the insitition of professional
cycling.